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Geekbench scores are basically useless, the benchmark is way too short to expose the thermal throttling problems these machines will definitely have.
Your everyday workload has much shorter durations than the Geekbench tests, unless your working a lot with large video files being converted. So, for most users (like me using them for programming) the short busts make the machines feel snappy.
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I really wish Geekbench would make a benchmark that runs for 20 minutes so you could actually test these machines under load with heat. No way this thing runs anywhere near as well as the 2019 iMac, much less the iMac Pro.
What workload are you using that the computer is under 20 min heavy load. Then, you probably should not be using a "laptop".
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Anyone think the upgrade to the 2.4 Ghz (Turbo Boost up to 5.0Ghz) processor for an extra $200 is worth it?

Or should I look at upgrading other things? I mostly do video editing, photoshop, etc. Don't do any gaming.
If you do a lot of video editing, then yes!
 
40% improvement over the 2018 i9 MBP? Really? Doesn't look like it to me.
I just ran GeekBench4 on my 2018 MBP i9, 1TB, 32GB, Vega20, and this is my score on Mojave 10.14.5:

Screen Shot 2019-05-24 at 13.37.17.png


And here's the link to the fulls results on GeekBench: https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/13249279
 
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The Vega 16/20 makes it run a bit hotter, the fans are a bit louder, and the energy consumption is increased slightly, reducing the battery life slightly. For folks who really need a high performance GPU, an eGPU would be a much better option.

As far as storage, I fully agree that Apple’s prices are insanely high. NVMe storage is currently $150 for 1TB, $300 for 2TB, Apple charges several times that. The MacBook Pro doesn’t even have upgradable storage since 2015, forcing users to go with external storage to avoid Apple’s insane prices for internal SSD.
You are comparing price for a NVMe with 600 GB/s to a 2200 GB/s transfer rate. Take into account that at least Apple is picking the very best components, but of course you can always find something that seems cheaper, but may not actually be when you factor everything in.
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40% improvement over the 2018 i9 MBP? Really? Doesn't look like it to me.
I just ran GeekBench4 on my 2018 MBP i9, 1TB, 32GB, Vega20, and this is my score on Mojave 10.14.5:

View attachment 838756

And here's the link to the fulls results on GeekBench: https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/13249175
Did you turn off all other programs, like Chrome, Spotify etc. that run in the background. And allow spotlight to finish processing?
 
One of the strange things is that Apple is the first to release 8 Core Notebook. Normally they will wait for far longer.

Which suggest to me this really is just about fixing the keyboard, and the 8 Core Count is a disguise.

It also means the MacBook Pro is the best money can buy at the moment, and a better deal if you are looking for performance.
 
Couldn’t care less. At that price, the 512gb ssd and VEGA graphics should be standard on a 15-inch version. These greedy bastards are bleeding us enough already.

$2,399.00

  • 2.6GHz 6-core 9th-generation Intel Core i7 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 16 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 512GB SSD storage
$2,799.00

  • 2.3GHz 8-core 9th-generation Intel Core i9 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 20 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 1TB SSD storage

You have really good prices in US... In europe (sweden) that same vega 20 config cost 4514 dollar. Thats a crappy price.
 
You have really good prices in US... In europe (sweden) that same vega 20 config cost 4514 dollar. Thats a crappy price.

That's before taxes probably. That $2799 config is $3600 if you go and configure it on the US website.
 
They’ll probably release the 16” with a redesign, OLED screen, super efficient cooling, better graphics and history’s best keyboard in like 3 months for the same amount. Seems to be the way it’s going these days.

DAMN APPLE FOR MAKING THINGS BETTER!!!!!!!

Apple waits for me to buy something before they announce upgrades.
 
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On paper it seems like a complete waste of money, but, keep in mind:

Being that the 2.4 Ghz is a "K" variant, it's possible that it'll indeed run cooler, and consequently much faster than the 2.3 Ghz unit as the die is soldered to the headspreader. Whereas, I believe the 2.3 Ghz chip is using conventional "paste." Someone correct me if I am wrong here.

Given this, the 2.4 Ghz should sustain much higher frequencies under load. A cinebench or other taxing benchmark will ultimately show how much each model throttles its turbo frequency.

That only applies to the desktop CPU's, majority of laptop CPU's are direct from die to heatsink and don't have an IHS.


You are comparing price for a NVMe with 600 GB/s to a 2200 GB/s transfer rate. Take into account that at least Apple is picking the very best components, but of course you can always find something that seems cheaper, but may not actually be when you factor everything in.
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Did you turn off all other programs, like Chrome, Spotify etc. that run in the background. And allow spotlight to finish processing?

https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-970-...1tb+nvme&qid=1558702622&s=gateway&sr=8-3&th=1

Samsung's 970 EVO has 3500 Reads/ 2500 Writes for much less than what Apple's charging for 2TB and I sincerely doubt Apple is paying full retail...
 
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Couldn’t care less. At that price, the 512gb ssd and VEGA graphics should be standard on a 15-inch version. These greedy bastards are bleeding us enough already.

$2,399.00

  • 2.6GHz 6-core 9th-generation Intel Core i7 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 16 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 512GB SSD storage
$2,799.00

  • 2.3GHz 8-core 9th-generation Intel Core i9 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 20 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 1TB SSD storage

I agree; they’re definitely overpriced.

Fortunately, they tend to last a long time, and in general, macOS keeps things running well as machines age. Personally, I only have to buy a MBP every 5-7 years. E.g.- my current mid-2014 15-in MBP is maxed out and cost $4000 (including taxes and AppleCare), but I was literally just telling a coworker yesterday that I don’t see myself needing a new machine for another 2 years. I use Logic, Sibelius, run plugins like crazy, and, while a newer machine would be “better,” it still runs smooth as butter. I think of like this: I pay just under $100 a month to have a Mac. For me, $100/mo. is worth it to have macOS, iOS, a machine that’s generally reliable, tech support that’s free and *usually quick (I live near an Apple Store). If someone does need the latest and greatest, they can buy a new machine every year and sell it, “spending” +/- $1000/yr. I have former coworkers (Genii at an Apple Store) who do just that and broke down the math for me. I’m just too lazy to use eBay once a year.

I completely understand folks’ (myself included) annoyances with Apple’s prices, but the alternative—headaches, general unreliability—is, IMO, not worth saving a few bucks a month. Yes, these prices are ridiculous, but I will keep paying them to keep my technological sanity. Apple knows this, and that’s why prices will remain exorbitant.
 
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You have really good prices in US... In europe (sweden) that same vega 20 config cost 4514 dollar. Thats a crappy price.

That is what he thinks he should get for that price. Speccing out that machine he listed is $3549 usd.
 
Couldn’t care less. At that price, the 512gb ssd and VEGA graphics should be standard on a 15-inch version. These greedy bastards are bleeding us enough already.

$2,399.00

  • 2.6GHz 6-core 9th-generation Intel Core i7 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 16 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 512GB SSD storage
$2,799.00

  • 2.3GHz 8-core 9th-generation Intel Core i9 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 20 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 1TB SSD storage
As a comparison, the only downside being the pre-installed Windows it comes with. Dell hardware is generally Linux friendly, so that might be a sweet option:

XPS 15 Touch
$2,449.99


  • 8th Generation Intel® Core™ i9-8950HK Processor (12MB Cache, up to 4.8 GHz, 6 cores)
  • Windows 10 Home 64bit English
  • NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 1050Ti 4GB GDDR5
  • 1TB PCIe Solid State Drive
  • 32GB 2x16GB DDR4-2666MHz
 
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Tbh, given that the keyboards are (likely) susceptible to heat, I'm wondering if the 6 core i7 is the pick of the bunch here.
 
You have really good prices in US... In europe (sweden) that same vega 20 config cost 4514 dollar. Thats a crappy price.
The USA Apple Store price is without (their very low) tax.
The Swedish Apple Store price of $4514 is including (our extremely high) 25% tax.

Our socialistic government has a lot of advantages, but prices of gadgets is not one of them. In addition, the crash of the SEK currency (I blame the current government for that too) isn’t helping, since Apple normalizes their prices to the USD currency.

/Fellow Swede
 
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I just wish they would go back to the smaller trackpad, so I wouldn’t have the constant cursor jumping issue...otherwise my late 2016 MBP still works fine.
 
Tbh, given that the keyboards are (likely) susceptible to heat, I'm wondering if the 6 core i7 is the pick of the bunch here.
Doesn’t matter, they all will run around 100C, max power way exceeds cooling capacity of the MBP. IMHO the most sensible would be 9th gen i7 + Vega, but you can’t have it. The 8 core is at best 15% faster than the ‘old’ 2.2 6 core in anything resembling real work, the difference between 9th gen 6 and 8 core should be even smaller.
 
You are comparing price for a NVMe with 600 GB/s to a 2200 GB/s transfer rate. Take into account that at least Apple is picking the very best components, but of course you can always find something that seems cheaper, but may not actually be when you factor everything in.
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Did you turn off all other programs, like Chrome, Spotify etc. that run in the background. And allow spotlight to finish processing?

First of all, your transfer rates should be in MB/s, not GB/s. Second, the 2018 MacBook Pro has transfer rates more like 2800 MB/s - you’re not giving it enough credit! Third, the NVMe drives I was referring to, such as the HP ex950, have transfer rates well above 2200 MB/s. Here’s the $300 2TB model:

D7648296-6D69-4AE6-9D65-7FD413C2EC28.jpeg
 
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I do wish Apple would either have better pricing on their internal SSD, or use NVMe M.2 slots rather than soldering the SSD to the logic board. I get that it’s way easier to support these things without customers installing dodgy storage and/or RAM, but these are “pro” laptops that cost several thousand dollars. It’s frustrating to have zero upgradability.

Big Apple fan here, been using their laptops since the iBook G4 came out.
 
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At least I can finally buy a refurbished 2018 model with a Vega 20 chip for $2599. I would say I'm shocked they didn't make Vega standard, but Apple has been hiking prices without compensation for years now
 
At least I can finally buy a refurbished 2018 model with a Vega 20 chip for $2599. I would say I'm shocked they didn't make Vega standard, but Apple has been hiking prices without compensation for years now
You might want to wait to see how much Best Buy, Adorama, B&H or Amazon discounts a brand new 2018 MacBook Pro unless you need one right now. I got a 2016 2.9GHz/16GB/1TB/RX460 for $2299, which was and still is $370 less than what Apple charges for a Certified Refurbished.

Source: https://www.apple.com/shop/product/...core-Intel-Core-i7-with-Retina-display-Silver
 
Couldn’t care less. At that price, the 512gb ssd and VEGA graphics should be standard on a 15-inch version. These greedy bastards are bleeding us enough already.

$2,399.00

  • 2.6GHz 6-core 9th-generation Intel Core i7 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 16 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 512GB SSD storage
$2,799.00

  • 2.3GHz 8-core 9th-generation Intel Core i9 processor
  • Radeon Pro Vega 20 with 4GB of HBM2 memory
  • 16GB 2400MHz DDR4 memory
  • 1TB SSD storage

I recall a time where the competition was giving 512GB of Video memory and Apple was still stuck at 64GB of video memory.
 
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Everyone's budget is fixed to an extent on almost any purchase one desires to make, either by your boss, your spouse, your bank account, your credit score or your own innate opinions of worth and value as it relates to physical goods.

My credit score and debt-to-income ratio told me I could afford a house that was 30% more expensive than what I ultimately purchased. I used a variety of factors to determine that the bank was out of its ever loving mind, despite the numbers...mostly my own common sense and the innate lack of wanting to be held hostage by a high mortgage. As a two income household, the goal was to be able to pay the mortgage on a one income household, which we can. The benefit of the lower purchase price allowed margin for extra principal payments, unexpected unemployment, catastrophic illness or death.

I still feel this point is a bit misplaced. The right way of thinking of this is in the marginal opportunity cost, which I brought up in the post you are responding to. That's precisely what "your own innate opinions of worth and value as it relates to physical goods" is getting at here. Opportunity cost. You'd rather have $200 for some unknown set of stuff than a small gain on your CPU. OK, fine. That's how you view the cost. Anyone buying a MBP for work has that marginal $200, the question is where is it best spent? Snacks, beer, eGPUs, RAM, CPU? And they all work together. Each can exist on their own or in combination. In the era of 0% loans for stuff, we're talking like $10/month here (Apple literally offers you a 0% 18m loan at time of purchase for one of these). Its likely all can exist together. In the scheme of things, a ~$3000 computer that will be productive for 3+ work*years is peanuts. The $200 margin then even smaller.

My argument is that, depending on your workload and area of industry, you would more likely see a better long term return with upgrading the DRAM or the GPU, if your workloads would benefit from more DRAM or a faster GPU, given the performance gains measured by others over the base configurations Apple sells and the fact that DRAM can speed up certain workflows enormously, while the GPU is being used a general purpose processor for more and more operations given the relative lack of progress in CPU IPC gains since the release of Sandy Bridge.

You've started to jump the shark, lack of IPC gains since Sandy Bridge is vague and not useful. We're talking about performance gains moving across the same design and architecture.

I would even venture to guess that the GPU upgrade is a bit of a quarter toss as an eGPU might be a better use of $250-$350 given that more powerful GPUs exist that can be utilized in macOS workflows than the Vega 16 or 20 Apple offers as a BTO option.

However, if your particular workload is served better by faster CPU clock speeds and cores (i.e. video compression versus video editing), then by all means, you should opt for the fastest CPU you can at the point of sale, especially since it cannot be changed later on.

Which is all just a way of talking about case-specific marginal cost.... I don't think you actually disagree with what I said, just don't fully understand it.

In my experience, CPUs are already so fast for general and specialized computing to the point that the need for the absolute fastest CPU is more esoteric exercise than actual problem. Because if it were, you wouldn't be wasting time asking about a 100MHz option for a MacBook Pro, and would have already bought an iCore i9 iMac or just about any flavor of iMac Pro and called it a day.

Gosh, hyperbole. What fun. Plenty of people do just click fastest possible and be done with it because its just not worth their time to think that much about it. But that doesn't mean they jump to a completely different, non-mobile, form factor. If you're intending to get personal about why I'm here, well, there are several things I want to be sure of before I spend, but that doesn't mean I'm not ready to spend if even small margins do exist.
 
I still feel this point is a bit misplaced. The right way of thinking of this is in the marginal opportunity cost, which I brought up in the post you are responding to. That's precisely what "your own innate opinions of worth and value as it relates to physical goods" is getting at here. Opportunity cost. You'd rather have $200 for some unknown set of stuff than a small gain on your CPU. OK, fine. That's how you view the cost. Anyone buying a MBP for work has that marginal $200, the question is where is it best spent? Snacks, beer, eGPUs, RAM, CPU? And they all work together. Each can exist on their own or in combination. In the era of 0% loans for stuff, we're talking like $10/month here (Apple literally offers you a 0% 18m loan at time of purchase for one of these). Its likely all can exist together. In the scheme of things, a ~$3000 computer that will be productive for 3+ work*years is peanuts. The $200 margin then even smaller.



You've started to jump the shark, lack of IPC gains since Sandy Bridge is vague and not useful. We're talking about performance gains moving across the same design and architecture.



Which is all just a way of talking about case-specific marginal cost.... I don't think you actually disagree with what I said, just don't fully understand it.



Gosh, hyperbole. What fun. Plenty of people do just click fastest possible and be done with it because its just not worth their time to think that much about it. But that doesn't mean they jump to a completely different, non-mobile, form factor. If you're intending to get personal about why I'm here, well, there are several things I want to be sure of before I spend, but that doesn't mean I'm not ready to spend if even small margins do exist.

The OP stated he did mostly video editing, Photoshop, etc and a 100MHz gain in clock speed for $200 that would be better spent along with an extra $50 or $150 to upgrade to Vega 16 or Vega 20 which will have a much higher return on investment with video editing, but a bit less with Photoshop.

The wording in the post implied that he may have a budget for his purchase, and the areas in which he works benefit from more GPU power than a slight CPU bump.

If you can justify the extra $200 for the CPU for yourself, by all means go for it. But I gave the OP my common sense answer based on his needs.
 
The OP stated he did mostly video editing, Photoshop, etc and a 100MHz gain in clock speed for $200 that would be better spent along with an extra $50 or $150 to upgrade to Vega 16 or Vega 20 which will have a much higher return on investment with video editing, but a bit less with Photoshop.

The wording in the post implied that he may have a budget for his purchase, and the areas in which he works benefit from more GPU power than a slight CPU bump.

If you can justify the extra $200 for the CPU for yourself, by all means go for it. But I gave the OP my common sense answer based on his needs.

Eh, s/he was asking if the $200 was worth it and if they should spend it on something else? I wouldn’t rule out both or multiple upgrades based on that. But hey, feel free to walk yourself back. There were other aspects that you brought up that you are now ignoring. So hey, have a good one.
 
No, If you can back up your baseless rhetoric, you would find, this is how they came up with their claim which is specifically: "Giving 3D graphics apps like Autodesk Maya 40% faster render speeds compared to the previous generation 6-core processor and up to 2x faster render speeds than a quad-core processor."

Pays to read

  1. "Testing conducted by Apple in April 2019 using preproduction 2.8GHz quad-core Intel Core i7-based 13-inch MacBook Pro systems with 16GB of RAM, and preproduction 2.4GHz 8-core Intel Core i9-based 15-inch MacBook Pro systems with 32GB of RAM; and shipping 3.5GHz dual-core Intel Core i7-based 13-inch MacBook Pro systems, as well as shipping 3.1GHz quad-core Intel Core i7-based 15-inch MacBook Pro systems, both configured with 16GB of RAM. Autodesk Maya 2019 tested using a 144.8MB scene. Performance tests are conducted using specific computer systems and reflect the approximate performance of MacBook Pro." https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/
A nice jump but not enough to tempt 3D enthusiasts. 2X the time may save a few minutes or an hour, tops. Any longer and money would be better spent on a dedicate rendering machine.
Rendering is not the main timesaver anymore. Good previews are becoming realtime, so rendering is not so hit/miss as it once was.
They should concentrate on the quality of image the machine can deliver in realtime, quality of animation and the FPS.
It's the quality of the feedback that sets machines apart in 3D.
 
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