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The Mac Pro will most definitely come. Just don’t think the 2 year transition is written in stone. Personally I’m betting on spring 2023 now, which would make it 2.5 years. Close enough. Or maybe they’ll surprise us and release it in December like the last one.

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the issue is software related, considering that Ventura is still quite problematic on common established hardware a few days before launch.
 
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I’m running out of internal storage on my iPad and Mac, so both purchase would set me back a whopping $8000. As for the MacBook, I think I might save towards M2 MacBook Pro 14”, maybe also 16” depending on the desk space. I love large screens. Well, gotta save that money first.
A discounted MBP here for $3100 and an ASD would set you back $4,500 or so, half of what you were mentioning but giving you both a great computer AND a big screen. That was my approach, and my ASD is coming Monday.


And:

 
i've had external HDD's fail in the past from a weird unmount or mount
it's also fairly annoying to do something on your laptop in bed or on the couch and have an ext hdd attached with a cable
having to think through what to keep in external storage vs not is a big pain imo
Dropbox, iCloud drive, OneDrive, or box.com...?
 
The M2 Mac Mini MUST have HDMI 2.1 OUt if not Apple will be sued.
It will. But HDMI 2.1 isn’t what you think it is.

Going forward, all 4K HDMI ports will be called HDMI 2.1, even if they don’t have most of the features that HDMI 2.1 includes. So “HDMI 2.1” now basically just means HDMI 2.0+.

IOW, the HDMI labeling is just as bad as USB now, if not worse.
 
A discounted MBP here for $3100 and an ASD would set you back $4,500 or so, half of what you were mentioning but giving you both a great computer AND a big screen. That was my approach, and my ASD is coming Monday.


And:

My price is AUD so naturally larger number than USD price due to exchange rate.
I am also looking for local refurb options but price drop isn’t good enough imo.
The price I mention includes a 1TB/2TB iPad and a MacBook Pro with 2TB/4TB internal storage.
 
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The Mac Pro will most definitely come. Just don’t think the 2 year transition is written in stone. Personally I’m betting on spring 2023 now, which would make it 2.5 years. Close enough. Or maybe they’ll surprise us and release it in December like the last one.

In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the issue is software related, considering that Ventura is still quite problematic on common established hardware a few days before launch.
Agreed, or they will preview it late this year to 'technically' meet the deadline.
New 14" MBP is going to cost crazy money I'm afraid
I kind of doubt that, but maybe. I would guess the price points will stay the same at least for entry level models.
 
I'm planning on upgrading only if the new color is introduced. I could care less about the M2 chip. Also, it feels weird macOS Ventura is due to release to the public next week and we don't have a new mac machine to upgrade it with. It feels left out.
Why not just get a cover for your M1? I'm only mentioning it because, well, I know that people who become wealthy do so in part by avoiding needless debt, and they do THAT by spacing out large expenditures by years.

The Internet abounds with examples of why it's financially smarter to buy used cars and keep them for many years. I think the same thing applies to expensive technology. Buy that $7,000 computer if you really want to, but then don't go and shoot your future self in the financial foot by buying another one next year. Especially if a $50 cover will change your perception and spur your enthusiasm and imagination.

What do you care? Not your money..
I know you wrote this to somebody else, but I DO care. I want every Living Yay to be successful in life, and that includes financial success!
Am I the only one who thinks that the word ultra is greater than extreme?
You are right. Ultra comes from Ultimate, which is the pinnacle, or tippy-top for those readers who still use sippy-cups. So what happens when you have "Ultra", and then you come out with "Max"? Now you're just confusing matters. Which is which? If Max is more tippy-top than Ultra, then you just made your Ultra "Penultra", aka: Penultimate, which means "second to last", or "second best".

And then when you come out with "Extreme", well, that's GOT TO BE something less than either Ultimate or Penultimate. Right? You can be Extreme without being Ultimate. But you cannot be Ultimate if there is something better.

Words mean things, except for all of the English majors who won't lift a finger to defend the language!
Apple can release whatever they want - only US and UK can afford to buy it at this point.
You must work for the Government...they're the only ones right now who are NOT being impacted by inflation. I don't know about the UK, but the Northeast and Northwest US are kind of busy trying to figure out how they're going to get to work without being robbed, beaten, or thrown in front of a train, and when they get home, they wonder how the heck they're going to heat their homes this winter.

Buying technology? Not on the list so much!
The rest of us, will be sitting in our living rooms, eating macaroni and cheese and watching...
Macaroni, yes. But have you seen the price of cheese lately? Cheese is for rich people, or people who don't mind being in debt. In my house, it's macaroni with an "ultrathin" pat of butter (see what I did there?), and maybe some salt and pepper. That right there is a rich man's side! I'll add paprika or curry powder if it's a celebration!
Let me get this right. You are selling your old laptop to get a new laptop and a better looking wife?
LOL, and here I thought cheese was expensive! Only the truly wealthy can actually afford an ex-wife!
Attached storage bites the big pickle when it comes to travel.
Wait, I don't know what that means! Wait a minute, yes I do. Now if you had said "spicy-hot pickle", I think I'd have to ask.
The one question no one is asking, what color options will there be for the Mac Pro Ultra Extreme? I suspect many would pay extra for glitter.
You just gave me an idea! Hey @Yay!, I can do a glitter finish for you for $150. With a fiberglas and epoxy glaze, just like they do on boat hulls. Would you like LEDs embedded? Add $200. How about light-up disco squares on the back of the open lid? $450. 50% down, 50% on delivery. Why no, I haven't done any of that stuff before, but I learned it on the Internet. "Botaltoat" for the win! 🛶
 
That does not work when you are out of town.
Sure it can! Some NASs have the ability to send and receive remotely. As long as it's on and has access to the internet. But you need to set that up.
Max one CPU, Ultra two CPUs, Extreme 4CPUs. It's not hard.
That makes no sense. Max and Ultra are synonyms. Extreme cannot be "more" than those. Besides that, nobody is doing SMP (Symmetric Multi Processing; it's a fancy term that means "multiple CPUs"). Instead, we do parallelism more now by having more CPU cores on (in?) the die.
Mostly computational models of viral propagation in a very large population.
So basically you're doing Folding at Home, or something similar. Doesn't your propagator work with GPGPU? Aaah, but then if it does, there might not be a client/driver available for the Apple silicon GPU, which might not even be able to do that kind of work anyhow...right. Damn, now I have to go back to Intel and Nvidia! ;)
You can backup to slow storage that fits in your laptop bag. I guess you could edit on the same storage, but it would not be fun. (Actually, backing up that kind of storage is not fun. You tend to not backup as often as you should because, it's just too slow.)
I agree. I still (STILL) use attached storage for backups of all computers in my house. I even formatted some drive partitions so that they could be used to back up my Mac and PC data (whichever machine is plugged into it and on). And I do still buy 7200 RPM fast drives...though mostly used drives.

My next step is to buy/build a second NAS and use that strictly for backups that will be stored offsite. Or to use the direct-connected drives for offsite; that might be safer since I'm mostly converting from internal drive bays to aluminum USB drive enclosures. The latter can just be slipped into a small flight case (even my gun case will hold one 3.5" drive enclosure and wall-wart power plus a USB cable when I'm travelling).

Nah, my wife is gorgeous, plus its cheaper to get a new laptop then a new wife :p
Getting a new laptop THEN (your word!) getting a new wife? Flunked out of mathmagician school, did ya? No sweat, if you're eligible, you can always run for the US Congress. No math, science, or reading/writing required! 😁

It doesn't seem to me like Apple silicon is in a place yet where it can replace the old Intel machines. The on-die RAM is really limiting at the high end.
Umm...where are you getting THAT?
 
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Sure it can! Some NASs have the ability to send and receive remotely. As long as it's on and has access to the internet. But you need to set that up.

That makes no sense. Max and Ultra are synonyms. Extreme cannot be "more" than those. Besides that, nobody is doing SMP (Symmetric Multi Processing; it's a fancy term that means "multiple CPUs"). Instead, we do parallelism more now by having more CPU cores on (in?) the die.

So basically you're doing Folding at Home, or something similar. Doesn't your propagator work with GPGPU? Aaah, but then if it does, there might not be a client/driver available for the Apple silicon GPU, which might not even be able to do that kind of work anyhow...right. Damn, now I have to go back to Intel and Nvidia! ;)

I agree. I still (STILL) use attached storage for backups of all computers in my house. I even formatted some drive partitions so that they could be used to back up my Mac and PC data (whichever machine is plugged into it and on). And I do still buy 7200 RPM fast drives...though mostly used drives.

My next step is to buy/build a second NAS and use that strictly for backups that will be stored offsite. Or to use the direct-connected drives for offsite; that might be safer since I'm mostly converting from internal drive bays to aluminum USB drive enclosures. The latter can just be slipped into a small flight case (even my gun case will hold one 3.5" drive enclosure and wall-wart power plus a USB cable when I'm travelling).


Getting a new laptop THEN (your word!) getting a new wife? Flunked out of mathmagician school, did ya? No sweat, if you're eligible, you can always run for the US Congress. No math, science, or reading/writing required! 😁


Umm...where are you getting THAT?
Not folding@home. It's my own code. I took the Kermac-McKendrik epidemiological model and turned it into a cellular model. That gave me the chance to be able to try various methods of determining propagation. It's kind of fun to set up mini clusters inside of larger clusters inside of established political boundaries. (Family, work or school, county, state, country.) Then you can track the way various migration patterns change the viruses spread and how long a wave lasts. It's even more interesting when you run several variants of the virus at the same time, with different levels of immune evasion between the variants and strains. It's even more, even more fun when you allow the virus to slowly mutate and track the points in time when a new variant or strain has the most advantage. (When the current dominant strain is coming to an end, that is when a mutant has the most advantage.)

As to connecting your NAS to the outside world, you can, but it's not a smart thing to do. If I need to share data with myself on the outside world, I usually add a layer of Public/Private key encryption on the individual files. Even then, I don't completely trust that my data is private.
 
I needed a plug in pro machine so I got the studio.

This pro mini will be very intriguing down the road.

I reckon I’ll get an m3pro down the road in the mini form factor say 2024ish ha!
The M2pro mini won’t need to be a plug in machine to get the same performance as the MacBook Pro. So if it needs to stay plugged in, it better deliver far better performance than the MacBook. Just because you have to use it plugged in at the desk doesn’t make it a pro machine. And just because it can be used anywhere doesn’t mean it is a toy.
 
Mac clones were Macs, booting directly into MacOS, just not running on Apple hardware; excepting the EPROM or whatever it was that was needed at the time to allow the hardware to boot MacOS...

Also, the PowerTower Pro would have been grandfathered in when Apple bought Power Computing...! ;^p

Apple switching to Intel CPUs is what lead to the Intel hackintosh era, because there was no hackintosh before Intel...
Power Computing originally was NOT sold by Apple so their not Macs.

They were like Motorola and others licensed to run macOS. That’s why “Mac” was not in the name of the product as they had no licensing rights to do that!

They were the precursor, as I’ve said before, to hakintosh’s (Intel based on more than aware of).
 
They are running out of time to complete the Apple Silicon transition, if we go by what Apple said in the past they'd have to release a new Mac Pro this year. Perhaps they combine that into one November event with the M2 refreshes.

Apple never promised a strict two-year transition...

The M2 Ultra in the Studio could get a new 192GiB memory option, or they might on purpose withhold it on the Studio and keep that at 128GiB, and then offer 192GiB on the Mac Pro. So even if they did this limited/soldered approach for the Pro, that could still be a decent workstation. Although I do hope they have a more elegant solution that allows swappable memory (and at least M.2 expansion slots if not U.2).

Highly doubtful on any replaceable RAM, and if the SSDs are replaceable, they will be proprietary Apple NAND blades...

Or maybe Apple decides to slap four M1 Max together and call it a day. It would hinder the single core performance, but then most of the applications that are running on such a workstation will support multi-threading anyways.

No 4-way UltraFusion with the M1 Max, most likely scenario at this time would be a N3E M3 Extreme Mac Pro; possible Spring 2023 sneak peek, WWDC 2023 full debut, shipping December 2023...

Unless they hold an event next month, it’s clear they will miss there target for transitioning over to Apple Silicon, which will be interesting to see how investors and the markets react, as they will have told them the transition would be completed in a set time frame.

Apple has never set a solid date for completing the ASi transition, and I am sure they have never told investors any specific date either; the ASi Mac Pro will be ready when it is ready...

Personally I think they are struggling to give enough performance to justify the no doubt sky high price the Mac Pro will continue to cost. And if it lacks expansion options like all the other Apple Silicon computers it becomes a very questionable price point.

A loaded Mac Pro has always been expensive, folks just angry because they cannot slap in third-party GPUs, RAM, and SSDs...

This time round, the 2019 MP is still available, reasonably up-to-date, has seen some updated GPU options (and could easily get a CPU update) and the Studio is being offered as an alternative.

Please explain the "easy CPU update"...?

The CPU socket is only good for the Xeons that currently ship in the 2019 Intel Mac Pro, there is no new Xeon family of CPUs that use the same socket...

Moving to a new Xeon family of CPUs would require an entirely new motherboard...

And Apple could have done that, new mobo & Ice Lake Xeons, but Intel was having problems providing those Xeons in the first place, and virtually none of the top tier PC workstation folks were bothering with Ice Lake Xeons either...

My suggestion for an Apple Silicon "pro" Mac would be a Mx Max in a 1U rackmount form factor that could be clustered and racked up with storage, PCIe cages, A/V equipment via fast TB4 links.

This is already covered by the Sonnet rackmount products for the Mac mini & Mac Studio...

Apple could make an ARM based "Xeon W Killer" with 2TB DDR5 RAM support and loadsa PCIe but it would be an expensive exercise, and a lot of the Apple Silicon advantage seems to come with unified on-package RAM and on-die GPUs.

Soldered or socketed, anything with 2TB of RAM is going to be stupid expensive...

...they've got everything they need transitioned except the 2019 Mac Pro - and I think there's a possibility that the MP won't get replaced.

Doubtful, since Apple has stated that the remaining product to transition is the Mac Pro, "but that's a story for another day"...
 
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My price is AUD so naturally larger number than USD price due to exchange rate.
I am also looking for local refurb options but price drop isn’t good enough imo.
The price I mention includes a 1TB/2TB iPad and a MacBook Pro with 2TB/4TB internal storage.
And the fact we're tax inclusive makes our price more expensive as well (US isn't)

Do you know that Officeworks will price match amazon (or any major retailer for that matter) and beat the price by 5% on a new model. Worth checking it out ;)
 
The M2pro mini won’t need to be a plug in machine to get the same performance as the MacBook Pro. So if it needs to stay plugged in, it better deliver far better performance than the MacBook. Just because you have to use it plugged in at the desk doesn’t make it a pro machine. And just because it can be used anywhere doesn’t mean it is a toy.
Unsure what you’re saying but, I just didn’t want to spend an extra $900 for a similarly spec’d MacBook Pro that would be plugged in 95% of the time.

Was waiting for an m1pro mini, happily settled on a base studio for work.

Definitely think an m3pro will be my next move tho.
 
Unless it gets a form factor overhaul (which I do not expect), I don't expect the M2 Mac mini to get a significant increase in price in the US.
It's strange to me how Apple buyers have come to equate form factor overhauls with giant price hikes. "Oh look, they put the same computer in a new case. I'll gladly pay an extra $200 for it. It's pink!"
 
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Regarding price hikes in the US - the dollar is much stronger these days compared to other currencies - potentially decreasing Apple's costs. That all depends on how much Apple hedges currency risk - and judging by the price hikes in the EU - maybe they don't so much?

So... I wouldn't expect a price increase in the US.
 
It's strange to me how Apple buyers have come to equate form factor overhauls with giant price hikes. "Oh look, they put the same computer in a new case. I'll gladly pay an extra $200 for it. It's pink!"
It’s unfortunate but you know as well as I do that change sells. Mind you in the case of the MacBook Air there were other upgrades as well. Probably not $200 worth of upgrades, but upgrades nonetheless.

As for the Mac mini though, as mentioned I’m not expecting a price increase in the US. Here in Canada there will be, but I expect it to be small, because the CAD value change was small.
 
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Moving to a new Xeon family of CPUs would require an entirely new motherboard...
Which every other PC and workstation maker manages to do every year, because it's a full-size tower PC with a full-size motherboard and no no real constraints on size, power and cooling so designing, whereas the Trashcan would have needed a ground-up re-design.

I wasn't talking about existing users upgrading - but if users want to they can at least upgrade their 8/12/16/24 Mac Pros to the 28 core version & load it up with new/additional GPUS.

This is already covered by the Sonnet rackmount products for the Mac mini & Mac Studio...
Those are useful for people that need rackmounts, but are really not a great substitute for proper rackmount systems.

Soldered or socketed, anything with 2TB of RAM is going to be stupid expensive...
Yes, but M1-style means different SoC packages for every RAM configuration, which will be really expensive - and it's physically limited by how many packages you can piggy-back on the chip.

Doubtful, since Apple has stated that the remaining product to transition is the Mac Pro, "but that's a story for another day"...
And "we're not making a Mac Pro and here's the magical and courageous reasons why you don't need one" would be a story.
 
The new form factor for the m2 Pro Mini that would be worth paying for would be for it to be portable like a slightly thicker iPhone, with a touch bar on top and built in battery like an iPhone, but running MacOS and designed to be paired with a (wireless?) display, both with a bunch of USB ports.

Apple Silicon chips don’t come in a high power desktop version and a slower laptop version like Intels did. The “desktops” run the same M1 and clocked the same as the MacBooks. So hopefully the new form factor can take advantage of having a laptop chip in it.
 
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