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Of course you are right on one side that some big players are moving in this direction. On the other hand there is the enormous success of Apples AppStores be it on iOS or on the Mac.

To me it is important to have legacy software still working and around in case I need to access old files.

I would not say the AppStore is an enormous success.

The iOS AppStore is the only way of people obtaining software for their iPhones and iPads, either they like it or not. The AppStore has only reached 75 billion downloads of its 1.2 million apps because users cannot choose an alternative to download their apps from (at least not without jaibreaking their devices). Its "success" is, therefore, directly linked to the success of the iPhone and the iPad.

As for the AppStore for OS X, I would not call it a success. I have seen an Apple press release stating that there were 100 million downloads from the Mac AppStore, which is a far cry from what the iOS AppStore achieved. And many of the most important and feature-rich programs for Mac are not available at the AppStore, such as Microsoft Office (which is by far the most popular paid software for the Mac), Adobe Creative Suite (Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, etc), Google Chrome, Mozilla Firefox, and so on.
 
I would not say the AppStore is an enormous success.

The iOS AppStore is the only way of people obtaining software for their iPhones and iPads, either they like it or not. The AppStore has only reached 75 billion downloads of its 1.2 million apps because users cannot choose an alternative to download their apps from (at least not without jaibreaking their devices). Its "success" is, therefore, directly linked to the success of the iPhone and the iPad.

As for the AppStore for OS X, I would not call it a success. I have seen an Apple press release stating that there were 100 million downloads from the Mac AppStore, which is a far cry from what the iOS AppStore achieved. And many of the most important and feature-rich programs for Mac are not available at the AppStore, such as Microsoft Office (which is by far the most popular paid software for the Mac), Adobe Creative Suite (Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, etc), Google Chrome, Mozilla Firefox, and so on.

While I don't entirely agree with your dismissal that the App Store is an "enormous" success, I do agree with your other statements.

Any store will be successful if it is or ONLY store. I'm sure many developers wish they could bypass the iOS App Store and it's 30% share of revenue if they could.

The Mac App Store however, is not the only place to download content. Developers like Microsoft and Adobe will not want to give up their 30% when they don't have to. Additionally, apps sold through the App Store have artificial limitations placed on them due to Apple's sandbox rules and many developers want to add functionality that the App Store simply won't allow. I have purchased software from the MAS simply because it's dead easy and straight forward, but I also will get it directly from the developer.
 
While I don't entirely agree with your dismissal that the App Store is an "enormous" success, I do agree with your other statements.

Any store will be successful if it is or ONLY store. I'm sure many developers wish they could bypass the iOS App Store and it's 30% share of revenue if they could.

The Mac App Store however, is not the only place to download content. Developers like Microsoft and Adobe will not want to give up their 30% when they don't have to. Additionally, apps sold through the App Store have artificial limitations placed on them due to Apple's sandbox rules and many developers want to add functionality that the App Store simply won't allow. I have purchased software from the MAS simply because it's dead easy and straight forward, but I also will get it directly from the developer.

Yes. Agreed. And this is why I think neither App Store can be considered an enormous success in itself.

As for the next version of Office for Mac, there are no signs of it yet.
 
One thing that bothers me is how Microsoft Office 2011 is inferior to its Windows counterpart.

A mim também.
Me too!

However, people on this forum are usually more interested in discussing how Microsoft and Office are a pile of crap and how Office 365 is not worth it. In my view, these discussions are worthless.

Concordo plenamente.
I couldn't agree with you more.

I would like to see big improvements in the next Office for Mac.

Eu também.
Same here.

Still, I don't know if it will keep the same features. I hope Microsoft does not remove any feature (such as it did with the iPad version). On the opposite: I sincerely hope more feature parity with the Windows version.

Nem mais, incluindo a já muito esperada tradução do GUI para Português.
Exactly, including the long overdue localization in Portuguese.
 
As for the next version of Office for Mac, there are no signs of it yet.

I really have to say that I'm shocked about this. I originally assumed it would be out within the first quarter of 2014 like the 2011 version was. I was surprised when they failed that date, but then they released Office for iPad and thought surely Office for Mac would follow by July. Nope.

I would have bet money that it would be out or announced by August 31 and the "back to school" season. I really am astounded and have absolutely no idea. If it isn't announced after Yosemite than I assume not this year at all.
 
I really have to say that I'm shocked about this.
I'm not, I've been a Mac user for so long, that I've seen MS leave the Mac Platform, come back and then very very slowly update the office suite.

Am I disappointed yeah a bit, but this isn't anything new unfortunately.
 
A mim também.

Me too!







Concordo plenamente.

I couldn't agree with you more.







Eu também.

Same here.







Nem mais, incluindo a já muito esperada tradução do GUI para Português.

Exactly, including the long overdue localization in Portuguese.


Great. Nice to see other Portuguese-speakers here.

I am not concerned about the Portuguese localization, though. It would be nice, but I can do without it.

What I cannot do without is the lack of features and the instability of Mac Office. Yesterday, Word for Mac crashed at 2am and I lost part of my work. I cannot even remember when was the last time Word for Windows crashed.

----------

I really have to say that I'm shocked about this. I originally assumed it would be out within the first quarter of 2014 like the 2011 version was. I was surprised when they failed that date, but then they released Office for iPad and thought surely Office for Mac would follow by July. Nope.



I would have bet money that it would be out or announced by August 31 and the "back to school" season. I really am astounded and have absolutely no idea. If it isn't announced after Yosemite than I assume not this year at all.


This is really very annoying. No annoucement so far. No beta version. Not even a screenshot. Nothing. Mac Office may not see the light of day before 2015.

----------

I'm not, I've been a Mac user for so long, that I've seen MS leave the Mac Platform, come back and then very very slowly update the office suite.



Am I disappointed yeah a bit, but this isn't anything new unfortunately.


I am not a Mac user for so long. And, honestly, if Microsoft keeps neglecting it and Apples does not do anything to make things better, then perhaps I will not be a Mac user for a long time from now.

I am basically left without choice and I must use Office for Windows under BootCamp or Parallels if I want a decent office suite. Parallels makes Windows run slower in my 15-inch retina MacBook Pro than in a crap Windows laptop. And BootCamp has bad drivers for the trackpad. And, in any case, I still have to buy a Windows license. Sometimes I think it would be smarter just to buy a Windows laptop instead.
 
then perhaps I will not be a Mac user for a long time from now.
I'm not trying to sound coy, but don't you think that's what MS wants? I mean true they have their MacBu unit for Apple stuff but clearly if they can get people to use Windows its a win for them. Why should they work hard and fast at providing an office suite to OS X when a delay may annoy people to the point that they just give up on Macs.

As for apple reacting to this, they made their strategic decision with iWork and that is lacking imo, so don't expect any major improvements there.
 
I'm not trying to sound coy, but don't you think that's what MS wants? I mean true they have their MacBu unit for Apple stuff but clearly if they can get people to use Windows its a win for them. Why should they work hard and fast at providing an office suite to OS X when a delay may annoy people to the point that they just give up on Macs.

Well, perhaps this delay is part of a greater strategy to make people give up Macs. If it is, then it seems to be working out well.

However, even though I think feature parity between Windows and Mac versions is not on Microsoft's best interests, I am more inclined to think that this is not the case. The whole user base of Mac users is just a fraction of the user base of Microsoft Office for Windows. Therefore, budget for the Windows version should be over a billion dollars per year right now. It just doesn't make business sense to spend as much money in the Mac Office, as it will never pay off. As a result, it is hard to imagine that Mac Office will ever be as good as Windows Office.

Office for Mac will never make help Apple in taking over the Windows world anyway. The cheapest Mac available is more expensive than what most users, both businesses and consumers, are willing to pay for a computer. Therefore, even if Office for Mac was as good as Office for Windows, people would still buy Windows laptops. I doubt Office for Mac plays a big part in people's choice of computers.

As for apple reacting to this, they made their strategic decision with iWork and that is lacking imo, so don't expect any major improvements there.

As much as I understand Microsoft's decision to delay Office for Mac (either for strategic or bugetary reasons), I cannot swallow Apple's decision not to make something to compensate this lack. Does Apple want OS X to become a consumer-driven platform and to make Macs a more expensive version of its iToys? If this is the case, then I am out.
 
As much as I understand Microsoft's decision to delay Office for Mac (either for strategic or bugetary reasons), I cannot swallow Apple's decision not to make something to compensate this lack. Does Apple want OS X to become a consumer-driven platform and to make Macs a more expensive version of its iToys? If this is the case, then I am out.
Actually yes, I think that IS Apples's plan. The MacBook Air debuted at $1800. Now they start at $900. Has Apple dramatically dropped the price on any other hardware as much as 50% over the product's life cycle?

Apple detractors have beaten th "apple products are overpriced boutique items" for so long that many people believe it. So When Apple introduced the iPad at $400, it set $400 as the high bar for 10" tablets... And every tablet that debuted at a higher price than that failed to sell in significant numbers compared to the iPad.

There's more to the hardware angle, but I'll try to bring it back on topic... The one thing that I've noticed in the last 6-7 years is apple moving away from software. When I purchased my first Mac-anything, 6 years ago, it came bundled with an amazing array of software (I'm including iWork and iLife for a nominal additional charge) that made it virtually unnecessary to purchase additional software.

But now it seems like apple has ratcheted things down software-wise to make the platform more attractive to developers. That is a positive thing for Apple in the long run, but not so good for consumers on the short.

With Ms office for Mac we're seeing the downside... an external vendor can have a more than insignificant impact on the platform...and as you mentioned may drive some off of it.

I have a cheap windows notebook (Lenovo S400 touch, 14" Ultrabook wannabe, $300) that I use when I'll have a marathon Office work session. It is ultimately better than wrestling with Office for Mac.

My hope is that Office 365 evens out the income stream for Microsot that they see the financial advantage of having parity between windows and Mac versions.
 
There's more to the hardware angle, but I'll try to bring it back on topic... The one thing that I've noticed in the last 6-7 years is apple moving away from software. When I purchased my first Mac-anything, 6 years ago, it came bundled with an amazing array of software (I'm including iWork and iLife for a nominal additional charge) that made it virtually unnecessary to purchase additional software.

But now it seems like apple has ratcheted things down software-wise to make the platform more attractive to developers. That is a positive thing for Apple in the long run, but not so good for consumers on the short.

This is exactly what makes me sad, and it's so true. When I bought my first Mac a little over three years ago it came with Snow Leopard and iLife and I purchased iWork. I remember doing heavy research before I purchased it and one of the main draws wasn't actually the hardware, but the software. Mac's came with truly amazing and intuitive software for the general consumer and some prosumers. I used the old Garageband, iPhoto, iMovie, Pages, and Keynote extensively. I also used iDVD to help make a wedding video. It was amazing and I received so many complements.

But now I'm really sad to think about it. I do admit that I love many of the updates to OS X such as the better gesture support, Memory compression, fullscreen mode, and the notification style (not center). But I am also sad to see how both OS X and Windows have been driven more and more into the general consumer. I hate all the Facebook and twitter integration and you can't hide it! I don't use either! The new version of both iMovie and Garageband is pathetic. I tried to use both for a personal and a school project and they couldn't do what the old versions did. I had to rescue the old versions from my TM backup. And iWork, it's just depressing.

Apple really stepped up their notebook hardware game with the retina Macs and they have a beautiful iMac and Mac pro (I won't get into the notebook level hardware inside the iMac :( ), but their software has taken a dramatic hit. I don't care if they are trying to spawn developer interest. I'm cautious of developers because they change or drop support for their products just like the lack of support for MS Office for Mac which is a vital part of my workflow. I trusted the software FROM the computer supplier, I thought Apple would be a safe bet for continual improvement, but I was burned...badly.

----------

I am not a Mac user for so long.

I will never leave one company and go for another because they make terrible software for my current platform. I left Microsoft for Apple because Apple offered things I wanted. If Microsoft really wanted me then they should make an AMAZING Office suite with great OneDrive performance and cross platform compatibility. I would see the quality software and think "maybe I should give windows another try," but I will not say "gee Microsoft really gave me some crappy software, maybe I should migrate to their OS and see if it's better."

----------

I'm not trying to sound coy, but don't you think that's what MS wants?

It is what they want, by like I said above, I think they are doing it in the wrong manner.
 
Does Apple want OS X to become a consumer-driven platform and to make Macs a more expensive version of its iToys? If this is the case, then I am out.
Simple answer is yes.

Just look to how apple gutted iWork, FCPX, killing Aperture (for a more consumer focused alternative). Simple answer is Apple was never interested in the enterprise sector, they had a strong following in the professional/creative sector but they're largely moving away from that. They're a consumer electronics company. I wouldn't expect Apple to provide an application that matched or surpassed MS Office, its simply out of their plans.
 
Additionally, the subscription model has dramatically helped with Microsoft's licensing issues. When my old system kept failing I had to reinstall Office 3 times in a month. The old box way would have resulted in headaches and several calls to customer support, now I can just use the web interface. I'm very impressed.

Couldn't agree more. Adobe and iTunes have always allowed you to deactivate a computer. It's so nice to be able to manage Office licenses this way too now. In fact it's even better than Adobe and Apple which (I think) require one to deactivate from the apps themselves on that particular computer. This is of no help if you have a problem and you've lost the ability to boot. With Office you can remotely deactivate licenses online after the fact. Very convenient.
 
Actually yes, I think that IS Apples's plan. The MacBook Air debuted at $1800. Now they start at $900. Has Apple dramatically dropped the price on any other hardware as much as 50% over the product's life cycle?

While I am not so sure about this, I agree that Apple has substantially dropped the prices of its products. Perhaps it is just its survival instinct on the market. Nobody would buy a MacBook Air these days for US$ 1,800.

We will see whether Apple's strategy is to keep the Mac affordable when it releases the retina MacBook Air. I guess it will keep a price tag similar to the current one, but some people say it will be substantially more expensive.

Apple detractors have beaten th "apple products are overpriced boutique items" for so long that many people believe it. So When Apple introduced the iPad at $400, it set $400 as the high bar for 10" tablets... And every tablet that debuted at a higher price than that failed to sell in significant numbers compared to the iPad.

Actually, Apple products are expensive boutique items, although not necessarily overpriced. The non-retina MacBook Pro, with a 1280x800 display and an Ivy Bridge processor, is definitely overpriced at US$ 1,199. And some retina MacBook Pros have rivals in the PC world selling for less. I would say that the MacBook Pro is expensive and a little overpriced, although not much.

There's more to the hardware angle, but I'll try to bring it back on topic... The one thing that I've noticed in the last 6-7 years is apple moving away from software. When I purchased my first Mac-anything, 6 years ago, it came bundled with an amazing array of software (I'm including iWork and iLife for a nominal additional charge) that made it virtually unnecessary to purchase additional software.

Yes. Apple is focused on hardware, and it delivers great hardware indeed (at least when it upgrades them). However, it is not delivering good software.

But now it seems like apple has ratcheted things down software-wise to make the platform more attractive to developers. That is a positive thing for Apple in the long run, but not so good for consumers on the short.

With Ms office for Mac we're seeing the downside... an external vendor can have a more than insignificant impact on the platform...and as you mentioned may drive some off of it.

I hope Swift is helpful for developers.

However, I still think Apple should focus more on software. OS X cannot rely on small developers. The big ones are developing software for Windows, which is where the money is. Microsoft makes a great Office for Windows not only because it sells Windows, but also because of the potential sales in the Windows platform. The same happens with Adobe and every other large developer.

If Apple does not make good software for the Mac, how is the Mac supposed to compete with Windows in terms of software, considering that 90% of computers run Windows?

I have a cheap windows notebook (Lenovo S400 touch, 14" Ultrabook wannabe, $300) that I use when I'll have a marathon Office work session. It is ultimately better than wrestling with Office for Mac.

It is just disappointing to know that a US$ 300 laptop can handle office tasks better than an über-expensive retina MacBook Pro.

My hope is that Office 365 evens out the income stream for Microsot that they see the financial advantage of having parity between windows and Mac versions.

Perhaps. I don't know if there is a financial advantage in this. But perhaps there is at least a strategic advantage, as Microsoft has the chance to keep users away from iWork.

----------

Simple answer is yes.

Just look to how apple gutted iWork, FCPX, killing Aperture (for a more consumer focused alternative). Simple answer is Apple was never interested in the enterprise sector, they had a strong following in the professional/creative sector but they're largely moving away from that. They're a consumer electronics company. I wouldn't expect Apple to provide an application that matched or surpassed MS Office, its simply out of their plans.

It looks like so.

But there is a difference.

Final Cut Pro and Aperture are apps for those "creative professionals" who were always leaned towards Apple products anyway. However, these users are a specific niche, as not everybody works with photos or videos.

An office suite is something completely different. Even if we think that a Mac is a computer designed for consumers, there is always someone who works in a household. It is likely that this consumer wants to use his Mac to produce some work at home, or wants to take his MacBook to work. And it is likely that this consumer works in an office or in a firm or somewhere else where he needs to use an office suite. So, the lack of a good office suite can be a disappointment for consumers who will occasionally use their computers for doing work.

People are people, after all. A person may be a consumer, but he is also likely to be a professional. I don't want to have two computers, one for my "consumer persona" and other for my "professional persona". I want just one that can do it all. If it has to be a PC, then be it.
 
Maybe I'm in the minority, in fact, I'm sure I am. But I'm still using Office 2008 on a daily basis and it works just fine for me.
 
Can you sync calendars in Outlook between machines? If so, how's it done?

Thanks

Well, I use iCloud calendar. You can sync this with Windows Outlook via Apple's iCloud Control Panel for Windows. iOS doesn't yet have Outlook and I believe you can add it to OS X Outlook just like any other service, but I'm not sure.

You have to have a cloud-based calendar (iCloud, Google, Outlook.com) in order to sync it between multiple machines. If you're just using a local (offline) calendar in Outlook you can sync that across without exporting it and putting on a flash drive or something.
 
Can you sync calendars in Outlook between machines? If so, how's it done?



Thanks


I do use Outlook with a MS Exchange account and it syncs nicely with iOS Mail. However, if you don't have an Exchange account, I don't know if and how it works, especially if Outlook is not available for the platform.
 
Maybe I'm in the minority, in fact, I'm sure I am. But I'm still using Office 2008 on a daily basis and it works just fine for me.


Of course it depends on your needs. If you don't need Office for complex documents, just for basic and everyday stuff, then the 2008 version may be enough. Even for some more complex needs, Office 2008 can satisfy you.

But then, again, there are other options that may suit your needs depending on what your needs are and how high you set the bar. iWork and LibreOffice are both fine solutions that may suit the needs of a lot of users, especially those who do not require a very sophisticated set of features.

However, what if you need these very sophisticated features which only Office for Windows, in its latest version, offers? Then Mac users are out of luck.

That is why the Mac is an inferior platform for Office work. And Office work is a big part of what people use computers for. If Office work was something people paid attention when comparing Windows to Mac, then perhaps Apple would focus more on making it better. But Apple is focusing even on games and not making any improvements in Office apps.
 
I do use Outlook with a MS Exchange account and it syncs nicely with iOS Mail. However, if you don't have an Exchange account, I don't know if and how it works, especially if Outlook is not available for the platform.

I use Outlook for my home email stuff (iCloud, and outlook.com) and it works well, I don't have anything set up for exchange.

Of course it depends on your needs. If you don't need Office for complex documents, just for basic and everyday stuff, then the 2008 version may be enough. Even for some more complex needs, Office 2008 can satisfy you.
I wouldn't even go as far and say complex, for example Numbers is very poor at handling some basic tasks, and inputting data can be awkward, its not as smooth as Excel.

True there is the open source options like Libra Office which is good, and I'd recommend that, but I think you can't go wrong with MS Office, its an industry standard and it will do everything you need it too.
 
I use Outlook for my home email stuff (iCloud, and outlook.com) and it works well, I don't have anything set up for exchange.





I wouldn't even go as far and say complex, for example Numbers is very poor at handling some basic tasks, and inputting data can be awkward, its not as smooth as Excel.



True there is the open source options like Libra Office which is good, and I'd recommend that, but I think you can't go wrong with MS Office, its an industry standard and it will do everything you need it too.


Yes. You are absolutely right about iWork. iWork cannot handle even simple tasks in several cases. Pages cannot even split a footnote in two pages, which is something unthinkable of any reasonable word processor. iWork is part of the iToys series of Apple products, Fun to play with, but completely useless if you want to do some serious and complex stuff.

As for not going wrong with MS Office, I am not truly convinced of that. Office 2013 for Windows is definitely a great piece of software and you cannot go wrong with it. I would recommend it any time over any other product as it is miles ahead of competition.

I cannot say the same about Office for Mac, though. This weeked I was working on a 10-page text on Word 2011. Characters got messed up frequently, and Word even crashed. I cannot remember when was the last time Word for Windows crashed. It was before Word 2007, and it never crashed since then. And I used it. I wrote an entire PhD thesis in Word 2010 for Windows and it did not crash even once. Word 2011 for Mac crashed while I was writing a 10-page piece.
 
Can some one explain to me whats the difference between Office 365 and Office in OneDrive?

I know 365 probably has the advanced features, but for like 90% of the people out there whats on OneDrive is more than enough and its free! It works just like a desktop app. Its not sluggish or anything, not sure how it runs, but just a couple of years ago it was like a dream to have in-browser apps work as good as this.


am I missing something? People used to buy Office just to write simple documents.
 
Can some one explain to me whats the difference between Office 365 and Office in OneDrive?

I know 365 probably has the advanced features, but for like 90% of the people out there whats on OneDrive is more than enough and its free! It works just like a desktop app. Its not sluggish or anything, not sure how it runs, but just a couple of years ago it was like a dream to have in-browser apps work as good as this.


am I missing something? People used to buy Office just to write simple documents.
Office 365 is the name for renting MS Office that is downloaded and locally installed on your device. It is identical to a shrink wrapped copy of MS office. It is the full deal.

Office on OneDrive is not full office. There are many features missing and one must be connected to the internet to use it.

I use Office for OneDrive on my HP Chromebook and I'm extremely impressed with it... But it is only for basic documents.
 
I currently use Parallels as we use a piece of software proprietary to my industry and only available on Windows. As a result, I also use Office 2013 (Which I prefer over 2011 or iWorks).

That being said...Parallels has quite an impact on battery life and overall performance. I would much prefer to limit my use of Parallels to the 1 application, and only when I need it. I hope the day when a new Office for Mac comes is soon.
 
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