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jxyama
macrumors 68040
j_maddison said:
several points:
1) G5 may cost less than G4 - that doesn't mean they can price G5 less than G4. because G5 is more advanced, it must be priced higher than G4. otherwise, who would buy a G4? G5 has a much higher perceived value than the G4, so there's no reason to price it lower than where the demand is.
2) the number of customers do not define the importance of the market. the potential profit defines the importance of the market. there may be 100 times more consumers, but if prosumers bought computers twice as often on products that have 50% higher margin than average consumers, then the prosumer market is just as important as the consumer one.
3) selling more units does not necessarily increase marketshare, unless the increase in units sold is higher than the market average. selling more units at lower profit margin is no better than selling fewer units at higher profit margin. since apple is a niche market player, it can afford to get higher profit margin. it's not a commodity. so it's arguable at best that if they lowered the price, they will ship appreciably bigger number of units to make up for the lower profit margin.
🙄
I would like to whole heartedly disagree with this post.
My 12" PowerBook rev. A has chugged through a lot of data. It does it quickly and effciently, without much in the ways of delays.
I think "power" users in need of a laptop would choose a PowerBook first, not an iBook, or anything else for that matter.
PB's are not just eye candy, they're hard working machines that are worth their weight in.....platinum.
ZildjianKX said:
I would like to whole heartedly disagree with this post.
My 12" PowerBook rev. A has chugged through a lot of data. It does it quickly and effciently, without much in the ways of delays.
I think "power" users in need of a laptop would choose a PowerBook first, not an iBook, or anything else for that matter.
PB's are not just eye candy, they're hard working machines that are worth their weight in.....platinum.
First of all to powerbook useres let me say hahahahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!
But look at the advantages! The eMac is currently outdoing the iMac which means next tuesday almost for sure the iMacs are in for updates or else the the eMac will become apples number 2 desktop which is just not feasable. So iMacs will be updated probably next tuesday.
Or they could follow the trend and update the iBooks, update the bottom line macs first. And after the iBook, at the begining of may I predict new powerbooks but DEFINATLEY NOT G5 thats ludacris have you seen the size of that processor!!!! It just wont fit. Then after the PB upgrade at around august I predict new g5 powermacs.
soo hey, look up its logic!
BUT YOU CAN BE SURE OF 1 THING NOW, NO G5 POWERBOOKS!
What do you guys think?
But look at the advantages! The eMac is currently outdoing the iMac which means next tuesday almost for sure the iMacs are in for updates or else the the eMac will become apples number 2 desktop which is just not feasable. So iMacs will be updated probably next tuesday.
Or they could follow the trend and update the iBooks, update the bottom line macs first. And after the iBook, at the begining of may I predict new powerbooks but DEFINATLEY NOT G5 thats ludacris have you seen the size of that processor!!!! It just wont fit. Then after the PB upgrade at around august I predict new g5 powermacs.
soo hey, look up its logic!
BUT YOU CAN BE SURE OF 1 THING NOW, NO G5 POWERBOOKS!
What do you guys think?
Off-topic, but I need help
How do you clear the auto-complete feature in Safari's address bar? Let's just say there are certain sites that I don't want to pop up in the list when I have company over...
How do you clear the auto-complete feature in Safari's address bar? Let's just say there are certain sites that I don't want to pop up in the list when I have company over...
LaMerVipere
macrumors 6502a
Borg3of5
macrumors member
Many users in these fora have been complaining for the last two months, that Apple isn't going fast enough; that Apple isn't giving any hints. Hello, wake-up call! If businesses operated like this, there would be copying all over the place.
After the 17" PB was introduced, I thought to myself, "Hmmm...I wonder how long it'll take for PC companies to copy Apple with a 17" notebook model?" Didn't even take more than a month and a half. PC companies are pathetic, in that thay HAVE to copy Apple. Get a shred of imagination, and CREATE your own innovations, for crying out loud.
First, Apple wasn't going fast enough in updates, now many are on the verge of a mental breakdown when Apple does update one of its product, albeit the eMac. Progress must start somewhere. If anything it'll push the envelope and the top end models beyond where no computer has ever gone before. I am making my first prediction in these fora: Apple will be the first to introduce a mass-produced prosummer/consumer-oriented QUANTUM computer. All other PC companies will just be copycats.
After the 17" PB was introduced, I thought to myself, "Hmmm...I wonder how long it'll take for PC companies to copy Apple with a 17" notebook model?" Didn't even take more than a month and a half. PC companies are pathetic, in that thay HAVE to copy Apple. Get a shred of imagination, and CREATE your own innovations, for crying out loud.
First, Apple wasn't going fast enough in updates, now many are on the verge of a mental breakdown when Apple does update one of its product, albeit the eMac. Progress must start somewhere. If anything it'll push the envelope and the top end models beyond where no computer has ever gone before. I am making my first prediction in these fora: Apple will be the first to introduce a mass-produced prosummer/consumer-oriented QUANTUM computer. All other PC companies will just be copycats.
hulugu
macrumors 68000
Childish? No. Cauldron of misdirected anger? Maybe.
While I wouldn't call you childish, I think you're overreacting. It appears that Apple is making updates to all of their machines, but there may be technical problems with the Powerbooks (a G5 perhaps?) and with the Powermacs (sensors as reported here), however the eMacs were ready. Would you be happier if they held the eMac back until the Pro and Consumer machines were ready? Would this make your Powerbook better if the new Powerbook were released today or next week?
I think you flew off the handle as least judging by your post and maybe you could calm down before you have an aneurysm.
Apple should release products when they are ready especially when it can help their low-end line; I'd much rather they do that than play games with the Pro and Consumer lines intentionally crippling the Consumer lines just so the Pro lines look better.
Powerbooks and Powermacs are coming, but it doesn't make your current machine or the machines they are selling now worthless. I have an old Powerbook, and I didn't freak out when they updated the machines to 800mhz six months later, I expected it.
a17inchFuture said:
While I wouldn't call you childish, I think you're overreacting. It appears that Apple is making updates to all of their machines, but there may be technical problems with the Powerbooks (a G5 perhaps?) and with the Powermacs (sensors as reported here), however the eMacs were ready. Would you be happier if they held the eMac back until the Pro and Consumer machines were ready? Would this make your Powerbook better if the new Powerbook were released today or next week?
I think you flew off the handle as least judging by your post and maybe you could calm down before you have an aneurysm.
Apple should release products when they are ready especially when it can help their low-end line; I'd much rather they do that than play games with the Pro and Consumer lines intentionally crippling the Consumer lines just so the Pro lines look better.
Powerbooks and Powermacs are coming, but it doesn't make your current machine or the machines they are selling now worthless. I have an old Powerbook, and I didn't freak out when they updated the machines to 800mhz six months later, I expected it.
Well, except that you'd never accuse the hefty Emac of being a portable machine, now, would you?a17inchFuture said:
I'm not sure how an improvement in the low-end mac market translates to shafting portable owners. Portables and desktops have different capabilities, always have. You're always going to pay more for that portability. I love the fact that I can take my Pismo on the plane with me, outside with me, to a friend's place to show photos on their TV, etc.
The new eMacs are great for Apple and great for consumers. Now you can burn DVD's and run iLife at a reasonable speed for less than $1000. I may need to get one. 🙂
Chip NoVaMac
macrumors G3
ipirate said:
I understand where you are coming from. I have a PB 12" and have been wanting a desktop. Really like the specs on the eMac and G4 Towers, but the lack of USB 2 was a killer. Now that the eMac is USB 2, it is a better option. Don't want to pay the piper just yet on the G5 PowerMacs.
j_maddison
macrumors 6502a
jxyama said:
you are busy today
firstly, your first point is invalid because thats not what i said. i didnt say anything about pricing a G5 unit lowr than a G4 unit.
Point two, i agree, looks like someone else did a business degree too ey, but your ignoring economies of scale. I dont see the increase in consumer sales affecting prosumer sales. a pentium four that costs $1000 doesnt affect sales of a high end gaming machine that costs $2500, different markets different undertandings of their products. Your assuming that a more competative consumer machine will errode sales of a prosumer product, then again im assuming it wont.
your also assuming that i dont understand the importance of the prosumer market, i do! Its just i dont think your understanding the importance of the consumer market. the prosumer market is a finite market, while the consumer market has much more potential for apple. After all it was the imac that kept apple afloat! No one is suggesting we see a dual 2ghz G5 eMac, I'm just saying that the fastest chip possible should have been used in the eMac, and in my opinion that should ahve been a 1.5G4 if it exists. Necessity is the mother of inovation. Apple has such long product cycles in comparison to the pc market that i'm sure Apple could have broke with tradition and facilitated one final G4 speed bump for the eMac and not an incremental road map. Would you really care if the eMac's next update was a single G5 at 2Ghz if the prosummer line had a dual 3Ghz G5. Of course not, I just find that prosummers are very defensive. Personally i'm only interested in the powerbook line up, but i didnt get mad when the ibook range went G4 and made my Rev A Powerbook look less attractive, thats just progress.
your third point, I didnt mention lowering the price. My argument would be to increase the attractivness of the product to the consumer, hence my repeated statements about colour eMacs on several message boards amongst other points. By selling more units, apple will keep the production cost of the units down. Of course there is a break even point, but thats what elasticitiy of demand is all about. i say push more units to the consumer, recognise that apple has different markets with different market needs, and stop being myopic and creating an artificial gap between the prosumer and the consumer range. At the moment the pc market is relatively stagnent, so pushing more units would increase market share.
Thanks for the inteligent comments, nice to see.
jason
Nice. The specs are pretty good now at the low-end. I can't wait to see if the iBooks are revised (lower price, higher specs) as well. Maybe the G4s are cheaper now than they were a year ago when the original "G5's are cheaper than G4's" rumour started. Mmm, a $999 12" iBook at 1GHz would suit me just fine.
What I would really like to see is a version without a monitor though. I have tonnes of monitors already. Give me an attractive slimline case with the eMac hardware inside and I'll be happy. Of course it will have to be a bit cheaper than the eMac because Apple will be saving on the cost of a 17" monitor (~$60?). Give it a standard DVI output and a DB15 output that doesn't require a special adaptor from Apple to use.
What I would really like to see is a version without a monitor though. I have tonnes of monitors already. Give me an attractive slimline case with the eMac hardware inside and I'll be happy. Of course it will have to be a bit cheaper than the eMac because Apple will be saving on the cost of a 17" monitor (~$60?). Give it a standard DVI output and a DB15 output that doesn't require a special adaptor from Apple to use.
kaylee
macrumors regular
Photorun said:
don't know if your budget will stretch this far but (from the thread):
"Good news: Education buyers can get one for $649
Bad news: They have to buy 20 of them.
But I suppose if you know 19 people who want one...
AppleMatt "
edenwaith
macrumors 6502a
Woo, hoo! This is what I've been waiting for. I was tempted to get an eMac a few weeks ago, but I'm glad that I held off, considering what recent rumors and the Buyer's Guide said. Now I can get a pretty decent machine for the family. Several people were jealous that GarageBand was a Mac-only application. Now they can enjoy it and the rest of the Mac applications! Plus, maybe I'll be able to play more games, now, without filling up my main machine. Oh, and I'll have Panther to test my own programs under, now. 🙂
AppleJustWorks
macrumors regular
Off Topic
Sorry that this is off topic but, everytime i try to open appleinsider.com or it says timed out....is this just me?
Sorry that this is off topic but, everytime i try to open appleinsider.com or it says timed out....is this just me?
AppleJustWorks said:
It takes a LONG time for it to load... I have a 3.3Mbps download internet connection (Comcast HSI)... The server is extremely busy... Updates are in the air 🙄