MBP Advice!

[bkribbs]

I'm heading off to college this fall and want to take a MBP with me!

It sounds like the regular MBP won't be updated anymore, and the rMBP might me later.

What's my best option? I don't think I care too much if I get retina or not but they tend to be more discounted in the refurbished apple store.

I think I want refurbished to save money so I can get a better computer.

How much difference is 4 vs 8 gigs of ram? I'm assuming 16 is overkill.

How much difference is 512 mb vs 1 gig of Vram?

I do want discrete graphics unless you all are going to say the integrated is just about as good, which I assume its not.

I'm looking for any advice! Oh and I do want the 15" I think, but could do 13 if it came with dedicated graphics.


EDIT:
As for my intended use, I'm planning on being a computer engineer. Quite frankly I'm not sure what all that requires, but better to have too much power then not enough.

If there are any specific questions I can answer to make answering my questions easier, ask away!

 

[Lunfai]

I'm heading off to college this fall and want to take a MBP with me!

It sounds like the regular MBP won't be updated anymore, and the rMBP might me later.

What's my best option? I don't think I care too much if I get retina or not but they tend to be more discounted in the refurbished apple store.

I think I want refurbished to save money so I can get a better computer.

How much difference is 4 vs 8 gigs of ram? I'm assuming 16 is overkill.

How much difference is 512 mb vs 1 gig of Vram?

I do want discrete graphics unless you all are going to say the integrated is just about as good, which I assume its not.

I'm looking for any advice! Oh and I do want the 15" I think, but could do 13 if it came with dedicated graphics.

The updated rMBP will not be on the refurbished store for a while. I recommend last years 15" model with no retina after the WWDC announcement.

 

[bkribbs]

The updated rMBP will not be on the refurbished store for a while. I recommend last years 15" model with no retina after the WWDC announcement.

Why no retina?

Also, will the refurbished prices fall after WWDC?

 

[B...]

Without your intended uses, it is very hard to answer questions like line, vRAM, RAM and graphics card.

 

[bkribbs]

Without your intended uses, it is very hard to answer questions like line, vRAM, RAM and graphics card.

Kinda added in OP now.

I really don't know. I'm going to school as a computer engineer. Really I think I want to know how much difference does it make? If you have a specific question about it I can do my best to answer it.

Like 512 mb vs 1 gig of RAM. Is that significant for much? Or is that a minor boost? That's really the biggest one.

But across the board, without being real specific to me, just how much of a difference do each of those make?

 

[B...]

Ok. So for computer engineering, you seem to want a 15" and plenty of power. The big thing is if you need upgradability/expandability or an optical drive. If you do, go for the regular MBP 15. If no, and if your budget allows, you may want to think about a rMBP 15. The regular is the only one with an option for 512 megabytes of vRAM, and quite honestly it is not enough now or any serious GPU work or gaming, nor will it be in the future. I would go 1 GB to future proof it. The retina version only comes with 1 GB, so you are relatively safe there. As for RAM, if you buy regular, just get the base model and throw in 8GB or 16GB for $50 and $80 respectively if you find a good deal. You may also want to think about putting in an SSD to make the computer "faster" and more responsive. The retina comes with an SSD, but you can't upgrade the RAM later on because it is so,Derek to the logic board. Therefore, order what will need for the future at the time of purchase. You may be fine with 8GB, but if you plan to use it for 4 or more years, 16 might be good to future proof it. As for refurb, I think it is a very good option because they are cosmetically as good as new just a few hundred dollars cheaper. Sometimes you even get an upgrade by mistake (more RAM, bigger HDD).

 

[Lunfai]

Why no retina?

Also, will the refurbished prices fall after WWDC?

Because you can save further reductions, and you don't need retina as its a luxury rather then something you need.

They should do, only by a small margin. If you get the base 15" you can upgrade the hdd to SSD and the ram yourself, you will save further money.

 

[bkribbs]

Ok. So for computer engineering, you seem to want a 15" and plenty of power. The big thing is if you need upgradability/expandability or an optical drive. If you do, go for the regular MBP 15. If no, and if your budget allows, you may want to think about a rMBP 15. The regular is the only one with an option for 512 megabytes of vRAM, and quite honestly it is not enough now or any serious GPU work or gaming, nor will it be in the future. I would go 1 GB to future proof it. The retina version only comes with 1 GB, so you are relatively safe there. As for RAM, if you buy regular, just get the base model and throw in 8GB or 16GB for $50 and $80 respectively if you find a good deal. You may also want to think about putting in an SSD to make the computer "faster" and more responsive. The retina comes with an SSD, but you can't upgrade the RAM later on because it is so,Derek to the logic board. Therefore, order what will need for the future at the time of purchase. You may be fine with 8GB, but if you plan to use it for 4 or more years, 16 might be good to future proof it. As for refurb, I think it is a very good option because they are cosmetically as good as new just a few hundred dollars cheaper. Sometimes you even get an upgrade by mistake (more RAM, bigger HDD).

Hm ok thanks for all that feedback!

So I'll shoot for the 1gb of VRAM. Would a 7200 rpm hard drive be a decent upgrade? SSDs are kinda pricey for me.

RAM I can handle upgrading myself.

Finally, is pretty much any of the i7 CPUs that come with the 1GB of vram alright? Not too much of a difference when it comes to .4 ghz, right?

Because you can save further reductions, and you don't need retina as its a luxury rather then something you need.

They should do, only by a small margin. If you get the base 15" you can upgrade the hdd to SSD and the ram yourself, you will save further money.

That makes sense. Thanks!

EDIT: Oh- can I expect prices in the apple refurbished store to fall after wwdc assuming new models are released?

 

[B...]

Hm ok thanks for all that feedback!

So I'll shoot for the 1gb of VRAM. Would a 7200 rpm hard drive be a decent upgrade? SSDs are kinda pricey for me.

RAM I can handle upgrading myself.

Finally, is pretty much any of the i7 CPUs that come with the 1GB of vram alright? Not too much of a difference when it comes to .4 ghz, right?

A 7200RPM is an ok upgrade to the 5400, but nowhere near as good as an SSD. I would just wait to buy an SSD, because they will be less expensive in a few months. Any of the i7s will be plenty for you. The difference between 2.3 and 2.7 is minimal (about 15%), but the important upgrade is the 1 GB vRAM. So I assume you are going for the non-retina?

EDIT: the will fall more, just not a lot. They most they seem to be discounted is by 25%.

 

[bkribbs]

A 7200RPM is an ok upgrade to the 5400, but nowhere near as good as an SSD. I would just wait to buy an SSD, because they will be less expensive in a few months. Any of the i7s will be plenty for you. The difference between 2.3 and 2.7 is minimal (about 15%), but the important upgrade is the 1 GB vRAM. So I assume you are going for the non-retina?

EDIT: the will fall more, just not a lot. They most they seem to be discounted is by 25%.

Ok sounds good.

Assuming that it saves me money to get the MBP and do the RAM and HDD myself, I will be going that route over the rMBP.

I will however price check those and see what the difference would be because who doesn't want retina if its about the same? (and the rMBP in the refurbished store seemed to be discounted more)

EDIT: How does the 1440-by-900 regular screen compare to a 1680-by-1050 (also how good is antiglare?)?

EDIT:

Refurbished 15.4-inch MacBook Pro 2.6GHz Quad-core Intel i7 with Retina Display
Originally released June 2012
15.4-inch (diagonal) Retina display; 2880-by-1800 resolution at 220 pixels per inch
16GB of 1600MHz DDR3L SDRAM
256GB Flash Storage
720p FaceTime HD Camera
NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M with 1GB of GDDR5 memory

That's 1949.

The first regular macbook pro is 1819 with these specs:
Refurbished 15.4-inch MacBook Pro 2.6GHz Quad-core Intel i7
Originally released June 2012
15.4-inch (diagonal) LED-backlit glossy widescreen display, 1440-by-900 resolution

8GB (2 x 4GB) of 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM
750GB Serial ATA @ 5400 rpm
8x double-layer SuperDrive (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M with 1GB of GDDR5 memory

Doesn't the retina sound better?

 

[KUguardgrl13]

Don't forget the Apple education discount. I'm not sure if it applies to refurbs, but it does help when buying a new model. If your university bookstore sells macs, you might check with them next week to see if they're running any deals to clear out old stock.

 

[B...]

The retina appears better there. Hi def is better than regular bc it gives you.l more real estate. Anti glare is very helpful, but remember that retina is suppose to have 75% less glare than regular.

 

[ohbrilliance]

My recommendations, based on what you'll be using it for:

* 15" screen -- 13" is too cramped for development work.
* SSD -- this offers huge performance benefits
* 8GB or more of ram -- 4GB isn't really cutting it any more.
* Optionally, a 1680 screen. More screen real estate without being too cramped. The rMBP can operate nicely at 1680.

 

[bkribbs]

Don't forget the Apple education discount. I'm not sure if it applies to refurbs, but it does help when buying a new model. If your university bookstore sells macs, you might check with them next week to see if they're running any deals to clear out old stock.

My understanding is that you get refurbished or education discount, with refurbs being the same or cheaper then the discount.

The bookstore is worth looking into though!

The retina appears better there. Hi def is better than regular bc it gives you.l more real estate. Anti glare is very helpful, but remember that retina is suppose to have 75% less glare than regular.

Ok great! Thanks! So you really think there's no way 512 mb of Vram would cut it? I've just never seen the difference but I believe you!

My recommendations, based on what you'll be using it for:

* 15" screen -- 13" is too cramped for development work.
* SSD -- this offers huge performance benefits
* 8GB or more of ram -- 4GB isn't really cutting it any more.
* Optionally, a 1680 screen. More screen real estate without being too cramped. The rMBP can operate nicely at 1680.

Ok sounds about in line with B...

 

[bkribbs]

Better to take 8 gigs RAM and 512 gb SSD or 16 and 256?

Also, I've seen reports of

screens with image retention and/or laggier ui which stutters and/or is capped at 8gb of ram

This posits a few problems. The devices don't necessarily get better in every respect. Thus the retina macbook pro lost a lot of storage capacity and also got a screen with a slow or laggy ui. Its thermals also became more of a problem again. Apple could have opted for a thicker design so you don't burn your balls (it's no laughing matter, it's documented it's important for fertility) and a second drive. With their software implementation though retina was always going to be a problem with current graphics. Anyway let's not digress here on what they should or shouldn't have done. At the end of the day that's what they came up with and we have to live with this.

Do I need to worry about this since it is a first gen?

 

[B...]

Better to take 8 gigs RAM and 512 gb SSD or 16 and 256?

Also, I've seen reports of



Do I need to worry about this since it is a first gen?

16 and 256 since you cannot upgrade the RAM later but you can upgrade the SSD when you need to with specialized discs from OWC. Laggy UI is a software issue, partly fixed with 10.8.3 and Safari lag can be fixed with WebKit nightly. Image retention is still a problem, but if you notice it you can always bring it into Apple for a screen replacement.

 

[bkribbs]

16 and 256 since you cannot upgrade the RAM later but you can upgrade the SSD when you need to with specialized discs from OWC. Laggy UI is a software issue, partly fixed with 10.8.3 and Safari lag can be fixed with WebKit nightly. Image retention is still a problem, but if you notice it you can always bring it into Apple for a screen replacement.

So I shouldn't really worry about any of those?

And if I go non retina, you're sure the 512mb vs 1 GB VRAM matters?

 

[B...]

So I shouldn't really worry about any of those?

And if I go non retina, you're sure the 512mb vs 1 GB VRAM matters?

You said yourself, better too much power than not enough, right? 512MB is very outdated and 1GB is much better for the future. What's the difference in price between the 512 and 1 machines?

 

[bkribbs]

You said yourself, better too much power than not enough, right? 512MB is very outdated and 1GB is much better for the future. What's the difference in price between the 512 and 1 machines?

The first model with 1GB is $1,819 but that includes an upgraded hdd and RAM, where the base would be $1,449 which would save a few hundred dollars I could put towards a SSD or RAM or both. So somewhat significant.

Refurbished 15.4-inch MacBook Pro 2.6GHz Quad-core Intel i7
Originally released June 2012
15.4-inch (diagonal) LED-backlit glossy widescreen display, 1440-by-900 resolution

8GB (2 x 4GB) of 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM
750GB Serial ATA @ 5400 rpm
8x double-layer SuperDrive (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M with 1GB of GDDR5 memory
$1,819.00

 

[B...]

I think that because the above computers has 8GB RAM and large HDD, you should be fine with that stock spec. 16GB is likely overkill, and SSDs are expensive now. Prices will likely drop following WWDC tomorrow, so keep looking at the refurb store for prices and other options.

 

[bkribbs]

I think that because the above computers has 8GB RAM and large HDD, you should be fine with that stock spec. 16GB is likely overkill, and SSDs are expensive now. Prices will likely drop following WWDC tomorrow, so keep looking at the refurb store for prices and other options.

So you think that I could take that and use as is until I can afford an SSD? If so, that's probably what I'll go with!

Also, do you think SSD prices are going to go down anytime soon? They've been out for a while so it doesn't seem like they'd be about to drop.

 

[B...]

So you think that I could take that and use as is until I can afford an SSD? If so, that's probably what I'll go with!

Also, do you think SSD prices are going to go down anytime soon? They've been out for a while so it doesn't seem like they'd be about to drop.

Even without an SSD, that is a very nice computer. Since SSDs are being used more and more, prices will drop even further as the continue to replace HDDs.

 

[bkribbs]

Even without an SSD, that is a very nice computer. Since SSDs are being used more and more, prices will drop even further as the continue to replace HDDs.

So do you think I should go with that over the retina equivalent so that I can upgrade the HDD and RAM later if I want, but lose retina?

 

[B...]

So do you think I should go with that over the retina equivalent so that I can upgrade the HDD and RAM later if I want, but lose retina?

Personally, I would take retina. Even though you cannot upgrade the RAM, you can the SSD. I will just max out RAM before purchasing. But if you think you might need 16GB in the future but cannot buy the upgrade, the non retina is for you. Also consider the optical drive. Not needed for me, but maybe for you it is.

 

[bkribbs]

Personally, I would take retina. Even though you cannot upgrade the RAM, you can the SSD. I will just max out RAM before purchasing. But if you think you might need 16GB in the future but cannot buy the upgrade, the non retina is for you. Also consider the optical drive. Not needed for me, but maybe for you it is.

That starts at $1,949 which is a lot for just 256 GB of SSD space. And its very expensive to buy that proprietary SSD to replace later on. But good to think about.

So you think even with all the trouble people have been having with the first gen retinas its worth that risk?

And finally, thank you B... for all of the help you have given me! I appreciate it all.

And does anyone else have any input?