Motorola Rokr Phone Ditching iTunes?

[mcstewart37]

I dunno if this has come up before, but the phone in question is the E690 that's availalbe in China and may be coming to the US soon.

Motorola probably "ditched" Apple and iTunes because this phone runs Linux.

Maybe Apple wasn't willing to develop a Linux version of iTunes after they already had to make a Java version for the current phones...

http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/leaked-motorola-loves-linux--e690-pda-phone-199607.php

http://www.handcellphone.com/archives/motorola-e690-pda-phone

http://www.mobilemag.com/content/100/340/C9460/

 

[prady16]

Good that Apple got out of the partnership!
Its not Motorola ditching Apple, its good riddens!

 

[peharri]

Could this be because of Apple not licensing iTunes to Motorola anymore? Could Motorola and Apple somehow be collaborting otherwise? Very interesting...

This is really bad news because it (and the recent trademarking news) does point at Apple producing the iPhone and exactly what I've been predicting happening as a result: ie Apple goes into competition with Motorola, Nokia, et al, so no longer stands any chance whatsoever of licensing iTS support to the majority of mobile phone manufacturers. Look at Motorola's choice of DRM'd music provider - Real Networks. It's more than Motorola just choosing to drop iTunes, it's an actual message to Apple, Real Networks being the people Apple accused of "stooping to the ethics of a hacker" because they found a way of making their music play on an iPod while remaining access controlled.

Apple truly has to come up with the ultimate cellphone, a phone so compelling more than 50% of people who buy phones with MP3 support will want it and be able to buy it and will buy it, or else see the iTS wither and die.

I know a lot of people here think Apple can do this. It sounds to me like Apple thinks it can do this. I can't say I agree. I'm not happy with their decisions of late, but can see the business logic behind many of them. However, in this case, I think this is going to be Apple's first major mistake, whether you're on the inside or outside.

 

[Misplaced Mage]

I dunno if this has come up before, but the phone in question is the E690 that's availalbe in China and may be coming to the US soon.

Motorola probably "ditched" Apple and iTunes because this phone runs Linux.

Maybe Apple wasn't willing to develop a Linux version of iTunes after they already had to make a Java version for the current phones...

http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/leaked-motorola-loves-linux--e690-pda-phone-199607.php

http://www.handcellphone.com/archives/motorola-e690-pda-phone

http://www.mobilemag.com/content/100/340/C9460/

The iTunes player isn't a Java application, it's integrated directly into the phone operating system. If it were Java-based, there would be no problem pulling iTunes off a phone and putting it on almost any other phone with a J2ME environment. Or almost anything running a Java VM, for that matter, including Linux machines.

 

[Misplaced Mage]

This is really bad news because it (and the recent trademarking news) does point at Apple producing the iPhone and exactly what I've been predicting happening as a result: ie Apple goes into competition with Motorola, Nokia, et al, so no longer stands any chance whatsoever of licensing iTS support to the majority of mobile phone manufacturers. Look at Motorola's choice of DRM'd music provider - Real Networks. It's more than Motorola just choosing to drop iTunes, it's an actual message to Apple, Real Networks being the people Apple accused of "stooping to the ethics of a hacker" because they found a way of making their music play on an iPod while remaining access controlled.

Apple truly has to come up with the ultimate cellphone, a phone so compelling more than 50% of people who buy phones with MP3 support will want it and be able to buy it and will buy it, or else see the iTS wither and die.

I know a lot of people here think Apple can do this. It sounds to me like Apple thinks it can do this. I can't say I agree. I'm not happy with their decisions of late, but can see the business logic behind many of them. However, in this case, I think this is going to be Apple's first major mistake, whether you're on the inside or outside.

And just to muddy the waters further, there's Motorola's iRadio to consider, which is effectively time-shifted radio. Motorola's been quietly working to amass licensing rights from the major record and broadcast media companies for it. To me, it strongly looks like Motorola isn't betting on any one horse to win this race, and has gone so far as to prepare its own entry.

And "...Apple's first major mistake"? Hardly.

 

[mcstewart37]

The iTunes player isn't a Java application, it's integrated directly into the phone operating system. If it were Java-based, there would be no problem pulling iTunes off a phone and putting it on almost any other phone with a J2ME environment. Or almost anything running a Java VM, for that matter, including Linux machines.

I have an unlocked SLVR I bought from Europe and I put iTunes on it and it runs as a Java application. I dunno if you've used SEEM or p2k editors for Motorola phones, but the way it works is that you install iTunes onto the phone using the JAD file with p2kcommander or something similar. I won't say how to do it here or give you the link but its pretty easy to find on the internet.

The reason it was difficult to pull the Java iTune program off the phone was that it relied on the American bootloader. Only phones sold directly from Cingular had this bootloader. All unlocked phones came from Europe, which had an incompatible bootloader. The iTunes program itself had to be hacked to run on phones with the European bootloader. Yes, its true, as long as you alter the iTunes program appropriately, you can run it on any phone or system with a J2ME environment.

 

[Misplaced Mage]

I dislike Moto's brand, particularly that conspicuous badge. I could never own a phone which presented that hideous logo so forcefully. That M shape has bad feng shui.

And how is Apple's conspicuous branding any different? All smooth surfaces, straight lines, gentle curves... and BAM! The Apple logo right where you can't miss it.

 

[Misplaced Mage]

The reason it was difficult to pull the Java iTune program off the phone was that it relied on the American bootloader. Only phones sold directly from Cingular had this bootloader. All unlocked phones came from Europe, which had an incompatible bootloader. The iTunes program itself had to be hacked to run on phones with the European bootloader. Yes, its true, as long as you alter the iTunes program appropriately, you can run it on any phone or system with a J2ME environment.

I stand corrected. So a Linux-specific client certainly isn't out of the question.

You know, the whole Real issue could just be a strong-arm tactic on Motorola's part to get Apple to reduce its licensing fees. That sort of thing is pretty common in big business.

 

[Hasa]

Rokr or Razr?

This thread started with rokr info but I noticed that it shifted to a general anti motorola and anti razr postings so I figure I share my thoughts. I really don't get why people hate it so much. granted the ui is not as elegant as a Mac or iPod but it is still very easy to use. Someone commented earlier that they would not buy a razr because they wanted something to sync with their mac. The razr does a great job at this. I've had mine for over a year. iCal and address book sync without any problems. I love the razr, its functionality and compatibility with Tiger. It covers all my needs at this time. Of course once the iPhone comes out, I'll take a look at it and see if its worth the switch for me but I can't say that I will go running to the store and buy one. I don't mind carrying the razr and an iPod but it would be nicer to just take one device. It will all depend on how the iPhone's features/price fit my needs.

 

[840quadra]

Thanks for the article and links!

This is just showing how petty Moto has become recently. The touted the Rokr E1 too much, pressured Apple, and leaked too much information with regards to that pathetic excuse for MP3-Phone that nobody wanted it when it came out.

Now that Apple is rumored to be coming out with their own MP3/Phone Moto drops iTunes support for Real ? Get 'real' motorola, with Apples pending iPhone, the iPod and the Zune nobody is going to want your MP3 Phone, especially if it will only play MP3 files, and no form of DRM protected media that the Masses are after. Who uses or buys Real DRM media anyway ?!?

::EDIT::

Ignore my run-on sentences and grammar, I am worked up a bit . All of my phones are Motorola, and I like the company, but I think this is a stupid move!

 

[peharri]

You know, the whole Real issue could just be a strong-arm tactic on Motorola's part to get Apple to reduce its licensing fees. That sort of thing is pretty common in big business.

That's not a bad theory. It may not even be the licensing fees that's rankling Motorola so much as the 100 song limit. I'm pretty sure the phone wouldn't have had the poor reception (no pun intended) it had if the iTunes software hadn't been crippled.

 

[Kaafir]

Crap

IMHO music players and phones aren't that great of a combo. It's kinda like lobster and chocolate milkshakes - they're great separate, but one really wouldn't order them together. You could, but it's just kinda strange. (and yes, the lobster and milkshake example is a throwback to an episode of Nip/Tuck)

That's how I feel about phones and mp3 players.

I love my iPod and I love my RAZR, but I don't want them in the same device. Partly because I love the form factor of the phone and also because I want more storage capability than what most phones have.

Just my $0.02

 

[OdduWon]

does anyone else think that if Zune gets a foot hold in the market they could use their success to strengthen their mobil phone market and take over world communications with winbox, xbox, and zunebox the telebox is sure to follow

 

[Misplaced Mage]

I'm sure the thought has crossed a few minds in Redmond...

 

[OdduWon]

this xbox live culture will be the end of us all unless iTv and the wii take this online culture to a better resting place.

 

[peharri]

This thread started with rokr info but I noticed that it shifted to a general anti motorola and anti razr postings so I figure I share my thoughts. I really don't get why people hate it so much. granted the ui is not as elegant as a Mac or iPod but it is still very easy to use. Someone commented earlier that they would not buy a razr because they wanted something to sync with their mac. The razr does a great job at this. I've had mine for over a year. iCal and address book sync without any problems. I love the razr, its functionality and compatibility with Tiger. It covers all my needs at this time. Of course once the iPhone comes out, I'll take a look at it and see if its worth the switch for me but I can't say that I will go running to the store and buy one. I don't mind carrying the razr and an iPod but it would be nicer to just take one device. It will all depend on how the iPhone's features/price fit my needs.

There were a lot of Motorola phones about two or three years ago that had serious quality problems. That, and Motorola's long standing reputation for bad UIs based upon the fact they used to sell awful phones that had no menus, various buttons whose use was undocumented, and even 7-segment LED displays, means people repeat the mantra over and over again that Motorola phones are in some way terrible. Just like Apple computers are "expensive", or that Dell makes the only PC compatibles, etc. The reputation continues well after any deserving aspect of it has withered away.

Motorola certainly make some good phones these days. I don't have a RAZR, I imported a V635 for roughly the same price which I think is/was a more capable phone albeit one that's less stylish. It's still pretty elegant though.

Despite the claim that Apple "needs" to enter the mobile phone market because all of the existing models are just too damned complicated and ugly, the truth is there are a lot of stylish phones out there, there always have been, and UIs are better today than ever. Most of the time when there's a problem with a UI, it has to do with a network operator corrupting a manufacturer's perfectly good design than it has to do with any problems with the original design.

Nokia, of course, used to have the market sown up on precisely the market Apple-phone proponents say needs to be "created", what's happened is that everyone has moved closer to Nokia and been heavily influenced by their attention to detail and elegant UIs.

So I'd ignore most of the criticisms of Motorola. It's not that they have no basis, it's more that they're, largely, obsolete or so subjective as to be irrelevent. The success of the RAZR and its immitators tells you a lot about Motorola's ability to produce something desirable in today's market.

 

[OdduWon]

was just watching cnn and they said that cingular is going to partner with other online music stores to offer music comtent for their phones. Apple will bring the Telepod to kill the zune in two weeks

 

[0010101]

I don't know about this iPhone thing.. I mean.. why would you want to carry around an iPhone AND an iPod?

iPhone has the distinct advantage that you can download music from wherever you have a signal, with no computer required.. but would either have a limited storage capacity, or be very expensive.

In my opinion, a wireless capable iPod makes way more sence than an iPhone.. especially considering how often people like to upgrade their cell phones as soon as the next latest and greatest thing comes out.. hell, my son who is 20 has had 4 different phones in the last 12 months.

Now, if Apple were just to make a wireless iPod that connected to cellular networks to retreve songs, that would be cool. Not a full blown phone.. just cell network connectivity.

You would pay a small monthly 'network' fee, plus regular iTunes rates.. and be able to download new music from where ever you had signal.

 

[Misplaced Mage]

Little secret? The only thing separating a cell phone from a broadband wireless modem is a computer card bus interface, a microphone, a speaker, and codecs for the analog-to-digital & digital-to-analog conversions required to transmit and receive voice. By the time you get done adding cellular network support to an iPod -- which inherently already has codec support for a number of audio formats -- you may as well add a microphone, a speaker, and support for the standard telephony codecs and make it a full-blown phone. Heck, people run Skype on laptops with wireless modems now!

The catch is that with a phone, you have to conform to a whole new set of FCC guidelines that the wireless modem doesn't (at least, to the same degree) because of the normal proximity of a phone's antenna to your head or body when transmitting while in use.

 

[kenneth1ny]

Rokr E6 Linux

Ok, so how do Mac users sync this one?
I can't get bluetooth to recognize the phone (not supported), but USB works. I can transfer files, but I'd really like to sync my address and calendar!!! Comments very welcome.