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LED refers to the method of backlighting the display. The largest commercially available LED backlit LCD display is the 15.4" in the MBP. The common method of backlighting is CCFL, which has environmental concerns due to its use of mercury.


ha,ha you're so wrong.there exist current up to 50 inches led screen yes they are not only in japan..In the entire world..
where have you bin?:p..but they are pricey..
edit:also you diden't have to tell me about the mercury part..i have had my shares of displays post
 
ha,ha you're so wrong.there exist current up to 50 inches led screen yes they are not only in japan..In the entire world..
where have you bin?:p..but they are pricey..
edit:also you diden't have to tell me about the mercury part..i have had my shares of displays post


Whatever. I suggest you read this to get you started: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backlighting

(by the way, if I don't reply, it doesn't mean you're right, it just means I'm done)
 
Here's Why I Will Not buy an LED

if you're such a pro Dante(no i will not bow down to you)
why don't you just buy a led screen instead of lcd?

MacHatch, I respect your points about the Pro versus Consumer display but as to your question of why I will not buy an LED Screen here is why:

Wide Gamut LED screens are currently not tuned for the kind of work I do. The gamut of colors is spread out over the same pixel resolution as a lower gamut LCD. Why is this bad? Because when you are editing photos, and print based output such as gradients, trade show displays, fine art, children's art, etc, the color deviation (called "Delta E") is greater between two adjacent pixels than it should be -- so what you work on, on the monitor does not match printed output.

Here is a URL from the "God of Monitors" Karl Lang, who developed many very high end displays explaining it in detail:

http://www.outbackphoto.com/tforum/viewtopic.php?TopicID=1700

And here is technical summary from the article of what I just said above:

1) A wide gamut LCD display is not a good thing for most (95%) of high
end users. The data that leaves your graphic card and travels over the
DVI cable is 8 bit per component. You can't change this. The OS, ICC
CMMs, the graphic card, the DVI spec, and Photoshop will all have to be
upgraded before this will change and that's going to take a while. What
does this mean to you? It means that when you send RGB data to a wide
gamut display the colorimetric distance between any two colors is much
larger. As an example, lets say you have two adjacent color patches one
is 230,240,200 and the patch next to it is 230,241,200. On a standard
LCD or CRT those two colors may be around .8 Delta E apart. On an Adobe
RGB display those colors might be 2 Delta E apart on an ECI RGB display
this could be as high as 4 delta E.

It's very nice to be able to display all kinds of saturated colors you
may never use in your photographs, however if the smallest visible
adjustment you can make to a skin tone is 4 delta E you will become
very frustrated very quickly.


Current wide gamut LED monitors are not up to the task of what I do. They are too bright, they have the same problems as the wide gamut LCD's mentioned in the above quote, have too many ON SCREEN controls -- again the article link explains why this is bad -- they are not yet ready for the exacting work we do here. Many of these current LED monitors are still 8 bit in their communication with the internal video card, the video card on the CPU and with the OS. If they are 10bit, interpolation is used to improve the 8bit signal coming out of the software, the CPU and Video Card on the motherboard. This is unacceptable. Again, Lang details this in his article. Bottom line is this: the LED panels are the RIGHT choice for gaming, viewing content such as DVD, etc, and daily consumer use, they are not the right choice for Print, and I would say Video pros as of yet. The Video point is debatable, for sure.

Thanks for the comments, and please, never bow down to anyone. We should all be strong as individuals! Power to the People. Peace.:eek:

Dante

PS -- Even if Apple does release a new swank 30" LED or similar in January, there is NO WAY I am going to be an early adopter of this new panel without checking out each and every spec in absurd detail. I would take a proven 30" ACD with current technology over a questionable release by Apple in this category. In this respect, MacHatch, I am NO fanboy. I make 110% of my living doing this sort of work -- I will not let Apple put that at risk. Chances are I am buying another current technology 30" ACD within the next week to two months.

Here is an example of early adopters getting burned 1) iPhone (and I have one, btw) -- $200 price drop 2) new iMacs have some issues and 3) Leopard has some holes. I don't just buy stuff because it is "new" -- for me and my work, New, Swanky, does NOT equal Best.
 
Exactly

Whatever. I suggest you read this to get you started: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backlighting

Yes, and from that article read what it says below -- pay attention to the "consistency" issues AND to this: "Also, the actual Red, Green, and Blue points can be moved farther out so that the display is capable of reproducing more vivid colors." Problem is, those color are displayed over the same resolution, creating more DIFFERENCE between adjacent colors than should actually be present -- this makes image editing and realistic print production impossible:

LED backlighting in larger displays is a recent innovation that helps to improve the color gamut of the LCD display. LED white light is created by three separate LEDs to produce a color spectrum that closely matches the color filters in the LCD pixels themselves. In this way the filter passband can be made more narrow, so that each color component lets only a very narrow band of spectrum through the LCD. This improves the efficiency of the display since little light is blocked when white is displayed. Also, the actual Red, Green, and Blue points can be moved farther out so that the display is capable of reproducing more vivid colors. Many current LCD TV's can generate only 70-80% of the colors specified in the NTSC specification while newer displays based on LED backlights will be able to generate all the colors in the NTSC specification plus some additional colors.
However, there are challenges with LED backlights. Good uniformity is harder to achieve especially as the LEDs age with each LED possibly aging at a different rate. Also the use of three separate light sources for Red, Green, and Blue means that the white point of the display can move as the LEDs age at different rates. Power also can be a challenge. Though it is possible for an LED display to be more power efficient, this is not a given and many first generation implementations may use the same or more power than their CCFL counterparts.


MacHatch, this is not about being "right," this is about understanding that different jobs need different tools -- it is NOT about the "latest and greatest" is the best.

Dante
 
Yes, and from that article read what it says below -- pay attention to the "consistency" issues AND to this: "Also, the actual Red, Green, and Blue points can be moved farther out so that the display is capable of reproducing more vivid colors." Problem is, those color are displayed over the same resolution, creating more DIFFERENCE between adjacent colors than should actually be present -- this makes image editing and realistic print production impossible:

Dante

From what I can see, the technology is still young. Despite the other poster's comments to the contrary, the largest LED backlit LCD panel I am able to find is the NEC LCD2180WG-LED. At $3800, it's not going to penetrate the home market any time soon.

I have no doubt that LED backlit displays will achieve further market penetration,especially given the impetus from RoHS requirements. But that time is not the present.
 
Whatever. I suggest you read this to get you started: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backlighting

(by the way, if I don't reply, it doesn't mean you're right, it just means I'm done)

Not to be an total ass.just look at this 70 " http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=11040914 change you're mind?read "backlight"..32,000$..i told they where pricey:D.
edit : ore did you just mean pure led?..he,he..
edit:link fixed my bad:)
 
From what I can see, the technology is still young. Despite the other poster's comments to the contrary, the largest LED backlit LCD panel I am able to find is the NEC LCD2180WG-LED. At $3800, it's not going to penetrate the home market any time soon.

I have no doubt that LED backlit displays will achieve further market penetration,especially given the impetus from RoHS requirements. But that time is not the present.

Yep, my thinking exactly: my bet is we've got a year to go before LED technology is really consistent, accurate and profilable in relation to the operating system, photoshop and creative suite.
 
Nice television. I don't think reproducing any measurable part of the aRGB gamut was part of their design goal though. I had a feeling you were talking about TV's and not monitors.


yeah you probably seen this before in my post http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/new-screens/samsungs-40+inch-tft+lcd-is-just-one-centimeter-thick-313357.p(tv/monitors..the tv can be used as a monitor since it hidef;)..can you tell me a pc-monitor that big what else would i be talking about..he,he..
 
...deleted...

MacHatch, this is not about being "right," this is about understanding that different jobs need different tools -- it is NOT about the "latest and greatest" is the best.

Dante

Thanks so much for your informative reply. As a photographer I value that information greatly. I've been struggling using 2 x 21" LCD dell monitors that are about 3 years old. The color is calibrated by hardware, and I think I get pretty good color matching.

I've toyed with getting a 30" ACD panel because I think I would like having a single panel better than the two bezels blocking the center of my view.

I've read that the 30" ACD does not have good color consistency compared with the smaller apple displays. Do you agree? Do you use 30" ACD for critical work? Any better options?

I would hate to buy a 30" display now as they are obviously ripe for upgrade, on the other hand if the "upgrade" is like the glossy Imac with lower quality panels, then I would actually be better off buying now.
 
Thanks so much for your informative reply. As a photographer I value that information greatly. I've been struggling using 2 x 21" LCD dell monitors that are about 3 years old. The color is calibrated by hardware, and I think I get pretty good color matching.

I've toyed with getting a 30" ACD panel because I think I would like having a single panel better than the two bezels blocking the center of my view.

I've read that the 30" ACD does not have good color consistency compared with the smaller apple displays. Do you agree? Do you use 30" ACD for critical work? Any better options?

I would hate to buy a 30" display now as they are obviously ripe for upgrade, on the other hand if the "upgrade" is like the glossy Imac with lower quality panels, then I would actually be better off buying now.

I have a 30 inch and a 23. The 23 is simply outstanding, the 30 a hair behind it. Here is the bottom line on the 30:

It is simply fantastic. The color does suffer, by a small amount, on the edges. The issue is bleed through of backlight affecting color.The main center area of the monitor is spot on. This is where the bulk of photo editing is done.

I would not hestitate to buy a 30 now. If apple does upgrade it, my largest fear is that they "sell their soul" and leave us print pros in the dust: it could happen. Print, is changing, some areas are dying -- like print newspapers and web is coming on strong. If they do compromise this monitor, I will immediately buy a current 30 inch. I don't want the fancy features. I want predictable SWOP color at the best price. I know you do too.

Good luck: let us know what you decide in coming weeks.

Dante
 
Dante....

After some research I recently bought a ACD 23" and calibrated it with Spyder2Express.

I do motorsports photography as a hobby and just love this display.

r10-turn-13.jpg
 
The ACD screens are great...but well Apple could make a 24" screen rather than 23". If I am going to link an ACD up to my iMac 24" I would like it to be the same size screen.

1" makes all the difference :)
 
could tomorrow be the day?

today's penryn announcement from intel certainly has all the folks who have been patiently waiting for redesigned/refreshed mac pros on the edge of their seats in anticipation of something big tomorrow...

could this news also bode well for an imminent announcement of redesigned/refreshed :apple: cinema displays? i suppose we will know in less than 24 hours... :rolleyes:
 
today's penryn announcement from intel certainly has all the folks who have been patiently waiting for redesigned/refreshed mac pros on the edge of their seats in anticipation of something big tomorrow...

could this news also bode well for an imminent announcement of redesigned/refreshed :apple: cinema displays? i suppose we will know in less than 24 hours... :rolleyes:

Yoo Buddy, I hear yah.

On the edge of my seat waiting for the day tomorrow.

I'll plan on spending some time in these threads discussing whatever Apple's moves are.

Dante
 
excellent news

Yoo Buddy, I hear yah.

On the edge of my seat waiting for the day tomorrow.

I'll plan on spending some time in these threads discussing whatever Apple's moves are.

Dante

Hey Dante - Great to know you'll be monitoring the situation closely tomorrow. Am on the west coast and, if you're east of here, will look forward to reading any observations you may have made as soon as I log on...

Fingers crossed for some good - and hopefully big - news tomorrow!
 
well, tuesday is here...

and there are no redesigned/refreshed mac pros or :apple: cinema displays. perhaps those who thought this might take place wednesday because of the holiday were right? or... perhaps there is to be no news on this front this week... :(

new question: if :apple: does, in fact, revamp the mac pro and :apple: displays, wouldn't that be worthy of an event rather than just an update to the apple store? anyone know how new mac pro rollouts been handled previously?
 
Forgive the stupid/ignorant question, but what can you plug into the screens USB ports. A keyboard? Mouse? Don't these have to be plugged into the MP or MBP?:confused:
 
Forgive the stupid/ignorant question, but what can you plug into the screens USB ports. A keyboard? Mouse? Don't these have to be plugged into the MP or MBP?:confused:
Yes, there does have to a connection back to the computer. The ACD cable plugs into the computer USB, FW ports in addition to the DVI port).
 
Yes, there does have to a connection back to the computer. The ACD cable plugs into the computer USB, FW ports in addition to the DVI port).

Not sure I understand. I connect the keyboard to the ACD then have to connect the ACD to the MBP via another USB cable? Easier just to connect to keyboard to the MBP direct, yes?

Doh! I think I am being thick here... I have no knowledge of separate screens with ports ;(
 
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