Merom/Core 2 Duo (Mobile) Now Shipping?

[Eidorian]

I said sub-$1000. $999 is sub-$1000. The iMac started out at $1300, and dropped to $800 at one point. Stuff it getting cheaper. I don't know when a cheaper laptop will be coming out, but I'll bet one is.

The iMac hit $799 later in the G3's life and when the G4 came out. Apple was still selling the older G3 as a budget model.

 

[islanders]

We may see a drop in the MB at the end of a production run.

$1099 is very reasonable, esp if it is a quality product…

at that price consumers are going to evaluate features, longevity…

although I think it is a valid point to consider pricing for consumer end.

 

[iBorg20181]

I lost my post up above. So, I’ll try and rephrase.

I don’t think we will see any portables with Merom for MWDC.

Don’t expect Apple to announce early then be up to 6 weeks behind demand on delivery. This could attract negative publicity, negative image.

Historically, Apple has been reluctant to upgrade portable lines, especially ibook, that had strong sales.

Anyone waiting for MBP Merom should be prepared to wait until November/December.

Not likely.

In the "old days" (i.e. pre-Intel) Apple could do this, keep selling outdated technology to clear out inventory before updating processors, graphics cards/chips, etc.

But now that they're competing head-to-head with PC technology, this won't EVER happen. It was not accidental that Yonah debuted on MBP's before Dell, HP and Sony started selling them. No, Apple will have them out of the chute as soon as anyone else does (Intel probably won't give Apple first dibs this time - that was probably a Yonah bribe to get Apple to commit to Intel), which means there's no way we'll be waiting until Christmas (unless some production snafu makes EVERYONE wait that long.)

Announcement in August, shipping in September maybe?



iBorg

 

[macman4291]

upgrade

If the new macbook pros are only different in the chips, will there be a way to upgrade to core 2 duo if you have a previous macbook pros?

 

[islanders]

Not likely.

In the "old days" (i.e. pre-Intel) Apple could do this, keep selling outdated technology to clear out inventory before updating processors, graphics cards/chips, etc.

They had no other choice… g3 or g4.


But now that they're competing head-to-head with PC technology, this won't EVER happen. It was not accidental that Yonah debuted on MBP's before Dell, HP and Sony started selling them. No, Apple will have them out of the chute as soon as anyone else does (Intel probably won't give Apple first dibs this time - that was probably a Yonah bribe to get Apple to commit to Intel), which means there's no way we'll be waiting until Christmas (unless some production snafu makes EVERYONE wait that long.)

Announcement in August, shipping in September maybe?



iBorg

September “maybe” is not to far from November!

Someone had to take a pragmatic position. Might as well be me.

Ok. Merom is going to happen for MBP September (maybe), October and Novermber (probably) December (maybe).

However, it has always been my conviction that not even Apple knows these exact dates. If sales are strong they put off updates, if they are slack they roll out new stuff.

This time Intel jumped the gun so Apple may take longer to respond.

 

[iBorg20181]

If sales are strong they put off updates, if they are slack they roll out new stuff.

This time Intel jumped the gun so Apple may take longer to respond.

You missed my entire point - Apple can't put off updates just because "sales are strong." The "other guys" (Dell, HP, Sony, etc.) upgrade to new technology as soon as they can ramp up production, and Apple won't be, and can't be, "late to the dance" with technology that they all have simultaneous access to. Particularly CPU's. Graphics chips .... well, there they may fudge a bit, especially with 2 brands to select from, but not processor upgrades.

There's no way we'll wait until "November/December," unless Intel fails to deliver Merom, as predicted. If any laptops have Merom sooner, so will Apple.



iBorg

 

[Multimedia]

Processors Are Soldered In MacBooks and MacBook Pros So No Upgrades Are Possible

If the new macbook pros are only different in the chips, will there be a way to upgrade to core 2 duo if you have a previous macbook pros?

No. Processors Are Soldered In MacBooks and MacBook Pros So No Upgrades Are Possible.

The way you do the upgrade is by selling your current model and buying the next one. It's called rolling over your Mac for the next one. Some of us here have done it numerous times. It's not hard to get a good price for your used Mac. By doing this at the beginning of every update, it only cost you a few hundred dollars to move up each time.

 

[islanders]

You missed my entire point - Apple can't put off updates just because "sales are strong." The "other guys" (Dell, HP, Sony, etc.) upgrade to new technology as soon as they can ramp up production, and Apple won't be, and can't be, "late to the dance" with technology that they all have simultaneous access to. Particularly CPU's. Graphics chips .... well, there they may fudge a bit, especially with 2 brands to select from, but not processor upgrades.

There's no way we'll wait until "November/December," unless Intel fails to deliver Merom, as predicted. If any laptops have Merom sooner, so will Apple.



iBorg

I think you have a reluctance to find some common ground, as was suggested in my previous post.

I said November.

You said “September Maybe.”

Which leaves August unlikely, and December pushing it.

However I will stand by my original post, that if I was planning to upgrade to a MBP Merom, I would be prepared to wait until December. As most experts have predicted a switch before the new year.

Otherwise I think everyone understands both schools of thought here, which have already been suggested numerous times in previous post.

Although, I think Apple will hurt themselves more in the long run if they announce an update and can’t meet demand.

 

[DJMastaWes]

Anyone waiting for MBP Merom should be prepared to wait until November/December.

This better not be the case. There is NO way I'm waiting untill then for a MacBook Pro. I don't think apple will wait that long, I think WWDC is likely, and if not I would say at Paris.

 

[Multimedia]

Merom In September MacBook Pros @ 2.33GHz • In November MacBooks @ 2GHz

I said November for Merom MacBook Pros.

You said “September Maybe.”

Which leaves August unlikely, and December pushing it.

However I will stand by my original post, that if I was planning to upgrade to a MBP Merom, I would be prepared to wait until December. As most experts have predicted a switch before the new year.

Otherwise I think everyone understands both schools of thought here, which have already been suggested numerous times in previous post.

Although, I think Apple will hurt themselves more in the long run if they announce an update and can’t meet demand.

I agree with you about November. But not for MBP - for Merom in MacBooks. I think since Merom is already shipping early it's a safe bet we'll see Merom MacBook Pros running @ 2.33GHz in September. November would have to be the drop dead date for Merom MacBooks still running @ 2GHz since above that speed they are way too expensive to go into MacBooks.

This better not be the case. There is NO way I'm waiting untill then for a MacBook Pro. I don't think apple will wait that long, I think WWDC is likely, and if not I would say at Paris.

Exactly. The Tuesday September 12 Paris Apple Expo Keynote is the latest MBP will be announced as "shipping today".

 

[islanders]

Also, I have been inconsistent in my post. On page 5 or so, I was crying for a roll out, then did a 180 after a little research.

Some call it speculation. It's also more fun if you don't research.

I’m going to cut my losses and leave it up to the pros.

I enjoyed the ride. Thanks for the responses!

 

[DJMastaWes]

I agree with you about November. But not for MBP - for Merom in MacBooks. I think since Merom is already shipping early it's a safe bet we'll see Merom MacBook Pros running @ 2.33GHz in September. November would have to be the drop dead date for Merom MacBooks still running @ 2GHz since above that speed they are way too expensive to go into MacBooks.Exactly. The Tuesday September 12 Paris Apple Expo Keynote is the latest MBP will be announced as "shipping today".

I guess I can wait till then. But do you think they will annouce at WWDC, and then say Shipping soon or something, like they did in january?

 

[ezekielrage_99]

Not likely.

In the "old days" (i.e. pre-Intel) Apple could do this, keep selling outdated technology to clear out inventory before updating processors, graphics cards/chips, etc.

But now that they're competing head-to-head with PC technology, this won't EVER happen. It was not accidental that Yonah debuted on MBP's before Dell, HP and Sony started selling them. No, Apple will have them out of the chute as soon as anyone else does (Intel probably won't give Apple first dibs this time - that was probably a Yonah bribe to get Apple to commit to Intel), which means there's no way we'll be waiting until Christmas (unless some production snafu makes EVERYONE wait that long.)

Announcement in August, shipping in September maybe?



iBorg

That's a pretty good analysis, all probability Applw will have to update their products very soon and it wouldn't surprise me to see a new Mac Pro and Macbook Pro update in August.

 

[macman4291]

uodate woth it

No. Processors Are Soldered In MacBooks and MacBook Pros So No Upgrades Are Possible.

The way you do the upgrade is by selling your current model and buying the next one. It's called rolling over your Mac for the next one. Some of us here have done it numerous times. It's not hard to get a good price for your used Mac. By doing this at the beginning of every update, it only cost you a few hundred dollars to move up each time.

Would it be worth it rolling over my 17 in macbook pro, w/ a 2.16 core duo to a macbook pro w/ merom chip and other new attributes. Would there be a significant difference in speed , ect. that would make it worth it. , and if so, what would i do about my registered applecare protection plan?

 

[Multimedia]

MacBook Pros Are Definitely Long In The Tooth

I guess I can wait till then. But do you think they will annouce at WWDC, and then say Shipping soon or something, like they did in january?

It's anybody's guess. They are due a refresh. And with Merom already shipping it's a 50-50 chance Steve will do that. I'm saying September 12 Paris is the latest. WWDC August 7 is certainly possible. I have no clue if he will or not. Anyone else here have a clue? If so, they're probably pulling it out of their butt.

 

[Multimedia]

Applecare Is Transferable To The Next Owner

Would it be worth it rolling over my 17 in macbook pro, w/ a 2.16 core duo to a macbook pro w/ merom chip and other new attributes. Would there be a significant difference in speed , ect. that would make it worth it and if so, what would i do about my registered applecare protection plan?

Your Applecare is transferable to the next owner not to your next Mac. I doubt your 17" top of the line MBP will be much different from the next version. But if they go Black Anodized Aluminum - as some of us think they will (including me) - cosmetically it will be very different. Best way to stay current is to sell on eve of or right at the point of the announcement. If you can swing it, buying the next one before selling what you have is the easiest way since you don't have to be without one.

I'm looking for:

1. Merom @ 2.33 GHz
2. User Upgradable HD like in the MacBook
3. 4GB RAM possible
4. Santa Rosa chipset (not due 'til Spring '07)
5. 17" like you have
6. Black Anodized Aluminum
7. 802.11n
8. 10-Gigabit Ethernet
10. Leopard Onboard
11. Refurbished

So I'm gonna only go refurb MacBook meanwhile if anything at all. I really spend most of my time on the Quad since it is so powerful. I'm multitasking something fierce lately. But I don't want 4 other cores. I want 8 with Leopard. So I'm pretty much in a holding pattern until all the above happen on the mobile front. I will especially NOT pull the trigger until they redesign to make upgrading the HD as easy as it is to do on the lowly MacBook.

 

[spetznatz]

Aplogies if this has been done before, and it's a little off-topic, but this is a link to an article about OS X performance on Core 2 Extreme (Conroe)

http://www.tbreak.com/reviews/article.php?id=461

Basically, they've installed a "floating" copy of OS X intel onto an intel mobo with C2E.

I thought this line was particularly impressive:

"These last two tests were also conducted on that same PC with Windows installed and we see the Mac performing as well as Windows in Cinebench and a mere 3% slower in Photoshop which is especially impressive considering that Photoshop CS2 was running under Rosetta on the Mac. "

Who needs to wait for CS3?

Edit: on reflection, I'm not sure if I believe this...do you think it might be a hoax?

 

[daneoni]

Aplogies if this has been done before, and it's a little off-topic, but this is a link to an article about OS X performance on Core 2 Extreme (Conroe)

http://www.tbreak.com/reviews/article.php?id=461

Basically, they've installed a "floating" copy of OS X intel onto an intel mobo with C2E.

I thought this line was particularly impressive:

"These last two tests were also conducted on that same PC with Windows installed and we see the Mac performing as well as Windows in Cinebench and a mere 3% slower in Photoshop which is especially impressive considering that Photoshop CS2 was running under Rosetta on the Mac. "

Who needs to wait for CS3?

Edit: on reflection, I'm not sure if I believe this...do you think it might be a hoax?

Yeah something just doesnt feel right. OS X recognises a 2.93GHz chip as 4GHz? and since when does Apple put in CPU features in system profiler?

 

[Half Glass]

I know about CPU features and I say sell your P-Mac!

Yeah something just doesnt feel right. OS X recognises a 2.93GHz chip as 4GHz? and since when does Apple put in CPU features in system profiler?

Ok, so I hate to admit it, but I can confirm from my experimental days that OSX 86 reports at least P4 CPUs innaccurately as mentioned above. The system profiler in OSX86 does attempt to describe the chip. My HT P4 2.4 GHz was reported as a 3.something. Don't know if it was the hyperthreading or the HT coupled with the OSX86 hacked version itself was the problem in the reporting.

I can say that I never got anywhere in terms of stability with the experiment. Video card was the biggest problem. Hey, I was curious.

I still have an eMac (wife's) and just like Multimedia mentioned above, I sold my PowerMac dual 2.0 last week for top $$ before the new ones are released. Have you ever met anyone who made a profit on a computer 9 months later? Bought the dual processor from the apple store *right* after the dual cores were announced. They took $500 off. I can't believe what people are paying on eBay knowing that the change is days away. But, they still got a great machine below current market value.

Since I don't make a living on my Mac and I have my wife's for email/internet I can go without one for a few weeks (but it's hard!). I am anxiously awaiting the announcements with Conroe/Merom. I bought my P-Mac only because of the original deal I got. With the $$ from it's sale, I don't know if I'll be getting a P-Mac or an iMac.

Add my name to the list of people wanting a midrange tower.

--Half Glass

 

[Eidorian]

Ok, so I hate to admit it, but I can confirm from my experimental days that OSX 86 reports at least P4 CPUs innaccurately as mentioned above. The system profiler in OSX86 does attempt to describe the chip. My HT P4 2.4 GHz was reported as a 3.something. Don't know if it was the hyperthreading or the HT coupled with the OSX86 hacked version itself was the problem in the reporting.

Yeah, OS X seems to report non-standard Intel chips as "Genuine Intel". I wouldn't be surprised if it goes into a debug mode.

 

[Willis]

hmm, just checked the Apple Edu Store (UK) and i noticed the 20" iMac was a 5-7 day. Checked the standard Store, same thing. Wonder if that means they may put the Merom/Conroe in a 20" and keep the yonah in the 17?

Most likely not, but no harm in having a shot in the dark.

 

[bryanc]

I'll buy as soon as they upgrade the MBP to merom

I'm going to be using my laptop for teaching in the fall, which means some fairly strenuous 3D molecular rendering, large movies, wireless internet and standard keynote (all simultaneously, of course), as well as the standard day-to-day chores.

I could manage with my ageing G4 AlBook (it continues to run like a champ, but it's a bit slow for the 3D molecular rendering, and it staggers a little with the big animations) but it occurred to me that, even with daily backups, should I have a catastrophic system failure, I couldn't get a replacement in time for the next lecture. So I've decided to buy a new laptop, and keep my venerable G4 AlBook as a backup system.

But I want any new system to be 64-bit, and otherwise as 'future-proof' as possible, so I'm going to hold out for the new merom-based MBPs. I'm really excited about the possibility of going top-of-the-line for the first time ever. I'm hoping for a system that looks like this:

17" anodized black MBP, with 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo CPU, 1 GB RAM, a 7200 rpm 120 GB HD, 802.11n, and a blu-ray Superdrive. Should be just over $3k with my educational discount, right?

Cheers

 

[Surreal]

I bought the 17" MBP the day it came out and i must say;


i don't care about these new chips.


that feels really good.


thank you apple. finally.

 

[Multimedia]

Pro Macs - No Blu-ray, No 802.11n yet, No 2.66GHz Merom yet

I'm going to be using my laptop for teaching in the fall, which means some fairly strenuous 3D molecular rendering, large movies, wireless internet and standard keynote (all simultaneously, of course), as well as the standard day-to-day chores.

I could manage with my ageing G4 AlBook (it continues to run like a champ, but it's a bit slow for the 3D molecular rendering, and it staggers a little with the big animations) but it occurred to me that, even with daily backups, should I have a catastrophic system failure, I couldn't get a replacement in time for the next lecture. So I've decided to buy a new laptop, and keep my venerable G4 AlBook as a backup system.

But I want any new system to be 64-bit, and otherwise as 'future-proof' as possible, so I'm going to hold out for the new memrom-based MBPs. I'm really excited about the possibility of going top-of-the-line for the first time ever. I'm hoping for a system that looks like this:

17" anodized black MBP, with 2.66 GHz Core 2 Duo CPU, 1 GB RAM, a 7200 rpm 120 GB HD, 802.11n, and a blu-ray Superdrive. Should be just over $3k with my educational discount, right?

Some of your feature list is not imminent. Blu-ray is too expensive. 802.11n is still another 6+ months off. Merom tops out at 2.33GHz for now.

 

[Multimedia]

How Much Did You Get and How Did You Sell The Dual 2 GHz G5 PowerMac?

I sold my PowerMac dual 2.0 last week for top $$ before the new ones are released. Have you ever met anyone who made a profit on a computer 9 months later? Bought the dual processor from the apple store *right* after the dual cores were announced. They took $500 off. I can't believe what people are paying on eBay knowing that the change is days away. But, they still got a great machine below current market value.

So how much did you sell it for and what technique did you use to sell it?

BYW I would advise against selling a G5 Quad no matter how much more powerful the Intel Quad is. The first and only PPC with 4 cores is a true collectors' item that I would encourage anyone to buy instead of a Conroe Core 2 Duo Mac Pro. 4 cores trumps 2 cores no matter what the processor.

Wonder if that's true or not.