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I paid $1200AUD in 2012 for the mid 2012 MacBook Pro 13, last year when Apple replaced that under AppleCare with a retina pro, I sold that and bought another classic mid 2012 MacBook Pro 13, and the baseline started at $1600, up $400 due to the exchange rate.

Crazy how 2012 tech sells for that much. Given that the 13 inch classic pro has sold so bloody well for nearly 4 years, I'm sure the profit margin continues to go up - I'm sure apple could have put a more recent processor in with all the cash made from selling outdated tech.
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You assume that bigger screens are automatically better which is wrong. Different sized screens suit different people. I find anything over 4 inches too big. Some people find 4.7 too small - it's a subjective thing, not resistance to change.

Are people who like the iPad Air size over the iPad pro just people who can't "handle change"?
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There is a point where all tech gets outdated and things fall behind. 16Gb of storage is in that category. A 32 GB baseline iPhone would not make the experience any worse for anyone, yet would improve many people's experiences.

The thing is that not all of us can afford higher storage capacities. 16 GB has been standard for years, and it should no longer be.

My reply was more about people always complaining about the good old days,
People whining that they miss and love the design of the 4. Miss iOS 6, etc.
I understand the need of a 4 inch phone, but when the 5 was released, even 4 inch was too big. Everything was better in the good old days, etc...

Although... Your name is oldmacs....
 
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Stop whining please, just get the 64 gb then.
You act like you don' t have a choice.
You do... Get the 64gb or get the cheaper 16gb or the generation before with more gb. Or...
It has always been this way with Apple .
The last 2 years, it even became a better deal. Instead of asking a 100 , for a 16gb increase, they ask a 100 for a 48gb increase.

iPhone 7 won' t change this.
Perhaps the iPhone 7 pro will start with 32gb.

No one is whining, we are just stating the fact after 9 years of $650/16GB and since the entire industry has moved to 32GB (due to ridiculously exponentially cheaper SSD prices), it's time Apple does the same and stop being greedy. It's not a unreasonable thing for an Apple customer to ask to their beloved company, is it?
 
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I don't pay any monthly fee for my iPhone, and I never want to do so. Plenty of people including myself buy outright and try to get many years out of their iPhones.
I'm not interested in plans,

You realize Apple's and the carriers payment plans are interest free, right? So you tell me, which makes more sense, paying Apple $650-750 upfront and be out that money, or putting that same money in an interest bearing account and paying a monthly prorated, interest free, installment which results in full ownership two years later, and earning the interest on the principle, and making money all the while?

Moreover, when you decide to upgrade, Apple will take your old phone and even with wear and tear, as long as it's functional, they will give you a fair market rate for your phone -- in many cases, likely more than you'd get from a private party if you have excessive cosmetic damage.

Your way doesn't make as much sense, regardless of how long you intend to keep the phone.

and I find the idea of a new phone every year wasteful and environmentally damaging. ... iPhones should be made to last, not for "a year or two". If you think its reasonable to put 1GB of ram into a 2016 Phone you clearly don't give a damn about user experience or anything other than Apple's profit margins. The cost for apple between 1GB and 2GB would not be great and Apple can swallow that cost.

1GB of ram as I've already said is extremely limiting, it should have disappeared with the 5S. Some of us like keeping tabs and multiple Applications open. 1GB was nice in 2012 and maybe 2013, but 2GB of ram should be the minimum now. I want my next phone to last a long time.

Well, you can make the wasteful and environmentally damaging argument if you like. The reality is, it's technology were talking about, and there are improvements made every year that people can benefit from, whether you are OK making the sacrifice or not. And Apple is the most environmentally responsible manufacturer there is. Is it better not to make the product in the first place, than to recycle it? Sure. But again it's technology. If you need it, then there's no point in doing without the benefits new tech provides. At least with Apple you know it's being managed well.

But that's not really your point. You seem to be angry about Apple's failure to offer more than 1GB of RAM. Personally, I have never had an issue with RAM. I fully expect I could keep my 5S for two more years if I didn't want Pay, just like I did with my iPhone 4, which I kept for over 4 years, and only replaced because the home and power/lock buttons broke. I'm still using an iPad 3, and have no intention of upgrading -- how's that for conservation? And miraculously, it works just fine despite not having 2GB RAM, just like my 5S.

So frankly I don't see a problem with Apple releasing a new iPhone with only 1GB of RAM. I can easily see getting two more years out of it without any problems, though possibly making some sacrifices just as I am with my iPad 3. And just like you are making sacrifices with your old phone. If this new phone doesn't suit you, then don't buy it. Make due with your old technology, happy that you are saving the environment, and eventually Apple will upgrade to 2GB and then you can buy your "forever" phone then.
 
That it didn't stutter on new hardware. While I love the new design and features in iOS 7,8 and 9, I've found especially 8 and 9 don't graphically run completely smoothly even on new hardware.
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That it didn't stutter on new hardware. While I love the new design and features in iOS 7,8 and 9, I've found especially 8 and 9 don't graphically run completely smoothly even on new hardware.

I don' t see it. Have a 6s and no stutters at all.
I am hearing this a lot though.
I set up my iPhone from new instead of restoring a back up, perhaps that is the problem?
 
I don' t see it. Have a 6s and no stutters at all.
I am hearing this a lot though.
I set up my iPhone from new instead of restoring a back up, perhaps that is the problem?

I have never seen stuttering on a 6S, I was more talking about the iPad Pro and Air 2.
 
You are welcome to purchase a device with more storage if you need it. My 5s with 16GB is working fine for my purposes today, which obviously disproves your opinion that all iphones need 32GB and 2GB of ram today.

This is exactly the same kind of crap that happened with the PC/Mac spec wars way before iphones were even invented. And Apple proved over and over that higher specs with a crap operating system meant nothing in every day use.

Just because it works for you doesn't mean Apple is not skimping.
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Stop whining please, just get the 64 gb then.
You act like you don' t have a choice.
You do... Get the 64gb or get the cheaper 16gb or the generation before with more gb. Or...
It has always been this way with Apple .
The last 2 years, it even became a better deal. Instead of asking a 100 , for a 16gb increase, they ask a 100 for a 48gb increase.

iPhone 7 won' t change this.
Perhaps the iPhone 7 pro will start with 32gb.

Or Apple can step up and ditch the 16 in favor of the 32. They have enough money sitting in Ireland that they can absorb the cost to make their customers happy(er).
 
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Just because it works for you doesn't mean Apple is not skimping.

If any other company thought they could get away with 16gb, they'd do it too. But when an S6 started off with about 8-10gb shaved off right off the bat, that's not exactly possible. Android devices, by and large, would be unusable with 16gb. The exception is obviously a Nexus.
 
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No one is whining, we are just stating the fact after 9 years of $650/16GB and since the entire industry has moved to 32GB (due to ridiculously exponentially cheaper SSD prices), it's time Apple does the same and stop being greedy. It's not a unreasonable thing for an Apple customer to ask to their beloved company, is it?
But in that 9 years of $650 16gb, Apple went from 3.5 inch to 4.7 inch, 512mb to 2gb , full Alu body, etc. and they offer 48gb more for $100 instead of 100 for a 16gb upgrade 9 years ago...
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Just because it works for you doesn't mean Apple is not skimping.
[doublepost=1456627117][/doublepost]

Or Apple can step up and ditch the 16 in favor of the 32. They have enough money sitting in Ireland that they can absorb the cost to make their customers happy(er).
They could even give free iPhones .
But they won' t ... It is just not the way this economy works. It is all about growth, increase, revenue , margins.
 
My reply was more about people always complaining about the good old days,
People whining that they miss and love the design of the 4. Miss iOS 6, etc.
I understand the need of a 4 inch phone, but when the 5 was released, even 4 inch was too big. Everything was better in the good old days, etc...
I have never seen stuttering on a 6S, I was more talking about the iPad Pro and Air 2.

My air 2, doesn' t stutter either. But perhaps there is another problem. It is very fluent on my air 2.
 
But in that 9 years of $650 16gb, Apple went from 3.5 inch to 4.7 inch, 512mb to 2gb , full Alu body, etc. and they offer 48gb more for $100 instead of 100 for a 16gb upgrade 9 years ago...

But their product structure is still based on storage, this is both artificial and outdated, because SSD storage costs nothing nowadays compared to 9 years ago.

After doing some research I found this:

NAND memory component costs for iPhone 6s

$5.50 16GB
$17 64GB

I assume 32GB would cost around $4-5 more than 16GB.

Apple could eliminate the 16GB iPhone and charge $655 for a 32GB iPhone, and not lose any money. I'm sure no one would complain that they are getting 32GB for $5 more.

Why don't they do it? Because of greed, they want 16GB to force people to buy 64GB.

http://www.ibtimes.com/iphone-6s-pl...ke-iphone-6-plus-ihs-teardown-reveals-2120667
 
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You realize Apple's and the carriers payment plans are interest free, right? So you tell me, which makes more sense, paying Apple $650-750 upfront and be out that money, or putting that same money in an interest bearing account and paying a monthly prorated, interest free, installment which results in full ownership two years later, and earning the interest on the principle, and making money all the while?

Moreover, when you decide to upgrade, Apple will take your old phone and even with wear and tear, as long as it's functional, they will give you a fair market rate for your phone -- in many cases, likely more than you'd get from a private party if you have excessive cosmetic damage.

Your way doesn't make as much sense, regardless of how long you intend to keep the phone.


They don't offer that sort of thing in Australia, and anyway I wouldn't take it up. I'm not interested in payment plans or anything. I don't know when I'll have money or when I won't have money, so I'll buy when I can afford it, and if not I won't buy it.

Well, you can make the wasteful and environmentally damaging argument if you like. The reality is, it's technology were talking about, and there are improvements made every year that people can benefit from, whether you are OK making the sacrifice or not. And Apple is the most environmentally responsible manufacturer there is. Is it better not to make the product in the first place, than to recycle it? Sure. But again it's technology. If you need it, then there's no point in doing without the benefits new tech provides. At least with Apple you know it's being managed well.


But that's not really your point. You seem to be angry about Apple's failure to offer more than 1GB of RAM. Personally, I have never had an issue with RAM. I fully expect I could keep my 5S for two more years if I didn't want Pay. I'm still using an iPad 3, and have no intention of upgrading -- how's that for conservation? And miraculously, it works just fine despite not having 2GB RAM, just like my 5S.

So frankly I don't see a problem with Apple releasing a new iPhone with only 1GB of RAM. I can easily see getting two more years out of it without any problems, though possibly making some sacrifices just as I am with my iPad 3. And just like you are making sacrifices with your old phone. If this new phone doesn't suit you, then don't buy it. Make due with your old technology, happy that you are saving the environment, and eventually Apple will upgrade to 2GB and then you can buy your "forever" phone then.

I'm more than happy to use an iPhone until it no longer receives software updates. Its cost effective for me, I can go on prepaid, and yes i would rather not have the environmental impact of having a new iPhone made and having the old one then recycled, as no matter how environmentally friendly apple is, that uses a lot of unnecessary resources for a completely unnecessary yearly or two yearly update. The better made an iPhone is, and the more future proof it is, the longer people can keep them and the better for the environment that is.

That is a pointless argument. 1 or 2 years out of a phone is NOT GOOD ENOUGH. It is environmentally reckless, its essentially built in obsolesce. How about we go back to 256MB of ram? That would work for plenty of people, so why does Apple not sell iPhones with 256MB of ram?

Sure 1GB of ram works ok, I have an iPhone 5 and iPad 2, I know living with 1gb and 512MB (respectively) of ram is like, and its ok, since we're talking older technology here that I've used for years, which are both obviously reaching the end of their lifespan - they are not brand new devices so I can put up with them not being able to keep applications open, or tabs open. Had the iPhone 5 had 512MB of ram in 2012 then it would not have lasted this long.

If you can't see that 1GB of ram is too little in 2016, then you must not use multiple tabs, or do really anything much demanding. I'm also guessing that Apple's profit margins are more important to you than user experience, as that is the only reason that we've been stuck with 1GB of ram so long. 1GB of ram is just hopeless in 2016, the whole industry has moved past that, and even iOS has moved past it given how much ram it now uses, and how much ram tabs use.
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My air 2, doesn' t stutter either. But perhaps there is another problem. It is very fluent on my air 2.
I've been able to make every single one I've ever used stutter in 2 window multitasking.
 
But their product structure is still based on storage, this is both artificial and outdated, because SSD storage costs nothing nowadays compared to 9 years ago.

After doing some research I found this:

NAND memory component costs for iPhone 6s

$5.50 16GB
$17 64GB

I assume 32GB would cost around $4-5 more than 16GB.

Apple could eliminate the 16GB iPhone and charge $655 for a 32GB iPhone, and not lose any money. I'm sure no one would complain that they are getting 32GB for $5 more.

Why don't they do it? Because of greed, they want 16GB to force people to buy 64GB.

http://www.ibtimes.com/iphone-6s-pl...ke-iphone-6-plus-ihs-teardown-reveals-2120667
You don' t get it.
Apple will loose iPhone 64gb buyers with that move and THAT will cost them money.
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They don't offer that sort of thing in Australia, and anyway I wouldn't take it up. I'm not interested in payment plans or anything. I don't know when I'll have money or when I won't have money, so I'll buy when I can afford it, and if not I won't buy it.



I'm more than happy to use an iPhone until it no longer receives software updates. Its cost effective for me, I can go on prepaid, and yes i would rather not have the environmental impact of having a new iPhone made and having the old one then recycled, as no matter how environmentally friendly apple is, that uses a lot of unnecessary resources for a completely unnecessary yearly or two yearly update. The better made an iPhone is, and the more future proof it is, the longer people can keep them and the better for the environment that is.

That is a pointless argument. 1 or 2 years out of a phone is NOT GOOD ENOUGH. It is environmentally reckless, its essentially built in obsolesce. How about we go back to 256MB of ram? That would work for plenty of people, so why does Apple not sell iPhones with 256MB of ram?

Sure 1GB of ram works ok, I have an iPhone 5 and iPad 2, I know living with 1gb and 512MB (respectively) of ram is like, and its ok, since we're talking older technology here that I've used for years, which are both obviously reaching the end of their lifespan - they are not brand new devices so I can put up with them not being able to keep applications open, or tabs open. Had the iPhone 5 had 512MB of ram in 2012 then it would not have lasted this long.

If you can't see that 1GB of ram is too little in 2016, then you must not use multiple tabs, or do really anything much demanding. I'm also guessing that Apple's profit margins are more important to you than user experience, as that is the only reason that we've been stuck with 1GB of ram so long. 1GB of ram is just hopeless in 2016, the whole industry has moved past that, and even iOS has moved past it given how much ram it now uses, and how much ram tabs use.
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I've been able to make every single one I've ever used stutter in 2 window multitasking.

So there was no stuttering in 2 window multitasking in iOS 6?
 
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You don' t get it.
Apple will loose iPhone 64gb buyers with that move and THAT will cost them money.

Which comes back to my point, after 9 years of 16gb which now costs peanuts, and EVERYONE in the industry at 32GB, Apple, the once leader and innovator, is stuck at 16GB due to profits, ie greed.
 
Your Pro stutters?

Every time I've used an iPad Pro for long enough its stuttered. Folder animations sometimes, the slide up from the lock screen to the camera, the app closing animation etc. I'm not talking constant stuttering, I'm talking occasional, but never saw this on say the iPad 2 with iOS 5 or the iPad 4 with iOS 6.
 
But in that 9 years of $650 16gb, Apple went from 3.5 inch to 4.7 inch, 512mb to 2gb , full Alu body, etc. and they offer 48gb more for $100 instead of 100 for a 16gb upgrade 9 years ago...
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They could even give free iPhones .
But they won' t ... It is just not the way this economy works. It is all about growth, increase, revenue , margins, screwing the customer.

I fixed that for you.
 
Stop about these android phones. They are nice, and i like the look of the s7(except for the branding/sensors.)
But the specs? octacores, 8gb of ram, 20 mp, etc.
This is just spec, not user experience, and apple has the resources to advance in technology this in the next year or so, with the release of the iphone 7 and 7s.
Apple already caught up with the socs, they have a solid lead. Next stop: camera and water resistance .
They will also have an updated display and will up the res. Oled will probably still take the lead, but iphone 7+7s will get closer. In 2017/2018 apple will be in the lead due to microled tech.
Wireless charging? in 2017 apple will have " true" wireless charging. instead of a mat with a cable.

Apple had always been in the lead with IOS, safety and ecosystem, design and materials. Android phones have caught up, are not quite there yet though. Android phones compensated that with paper specs, or far more powerful hw to drive android at the same smoothness as IOS.
Apple is playing catch up in the specs and screen tech. But the problem is that only a few android players can compete(samsung, and a small chance for LG) with apple on that front in the future. If apple has caught up with better screen tech, wireless charging, camera, etc, a lot of the android phone manufacturers will only be a good option for budget phones, and won' t be high end anymore, they don' t have the same massive financial resources apple has. In the future perhaps only samsung or huaweij will be able too keep up, because they have decent margins and their own production/R&D departments. But that is it. It will be samsung or Apple in the high end(just like it is now), and the rest will be budget and pricefighters, get very low margins, perhaps won' t even make a profit.

In short:
The cheaper android have some things for them going now over the iphone, but in a few years that is finished.
They won' t be able too keep up with the more advanced technology, and they will have to reduce prices even further to compensate for that.They will need to lower their margins even further, and R&D expenses will be cut.

It will only be samsung and apple if you want real high-end phones in the future.
And we know which brand sells more high end/expensive phones now....
Everyone's entitled to their opinions, of course. But I can objectively say that Android Marshmallow running on the Nexus 6P is as smooth a user experience as the iPhone 6S+--no lag, stutters, hiccups, etc. It just works. I can't and won't vouch for Samsung devices, but will tell you that the latest Google Nexus devices are about as close as you can get to reaching iOS/iPhone parity.
 
You don' t get it.
Apple will loose iPhone 64gb buyers with that move and THAT will cost them money.

So what? That doesn't matter at all to me. Apple is rich. Customers have been paying for years to get storage levels that should be standard. They're mega rich, and they rip of customers a lot, so occasionally it would be nice to see them give back. Maybe they can pay for it through all the extra earnings from the taxes they avoid in Australia and many other places.
 
Me, and MILLIONS of others.

I take it your user experience would be worse off with 32GB of ram?

You know Millions would probably be happy with an A5 processor and 8GB of ram... I'm guessing thats what the iPhone 7 baseline should include.
 
Which comes back to my point, after 9 years of 16gb which now costs peanuts, and EVERYONE in the industry at 32GB, Apple, the once leader and innovator, is stuck at 16GB due to profits, ie greed.

Yes it is! It is a company that needs to report growth. Have you seen their margins? Sky high! That is the way Apple works and has worked over years.

You can do it the lg, Sony and Huawei , etc way, but they barely make profits or loose money in the smartphone market.

I don' t let my feelings about margins, etc play s role when I buy an iPhone.
For me it is all about my own satisfaction with the product for the price. And I am satisfied..
 
Yes it is! It is a company that needs to report growth. Have you seen their margins? Sky high! That is the way Apple works and has worked over years.

In the past Apple have increased the bottom tier storage, from 4GB to 8GB to 16GB, as prices have come down and people have had the need to store more. Right now people are storing bigger photos and videos, prices for 32gb of storage have come right down and 16GB is becoming more and mire restrictive, yet its been standard for years. Its time for it to change. Apple will not do well if it overcharges for yesteryear's technology.
 
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Yes it is! It is a company that needs to report growth. Have you seen their margins? Sky high! That is the way Apple works and has worked over years.

You can do it the lg, Sony and Huawei , etc way, but they barely make profits or loose money in the smartphone market.

So you support Martin Shkreli levels of greed? Apple could make 8GB iPhone and charge $200 for 64GB. Why don't they? There's gotta be some balance right? Because company image and user experience at some point is affected and that ultimately will hurt profits as well.
 
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