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I'll gladly take it off your hands. :D

I would love to own a TV that's the same resolution as a Wii. :) I've looked, but they're ridiculous priced now days in relation to a HD set.

I'm assuming you turned off your Wii when you switched to components? :eek: The broadcast bastardizing 19" LCD HD in my office automatically switches to progressive if I'm using components.

<]=)
 
MRU- you think you're getting annoyed with the Wii, try setting one up for 480p on a TV that only has one port for SD only, and one port for ED only.

  • Plug in Wii in SD with regular cables
  • Try to select 480p mode
  • 480p mode is grayed out because I am not connected to a 480p port
  • Unplug old cables. Plug in composite cables, and hitch up to 480p port
  • Screen goes dead
  • Swear
  • Using the force, jab wildly with the Wii remote at the blank screen, hoping to hit the 480p button, which is now no longer greyed out
  • Wii will display 480p if you managed to hit the right button. Blindly.


LOL!! You cheered me up! I'm glad i'm not the only one suffering from W.R.S.S ( wii related stress syndrome ) :D:)
 
I'm assuming you turned off your Wii when you switched to components? :eek:

Well this is it, I couldn't, because otherwise I'd have to 'blindly' navigate my way through the system menus to get to display settings. So in SD I found my way to the display settings page, switched cables, and then used the force to hit that 480p button. A combination of sound and vibrations got me there.

LOL!! You cheered me up! I'm glad i'm not the only one suffering from W.R.S.S ( wii related stress syndrome ) :D:)

It's nice to know someone else out there has the same symptoms ;)
 
MRU- you think you're getting annoyed with the Wii, try setting one up for 480p on a TV that only has one port for SD only, and one port for ED only.

  • Plug in Wii in SD with regular cables
  • Try to select 480p mode
  • 480p mode is grayed out because I am not connected to a 480p port
  • Unplug old cables. Plug in composite cables, and hitch up to 480p port
  • Screen goes dead
  • Swear
  • Using the force, jab wildly with the Wii remote at the blank screen, hoping to hit the 480p button, which is now no longer greyed out
  • Wii will display 480p if you managed to hit the right button. Blindly.

That's great, you should create a game, called, "Wii Setup"...

I'd like to contribute the stage where you try to get the Wii to work with your Wireless Access Point.... :eek:

LOL

(sorry, leftover hostilities from the "Get A Mac" Ad thread....) :D
 
Well this is it, I couldn't, because otherwise I'd have to 'blindly' navigate my way through the system menus to get to display settings. So in SD I found my way to the display settings page, switched cables, and then used the force to hit that 480p button. A combination of sound and vibrations got me there.

But the reason I'm asking if you turned off your Wii, is that it automatically switches to 480p when starting up, if the component cables are pluged in.

I have component cabels on LCD and RCA on my glorious little CRT. I switch between them for certain games. The only settings I need to change as a user when switching between the cables, is the widescreen setting. It does the 480p for me on boot.

AND WHO MAKES YOUR EDTV? :D Is it widescreen? I looked some more last night and found a 32" for about $600, which is better than 1700+ for the 42", which is ridiculous for its limited pixel density. Why can't I buy a smaller than 20" widescreen EDTV... :(

<]=)
 
I'm at the part in Zelda where I just got the shield attack, and I must say it sucks. While someone mentioned earlier in this thread they had issues with grappling on MP3, and I didn't, I find I get the shield attack to work maybe 10% of the time. He either does nothing or sometimes will do the spin attack. I'm quite horribly pissed at it, and feel yet again that motion control sucks for gaming.

On unrelated news, I popped in Ar Tonelico again on my PS3 (ps2 game) and think I'll be playing that until completion. So the Wii will have to wait. :) Makes a nice gamecube, though. Almost done with metroid prime 1.
 
But the reason I'm asking if you turned off your Wii, is that it automatically switches to 480p when starting up, if the component cables are pluged in.

I have component cabels on LCD and RCA on my glorious little CRT. I switch between them for certain games. The only settings I need to change as a user when switching between the cables, is the widescreen setting. It does the 480p for me on boot.

AND WHO MAKES YOUR EDTV? :D Is it widescreen? I looked some more last night and found a 32" for about $600, which is better than 1700+ for the 42", which is ridiculous for its limited pixel density. Why can't I buy a smaller than 20" widescreen EDTV... :(

<]=)

Just a thought as I'm not sure what EDTVs you've looked at and what price ranges, etc, but you might consider looking into a CRT model. There's HD CRT TVs that support 480p and 1080i natively so you get the best of both worlds (native 480p for DVDs and Wii, and HD for TV, etc). Plus, the contrast and color on CRTs is still better than most/all LCDs.

You can chose from direct view CRTs up to 40" or so and rear projection for larger sizes. Just a though. :)
 
I'm at the part in Zelda where I just got the shield attack, and I must say it sucks. While someone mentioned earlier in this thread they had issues with grappling on MP3, and I didn't, I find I get the shield attack to work maybe 10% of the time. He either does nothing or sometimes will do the spin attack. I'm quite horribly pissed at it, and feel yet again that motion control sucks for gaming.

On unrelated news, I popped in Ar Tonelico again on my PS3 (ps2 game) and think I'll be playing that until completion. So the Wii will have to wait. :) Makes a nice gamecube, though. Almost done with metroid prime 1.

I never had a problem with the shield. The grappliing hook though... Sometimes it wouldn't respond when I was trying to pull a dam Metroid's arm off. :mad: When it worked it was cool, but other times I was just putting way tooooo much force into it and nothing was responding. :eek:

<]=)
 
Just a thought as I'm not sure what EDTVs you've looked at and what price ranges, etc, but you might consider looking into a CRT model. There's HD CRT TVs that support 480p and 1080i natively so you get the best of both worlds (native 480p for DVDs and Wii, and HD for TV, etc). Plus, the contrast and color on CRTs is still better than most/all LCDs.

You can chose from direct view CRTs up to 40" or so and rear projection for larger sizes. Just a though. :)


I'll take a CRT EDTV. :)

My firend has the Samsung 32" HDT CRT, it's great and if I had the room, I would get one, but it's too big for where I want to use it. :(

I'm looking for a widescreen alternative to my little 14" CRT, which I find myself using more than my widescreen LCD most of the time -- since it looks folds better for most content. It's on my spare desk, which is also occupied by my other computers and the LCD TV.

Most of the EDTVs seem to be 42" Plasmas, which I've seen costing up to $1700. Bleh!

<]=)
 
I never had a problem with the shield. The grappliing hook though... Sometimes it wouldn't respond when I was trying to pull a dam Metroid's arm off. :mad: When it worked it was cool, but other times I was just putting way tooooo much force into it and nothing was responding. :eek:

<]=)

Yes, and if you like to game unreliably then be my guest. :p I can probably live with it in Zelda because apparently you don't need the shield attack all that often, but I know I need it from an upcoming boss. My friend who has the gamecube version said I will, and of course it works for him 100% of the time.
 
The shield is easy. Just thrust your hand forward. You just need practice, or something. :) I like it. It's like the knife attack in RE4 for me, since it just makes sense.

The grappling hook was only a challenge "for me" when fighting the EVIL adult Metroids. I found that I was unnecessarily putting too much effort into it. As for every other instance, it fires off without a hitch, weather I'm swinging around like a monkey or not. :p

And that fact that I can actually "aim" a bow on the Wii version of Zelda, instead of just pushing the pointer to where I want to point, I can safely say that the Cube version SUCKS. :D

<]=)
 
The shield is easy. Just thrust your hand forward. You just need practice, or something. :) I like it. It's like the knife attack in RE4 for me, since it just makes sense.

The grappling hook was only a challenge "for me" when fighting the EVIL adult Metroids. I found that I was unnecessarily putting too much effort into it. As for every other instance, it fires off without a hitch, weather I'm swinging around like a monkey or not. :p

And that fact that I can actually "aim" a bow on the Wii version of Zelda, instead of just pushing the pointer to where I want to point, I can safely say that the Cube version SUCKS. :D

<]=)

I don't have the bow yet, so I can't know for sure. I've only aimed the slingshot and the hawk. Since you can lock on and auto aim anyway, I'm not sure the GC version sucks. If you're in a hurry because something is attacking you, then it isn't an issue on either platform because of that. If you need to hit something far away, then you have time anyway.

I'd rather be able to run across hyrule field without taking my sword out when I didn't mean to, or not get all ticked off and red in the face because I'm about to die because Link won't swing his sword for the 10th time.

:p

I mainly bought the wii version for the widescreen presentation... which the GC could do as well.

The reason I hate Nintendo so much I think (other than the fact they don't push the bar with hardware anymore) is because they delayed TP for the gamecube just so we'd all buy a wii, and then released it a month later after the Wii finally arrived. Should have been out in 2005 at the latest.

In fact, the most fun I've had with my Wii so far is playing metroid prime 1. Having 3 finally encouraged me to dust that off and finish it.
 
You bought a Wii and you hate Nintendo. :D You are a weird person Darkwing. ;) But it's all good. :)

Nintendo really mixed things up this time around and have helped to reinvigorate the gaming market. So you can gripe about their hardware not being up to your specs and their controls not being what you're used to, but when it comes down to it, if Nintendo hadn't released the DS and Wii, chances are that the industry would probably have been in another eighties style crash right now.

But to share in my rant as usualL
I have absolutely no hate for Sony's gaming division, only their music division -- EVIL, :) because of their big brother tactics and Sonic Stage, but in the gaming area, if I use hate, it would have to go to Microsoft's controller -- since unlike Sony, they don't offer mouse support, but Sony's optional stance isn't really that much better. I really don't hate MS, they just bother me when they push mediocrity onto the market. This is only an issue to me, because their capital and army of brilliance should prevent this sort of thing, but yet it's a constant reoccurrence.

But to target MS in gaming, they've done some very bad things that have hurt both PC gaming and console gaming this century:
-Consoles;
They created an environment for lazy developers, similar to what had already existed on PCs; Ship a buggy game, patch it later. There have been flawed games shipped on consoles -- even in cartridges, but prior to MS entering the market, It seemed to be a rarity. MS also made the mistake of offering multiple hardware SKUs. For console gaming this is NO. This requires a developer either axe features in favor of the limited SKU, or offer features only available to the elite SKU. And there's the whole hardware reliability issue.

-PCs
Microsoft's influence had helped to make PC gaming great, but when they went Playskool with their console's controls, they managed to undo all of that good and now we have games that are visually nicer, but overall less sophisticated. By funneling AAA games to their console first, which in turn get ported back to the PC, but in a simplified form, they've inadvertently almost killed PC gaming. Vista has also helped. :eek:

The above would not be a problem, if the games that were so popular on the XBox, weren't the same games that had been so popular on the PC. But as is, games have been "thumbed" down in general. Features like auto-lock are a good solution for poor controls, and can help in a situation where one's setup is not optimal, but they strip out a layer of sophistication in gaming, that PCs had already established prior to the console boom. I'm OK with it in games like Prime, or other console derived -- platformers -- games, but when given the option to do something on my own merit, I'll choose to do so every time. I prefer a sophisticate game UI and as of right now, the Wii is really the only console that can offer it.

<]=)
 
You bought a Wii and you hate Nintendo. :D You are a weird person Darkwing. ;) But it's all good. :)

I bought the Wii mainly for Tales of Symphonia 2. I bought a GC for the first game. :)

Nintendo really mixed things up this time around and have helped to reinvigorate the gaming market. So you can gripe about their hardware not being up to your specs and their controls not being what you're used to, but when it comes down to it, if Nintendo hadn't released the DS and Wii, chances are that the industry would probably have been in another eighties style crash right now.

I have to disagree. The industry is booming and continues to grow like crazy. Just because gamestop's stock is down (I sold at 56 after the split) that doesn't mean the rest of the industry is faltering.

I bought the DS mainly because I wanted the Lunar game, and that game sucked. Can't even target enemies? Give me a break. I like the stylus but it gets old after a while.. but at least it's predictable. I just like controllers. I like how the DS has the buttons on the right side which makes it easy to hold the stylus in my left hand, though.

I really just hate MS because I'm a Mac fanatic or something. I will never spend money on their stuff. OSX + Linux for me.

But to target MS in gaming, they've done some very bad things that have hurt both PC gaming and console gaming this century:
-Consoles;
They created an environment for lazy developers, similar to what had already existed on PCs; Ship a buggy game, patch it later. There have been flawed games shipped on consoles -- even in cartridges, but prior to MS entering the market, It seemed to be a rarity. MS also made the mistake of offering multiple hardware SKUs. For console gaming this is NO. This requires a developer either axe features in favor of the limited SKU, or offer features only available to the elite SKU. And there's the whole hardware reliability issue.

Yes, MS took all the benefits of console gaming (common hardware which is easy to write software for) and threw up all over it. Apple is more "stable" because they control the hardware, though I'd argue their stability with all the wake-up and sleep issues my MBPs/PBs have continued to have since 2003. By having multiple platforms and the online stuff, the lazy developers quickly followed suit. Now all 3 consoles have this feature. It's nice to have connectivity, but it's also nice to buy a game and have it work. Of course, I have a few glitched PS2 games... most are published by NIS. ;)

-PCs
Microsoft's influence had helped to make PC gaming great, but when they went Playskool with their console's controls, they managed to undo all of that good and now we have games that are visually nicer, but overall less sophisticated. By funneling AAA games to their console first, which in turn get ported back to the PC, but in a simplified form, they've inadvertently almost killed PC gaming. Vista has also helped. :eek:

I guess I don't need the average artistic Wii owner's idea of "sophistication" I just like games the way they always were. Just get rid of the jagged edges and give it a good story and I'm happy. ;)

I don't think that auto-lock and things like that dumb down games, it merely prevents frustration some players have. You can often turn it off. Frankly I'd rather auto-lock than make my arm tired trying to point the thing. I've shot all kinds of real guns, and the Wiimote is no substitute. :)

Still, I remain hopeful that I'll get used to it. Even if I can't relax or lay down and have to sit up straight to use it, it's something I figured might happen when I bought the thing.
 
That's something I hate...not being able to lay back. Sure you can once you're used to it, but you find yourself not most times. Then again on the 360 I lay back and the text is to d@mn small to read so I have to lean forward/get out of my comfortable position to read the screen :)

Paul
 
I bought the Wii mainly for Tales of Symphonia 2. I bought a GC for the first game. :)

I bought this game for the 2 player mode. Tried it with a friend and found it was still mostly single payer, so I ended up trading it. I'm sure I would have enjoyed it single player though. It got good reviews. :eek:


I have to disagree. The industry is booming and continues to grow like crazy. Just because gamestop's stock is down (I sold at 56 after the split) that doesn't mean the rest of the industry is faltering.

Hey, I didn't even know about Gamestop. :eek:

The Wii, DS, and even PSP are growing like crazy, but the same can not be said for the PS3, and even the 360. I'm probably generalizing to much, but what I stated does hold merit. Nintendo did mix things up and they did pull in a whole slew of new gamers. They also pulld back gamers like I, peeps that had grown bored of console gaming. I need to find the article again, but I know that Nintendo talked about a slum in gaming, where the industry had pretty much reached its saturation and older gamers were no longer interested.

Look at the 360's sales, they're just OK and actually worse than the original XBox. Go outside of the US and the Xbox is a failure. Look at the PS3, its sells are still not great and were very poor at launch. Besides portables, the Wii is the only console that's truly successful right now. And with the high-cost of game development, most games of the uber AAA aren't seeing the same level returns.


I bought the DS mainly because I wanted the Lunar game, and that game sucked. Can't even target enemies? Give me a break. I like the stylus but it gets old after a while.. but at least it's predictable. I just like controllers. I like how the DS has the buttons on the right side which makes it easy to hold the stylus in my left hand, though.

That game was VOMIT. I forgot I had bought that POS. My friend is a huge Lunar fan and managed to finished it, but I couldn't.

I recommend trying Magical Starsign if you haven't played it. It's rather odd, especially at first, but it's a solid RPG and really makes good use of the DS stylus. I generally prefer the thumb-pad, but this game really showed me it could be done.

I really just hate MS because I'm a Mac fanatic or something. I will never spend money on their stuff. OSX + Linux for me.


I'm jealous. I bought a few version of DOS I think 5 and 6 from them -- prior to that they were, errr, freee, a few Microsoft Mice, and Windows 3.1. But that's the last time I gave them money. :eek: Oh, I did pay for my stupid Pocket PC 2002 license. :(

Yes, MS took all the benefits of console gaming (common hardware which is easy to write software for) and threw up all over it. Apple is more "stable" because they control the hardware, though I'd argue their stability with all the wake-up and sleep issues my MBPs/PBs have continued to have since 2003. By having multiple platforms and the online stuff, the lazy developers quickly followed suit. Now all 3 consoles have this feature. It's nice to have connectivity, but it's also nice to buy a game and have it work. Of course, I have a few glitched PS2 games... most are published by NIS. ;)

That they did. My G5 up till the huge Intel migration with 10.4.5+, was rock solid. I had some rough spots up until 10.4.11. And a .11 updated, WTF, I never expected that, but it certainly helped. I've had good luck with my Macs, I just like that I don't need to maintain them like my PCs.

EA froze my DS.

I guess I don't need the average artistic Wii owner's idea of "sophistication" I just like games the way they always were. Just get rid of the jagged edges and give it a good story and I'm happy. ;)

Like they always were. I'm sorry. :D Simple and limited with eh controls. OK, this is true for consoles, but not PCs, well... STUPID CONSOLE TO PC PORTS.

I'm all for a good story, if you know of one amongst the slew of current vomit, point it out so I can play it. :) The greatest stories I've interactive with have been with games that visually look like crap by today's standards. They have enough jaggedness to kill a hoarse. As long as the story and game's sophistication are there, I can overlook poor visuals, but it really is inexcusable now days.

I attached an artistic picture for reference to show what I mean by sophistication. :)


I don't think that auto-lock and things like that dumb down games, it merely prevents frustration some players have. You can often turn it off. Frankly I'd rather auto-lock than make my arm tired trying to point the thing. I've shot all kinds of real guns, and the Wiimote is no substitute. :)

Its' called skill. Auto-lock is for... *censored*. :p And having come from a family of farmers, via the Montana a North Dakota frontier, I've also shot real guns. I've killed gophers, cans, fence posts, pheasants and even a state bird. :eek: Anyways, I know how to shoot. I've shot most guns up to a 12 gauge.

The Wii is a pointer, and it works great as pointer, well, at least with my little screens here in the office. :) Have you ever shot a rubber-band from your finger? I could hit anything I wanted, the Wiimote is the same. It's fast and accurate to where I'm thinking...

When they strip menus out of games and tailor them to a controller that's limited speed wise and on its options, that in my books is thumbing things down.

Just buy an office chair with nice arm rests for your TV room. It will allow you to be lazy like me.


Still, I remain hopeful that I'll get used to it. Even if I can't relax or lay down and have to sit up straight to use it, it's something I figured might happen when I bought the thing.

I hope so also. I want everyone to be happy. :)

Metroid Prime 3 is the worst game to relax too. :D My right arm was so freaking sore from the repetitive fire.

<]=)
 

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That's something I hate...not being able to lay back. Sure you can once you're used to it, but you find yourself not most times. Then again on the 360 I lay back and the text is to d@mn small to read so I have to lean forward/get out of my comfortable position to read the screen :)

Paul

Get a bigger tv! :D

JackAxe said:
I bought this game for the 2 player mode. Tried it with a friend and found it was still mostly single payer, so I ended up trading it. I'm sure I would have enjoyed it single player though. It got good reviews.

Dude, I tried it 2-player for the first time with my girlfriend last year. I've been slowly playing it again in anticipation of the sequel. Anyway, 2-player mode sucks! The camera always focuses on player 1 just like in SSBB when you do 2-player adventure mode. Ugh. You can find the game used for like $17 usually. I suggest you pick it up. It's got a very dark but enthralling storyline that mostly deals with one's own interpretation of right and wrong, racism, and biological experimentation. Plus, Lloyd is Robin from Teen Titans so what are you waiting for?

JackAxe said:
The Wii, DS, and even PSP are growing like crazy, but the same can not be said for the PS3, and even the 360. I'm probably generalizing to much, but what I stated does hold merit. Nintendo did mix things up and they did pull in a whole slew of new gamers. They also pulld back gamers like I, peeps that had grown bored of console gaming. I need to find the article again, but I know that Nintendo talked about a slum in gaming, where the industry had pretty much reached its saturation and older gamers were no longer interested.

Yeah I've really been surprised at the PSP especially the last few months. Apparently it's been beating the DS sometimes week-to-week now in Japan. However the PSP software sales in Japan aren't as great as the number of hardware sales, so the speculation is a lot of people are using it for a media device. Sales really took off when they released that digital tv receiver thingie for it. Actually when I went to Japan last year, I saw mostly cell phones being played with on the trains. I saw 2 PSPs (other than my own:p) and no DSs.

JackAxe said:
Look at the 360's sales, they're just OK and actually worse than the original XBox. Go outside of the US and the Xbox is a failure. Look at the PS3, its sells are still not great and were very poor at launch. Besides portables, the Wii is the only console that's truly successful right now. And with the high-cost of game development, most games of the uber AAA aren't seeing the same level returns.

The PS3 is actually doing rather well in Europe, which is odd really because Europeans really get the short end of the stick when it comes to gaming. They've been in Sony's camp for a while and it seems like this will continue this generation. I still believe the PS3 will be rather successful because as a software engineer I see Sony is doing the right thing. They are licensing and providing a lot of middleware to developers which brings down development costs. Frankly, systems like the PS3 and the 360 have the power to handle that kind of overhead. With 3d modeling, I don't buy the argument that higher resolution requirements drives up dev costs anyway. I think that if the market continues the way it is, (buying cheaper hardware primarily) then the industry will simply stagnate for another 10 years. I want to see things move forward, but that's driven more from an engineering standpoint than a gamer's standpoint.

JackAxe said:
That game was VOMIT. I forgot I had bought that POS. My friend is a huge Lunar fan and managed to finished it, but I couldn't.

I recommend trying Magical Starsign if you haven't played it. It's rather odd, especially at first, but it's a solid RPG and really makes good use of the DS stylus. I generally prefer the thumb-pad, but this game really showed me it could be done.

I do have Magical Starsign and it's ok. Honestly I just hate using the DS because I can't stand seeing each individual pixel on the $5 screens. (I'm a graphics whore, what can I say? :p) The game doesn't provide a story interesting enough to keep me going, but I imagine I'll play it in bits and pieces as time goes on. I think I last picked it up about 5 months ago and played for an hour. I have a 6 foot tall stack of shrink-wrapped games I still need to get to. One odd thing is that the PSP seems to be the portable system of choice for RPGs now. I bought the DS thinking it might be, but apparently not. All the RPGs for DS the last 6 months seem to be dungeon crawlers and I'm not into those.

Games within the last year with good stories or gameplay:

Ar Tonelico (ps2 but slightly over a year old)
Tales of the World (psp, and yes it's a dungeon crawler sorta... but I buy anything tales)
Patapon (psp)
Legend of Heroes 3 (psp the 3rd game is surprisingly good actually, but it's a very traditional rpg)

Those games have interesting stories or styles. I am very upset that Namco is releasing Tales of Vesperia on the 360, and will probably buy it in the hopes it eventually comes to ps3. If not, I'll pick up a used 360 or something. I think that both the Wii and the PS3 need more JRPG love, and for some reason the 360 is getting it all. Weird.

What I will point out is that after buying a Wii, I will no longer let anyone get away with the argument that it's vastly cheaper. Nintendo rapes you on any accessory from $35 component cables to paying out the wazoo for virtual console games. I'll stick with my roms. :p

I have every RPG made on the SNES in America except Breath of Fire 2 with original box and manuals... I wonder what it would go for. :p

What's wrong with "stupid and limited controls" for consoles anyway? I'll take that over having to upgrade my PC every year. :p Also I really don't understand what you meant by that picture, sorry.

I think my main problem with the pointing aspect of the Wii is the simple fact that it's not calibrated for my tv. The other problems I have with motion detection will hopefully be fixed with better programming as time goes on. I've done a lot of work with accelerometers at my previous job, and I can tell you that they are not going to ever replace a good thumb pad. :p
 
HOLY MONKEY.. Lots of rambles... :eek:

I only picked Symphonia up for about $14 originally, or that was the trade in, I don't recall, but I had bought it used. I was in the mood for 2 player RPGs and at the time, games like Crystal Chronicles and Zelda Four Swords for the cube both required a GBA -- which mine was old and my friend's gba was lost. I'll pick it up again though, if I see it.

-- ::

I think now that everyone and their mother has a DS, that the PSP will make its grounds. I've been thinking about getting one just for Genesis emulation on the go. My Pocket PC sucks for this. :( But I'm looking into a iPod touch first, since I would like to tinker with the SDK -- just need new equipment of the Intel kind. I like the PSP now, mainly because Sony has eased up on some of its original restrictions.

-- ::

It's already been stated by several developers and publishers that the development cost on the Wii is 2 - 3 times less than the 360 and PS3. Ubisoft stated it was a fraction of the cost, but that was for the blah that was Red Steel. :eek:

From personal experience with Maya, which I've been using since version 3. Upping a model from low to high poly is pretty easy now days. But when it comes to texturing, one can no longer use quick abstractions for areas that aren't as important, since every area can now have a higher level of detail. I do illustration work as one of my many trades, and it does take considerable longer to produce something for print, or higher-rez, than something for web. But just to contradict myself, I noticed that most of these younger artists aren't good at working at lower rezes, or at the pixel level. When it comes to things like icons they don't have a clue.

-- ::

Engineers have been pushing things forward, this is why some gamers think realistic water is more important than fun and features. :eek:

-- ::

Nintendo's biggest issue in my eye, is their closed door policy for small developers. I ran into a wall when I approached them at E3 a few years back with just some general questions. They could have said go to warioworld.com and fill out our application and will go from there, but no they simply started out with it takes time and money to develop a game and other statements that were already quite apparent and discouraging.

I would eventually like to work on a WiiWare game, but I'm weary of even applying, since they're a gatekeeper with inconsistent requirements. They tick me off, because games like Elf Bowling-- complete and utter vomit, not even good Flash work -- get published on the DS, and yet Nintendo's developer site states their stance on how quality is important. I wish they were more open like Sony, or even offered Apple's approach. I would invest in a Wii SDK just to tinker.

-- ::

I love pixelated art BTW, so the DS is my friend. Its $5 screens look GREAT. :p This stuff is candy to me. As an example, I prefer the old Arthur from Ghouls 'n Ghost over the 3D vomit they spewed upon Extreme Ghouls 'n Ghost for PSP. Don't get me wrong, the new EG'nG on PSP looks great in play, but I still would have liked a hybrid of sprites and polygons. If EG'nG's controls weren't a complete abomination to the series, by far the worst, I would without doubt own a PSP right now.

-- ::

I had to play Magical Starsign up to the point where I had every character, and only then did the game really start to shine. The first time I played it was for less than an hour and I eneded up putting it down for a few months. The only reason I tried it again, is because my friend had mentioned he ilked it, so I gave it a go and I'm glad I got past its initial oddness.

-- ::

Patapon wants to make me KILL when I watch the videos. But I'm sure I'll like it. I just need to eventually buy a PSP -- I love its art direction. I figured when I buy a PS3, I'll be able to play the PS2 games I missed out on, like the one you mentioned. If Okami weren't coming to the Wii, I would have had more incentive to get one sooner -- I'm just waiting for more games now.

It is weird that the 360 is getting so many JRPGs, since it's doing so poorly in Japan. I just figured they were using their massive capital to make it happen, especially since their Japanese share is so dismal.

-- ::

If you paid $35 for component cables, they better be long, or at least of uber quality. All console manufactures rape us on accessories. It's a given. :)

-- ::

I have most of the games I loved when I was younger, but for PC. :) Needless to say, I'm jealous and wish I hadn't sold my consoles back then.

-- ::

I said "Simple," not stupid. :p When you compare a controller with two thumb-sticks, a D-Pad, and a few buttons to even a mouse an keyboard, this is where things become simple. And most heavy duty PC gamers will have uber joysticks and throttles -- I had my CH and Thrusmaster(when they were good) products when I was younger. I certainly don't want to play Mario with my keyboard and mouse, but I don't want to play KillDeathMurder part 7 with a thumb-stick.

I expect their to be some finagling with PCs, so I don't mind it, but I have grown tired of it though for anything but games. I do prefer the console approach better, but then that limits the developer -- which can be good. With PCs in the past, the developer could rely on a certain level of user, as in someone that knew their PC in and out, thus provide games that were more complex than your average console game. Game makers of the past were the tinkerer and since they didn't need to have a masters in art to make something look good, they could focus purely on game play and story. Most console games seem to only focus on art these days, and since they no the users is on a thumb-stick, they have to make compromises in how the user navigates the UI and adjust the game play accordingly. This is fine for console games, but for PC ports, it's a problem, since as I rambled over an over, console games are getting ported to the PC now days.

I grumble and rant quite bit about this, because I'm torn. I've always enjoyed the separation of console games and PC games, so sophistication vs simple, but both are equally fun in their own respect. Now there's a blurring of the lines and PC games are the ones getting the shaft and that has only accelerated in recent years. The first 3D game I played on a PC -- actually the FIRST ever, Ultima Underworld, allowed me to swing my axe/sword/whatever, up , down, right, left, and thrust, all with variable strengths of which I could control with the mouse. Now about 16 years later, most games are still using the lame Doom-thrust attack. After playing this game, then trying games like Oblivion, with its robotic and limited controls, I get irritated, because developers have clearly lost site of what makes a good game.

On that picture... :)

Top image:
System Shock in all of its jagged glory. One of the best games I've played and it's quite sophisticated by today's simple standards. It's a true hard-corn game in every respect, even with its keyboard aiming -- which sucks compared to a thumb-stick. I really don't know why they took this approach though, since both Underworld games, which Looking Glass had also produced, used mouse aiming for projectile weapons.

Bottom image:
BioShock, which was gimped for the console generation. It IMO, is everything that is wrong with today's supposedly hard-corn games, since it has been simplified for the masses and for a younger audience.

-- ::

I hope you can get it worked out. If not, think small with a smaller TV. The Wiimote is awesome on these puny eyestrain's. :p And I second that on the thumb-stick not being replaced by the Wii's internal tech. They both have there place though and I like that the Wii offers both. I like golfing with a Wiimote rather than with my thumb -- I'm too lazy to go outside and burn in the hot sun. And even though it's cheese to waggle when I want to pull out my knife in RE4, it's still fun.

<]=)
 
Nintendo's biggest issue in my eye, is their closed door policy for small developers. I ran into a wall when I approached them at E3 a few years back with just some general questions. They could have said go to warioworld.com and fill out our application and will go from there, but no they simply started out with it takes time and money to develop a game and other statements that were already quite apparent and discouraging.

I would eventually like to work on a WiiWare game, but I'm weary of even applying, since they're a gatekeeper with inconsistent requirements. They tick me off, because games like Elf Bowling-- complete and utter vomit, not even good Flash work -- get published on the DS, and yet Nintendo's developer site states their stance on how quality is important. I wish they were more open like Sony, or even offered Apple's approach. I would invest in a Wii SDK just to tinker.

Total agreement here. Nintendo is one of the most incredibly finicky companies to work with I've encountered. They defer almost any press contact to third parties (Golin Harris), but they limit the third parties from being able to do a lot of things to help you and I've even had them express a measure of frustration. And I've worked with some indies to talk with Nintendo and just can't get anywhere.

Hudson, Atlas, Capcom, and others, on the other hand, are very approachable, and Ubisoft's devs are some of the friendliest at the events like E3. But maybe I'm biased because they gave me crab cakes.
 
I had hope for Nintendo and I honestly think if the Wii hadn't exploded, they would have taken an open approach with WiiWare.


CrabCAKES are EVIL. Last time I got food from E3, was when I worked for Interplay in 95. :eek: Back then, Lucas Arts booth was full of SNOBS. :mad:

Next time you see Ubisoft, can confirm that rumor that they're happy to shovel vomit onto the Wii, then turn around and use that profit to work on PS360 games? :)


And this is for Darkwing. Be not frightened. :D
 
Yeah quoting sucks. I'll just do what you did, only use ruder separation symbols.

\\\\\\\D

Symphonia really is great. It's good to see you keeping an open mind about it. :p My friends and I had a lot of fun with Zelda 4 swords on the GC withour GBAs. We used to like tossing each other in pits.

\\\\\\\\D

I have a friend whose into the whole custom firmware stuff on PSP but it doesn't interest me. I already went through the phase of running Linux on everything, anyway. :p Boooring.

\\\\\\\\D

I know that development is cheaper on the Wii, but keep in mind that when devs were saying that the PS3 and 360 were still relatively new. The wii is basically an overlcocked gamecube (don't bother arguing with me on that one) so the techniques are the same as last gen. Sony originally took a lot of heat for not being supportive enough to devs but I feel they've done a good job reversing that in the last year.

\\\\\\\\D

I love seeing realistic water. Why can't you have that in addition to fun and features? Speaking of water, I was playing through God of War and I think the water in that game looks pretty good for 2005 PS2. I don't know how, but somehow they made that game not look blocky and ugly. The gamecube was, imho, the best system last gen. The xbox may have edged it out on graphics but the GC had much better loading times and the system was so small and easy to take to people's houses. Shame it didn't do better.

\\\\\\\\D

I think Nintendo's years of failure starting with N64 was due to their arrogance with 3rd parties. Sony started to do the same thing with the PS3 but has learned some humility in the last 12-15 months.

I've never heard of Elf Bowling. Do you actually throw elves down the lane?

\\\\\\\\\D

Don't get me wrong on the whole poly vs sprite thing. I prefer 2d games, especially RPGs and platformers. I don't even really like 3d. I'd rather stuff be hand drawn than computer generated. However, I want it to be high-res and pretty... not blocky and crappy. Why is that so bad? :p There's simply no excuse for jagged games anymore, and the Wii and the DS tick me off for that. I don't really care for the Wii's controls, but I like the stylus just fine. I only wish the DS had more games that I like. New SUper Mario bros was the only game in the last year I played more than 10 hours (12) but the only thing I use the DS for is Mario Kart with my girlfriend.

\\\\\\\\D

You seem to have pretty good taste in games, so I'll give Magical Starsign another chance.

\\\\\\\\D

The only problem with Patapon is sometimes you get anxious and want to beat faster but you can't. Loco Roco is also really fun and is made by the same team. If you get a PSP you really should get both those games. Neat art direction, new sense of controls, and no jagged edges. :p

I think Namco must be ticked at Sony. It's the only thing I can think of.

\\\\\\\\D

Sony's component cables are only $25... :p and I didn't need those since I had them from my PS2, and because I used a $14 HDMI cable anyway. (Thank goodness for open standards, which Nintendo only used with the SD card on the Wii.)

Did you notice how Sony used to be criticized for making everything proprietary and lately everything they do is open? I hope the whole industry goes that way... especially looking at you, 360. Wrapping open standards around your own proprietary stuff... awful. Simply awful! (hard drive)

I wouldn't necessarily mind having to use a mouse for some console games... I think Unreal Tournament lets you se a kb/mouse on the PS3. But I'd rather still just relax and lay back anyway with my controller. :p

I agree that fighting with PCs to play games is the norm, but that's why I got into console gaming. I just got tired of it. Plus I decided years back I didn't want to support microsoft anymore, so I don't buy their junk.

I never cared for Ultima since 3 and 4. Not sure why, really.

Oblivion I figured out wasn't about fighting, btw. The swinging your sword or whatever was really just about a turn based RPG. Each side taking turns. I made an archer only to find out it takes 30 arrows to kill an ogre. I finally put the difficulty on easy so I could kill things. :p Then I quit playing. Not my kind of game, really.

\\\\\\\D

I've never played System Shock or BioShock. What the heck is hard-corn anyway?

\\\\\\\D

So in order to play the "cheap" console I have to spend more money on a new tv? Not so cheap now is it? :p

BTW, the dungeon game is fun. I really enjoyed that Throgdor game or whatever it was called a while back.
 
Each post was turning into a book of ramblings. It saved some height. You can thank me later. I'm not denying my rudeness, it was quite rude. ;)

These long post take up lots of time...

-- ENHANCED RUDENESS, with indexing -- >
0 --- ::


I really would have liked the option to link my DS to my Cube. Oh well, maybe Nintnendo will offer a patch solution for the Wii. I really want to play Four Swords.

Just to be sure, this is the Symphonia right; (It's the one I had bought.)
http://www.amazon.com/Namco-Tales-o..._2?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1208242066&sr=8-2

I bought my original copy from GameCrazy. I'll check them again for a used copy when I pick up Okami. :)
1 --- ::

I've never ran Linux on anything. :eek: I just want to play a couple of Genesis games again, but on the go. My DS emulator is limited because of screen size, but runs great. The Pocket PC runs like a slug, so isn't worth it. The PSP on the other hand is the best solution, besides a Nomad. I'm just looking for an excuse to buy one, but they'll probably have a Genesis emulator out for the iPhone/Touch soon, which would be another excuse for me not to buy a PSP.

2 --- ::


Nintendo pissed of lots of developers in the Nineties, Sony simply took their place. *EVIL* Given the chance, both will always go back to their previous ways. Nintendo certainly hasn't changed much. *grumbles*

Now that the Gamebryo -- Used to make Oblivion -- engine supports the Wii, it should be easier for developers to make cross-platform games and drive the cost down. I certainly don't mind that any future Wii ports will probably come from a much higher-budget game developed for one of the other systems. :)

And I'm not trying to argue, but you can't throw out something like that and not expect a reply -- especially from MEEEEE. I'm a HUGE NERD. :eek:

Just think about it from this perspective. If the Wii were simply a "overclocked gamecube," than the PS3 wouldn't be that impressive a game console. Just take Factor 5's comment -- the same guys that fed the fire of so many fanboys with their Cube 1.5 remark -- as an example;

“The engine does everything the PS3 did and then some, quite frankly.”
-Julian Eggebrecht


If the Wii were simply an over-clocked G3 variant + Radeon 8xxx variant, than Factor 5 would not have been able to replicate the PS3's feature on the Wii. It takes a modern GPU. When I look at the Wii, I see basically a G4/G5 hybrid varient with a Radeon x1xxx variant and some other undisclosed tech -- there's a chunk of transistors next to the GPU that know one has identified/disclosed.

The Wii's no more an over-clocked Cube than a Core Solo is an over-clocked Celeron. Sure, a Celeron and Core Solo run the same software, but the newer proc does have more tricks up is sleeve, like a newer SIMD as example.

3 --- ::


No reason we can't have both, if the budget and time allow for it, and now days it's sometimes just a shader to add purdy water. I was generalizing about the water comment, because for sometime, most developers were more concerned about technical aspects rather than gameplay.

I never played Gods of War, but I've been interesting in trying it out. I personally like the simple stuff like Wind Waker, which I know to this day, a few of my friends are still avoiding because of its art direction.

I only owned a few games on the Cube (I still own 6 and still have 3 controllers), but I really enjoyed it. Wind Waker is probably my favorite game of last generation. All of my friends had PS2s and and XBoxes. Beyond Halo, we didn't play the Xbox, and didn't really bother with the second. Most of our time was on the Cube for the cheese that is Mario Party. :)

4 --- ::


Nintendo was all high and mighty with the 64. I worked for Interplay when it came out. I recall the dev-kit was a SGI Indigo setup and it cost $500k just to develop for their console. Sony's PS1 was only $18k in comparison and I never heard of them charging such an exorbitant cost like Nintendo.

Behold the VOMIT that is Elf Bowling;
http://www.gamespot.com/ds/sports/elfbowling/index.html

It just shows that Nintendo will allow anyone to develop for them, as long as they have sufficient capital.

5 --- ::

I like also pretty, and for some things I like Hi-rez. I just don't like it when a developer doesn't put in as much effort for the rest of the game as they had for the visuals.

My ideal game would be a marriage of the some of the games I keep on spewing about like System Shock, but with the visuals of today. I would have to be sedated if someone actually updated X-Wing to today's visual standards, but didn't gimp the gameplay or controls in any way during the conversion.

I like games like Paper Mario, which have a combination of drawn art and stylized pixelated art, like the giant Mario. Games like the Patapon look awesome and inspire me.

I don't always like overly pixelated art, unless it's intentional, and I'm not a fan of unintentional jaggedness, this is why I go back and forth on which TV I use for my Wii. Some games look heads and tails better on the CRT -- with out jaggedness of course, where as other games like Metroid Prime look great on my LCD -- not as good as the CRT, but widescreen is a huge plus. I guess it comes down to our TV sets and how well they handle lower-rez content. HDTVs have certainly come along way now, but I still see modern sets that destroy anything SD and they don't seem to be able to handle broadcast colors.

I wouldn't want to play the Wii full screen on my Apple 30", but I really like how the Wii looks on plasma screens. And speaking of HDTVs handling SD content, I might pick up a 4 ton used Sony HDTV direct tube this week to replace my 3 ton 36" SDTV in my living room. I've already played the Wii on other widescreen CRTs and it looks great. This would tide me over until FEDTV is commonplace.

6 --- ::

Thanks, I aprecieate that, you just need to drudge past its initial weirdness. I like the game for its battles, the way you can time your attacks, and that it kept things going. Its story was cheese, but it still had some really messed up moments later on, but with gummy candy of all things. :) Visually I really liked how this game looks. Fore me it's top-notch pixel art.

7 --- ::

If I were single, I would own a PSP, a PS3, and probably even a 360 right now. This is how I was before I got married. :eek: I'm just getting old and I often find myself always factoring in weather of not I really need something. I really love portables, more than any console, I just need to bite the bullet and get one. I know I would love it and those games do look great

So you have Namco, I have Capcom. :) I always thought Capcom had something against Nintendo.

8 --- ::

Nintnedo was EVIL for not allowing its previous cable to work on the Wii. But Nintendo's compnent are only err, $29.95. :)

I've noticed that Sony is more open now. The criticism must have helped, but I'm still paranoid of somethings. As an example, Sony has always stated their devices could play MP3s, but what they didn't tell the end-user, was that there were limitations put on that format. I've always been a huge Sony fan, but their closeness really ticked me off, especially after I had invested $1200 in 2 Sony NR70 Cliés, only to find they didn't work as advertised. Sony was very misleading. This is also why I had my reservations about the PSP, which was released right after they discontinued the Clié in the US.

I would buy a PS3 for Unreal, before upgrading my PC. It would cost me less to do so. :) Other developers are neglecting the mouse though. My friend is playing Orange Box on the PS3 and they didn't bother adding in mouse support -- to me that's messed up. And why do you want to relax during a shooting/killing game... :p

Now days, if I can, I'll play games on my Mac. I'm glad that Blizzard has always offered support. MS needs less money, so that they'll go back to innovating. They seem to want a credit card for all interaction with them now days.


The early Ultima were good, but took lots of time, so I hear... My friends played them to completion, I never got that far with the earlier games. :eek: I was blown away by Underworld though, because it was the first continuos dungeon EVER, ad it was a great game. I upgraded to a 386 DX 40 just to play it -- it's what I could afford. :eek: My brother had a 486 DX 25 at the time. I was jealous. Anyways, I ordered the Pocket PC version last week for $3.99 on Amazon. :D

I only played obvlivion for short bits of time, so it's easy for me to be overly critical about its stiff controls. I can't really say if I would like it, but I recall no liking any of the previous Elder Scrolls, especially when companies like Looking Glass were around making way better games.

9 --- ::

Hard-corn is my cheese term for hardcore. I just find the term kind of silly, since most games are so easy now days and the press always uses that term for anything that contains blood.

And you must play the Shock... :eek: The first one scared the freak out of me and never before had I ever felt like I was truly part of a game.

10 --- ::

Yep about the Wii's cost, it adds up.

Trogdar is great! I've played the dungeon games a few times now, but I have yet to complete it. I really like this stuff. It's the kind of pixelated stylized cheese I'm rambling about. Their other newer games also cary that fun pixel art.

I also thought this was funny:
(Beware of the Flash video they have on this page. Blizzard does not know how to work with Flash period. Their Flash developer SUCKS BIG TIME. This thing uses 80% CPU idle.)
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/moltencore/


<]=)
 
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<snip>comment to long for quoting</snip>

Just wanted to add to a few things you touched on... first is art direction. I remember seeing the title Art Director in movie credits and on game credit, etc, and thinking WTF is that and what a useless thing to pay someone to do. Until companies, seemingly, decided to agree with me and started making games with no art director.

A game can be intensely simply in it's graphics, but if they are presented well will blow the biggest HD games out there.

Some examples: Viewtiful Joe and Alien Hominid are two side scrolling 2D "low tech" games (Alien Hominid was a flash game, FFS) that make bigger, more expensive 3D games look pretty bad, in my opinion.

As the counter point, Oblivion always looked like crap to me, not because the graphics were BAD, but they just lacked ANY style or direction whatsoever. Look, a tree and look a goblin got pretty much the same effect out of me. The game just looked BORING.

Same thing can be said for older games trumping newer ones due to superior art direction (even when comparing games in the same genre): Quake vs Halo (Halo always felt like I was in either an abandon city park or it's adjoined subway system. Quake had a great atmosphere to it, but that may have been the Trent Reznor/NIN soundtrack). Warcraft 2 vs. LoTR: Battle for Middle Earth (you have one of the richest fictional settings of all time to work from and THAT is what you end up with?).

The list could go on and one (Zelda: Wind Waker vs. Fable... any Mario Kart vs. any other kart racer ever :p). But, here's where I get to some sort of point (it's a slow day at work, so I'm taking my time getting there): sometimes I feel like artificial limits on what the target hardware can do forces game makers to focus on art direction and gameplay. When you have near unlimited resources (say developing a PC game or a 360/PS3 game, to a lesser extent) there's a chance you'll just make a bunch of really nice models and high res textures and go "Wow these look great!" but when you put it all together it's just sort of "meh".

This is why I think the Wii will end up with most of the "gems" of this generation - titles that are well thought out executed because you can't just through a bunch of 1080p lighting effects at it which will distract reviewers just long enough to get them to give it a good score, but bore players after the first week of staring at it.
 
I wasn't saying you were rude, I was saying that I would be rude by using \\\\D to index posts. It's supposed to be a penis, you see.

Anyhow, let's begin.

0:

When I got my DS years back, I figured it would have some kind of connectivity to Nintendo's next console, but so far this isn't the case? I don't know why they didn't put the plug on it for GBA-GC connectivity. They have this trade-in deal for your GBA/SP and then pull that, presumably to make people go out and buy another old SP or something after they already traded it in. That kind of irked me, but I bought my DS used off someone who bought it + a couple games and then bought a PSP. ;)

1:

If you want excuses to get a PSP, then get it for Loco Roco, Patapon, and Chili Con Carnage. I love that game. Mama Virjillo's boobs have more polys than the entire cast of DOA, too.

2:

The Wii is an overlcocked GameCube, sorry. Point me to any other evidence and maybe I'll reconsider... but it uses the same architecture and the same components. If you really believe that the Wii can handle all the calculations the PS3 can (and I'm not talking about graphics at all here) then I won't bother arguing with you about it. I mean, even if the CPUs were the same the fact that the PS3's memory bandwidth is over 10 times that of the Wii is pretty startling. I guess they'd tie at a hard increment loop in that case.

3:

I think that Wind Waker is a great game. The graphics are fun, and add to its charm. I think it had great graphics for its day and really look down on people who refused to even try it just for its art.

I'll never touch a Mario Party game, and that isn't because of cheese or graphics. I've simply realized that with the exception of Mario kart, the whole franchise sucks and is incapable of producing a good game. However, New SMB I bought because it returned to its classic roots and works quite nicely. (It even looks good!) 3d mario? No thanks.

4:

I have an SGI O2 with a 350 mhz r12k in a box in my basement somewhere. Fun stuff. I didn't realize the dev kit cost so much.

Elf Bowling does look pretty stupid. Crazy.

Remember when Nintendo ticked off the Doom people and they gave their source code to that company that makes the unlicensed Bible games and they made an FP"s" with it? That was funny stuff. (At least, that's how the story goes.)

5:

Paper Mario was hands down the worst game I ever played. The only reason I didn't destroy the disc is because I figure in some small way it would add to the appeal of a used gamecube in 30 years if someone's trying to buy one for a retarded 5 year old. The Wii version almost looked cool, but I just can't bring myself to get it. Maybe someday when it's $6 in a bargain bin, if that ever happens. I'll pass on Mario Galaxy, too. Tried to play that in the store and threw the controller down in disgust when I clicked the game's channel and the idiot who was kicked in the sack shouted "Super Mario Galaxy!" You can tell I'm bitter. :)

I'm waiting for a good price on the new OLED tvs. When I can get one in 60+ inches I'll be happy. I have a 60" SXRD (lcos) right now and love it quite muchly.

I agree that sometimes intentional pixel art can look nice, especially if done to poke fun at things in a nostalgic way like sprite comics do. However, when I play Wii Sports and do the bowling, the floors look nice and all but the pins are all blocky and jaggedy. There's simply no excuse at all for that in this day and age. One game that looks remarkably nice is Zelda TP. It has some jagged edges sure, but they aren't very noticeable probably because of the darker tone to a lot of the textures. Where I really cringe is in SSBB when the frame freezes at the end of the battle and the characters look like crap on their edges. It's a still shot, so surely the Wii can provide some AA there.

7:

I just dropped $7500 on an engagement ring, so I should probably sell the PS3 and PSP to recover. :p Luckily for me, my girlfriend is a huge gamer... but she prefers the xbox, so that means I'll have to get yet another console! Ugh.

Maybe I can bring her over to the Sony side?

Agreed with you on the portable love. That's why I use an MBP. I like being able to turn it off and back on whenever I want wherever I want.

8:

When I bought the Wii component cable, it was $35 at gamestop. Sony's was only $25. The component cable for the GC was only like $10 direct from Nintendo, but I waited until the GC was $99 and came with the Zelda disc before I bought it.

I thought they had mouse support on UT for PS3. Is that right? And why wouldn't I want to relax during a shooting/killing game? I don't play the games on super-hard difficulty mode and I don't play online. Sure I miss out on some challenge, but I don't really care. I only buy shooters that have interesting stories anyway. Can't wait for Resistance 2.

9:

I don't even know what system System Shock is on. I'll have to check Wikipedia. I was never a fan of survival horror games, though.

10:

Peasant's Quest is the game I was thinking about. I had a lot of fun with it, but never got a complete score. I got a complete score on dman3 the first time though! I usually type in silly things just to get a response out of it.. who knew you had to pour the blood on your own head?

----

mrgreen, I find oblivion to look incredible but the game itself to be kind of boring. That is my fault, though, for thinking I could be an archer and play through the whole game. Frankly, the stuff in the oblivion plane/world is boring and it's the side quests that are often fun.

The bottom line is that I want good gameplay and good graphics. If a game only gives me one, then I won't like it as much. Even a crappy game with pretty visuals can be fun for a little while because it is pretty to look at. If I pay $60 for a game and play it for 5 hours, that's $12 an hour to enjoy myself. Not bad considering how hard I work. I simply feel that the Wii can't give me the graphics I want, so while games can look good. I'll never feel that I have a "complete" experience even if the gameplay is nice. (my feelings about the controls aside.) So, the PS3/360 is the only console that can deliver the experience I want. What I really want is a JRPG that is hand drawn/cel shaded and in 1080p natively. Nowhere in sight it seems. Sigh.
 
Oh, I seee, now I must look away in horror!!! Oo

I should just split this into multiple posts, it's long, but then again...

0:

Yeah, that ticked me off. I griped about that for about 3 weeks and even noticed a wireless GBA connector accessory in stores, so why no DS connectivity was more than frustrating.

I'll have my PSP, it's just on hold. :eek: I found a Genesis emulator for the Touch yesterday, but of course the controls look non-tactile.

1:

The Genesis emulator is a good enough excuse for me. And since I've been seeing WiiSP games, * shudders * I might as well buy the system that some of these 'lazy' developers have been using as the starting point for their Wii games.

Chili Con Carnage looks funny. I had never even heard of it. :)

2:

When I made the comparison to the PS3, I was by no means stating that a Wii is as powerful/fast as a PS3, I was pointing out that the Wii's hardware, being newer, shares traits with other modern components, liked the PS3's GPU, and thus it's capable of doing similar tasks -- just scaled down. It's already clear that a Wii is capable of Antiscopic filtering, which the Cube was not. You can see this in games like Prime 3.

What I'm getting at, is that a GameCube with its nineties tech can not handle modern GPU effects. it would not be able to duplicate anything a PS3 can dish out, even at a much smaller scale, where as Factor 5 stated a Wii can. If I shove a DX8 card in my PC and some how over-clock it by even a 100 fold, it still won't be able to display a DX9 game correctly, if at all. Factor 5 states they could reproduce their PS3 engine on the Wii, that has to be proof enough that the Wii is simply not over-clocked dated-tech.

Here's a definitive difference between the Cube and Wii for starters and t's a known fact; Its GPU is allot bigger and it was manufacture at 90 nm. If it were just an over-clocked Flipper manufactured at 90 nm, it would be smaller than the Cube's 180 nm GPU, but this is not the case. So there's clearly more to the Wii's GPU, than just extra MHz.

The supposed leaks mention that the Wii has more TEV units and double the pipelines to make up for the extra girth of its GPU.

It's also known that it has a 128-bit memory interface, something a Cube did not.

I blame your skepticism on all of those lazy developers that have vomited PS2 games onto the Wii. I was the same way towards the PS2, thinking it was nothing more than an over-clocked PS1. ;)

Anyways, 6 years had past between each console. 6 years... :eek: That's a huge leap in performance and features for any GPU and any CPU.

The conclusion from this article from 2004 is relevant to what I'm trying to convey;
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2195&p=10

Even the newer low-end cards are better than the high end-cards from a couple of generations past and the Wii's GPU is based on a newer design than the GPUs they mention in the above article.

3:

I love the art for Wind Waker, but not in a weird way. In some areas it was really like being in a cartoon and its weather system really conveyed the different elements so wonderfully, because of the simplicity. I still rub it in my friend's nose that he didn't bother playing it. :eek: It's more relevant now, because he's enjoying Phantom Hourglass.

Mario Party is cheese, but for cheese and wacky graphics, it's been so much fun. My friends are ages that vary mostly from their early thirties to mid forties and we've had a blast with it. It's fun that my their kids and sometimes our wives, can/will also join in. Anyways, I think if you were given the opportunity and you were with the right group, you might like it, but then again, it would probably bore you. :)

I played Brawl Wii for the first time on Tuesday night. My friend's nephews are in tow this week and I got my arse handed to me by the youngest. =o. To me it's like the Cube game, just tons of button mashing and chaos. I'm a Street Fighter nut, I believe in skill. :eek: But obviously their is some skill in Brawl, because the 8 year old won every game, even against his uncle/my-friend -- who has always owned others in arcade fighting games.

4:
I'm jealous of your O2. I remember them at work, but I wasn't privy to one in the art department. I had a 9500 MP 180 at the time though. :) But still.. Just not the same as having a SGI. ~i~

Elf-vomit was heavily advertised on tech-tv. It's EVIL and frustrates me, because it's not even worthy of mediocre.

I don't recall the doom thing. :) I just thought it was a joke on the SNES, since I had my UBER 486 DX2 66, then my UBER P-90 @ 100Mhz.

5:

I never played Paper Mario on the Cube, only on the Wii version and I like it! You are bitter. :D I don't really know how it differs from the Cub, but it's like the classic platformers, just with a few puzzles. To me it's worth about $30. Galaxy is fun, but I have yet to finish it. I've only played it for maybe 2 days. I actually went back and finished Super Mario DS instead. :eek:

OLED is awesome, I've been waiting for it ever since Popular Mechanics mentioned it. Blah. I figured it would be mainstream by now. :( And if you're ever interested in trading your 60" for my 14" CRT, or 19" LCD TV, I would be willing to depart with either. I would just have to move my light-desk or something to make room. :) I'm still too fickle about HD content and frugal, OK cheap, when it comes to my entertainment, this is why I'm looking at a 300 ton CRT widescreen set, besides the inherent distortion, I know they handle most content nicely. I figured that since they're discontinued, I'll get a good transition TV at a good price as people dump them for the newer sets, and that if it's like my current CRT and others that I've owned, it has at least a decade of life.

The bowling pins look jagged even on a nice SD CRT. I played Brawl on a SDTV, so I didn't see it there, but I could see the facets on some of the polygons. I know 480p has its pixel limitations, but when I can see the developer has put in the effort to work with those limitations, I'm happy. I would like Nintendo to bump it to 720p via firmware, but even then there's only a moderate difference in quality, so I'd rather have 60 fps with all the purdies -- which developers are slowly warming up to.

The times I get frustrated with the Wii's visuals, are when it's obvious that developer didn't even bother. When I hear about a Wii game being developed by the "other" studio, of which they're also conveniently developing the the PS2 and PSP version of a game, I cringe. It leaves me irritated and even though I won't buy the game, it still resonates with me, since it gives developers an excuse and belief that it's OK to not to put any extra effort in on the Wii and do things right.

It's just like the PS2 last generation, developers puked out some nasty looking game for the first years as they struggled to learn what works.

6 -- it's the 7:

Congratulations! But don't compromise on the console. :p Just hold the engagement ring over her head as a deterrent. =O OK, I kid, that would create issues most likely. I've been married 11 and half years now. It has its.. Its.. Its good at times. :eek:

I just paid my corporate tax, so after I get one other expense out of the way, I'm going to finally get new portables. I've been waiting for a really long time. The two Ti-Books here finally died over the last year and if not for the whole Intel switch by Apple, I would have bought new books 2 years back. Just more excuses. :eek: But I'm glad I waited, because even last year's models are nice!

8:
My component cable was $60 at Circuit City. It's extra long... My LCD TV bastardized Zelda TP so badly and I wanted to play it in widescreen, so I bought the first component cable I could find during that stupid shortage. It certainly helped and I could then happily play Zelda.

I was going to wait for Zelda Cube also. The only reason I jumped earlier, was because of Metroid Prime. I wasn't remotely interested in Metroid BTW, not until playing it for 3 hours at my friend's place. Then I bought a Cube that week. It was black and came bundled with Brawl, which I gave to my friend's kid.

UT supports it. So I was surprised that Orange Box did not -- lazy developers and that doesn't even make sense, since it's on the PC and it has mouse support. So what gives?!!

Shooters are usually intense adrenaline games... Especially when gaming with friends. :) And if you like stories, I can guarantee you'll like System shock -- graphics aside, it has an awesome story. But you probably wouldn't be able relax. I used to run into the elevator and wait there as I tried to calm my nerves. The game was freaking scary, if not for the story, I would have stopped playing just to save my heart from exploding! O.O

9:

System Shock isn't really a survival horror in the sense of todays' console games that fit that description. It's a FPS adventure, in the flavor of Cyberpunk, but it doesn't suck. It's like reading a great, but scary sci-fi novel. Even with horrid controls, it's still so much better than most of this newer pampered stuff, enough that I can't shut-up about it.

It was released on PC and Mac back in 94. You're in luck, it's FREE now. Here's the link to System Shock portable. :D I still have my CD case, but I can't find the CD. :(

Note that the younger guys like System Shock 2 and it seems to get the most press. But I can tell you that it wasn't as good as the first -- which was so wonderfully balanced, but it's still an excellent game. If SS2 had been my first experience, I would have also been praising its merits -- it certainly had way better controls, but since it tried to be too many things and had some really stupid flaws, like monster-respawn (They suck for this, and BIG-TIME) and super-fragile weapons of the future, it just didn't hold up to the first.

10.

I haven't even played that far with Dungeon Man 3. I took the monk's stein and let him stew me. :]

----

I agree with mrgreen, good art direction is king. Games like Lost Wind are the kind of Wii games I look forward to playing. I personally like the art of games like World of Warcraft over Oblivion.

---


You're going to miss out on some great games then. ;)

I want it all also, but as I rambled, the best games I've played visually look like turds today. I except that not everything can be 100%. As long as the art style is right for the game and I can see they didn't puke it out, I'm usually happy and won't be bothered. I just don't like mediocrity, especially for controls. HD gaming to me is not a big deal, mainly because I've been gaming on PCs since the mid-eighties. I just got to a point where everything started to look the same , and even worse, play the same. When I play on my PC here, I game at 2560x1600, but when I go to a friends to play, sometimes I end up on 1024x768 screen, it really doesn't bother me. I've been spoiled with PC controls over the years, so of course my grumpy side has never liked playing any PC type game with a console controller. Even before I got my Cube, I was gaming at 1280x1024 on my PC. I had my stage when I was really excited about what was next with graphics, but that was when 3D accelerators were first introduced and games switched from 256 to thousands of colors -- now that was exciting. I still have my 2x Voodoo cards.

If I pay $60 for a game and it only lasts me 5 hours, it better be repayable, if not, I'll be annoyed. That's not much money, but when it comes down to what I like, I'd rather spend that on a reference book instead, which I buy more than games and there's never a hesitation about doing so, but with games, I always re-think if I really need to buy it or not, even if it's only $20. I guess it's priorities.

<]=)
 
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