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[Merged] $29 Snow Leopard vs. $169 Box Set Questions
- Thread starter Gregintosh
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Many confirmations of different people in reviews and on different message boards.
Just as Apple doesn't bother with serial numbers for OS X, they don't bother with many different types of installation disks. Just one.
http://www.macworld.com/article/142423/2009/08/snow_leopard_review.html
I've not seen any such confirmations yet, certainly not on MR. Your link doesn't prove anything unfortunately.
Apple's Up-To-Date discs have in the past had an additional install check routine in the installer - Tiger and Leopard discs did. I want to know if Snow Leopard is the same or if they changed their policy.
Can you elaborate on that?
If it doesn't do version checking, then besides the EULA violation, I see absolutely no reason an archive and upgrade wouldn't work, whether it be from Tiger or not. If SL doesn't know/care about the difference, why would it make a difference?
I'd like to know this as well. I'm looking forward to the images hashes of both disks.
harrymerkin said:
Even apple will suggest backing your current important data to an external drive before upgrading, that's just standard operating procedure for installing ANY new operating system as an upgrade, whether it be Apple OS, Linux, or even the Windows upgrade disks. ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS back up your import data before an upgrade installation. I've seen them go wrong on multiple platforms one too many times.
@ All:
There still seems to be a bit of confusion as to what is what.
From what I gather:
Basically this should be like installing any regular 'ol OS 10.X.Y OS - as in like installing Leopard, this should be just as easy/same exact method.
The only things I'm concerned about is:
A) The hashes of each image (proof) that they're the same disk
B) Will SL indeed check for any kind of install? I mean if it doesn't look for any kind of install, theoretically you could install it on a panther installed system - may not archive anything correctly (though it should), but it should still install just fine and dandy.
It seems as though snow leopard is a lot less of an "upgrade" as apple is pushing it, more-so simply re-branding a very highly re-factored build of Leopard and selling it as a new OS. Anybody care to agree/decline that?
Geez, take him for his word or go find your own definitive source. This is a forum, and he's attempting to help you. If his answers don't suffice, then go bother someone else on some other board. OR pay for the Box Set, like it sounds like you should be, instead of trying to find some concrete evidence on how to illegally save yourself a few bucks.
:facepalm: (Yes, I know this smile is not enabled on this forum, but it deserves to be.)
Not sure who you think you are mate, but you're pretty far off base with this glib comment. Please don't accuse me of "illegal" behaviour, it's laughable.
You've missed the point entirely - :facepalm: indeed.
Snow Leopard only works on Intel macs anyway, so no Intel mac should have Panther on it...only Tiger or Leopard (unless they downgraded which
I seriously doubt).
Ugh.
You completely missed my point.
Entirely...
Read again, please...
I'm saying IF somebody had an Intel based mac with Panther on it - it would still work, correct? I'm not asking in that I have panther on there - I'm asking as in, Snow Leopard WOULD install over an Intel based system with ony Panther on it. As in it wouldn't give some version error from "version checks" - assuming the computer met the requirements for SL (including the Intel CD/C2D arch), it "would" install.
Yay? Nay?
I wouldn't call it illegal, illegal means "against the law" - it is not a law that you will not install Snow Leopard on a Mac with Tiger on it. It's a violation of the EULA and Apple has the right to sue your ass (and win easily) if you do so. Though illegal? I don't believe so. EULA violations fall under breach of contract and are grounds to have a suit filed against you, not a law violation.
Though that's just semantics, I still agree with what you're saying.
If you want to bring up semantics ...
Breach of contract is a violation of civil law, but not criminal law. Therefore it is illegal, but you won't be going to prison over it - since it is a civil matter.
Illegal? If you've got a Mac, you've got OS X and if that Mac meets the system requirements you can install Snow Leopard. That's it. There is no requirement you need to have a specific OS X version installed and there is no requirement you need to buy a specific version of Snow Leopard (retail or Mac Box Set) unless it is the up-to-date version (you have to meet the requirements for that program in order to be able to participate).
It's all about marketing: Apple thinks the Mac Box Set is better suited for Tiger users since they most likely will be using older versions of iWork and iLife. They could buy iLife 09 and iWork 09 separately but I think there was a certain system requirement requiring Leopard (aka it won't run on Tiger). Leopard users don't have that problem so there is not much need to target them. The Mac Box Set is just a box with OS X, iLife and iWork. That does not change any of the EULA's for those pieces of software, I doubt that it is even possible to do so since it's not a different product. If Apple did they might even violate some laws.
If you take a look at the EULA which you can find at http://www.apple.com/legal/sla/ you can clearly see the argument about EULA violation is FALSE! It is not a violation of anything if you buy the 29$ Snow Leopard version and upgrade Leopard or Tiger with it because that's exactly (!) what the EULA says you can do! Open the pdf and do a search on "tiger" and be amazed you'll only find those 5 letters in the German translation in a couple of words.
Stop the madness: if you've got Leopard or Tiger and only want to upgrade your OS than just buy the 29$ Snow Leopard upgrade. You also want to upgrade iLife and iWork to the newest 09 versions? than buy the Mac Box Set. It is THAT simple!
Yes, it will check for any kind of install since it's default option is to upgrade whatever is on the disk. As you can see from other on this forum and elsewhere there is no check if you're running a specific OS X version to prevent it from installing, well at least the retail versions don't. There seems to be some version checking for the up to date dvd. In that regard, the Snow Leopard release is not anything different than the Tiger and Leopard releases were.
Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard license = Up-To-Date disc = EULA says you must already have a Leopard licence.
Single Use = $29 Retail disc = EULA makes no mention of needing a Leopard or Tiger licence.
Family Pack = Family Pack = EULA makes no mention of needing a Leopard or Tiger licence.
Just to refute Corrode's glib assumption that others in this thread have erroneously picked up and run with, I have a professional interest in knowing what each of the Snow Leopard discs do or not do. I have OS X licences coming out of my ass; I have no need to buy the Mac Box Set and have not and am not planning on breaking any EULA's or laws pertaining to this bloody OS
That is all Where does it say that the $29 disc is the Single Use - especially since Apple markets and sells it as the Upgrade?
So you're saying the "Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard license" and the "Single Use" are the same thing, even though they're separated out in the EULA? Does this make sense to you, cos it doesn't to me. I know as much as you do, just trying to find the truth in all this and starting to lose the will to live to be quite honest
So you're saying the "Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard license" and the "Single Use" are the same thing, even though they're separated out in the EULA? Does this make sense to you, cos it doesn't to me. I know as much as you do, just trying to find the truth in all this and starting to lose the will to live to be quite honest
No. I'm saying that using Apple's requirements and marketing, the Upgrade is the $29 disc. The Single Use version comes in the box set.
So where's the EULA for the Up-To-Date disc? I think it's already there as I've set out above, and the Single Use encompasses the Retail disc, which is the same disc and EULA that you get in the Mac Box Set.
So therefore you can upgrade Tiger from the $29 retail disc without breaking the EULA?
The EULA for the up-to-date disc is also the upgrade EULA, since they are both upgrades.
If you buy the retail Snow Leopard on the Apple Store it says it's the Single User version, NOT Upgrade. On the Snow Leopard page on the Store it refers to "upgrade" for BOTH the Single User version AND the Mac Box Set.
"Find out which upgrade is right for you.
Mac OS X v10.5 (Leopard): Upgrade your Mac by purchasing Mac OS X Snow Leopard.Mac OS X v10.4 (Tiger): Upgrade by purchasing the Mac Box Set, which includes Snow Leopard, iLife ’09, and iWork ’09."
The Up-To-Date disc requires you to already have a Leopard licence, and therefore in the EULA I believe it's referred to as the "Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard license". Apple aren't helping by using inconsistent naming of their products
Edit: OK, I think I see what you mean now. I've noticed you can buy a Family Pack Mac Box Set, which means the EULAs make more sense.
Normally it is not wise to reply to trolls but in this case it is necessary in regard to correct information. You're trolling since you explicitly left out a very crucial part. It's the first part, namely "C. Leopard Upgrade Licenses.". So yes if you have a Leopard Upgrade license it's quite normal to have the Leopard requirement, that's what that part of the EULA says. Unfortunately that is not the entire part. The other parts you probably intentionally left out and the full citation you should have put in your post is the following:
Now let's take a look at the different Snow Leopard options Apple offers...gjee, that seems to be exactly options 2a, 2b and 2c! If you buy the 29$ Snow Leopard version or the 169$ Mac Box Set you have option 2a. If you buy the 49$ Snow Leopard Family pack or the 229$ Mac Box Set Family Pack you have option 2b. If you have entered the up-to-date program you have option 2c. However, none of the options mention anything about Tiger, options 2a and 2b don't even mention Leopard.
EULA's can be hard to read sometimes but this is one very very simple and crystal clear.
Also the correct term for going from one version to a higher one would be updating or upgrading. It does not impose restrictions of any kind. It's just going from one version to a higher one. The opposite is also possible, that would be downgrading. Source: a proper English dictionary like Merriam Webster. You could also try wikipedia: Upgrade.
Now try and piece those pieces of information together...
BTW: of course, if you really want to be sure just email Apple's legal department with your question.
I think r.j.s has got it right actually.
Check out the bold text below, you forgot to mention it and it's crucial to working out what products the EULAs apply to:
C. Leopard Upgrade Licenses. If you have purchased an Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard license, then subject to the terms and conditions of this License, you are granted a limited non-exclusive license to install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software on a single Apple-branded computer as long as that computer has a properly licensed copy of Mac OS X Leopard already installed on it. If you have purchased a Family Pack Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard license, then subject to the terms and conditions of this License, you are granted a limited non-exclusive license to install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software on up to a maximum of five (5) Apple-branded computers at a time as long as those computers are located in the same household (as defined above), are used by persons who occupy that same household, and each such computer has a properly licensed copy of Mac OS X Leopard already installed on it. The Family Pack Upgrade for Mac OS X Leopard License does not extend to business or commercial users.
This means that 2C applies to 3 Snow Leopard products: the $29 disc, the $49 Family Pack AND the Up-To-Date disc. All 3 require you to already have a Leopard licence.
2A and 2B refer to the Mac Box Sets and do not refer to any requirement for Tiger or Leopard licences - you can install them on any freakin' Mac it'll work on, but it'll cost ya
PLease reread my post again, I copy-pasted the 2c exactly as it is in the EULA and so did not leave out the bold piece! The reason I did not mention that is because the up-to-date program is not for just 1 Mac, if you have multiple Macs that apply for the program you can do that in one batch. That would be the family license pack
From the up-to-date program:
Next there is this legal question since they advertise the 29$ and 49$ license as being the single user and family pack on their online store:
That would make it hard for them to state it differently.
Source: http://store.apple.com/us/product/MAC_OS_X_SNGL
Again:
2a: 29$ Snow Leopard or 169$ Mac Box Set
2b: 49$ Snow Leopard Family Pack or 229$ Mac Box Set Family Pack
2c: up-to-date program (whether 1 or multiple ones)
Also note what they mention about business use, there are no separate business versions.
is this a dead horse topic yet?
I want to try and ask this a different way.
I paid the $10 for the upgrade dvd through the apple site using my serial number b/c my brother got a new imac in june.
The disk came and it says uprade dvd on the disk.
Here is how I will ask this question.
Say.. 3 years from now, my imac is kinda hosed.. ready for a new install. most likely i will want to wipe the drive, then reinstall snow leopard. forget that there may be another OS upgrade in 3 years.
So, all i have is this handy upgrade dvd that I got for $10. Lets say i lost the Leopard disk that came with the imac and all i have is this $10 upgrade dvd.
Will I be able to accomplish the task of reinstalling on my imac with this dvd?
thanks
I want to try and ask this a different way.
I paid the $10 for the upgrade dvd through the apple site using my serial number b/c my brother got a new imac in june.
The disk came and it says uprade dvd on the disk.
Here is how I will ask this question.
Say.. 3 years from now, my imac is kinda hosed.. ready for a new install. most likely i will want to wipe the drive, then reinstall snow leopard. forget that there may be another OS upgrade in 3 years.
So, all i have is this handy upgrade dvd that I got for $10. Lets say i lost the Leopard disk that came with the imac and all i have is this $10 upgrade dvd.
Will I be able to accomplish the task of reinstalling on my imac with this dvd?
thanks