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dswoodley

macrumors 6502a
Jul 18, 2002
538
1
Microsoft thinks iTunes will fail

Everyone read this article ?

Fester thinks MS customers want choices and Apple doesn't give any. Why does this comment seem strange to me?:rolleyes:
 

1macker1

macrumors 65816
Oct 9, 2003
1,375
0
A Higher Level
I sorta see what he is trying to say. It's a valid point. If a person buys from the other Music stores, they can use the same MP3 player, but is they buy from the Apple store they are stuck with the iPod. (not that's a bad device to be stuck with). Either Apple need to support WMA or the others need to start supporting AAC.
 

Le Big Mac

macrumors 68030
Jan 7, 2003
2,729
305
Washington, DC
I saw that (or some quotes from it). It's typical spin. Basically, Microsoft is saying iTunes is bad because "you ought to use our proprietary standard." It's likely garbage: the market will sort this out, or Microsoft will use it's heavy-handed tactics to assure that WMA/WMP wins out.

What it really means is that Microsoft is actually pretty scared that people will reject its standard and use another one that they don't control. If Apple's claim of 31% market share for the ipod is right, then MS does have something to be worried about. 3% they can dismiss as irrelevant, but 31% is significant enough to matter. If that many folks are downloading songs that are AAC encoded, that will win out over WMA/WMP. Once others adopt AAC playback (which they'll have to, to compete with the iPod), fewer cos. will have any reason to bother with WMA format. MS loses for once.

So the real question is who blinks first: Apple supporting WMA on iTunes/iPod or all the other vendors of mp3 players supporting AAC as well, so they can play iTunes songs? I'm guessing the other vendors, because they have an incentive to market players that can play any format, whereas Apple has an incentive to hold tight.
 

1macker1

macrumors 65816
Oct 9, 2003
1,375
0
A Higher Level
I think apple is jumping the gun with the iTMS for Windows. I mean what windows users is really going to get rid of their WMA for AAC. I think (and i could be wrong) that most people by PC's due to their low cost. Why would apple think people would flock to the iTMS and have to buy and ipod (299.99 for the low end) when they can get WMA, MP3, music player for 100 dollers. Sure it's not the same quality as the iPod, but if they were worried about quality, they'd be using a Mac to begin with.:)
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,316
5,642
I'd ask people not make this a WMA vs AAC quality thread.

People have expressed their opinions on whether one format is "better" than the other. The point is, I think... it doesn't matter for this discussion.

arn
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,316
5,642
My personal opinion is that I would be more worried if Apple had just released iTunes for Windows as is... without the partnerships.

I think mind-share has a lot to do with successful adoption.

If you get enough people to start with iTunes... then I think it won't matter... people will stick with it.

Apple DOES need to try to increase their AAC/Fairplay (DRM) licensing. I know Apple makes a fair amount of money on the iPod... but there's room in the market for other 3rd party mp3/aac players.

I can't tell how someone can get a FairPlay license. Is it through Apple or is it actually part of AAC/MPEG4?

arn
 

dswoodley

macrumors 6502a
Jul 18, 2002
538
1
Originally posted by arn
I'd ask people not make this a WMA vs AAC quality thread.

People have expressed their opinions on whether one format is "better" than the other. The point is, I think... it doesn't matter for this discussion.

arn

I agree...my point was what a bunch of hypocrites MS is (are? whatever)! WMA vs AAC has been done to death.
 

Steve M

macrumors newbie
Jan 28, 2002
22
0
You can play music in just about every format BUT WMA. So if you rip your own CD's, or import your music collection from other sources, you can still play all that music.

The only limitation is that you can't play music from Napster 2.0, MusicMatch, or the other services. And I'm willing to bet that iTunes and iPod will be playing WMA files within the next few months...

This article is horribly misleading, but what do you expect from a Microsoft employee. Wonder if they're going to pay MP3 manufacturers to NOT support AAC? Hmmm...
 

panphage

macrumors 6502
Jul 1, 2003
496
0
But both iTunes and the iPod use MP3 just fine. So MS and the wma-only download services can bite a big one. It's so funny that these people are criticizing apple for using one closed, proprietary format that locks users out rather than using another closed, proprietary format that locks users out. If people have a player that only plays mp3s, they can't use ANY of these download services.
 

usingmac

macrumors newbie
Oct 9, 2003
11
0
boston
Why Window's Media Part of MP4 Standard

This Microspec bafoon contradicts his own words as to why Microsoft has chosen not to become part of the MP4 standard.

Teenagers are not stupid. I think Microsoft is thinking they are.


When they use Itunes, they will see what the word "class act" means.
 

cgmpowers

macrumors regular
Mar 21, 2002
129
0
Commercial on XM Radio....

I was listening to a commercial on XM Radio, only caught the tail end of it..

It was telling you about how you can download songs off the Internet and it cost "x" amount a month and then an additional price per CD burn...

Yeah, it wasn't iTunes...I don't know what service it wasy but it sounded great.

I really would rather pay a monthly service fee and THEN pay each and every damned time I burned a CD...

Now if that's not limiting...I sure the hell don't know what is...

Hahaha...I think I'll stick with iTunes. 400,000 songs and I purchased 500 so far...I think I'm happy where I am. No monthly subscription, $0.99 a song, unlimited burns at no additional cost..

Christopher
 

VIREBEL661

macrumors regular
Feb 24, 2003
241
0
My impression of this whole thing is that this service is INTENDED to be for iPod users, right? Not for all the competition. Apple isn't setting this up to be THE windoze solution for audio, rather, it's the Apple solution for windoze users with an iPod. Just added support for Apple's product, which other companies will have a hard time matching. Granted, it has a lot of extra bells and whistles for those who don't use it for the iPod support, but that's the primary market in my opinion.
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,316
5,642
Originally posted by VIREBEL661
My impression of this whole thing is that this service is INTENDED to be for iPod users, right? Not for all the competition. Apple isn't setting this up to be THE windoze solution for audio, rather, it's the Apple solution for windoze users with an iPod. Just added support for Apple's product, which other companies will have a hard time matching. Granted, it has a lot of extra bells and whistles for those who don't use it for the iPod support, but that's the primary market in my opinion.

no, I think that's backward.... the iTunes Music Store for Windows is to sell iPods, and eventually Macs.

Apple's basically said so.


arn
 

yamabushi

macrumors 65816
Oct 6, 2003
1,009
1
AAC is owned by Dolby and Apple uses it under license. There is no reason that I can see why manufacturers wouldn't simply add the capability to use AAC to future digital music devices.
 

racolvin

macrumors newbie
Jul 17, 2002
10
0
Madison, AL
Speaking as a Windows user ...

Originally posted by 1macker1
I think apple is jumping the gun with the iTMS for Windows. I mean what windows users is really going to get rid of their WMA for AAC. I think (and i could be wrong) that most people by PC's due to their low cost. Why would apple think people would flock to the iTMS and have to buy and ipod (299.99 for the low end) when they can get WMA, MP3, music player for 100 dollers. Sure it's not the same quality as the iPod, but if they were worried about quality, they'd be using a Mac to begin with.:)

.. I can tell you I've got over 5500 legit songs on my computer (ripped from my personal CD collection) and not a single one of them is WMA. I haven't bought any songs from the prior crop of music stores BECAUSE they were WMA with all the DRM crap associated with it and the fact that no MP3 player I wanted would play them anyway.

I downloaded iTunes for Windows last night, installed it, ran it played with it for 20 minutes and promptly removed MusicMatch Jukebox Plus (that I paid $$ for a lifetime upgrade for). After removing MusicMatch I promptly played with iTunes some more, ripped a CD, burned a playlist, registered for the iTunes Music Store and bought $10 worth of music - all in under a further 20 minutes.

Micrososoft and WMA format can kiss my ease-of-use-loving arse. I may even be a Mac user by this time next year but I can guarantee I'll be a proud 40G iPod owner by Christmas of this year.

If lack of support for WMA is Apple's only weakness in iTunes, then they have very little to worry about. That'd be like saying Cindy Crawford is an ugly ho that'll never work as a model just because she has a mole on her face.

Now there is one feature I've found lacking from iTunes ... it doesn't have any way (that I can find) of printing a CD jewelcase liner or CD label. I will admit I would like to be able to print a nice cd jacket with track listing, etc.

Other than that, its seemingly perfect.
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,316
5,642
Originally posted by yamabushi
AAC is owned by Dolby and Apple uses it under license. There is no reason that I can see why manufacturers wouldn't simply add the capability to use AAC to future digital music devices.

But who owns "FairPlay"? The Digital Rights Management?

arn
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,316
5,642
Re: Speaking as a Windows user ...

Originally posted by racolvin
I downloaded iTunes for Windows last night, installed it, ran it played with it for 20 minutes and promptly removed MusicMatch Jukebox Plus (that I paid $$ for a lifetime upgrade for).

......

I may even be a Mac user by this time next year but I can guarantee I'll be a proud 40G iPod owner by Christmas of this year.

Haha.... you are the Poster Child for Apple's iTunes Windows.

Now there is one feature I've found lacking from iTunes ... it doesn't have any way (that I can find) of printing a CD jewelcase liner or CD label. I will admit I would like to be able to print a nice cd jacket with track listing, etc.

Nope... no feature for that yet in iTunes.

arn
 

goops

macrumors newbie
Oct 17, 2003
1
0
Microsoft loves to make up crap and rewrite history. People seem to forget their history of trying to hijack file formats with their own pseudo-proprietary rip-offs of others.

Anyone remember the whole shebang when they had copied code directly from Quicktime and pasted it into their Windows Media code?

The wisest thing for Apple and everyone else to do is steer clear of the proprietary Microsoft stuff - and for Microsoft to adopt AAC or at least embrace MP3 to a greater degree instead of being a self-centered bunch of hippocrites.
 

yamabushi

macrumors 65816
Oct 6, 2003
1,009
1
Originally posted by arn
But who owns "FairPlay"? The Digital Rights Management?

arn

Digital rights management is a general term for the types of licensing restictions placed upon digital media. Fair Play is the name of the DRM used by Apple. Basically it is the method of transfer of ownership and what rights a person has once they own it. In Apple's Fair Play the rights given to the purchaser are fairly broad and approximately equal to what you would have if you had bought the music on a CD. This article may make things clearer.
http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=4450
 

racolvin

macrumors newbie
Jul 17, 2002
10
0
Madison, AL
Re: Re: Speaking as a Windows user ...

Originally posted by arn
Haha.... you are the Poster Child for Apple's iTunes Windows.



Nope... no feature for that yet in iTunes.

arn

I'm not sure if I should be insulted or flattered by the whole "poster child" thing ;)

I can tell you that since coming in to work today, I've gotten 6 other Windows users to download and try iTunes. We'll see if they become converts or not but they all loved its first impressions.
 

arn

macrumors god
Staff member
Apr 9, 2001
16,316
5,642
Originally posted by yamabushi
Digital rights management is a general term for the types of licensing restictions placed upon digital media. Fair Play is the name of the DRM used by Apple. [/URL]

I understand that. I was wondering: if I was a 3rd party MP3 player manufacturer... how do I license FairPlay for use in my player? who owns it?

arn
 
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