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New iBooks, Mac minis and iPod shuffles at MWSF 2006?

Norse Son said:
And the TPM is the tipping point on this - I don't think the Celeron M or Pentium M have it, so you know Apple won't touch it.
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TPM is a feature on the mobo, the CPU chips are not relevant.

And, btw, yes there are Pentium M systems for sale with TPM embedded:

http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20030219corp_a.htm
http://h71016.www7.hp.com/dstore/Mi...=1598&BaseId=13579&oi=E9CED&BEID=19701&SBLID=
http://shopper.cnet.com/4566-3126_9-0.html?filter=500374_11409906_
http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/compare.aspx/latit?c=us&cs=04&l=en&s=bsd

TPM + Centrino got 115,000 hits on Google....
 
Norse Son said:
Don't get me wrong, I think the Pentium M would be a fine choice for both the iBook and mini, but I just don't see Apple adopting a chip-design that's been out for a couple years already. And the TPM is the tipping point on this - I don't think the Celeron M or Pentium M have it, so you know Apple won't touch it.
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Umm Yonah is Pentium M. The next signifigent release of a dirrerent design will be Merom in the end of 2006.
 
~Shard~ said:
...we won't be seeing P4s and the like in the new Macs...
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The DTK is a 64-bit P4... :) So Apple *is* shipping P4 systems today.

IMO, Apple would be smart to bring out Powermacs with dual dual-core Xeons today.

Not replace the PPC machines, but sell some early adopter/development machines today so that companies can work on their multi-threaded code.

But I suppose, since OSx86 is so easy to crack and run on standard boxes, using quad core Dell Precision Workstations is good enough.
 
but...

Randall said:
Umm Yonah is Pentium M.
Click to expand...
But Yonah is not Dothan.

There are many significant changes in Yonah compared to Dothan (VT/SSE3/FP...). It's not the same chip.

Merom adds EM64T and higher performance (per Hz and per watt), but that doesn't mean that Yonah is "just a Dothan".
 
New iBooks - Thoughts

lasuther said:
I doubt Apple is going to make a iBook with 17" widescreen, 7200 RPM, 128MB graphics, and SuperDrive so don't worry so much PowerBook sales.

[Later post]

This what I mean. It is a huge assumption that Apple will release a $1000 iBook with the performance of a AMD 64bit desktop. The reality of what Apple brings us in 3 more weeks might be quite different. We need to see the benchmarks of the actual iBook after its released. Apple has always done a good job of crippling the iBook line, I see no reason why this will be any different.

lasuther
Click to expand...

Most comparisons which demonstrate the similar performance of the Intel Duo Core as it is now called (i.e. Yonah dual-core) use a 2.0 GHz Duo Core. It does compare favorably, but I wouldn't expect this performance out of a low-voltage chip in the 1.5 - 1.83 GHz range. Rather, we should expect a proportionate increase over the Dothan architecture for similarly clocked Duo Core chips. See this story at AnAndTech.

I could see Apple releasing an iBook with 13.3" widescreen, 5400 RPM (at least as an option), 64 or 128MB graphics, and DL SuperDrive. The PBs could be distinguished by bigger and higher resolution screens (e.g., Dell uses XGA, SXGA, for the Inspiron series while using the XGA+, SXGA+, for the Latitude series), and faster 7200 RPM HDDs (at least as an option). It would be nice if Apple's hardware was brought out of the Dark Ages.
 
MWSF Laptop Scenarios

Norse Son said:
I don't see the iBook getting Yonah before (or unless) the PowerBook does. The first version is the 32bit, dual-core dubbed Centrino Duo. It has a 667MHz frontside bus and 2MB of L2 cache, as well as the other bells & whistles of the Napa platform. The PowerBook has a 66MHz bus and 512k(?) of L2-cache... You do the math.

No, I think it will be PowerBooks "announced" at MWSF, available around the first week of February. The iBook will wait until May, for the single-core Yonah, dubbed Centrino Solo. Next after Yonah comes Merom (September-ish). This beast will be a 64bit, dual-core cpu.
Click to expand...

I disagree. I think the iBook will get the Yonah (=Duo Core) first only because the low voltage will be ready first. The PBs will also be announced at MWSF but will not ship until the first week of Feb., when the higher voltage "performance" processors will be released. Certainly, the PBs will receive Merom when it is ready later in 2006, the only question will be when the iBooks will transition--probably with the release of Leopard or shortly thereafter.
 
AidenShaw said:
The DTK is a 64-bit P4... :) So Apple *is* shipping P4 systems today.

IMO, Apple would be smart to bring out Powermacs with dual dual-core Xeons today.

Not replace the PPC machines, but sell some early adopter/development machines today so that companies can work on their multi-threaded code.

But I suppose, since OSx86 is so easy to crack and run on standard boxes, using quad core Dell Precision Workstations is good enough.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification on that point. :)

Yeah, I see your point regarding the Xeon PowerMacs, and I'm not saying it would be a bad thing, but I just don't see it happening. I still think, rightly or wrongly, Apple will transition the PowerMacs last, in 2007, when Conroe/Woodcrest are available. Guess we'll see...
 
~Shard~ said:
I still think, rightly or wrongly, Apple will transition the PowerMacs last, in 2007, when Conroe/Woodcrest are available. Guess we'll see...
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Well, the DTK has to be returned end of 2006, so I expect there'll be some desktop based machine for developers at that stage. Who knows what it'll be.
 
GregA said:
Well, the DTK has to be returned end of 2006, so I expect there'll be some desktop based machine for developers at that stage. Who knows what it'll be.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I realize that, but I'm also taking into account Intel's current roadmap (subject to change of course!) for Conroe/Woodcrest and when it would be viable to see those chips in Apple hardware. As I said, guess we'll see how Apple decides to handle this. 2006 will indeed be a very interesting year!
 
GregA said:
Well, the DTK has to be returned end of 2006, so I expect there'll be some desktop based machine for developers at that stage. Who knows what it'll be.
Click to expand...
Merom (dual-core 64-bit) will be out before that, and Yonah (dual-core 32-bit) will be here before MWSF.

The normal way to support developers is to give them the tools (i.e. dual CPU and 64-bit systems) *before* you release them to the public.

That way you can have 3rd party apps ready *when* the new products ship, rather than waiting a long time.
 
NEC's announced dual-core Yonah notebook is supposed to cost $2,000, and the feature set is not all that great.

That suggests to me that a dual-core Yonah would put an iBook squarely into Powerbook price range.

Which makes no sense. There's no point selling an iBook line that *starts* at the price of the midrange G4 Powerbook.

The only reason to assume the iBook is getting a Yonah first is that the Powerbooks were recently updated. But given how slight those upgrades were (pretty much just the screens), this is a pretty weak reason to bet on the iBook, especially given the price issue demonstrated by the NEC product.

My guess - PowerBooks get dual-core Yonahs. iBooks either a) get nothing for now, or b) get slightly faster PPC CPUs, or c) get form factor change with their current PPC CPUs.

Later this year, the iBooks will get single-core Yonahs and a price cut.

As for the mini, again given the price of that NEC Yonah laptop, I wonder if it might ship with a G5 instead of an Intel chip.
 
Well my Uncle just came back from buying his young children a pair of shuffles and he found it interesting when he was only given until the 8th (the day before the keynote) to return them, instead of the typical 30 day policy
 
Cloud9 said:
So if these new intel machines are going to be out in jan/feb would that not mean leopard will be released simultaneously? I mean leopard will be the x86 os wont it?
Click to expand...

No. The x86s will run a version of Tiger, perhaps 10.4.4.

Leopard is due end of 2006.
 
Cloud9 said:
So if these new intel machines are going to be out in jan/feb would that not mean leopard will be released simultaneously? I mean leopard will be the x86 os wont it?
Click to expand...

To put it simply, no. Leopard will not be released until 2007 - even saying late 2006 is stretching it in my opinion. Jobs will provide us with more insight on Leopard possibly at MWSF at a very high level, but definitely in greater detail at WWDC. :cool:
 
Disappointed?

What with all the things people here are predicting, I think there will be a lot of disappointed people on January 10.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but the Apple store is shutting down free shipping on qualifying items on January 9. Is this an omen of things to come?
 
steeldrivingjon said:
NEC's announced dual-core Yonah notebook is supposed to cost $2,000, and the feature set is not all that great.

... a dual-core Yonah would put an iBook squarely into Powerbook price range...

The only reason to assume the iBook is getting a Yonah first is that the Powerbooks were recently updated. But given how slight those upgrades were (pretty much just the screens), this is a pretty weak reason to bet on the iBook, especially given the price issue demonstrated by the NEC product...

Later this year, the iBooks will get single-core Yonahs and a price cut.

As for the mini, again given the price of that NEC Yonah laptop, I wonder if it might ship with a G5 instead of an Intel chip.
Click to expand...
Wow! That pretty much sums up the logic I've been trying to use, but it hasn't appeared to register with a lot of people. Back in the Fall there was speculation that Yonah would be more expensive than the G4 based on those prices.

Here, this is from an Apple Insider article dated June 9th, 2005 entitled, "Intel's dual-core 'Yonah' chip could carry PowerBooks beyond 2GHz". In the chart it says the Yonah dual-core will run from 1.66GHz @ $241, 1.83GHz @ $294, 2GHz @ $423 and the 2.16GHz @ $637. It, also, lists the single-core 1.66GHz @ $209...

And there's this June 2nd article from C|Net, which explains the specs and shows just how different Yonah ("Centrino Duo/Solo") is from Dothan ("Pentium M"):
http://news.com.com/Intel+spills+beans+on+Yonah%2C+the+next+notebook+chip/2100-1006_3-5729925.html

Taking those price-points into account (quantities of 1,000), it's hard to justify any of the dual-cores in an iBook... "Maybe" the 1.66GHz dual-core for a hi-end iBook... Granted, Apple may get some discount if they buy "a few hundred thousand...", but it looks priced out of the sub-$500 mini range.
 
New Apple Email offers free shipping until January 9th, 2006...

...at least we know new stuff is coming...lol

EDIT: Crud...someone else already noticed this.
 
Exactly what I want... Well almost

Well, I am sitting here after a tiring Chrimbo typing on my G4 12inch PBook running at 1.33GHz.

I also run a 2.1GHz iMac and a Dual 2.7GHz PMac.

Now, what do I use my PBook for. Well for lounging on my sofa (or in my garden if it ever stops snowing) and surfing the www, reading this forum, emails, IM, ebay, etc. On the odd occasion I will use PhotoShop or Quark, but only when I really need to as most of my serious work is done elsewhere.

What I am hoping for is a new iBook or PowerBook, with new design features, something that wows me like Apple always does. This new machine will likely replace the PB I am using now, as it will be suited to the task in hand, BUT and it is a BIG BUT, it will have to wow me, to make me part with my much loved PB. So come on everyone, let's here what you really want out of the new iBook or PBook apart from the Intel processor.

For starters:
13.3 or 12 inch WIDESCREEN
New style lid and form factor
Built in iSight (would be very nice)
Two buttons under trackpad (again can live without, but would be good)
Built in memory card reader
Front Row Version 2 App
PVR capabilities (again nice, but not essential)
Media Keys above function keys for iTunes
iR for Remote
A battery that fits flush ;-)

Anything else...
 
iBook or Powerbook

I believe that the iBook will be updated before the Powerbook because until most of the pro apps are ported to fat binaries an Intel machine will run the apps no faster than the PPC machine. Rosetta has a lot of work to do to emulate the PPC instruction set. Only old instruction sets run faster under emulaton than natively. This also gives apple time to use the next gen Memron chips in their flagship portables, when the full range of fat bin apps are released.

And anyway if you buy an iBook in the meantime before the new PB's come out you can always sell it on eBay and buy your new PB!
 
b0x said:
I believe that the iBook will be updated before the Powerbook .... This also gives apple time to use the next gen Memron chips in their flagship portables, when the full range of fat bin apps are released.
Click to expand...

You really believe the PowerBooks will not be updated until Merom is available late in 2006? That's an awful long time without an upgrade, especially considering the iBooks will definitely be Intel at that time. I just don't see it happening. If the iBooks do indeed go Intel first, then it will be with the dual core Yonahs, which would mean that the PowerBooks would probably get the "performance edition" which will be released a short time afterwards. I could see that happening. Either that, or the PowerBooks gets updated first with the dual core Yonahs and the iBooks follow a few months afterwards when the single core versions are available. :cool:
 
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