Ming-Chi Kuo Says Apple Considering Lower-Priced HomePod After Potentially Lackluster Sales

[Macaholic868]

If I were Apple I would spend whatever amount of money is required to hire the best people working in AI and voice recognition to rebuild Siri from the ground up if it can’t be fixed.

Maybe they purchased a product and service that was ahead of its time when they bought it but it’s now reached its own natural limitations and needs to be rearchitected from the ground up.

One disadvantage of being first to market is that your competitors can identify the strengths and weaknesses of your products and services when they are developing their own alternatives. Essentially they get to learn from your mistakes and use them to guide development of their alternatives.

There is no shame in recognizing that and starting over. It’s what Apple did when they acquired Next and released OS X. They appear to be doing this now with Intel chips. Why not do the same with Siri? It’s not like they don’t have the money.

 

[Cigsm]

The lower priced alternatives in the $100 bracket you mentioned are nowhere near the quality - build wise or audio wise - as the HomePod. Not to mention the fact that, Amazon and Google aren't making much at all on their audio products in that price bracket.

There's too many lower priced alternatives. If Apple comes out with a slick looking HomePod for $100 they could make a killing.

 

[Xenious]

I don't get why everyone complains the speaker is so expensive. I was looking at a B&O M5 ($599) and instead went with the Home Pod. I am not an apple music user, i stream stuff via Airplay and I use Siri for simple stuff like home automation control. The only complaint I have is that the complex Siri features are tied to my phone which means the others in my house can't use Siri to read their messages, etc. The speaker itself sounds awesome and was a better deal at $350 for me.

 

[Cigsm]

Literally not one review - anywhere- has said that Amazon or Google's offerings had superior sound.

A smaller $150 'brain' still isn't going to interest consumers if the brain isn't as smart as the competition.
I'd say that consumers don't want the speaker because of the walled garden approach, and Siri's blatant not-as-smart-as-google/alexa problem.

Apple are way behind the curve here. Any user can have an equal or better sounding home assistant speaker setup for less money using either google's or amazon's more intelligent AI and hardware that can fit into their current speaker system.

A cheaper (but still not as cheap as the competition) voice led assistant from Apple, is still a poor quality rival next to say, Alexa and a couple of Sonos Ones.

There's just no reality distortion field here that is gonna do it for Apple this time.

 

[H. Flower]

They're just now "mulling" this over? lol
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Except that $349 is not a high price for speakers/headphones at all, regardless of whether they have "smart" features like Siri or not. That's the reason Apple emphasizes the music aspect first and not Siri. HomePod wasn't released to compete against $99-$199 speakers. It was released to compete against $300-$500 speakers.

Which is fundamentally flawed because you can buy superior sounding speakers (2 of them for stereo, no less) at around the same cost.

 

[Regime2008]

Literally not one review - anywhere- has said that Amazon or Google's offerings had superior sound.

Ahem, MR even covered a couple articles.
www.macrumors.com/2018/02/12/homepod-sonos-google-max-comparison/

 

[Lab4Us]

They're just now "mulling" this over? lol
[doublepost=1523661462][/doublepost]

Which is fundamentally flawed because you can buy superior sounding speakers (2 of them for stereo, no less) at around the same cost.

Only reason you can get 2 for about the same price is because Sonos is concerned, and their discount price won’t last forever.

 

[kshitijshah]

How about them privacy issues though? Let’s look at how Amazon and Apple and Google handle privacy.

Can’t put a price on that.

The standard excuse for the short comings of a multi-billion dollar company which doesn’t feel shy to charge premium prices but delivers less than premium software and AI

 

[Brien]

Good. With sub-$50 Echo/Google Home devices and Amazon and Google snapping up home automation companies (nest, ring etcetera) they need something or HomeKit is going to be as DOA as Siri...

 

[reesecameron]

why not make siri better instead

 

[gim]

A smart home device that isn't smart and doesn't integrate with much, not even with itself, and yet has a whopper of a premium price tag. Just being expensive, doesn't make something good.

It is a poster child for a Fail Meme and worse, is a clear demonstration of how Apple are now skating to where the puck was.

Couldn't have said that any better.

 

[MacFan23]

Apple is getting dangerously behind in almost every category they once dominated. Name one category they still excel above the competition... I can't really not think of any today.

Wireless earphones, smart watches, tablets.

 

[ConfluxNZ]

Is anyone surprised by this? It’s a half-baked first gen product (which is classic Apple anyway) with a half-baked assistant.

The things you expect it to do straight off the bat are not there yet or only coming later. To name a few - tight integration with Apple TV; linking two together for stereo sound; making and answering phone calls from the HomePod. The one thing it has going for it is the phenomenal sound quality. But that’s not enough for a lot of people - including me - to buy one.

 

[radiologyman]

Should I get Sonos or this? I have lot of Apple products

 

[TriBruin]

I tend to agree here.

I have done a lot of experimenting with Alexa with my alarm system and thermostat because neither of those items in my house are currently HomeKit compatible. Here is the EXACT command I HAVE to use to get Alexa to set my security alarm:

"Alexa, ask Alarm.com to arm stay my security system." You can't say "Hey Alexa, arm my security system." or even "turn on my security system". And you DEFINITELY can't say "Set the security alarm". These are all natural things I should be able to tell a voice assistant. I shouldn't have to do verbal acrobatics to get what I want. But if I don't use that exact phrase, she either says she can't do that, or she tries to set a wake up alarm instead.

With the HomePod and my Hue lights, smart locks, etc., there are a zillion different ways I can ask Siri to do something and she will catch my drift most of the time, even if I don't quite give her the correct room name or the correct device name. And I don't have to ask Siri to ask another service to ask a device to do something. I just tell Siri directly to do it.

I have no experience with Google Assistant, but I find Alexa to be even more frustrating than Siri. I'll take a conversational voice assistant that's a little more limited over Alexa any day. With critical items like lights, I just need the thing to know what I mean. 99% of the time, Siri does.

Either you are not using the right products or you haven't setup your Echo right.

Here are the some of the phases I use on my Alexa:

"Alexa turn on Living Room Lights"
"Alexa turn on Television"
"Alexa set Home to 70 degrees"

None of my commands require me to tell Alexa which Skill to use. All of my devices are integrated with Alexa via their apps and setup in the "Smart Home" section of the Alexa App. As far as account liking? Yes, it is slight more difficult than linking a Homelink device, but you have to same thing on other devices (like an AppleTV).

 

[siddavis]

I think a lot of the knockers for HomePod are either to friggin cheap to buy one or wrapped up in other ecosystems that don't have as good a speaker.

Econ 101. I’m not too cheap. The value proposition just isn’t there yet. I am very intrigued, but they just haven’t delivered yet. I might give it a shot in the future if they get some of the features in place and if Siri gets some serious help. That’s a big if though. We’ve been waiting and talking about improved Siri for years now.

I did get a couple of Echo Dots to mess around with. Sure the sound quality is not good, but it’s good enough for podcasts, news, weather, and some home automation skills. I’m in the fence about expanding in the Alexa system.
[doublepost=1523711760][/doublepost]

Either you are not using the right products or you haven't setup your Echo right.

Here are the some of the phases I use on my Alexa:

"Alexa turn on Living Room Lights"
"Alexa turn on Television"
"Alexa set Home to 70 degrees"

None of my commands require me to tell Alexa which Skill to use. All of my devices are integrated with Alexa via their apps and setup in the "Smart Home" section of the Alexa App. As far as account liking? Yes, it is slight more difficult than linking a Homelink device, but you have to same thing on other devices (like an AppleTV).

I think for devices with a certain level of security requirements, there is also a more structured command sequence. I have an August lock and I do have to specify the skill. With my Hue lights, that is not the case.

 

[spiderman0616]

Either you are not using the right products or you haven't setup your Echo right.

Here are the some of the phases I use on my Alexa:

"Alexa turn on Living Room Lights"
"Alexa turn on Television"
"Alexa set Home to 70 degrees"

None of my commands require me to tell Alexa which Skill to use. All of my devices are integrated with Alexa via their apps and setup in the "Smart Home" section of the Alexa App. As far as account liking? Yes, it is slight more difficult than linking a Homelink device, but you have to same thing on other devices (like an AppleTV).

My Alexa is set up exactly right. The thermostat is directly integrated so I don’t have to tell Alexa to tell a service to do something. She directly sets the temperature I ask (when she actually understands the command, which isn’t always what happens). But my alarm system operates through the Alarm.com skill. For that skill/hardware, you have to say “Alexa, ask Alarm.com to arm stay the security system.” If you deviate from that command at all she asks what time you want the wake up alarm set for or says “Sorry, I can’t do that.”
[doublepost=1523711928][/doublepost]

Econ 101. I’m not too cheap. The value proposition just isn’t there yet. I am very intrigued, but they just haven’t delivered yet. I might give it a shot in the future if they get some of the features in place and if Siri gets some serious help. That’s a big if though. We’ve been waiting and talking about improved Siri for years now.

I did get a couple of Echo Dots to mess around with. Sure the sound quality is not good, but it’s good enough for podcasts, news, weather, and some home automation skills. I’m in the fence about expanding in the Alexa system.
[doublepost=1523711760][/doublepost]
I think for devices with a certain level of security requirements, there is also a more structured command sequence. I have an August lock and I do have to specify the skill. With my Hue lights, that is not the case.

With my August lock, all I have to say is “Hey Siri, lock the front door.”

 

[siddavis]

I’m skeptical. Lowering the price this soon is a terrible idea that only undermines HP and Apple. The price is to much for what it is but Apple is stuck with it now. Time to make lemonade.

Rather than lowering the price Apple should bundle in a year of Apple Music and also clearly out line updates and new features by year’s end.

Also a HP mini with good Siri support would also help I think.

I was stunned that there wasn’t some kind is Apple Music bundle at launch. At this price, throwing in 6mo or a year would cement people into that system. Plus it could get people off the fence that don’t like the fact that it doesn’t work with other services.

 

[I7guy]

My take. If I were to get a smart speaker, that actually has some fidelity, it would be a HomePod. As long as Siri does the basic tasks well I’m good. I have no use for google home or Alexa. I had a taste of Alexa. My son bought us an echo dot and at first we were excited but now it sits in the corner unplugged gathering dust.

Second, how could he (Ming) know exactly what Apple has been thinking unless he was debriefed by someone inside Apple that is in the know?

 

[mrklaw]

The price *is* challenging. However more importantly to me is the complete and utter lack of any direct support for spotify or other services other than apple music, and no 3.5mm input jack or bluetooth input support.

 

[robjulo]

Then you should have gone with the Sonos One and had two speakers, true stereo, with multiple services available, for the same priced.

I don't get why everyone complains the speaker is so expensive. I was looking at a B&O M5 ($599) and instead went with the Home Pod. I am not an apple music user, i stream stuff via Airplay and I use Siri for simple stuff like home automation control. The only complaint I have is that the complex Siri features are tied to my phone which means the others in my house can't use Siri to read their messages, etc. The speaker itself sounds awesome and was a better deal at $350 for me.

 

[siddavis]

My Alexa is set up exactly right. The thermostat is directly integrated so I don’t have to tell Alexa to tell a service to do something. She directly sets the temperature I ask (when she actually understands the command, which isn’t always what happens). But my alarm system operates through the Alarm.com skill. For that skill/hardware, you have to say “Alexa, ask Alarm.com to arm stay the security system.” If you deviate from that command at all she asks what time you want the wake up alarm set for or says “Sorry, I can’t do that.”
[doublepost=1523711928][/doublepost]
With my August lock, all I have to say is “Hey Siri, lock the front door.”

I was speaking to the requirements with Alexa. You are correct with Siri. In fact, I just tested it and was able to simply state “lock the door” and it worked.

 

[palmerc]

My Alexa is set up exactly right. The thermostat is directly integrated so I don’t have to tell Alexa to tell a service to do something. She directly sets the temperature I ask (when she actually understands the command, which isn’t always what happens). But my alarm system operates through the Alarm.com skill. For that skill/hardware, you have to say “Alexa, ask Alarm.com to arm stay the security system.” If you deviate from that command at all she asks what time you want the wake up alarm set for or says “Sorry, I can’t do that.”
[doublepost=1523711928][/doublepost]
With my August lock, all I have to say is “Hey Siri, lock the front door.”

I’m baffled by how much traction the Siri sucks meme has. I use it a dozen times a day to control the lights, temp, play music, make calls, send messages, create reminders. Anyone that has used Alexa on echo knows how rigid she can be, but still Siri gets beat up because she doesn’t do presidential trivia as well as the Google AI

 

[rcappo]

I was expecting Siri to be much more advanced by now. From being predictive (I ask what the weather is most mornings, it should have that data cached and ready to go before I ask), to not needing to use the Internet to change a setting or open an app. And Apple should review the questions Siri doesn't get right and write better responses for the next person who asks that question. There should also be different levels of interaction you can setup. I wouldn't mind if Siri started talking to me to remind me of events or to suggest things that are going on that I might be interested in. She should be able to know if I forgot to shut the garage door or turn off some lights. If I get an e-mail from certain people, I would like to be notified, and when my furnace died last December and my smart thermostat sent me an e-mail when I was 300 miles away from my house, that would have been a good time to say "I'm sorry to bother you, but you may want to look into the operation of the furnace, your house is at 44 degress F."

I do need a Homekit controller, as my iPad isn't the best. But, pushing music isn't going to do it for me. I already have my house wired with speakers in every room and garage. What I don't have is the microphones that would go back to my Macbook Pro to control Siri. I can sometimes use the remote app on my iPhone to control iTunes on the Mac from around the house, but only when my iPhone is connected to my home network and not the cellular network. It would be great if Siri could do things for me without me asking as well.

 

[mtneer]

If I were Apple I would spend whatever amount of money is required to hire the best people working in AI and voice recognition to rebuild Siri from the ground up if it can’t be fixed.

I dont think Apple's problem is money (obviously) or even people. I think they have issues with decision making. Their personality driven, top down culture worked well when they were a few thousand employees. But now, with over 100,000 employees and thousands of subcontractors and outsourcing companies, they need to seriously re-think decision making culture in the company.