New Microsoft Ad Campaign Targets Mac Prices

[ZiggyPastorius]

Chances are you'll be installing it, and had spent 15 seconds reading how to get the few 'non free' alternatives anyway - assuming you didnt put them on the cd. Apart from flash (and maybe some auto installing codecs?), there isn't really anything else that a novice (or an 'expert'?) might have wanted anyway.

I didn't claim to be an expert, first of all, and it could have changed since then (and forgive me if it has, the last time I used Ubuntu was last November), but when I went to get Flash player so I could actually watch videos and such on Youtube, I had to download some file (.tar.gz or something?), then I had to look up instructions online because I had to (I don't remember the exact course of action) do something like, unpackage it with something in terminal, navigate to some deep folder in my system for plug-ins, type a terminal command in to move (or unpackage or something) the file into the folder. Hardly user-friendly. Of course, if it's changed since then, good for it. That's just the example I remember the most.

 

[ian1219]

My roomate has an HP Pavilion notebook from 14 months ago that has completely died as of yesterday. I have had my PowerBook G4 since the fall of 2004 with absolutely no problems.

Microsoft's new campaign should show the price over, say, a 5 year span and all of the total costs that go into that. This would undoubtly include 2 (or more) computers for every 1 Mac that is purchased. Let's see who is less expensive then!

The sad fact is that there is no other route that PCs can take in order to 1-up Macs, so they attack the only thing that (at first glance) seems to give them the upper hand.

By the way, my roomate is now going to get an iMac.

 

[Beric]

17" = big.
Average consumer thinks big is good.
Average consumer does not understand the distinguishing features between 17" Macbook Pro and 17" HP Pavilion.
Hence, average consumer thinks that both machines are similar.
Lauren buys HP.
Average consumer thinks "Why buy a Macbook Pro 17" when I can just get an HP for way less?"

It's a horribly, horribly misleading ad.

Did you ever think that perhaps the average consumer doesn't NEED any of the additional features of a 17" MBP, and therefore saves himself an otherwise wasted $2000, by instead getting the HP?

 

[markintellect]

In what way? Apart from price, the machines are pretty similar.

Both have dual core processors, both have 4GB RAM, both have a 17" screen, both have a 320GB hard drive, both have a DVD-RW drive, both have built in webcams, both have a one year warranty.

The only area where the MacBook Pro will likely outperform the HP is in battery life, but then, I don't want to be one to fall for Apple's marketing garbage on that. I'm promised 5 hours on my MacBook, I get closer to 2 and a half.

Hmm...

So the faster DDR3 1066MHz RAM, 9400M integrated + 9600GT 256MB, full HD screen (1920x1200), 45nm 2.66GHz Core 2 Duo, Gigabit Ethernet & 802.11a/b/g/n. Not to mention the multi-touch trackpad, MagSafe, Sudden Motion Sensor, magnetic latch and something called Mac OS X.

 

[badmac78]

Cool Factor . . .

The "I'm A Mac" ads did create this air of "coolness and elitism" so the MS ad is a product of Apple's own doing. It's like watching Coke & Pepsi duke it out.

I say they should have run this ad during the Super Bowl.

The other thing to think about is that with the iPhone and the iPod touch, a lot of things you used to do on your computer, you can do directly on the phone so there is no need to go boot up a laptop and carry it around with you if all you are doing is checking email and paying bills.

If Apple comes out with a tablet that is in the $500 range, then this MS ad will be useless. . . Lauren may take her HP Pavillion back and get the tablet.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

I never understand why Mac haters come to a site like this.

Clearly, you cannot tell the difference between a "hater" and genuine outrage at the prices Apple are charging for the hardware you are getting. Never mind that there are also some hardware features (e.g. SLI GPUs & Blu-Ray) you cannot get at any price on the Mac yet are common on the PC and make it BETTER in those areas. Apple's move to Intel was supposed to level the playing field and at first, the prices seemed comparable in a few areas, at least. But PC prices keep falling and Apple's prices keep going up and they literally have NOTHING to justify it. They don't add things like Blu-Ray because they are in the media business too and they would rather sell you a movie for $20 digitally at 720P compressed than let you choose the better format. In other words, Apple has its hands in so many cookie jars these days that they have a CONFLICT OF INTERESTS when it comes to their computer lines. That means that you the user will never get the best technology because Apple would rather sell you $99 display adapters than let you jump ship and buy BD discs instead of iTunes movies (no matter how inferior the experience).


Because iPods and iPhones are selling well, they seem to think they can get some ancillary sales off them to people that don't know any better about the value of the hardware. Maybe they can too, but they are alienating the well informed in the process by moving a good part of their base of computer literate people to completely computer illiterate people in all areas. Witness the lack of matte screens. Witness the dropping of firewire on the regular Macbook line. Look at how little attention Mac OS X Server gets and how some of their professional server hardware was dropped. Clearly, Apple has gone from targeting the general PC user who prefers Mac OS (seems to be their target user in early 200 era with PowerMac selection and even the early Mini had a dedicated graphics card) to targeting casual computer users who thought the iPhone was 'neat'. They delay OS development to push cell phones (instead of hiring more people and helping the economy so they can do both. No, despite massive record breaking profits in the middle of a recession they are talking about laying people off like everyone else and yet they can't seem to meet their own self-imposed deadlines half the time and release things like Leopard initially full of bugs, which only further tarnishes their image).

But if you point any of this out or just comment how current Mac hardware is overpriced, you become a "hater" in the eyes of the Apple FANATICS. They don't accept ANY criticism of Apple no matter how justified or valid it is and they label you and tell you to go to Windows World if you hate Macs so much. I think some of you need to learn the difference between hating Apple or Apple's prices and hating their products and/or operating system. I realize to a fanatic, they are one and the same. But to normal people, they are NOT the same thing. We don't worship Apple or Steve Jobs. We use OS X because it's a better operating system not because we "love Apple" or "love our Macbooks" or whatever.

Quite frankly, if Microsoft releases a better operating system in the future or Apple doesn't start releasing reasonable hardware/price combinations, we might just do that and we'll probably feel sad that Apple is so darn greedy that they cannot be competitive if they think they can steal your hard earned money and get away with it, knowing full well that the fanatics will pay ANY price they ask and LOVE THEM FOR IT to boot. Well, who wouldn't charge insane prices when you have a fan base like that? The problem is, of course, that Apple supposedly wants to target 'switchers' and switchers aren't like that. Apple probably has a core 'fan' base of around 6 million users. The rest of their base are 'normal' users who will eventually migrate back to Windows or Linux if they feel they are being completely ripped off and if Windows7 is better than XP (Vista is not in most areas). The rest of the world is already using Windows and will only come over if they feel it's worth their while. Charging insane prices for cheap vanilla clone hardware is no way to attract new users.

 

[ericinboston]

I'm not going to debate the supposed "cash value" of a user experience, as I think that varies wildly from person to person, as it's all a matter of opinion...

That said... yes, absolutely, I find OSX to provide a vastly superior experience in even those "Basic" tasks such as chatting, web browsing, etc. than does Windows. Again, this is *my* opinion, but I don't understand why you seem to think that every operating system does these things the same.
The same activity being performed on different operating systems is an entirely different animal, especially when you consider that nobody does one thing at a time.
I'm using Safari right now, but I'm also referencing files in my Finder by taking advantage of Spotlight and Spaces, I check weather and make simple notes and calculations using Exposé widgets, I have Transmission running some torrents in a separate space and Photoshop open in another where I'm cropping some photos as I get a few minutes inbetween tasks.

My Time Machine backup kicks on every now and then and is saving all this stuff I'm working on..

etc. etc. etc.

You see, all I'm doing is browsing the web, running a couple torrents and doing very basic photo work. I could easily do this on XP or Vista as well. Would it be the same? Absolutely not.
Not necessarily inferior, but not the same, and that's the point.

And I totally agree with you...and as many people have stated, there is no 1 single use case for a "computer"...what you are doing in your example above is a bit different than what I do from 8-6 at work on my Lenovo (VMWare, Lotus Notes, programming, etc) laptop then when I am home playing tunes or surfing the web or playing with Sony Acid on my Dell 530 desktop.

I feel that the Apple OS is usually a bit more "integrated" than Windows, but to me I say "so what?". So click 2 times here vs. 1 time on a Mac...or I need to spend the 2.8 seconds to manually launch an app on my Start Menu. I (and others can agree or disagree), as both an end user and a LONG time computer techie, feel that the operating system differences are minimal in relation to the major price gap.

I think both operating systems and computer hardware are decent for what I, a human being, need to do both professionally and personally in day-to-day life.

But Apple is not going to convince the personal side of my life to shell out 1.5x to 3x the money. This point is mostly what the new adverisement is claiming...that with a $1000 budget (which I think is VERY fair), can you go out and buy a laptop that you FEEL meets your needs? Yes, you can find a sub-$1000 notebook anywhere on this planet. She spent $699 (notice that she didn't go out and buy the $999 one...that's marketing for ya but not enough time on this thread for that reasoning). Personally I **HATE** HP and will never buy a single HP manufactured device again in my life. The ad is only 30 seconds so they can't sit there and spend the full 30 seconds listing every minute detail about what is needed...again, that's advertising for you.

-Eric

 

[hagjohn]

At least this commercial makes sense.. those other MS commercials didn't make any.

 

[MrGouda]

As much as I love my Macs, they are far from perfect. I'm man enough to admit it. I've dealt with Safari and it's memory leaks, to wonky wifi, hardware failures, and everything in between.

I am also tired of the fact that Apple seems to rarely listen to its own customers. Heck, I remember the day the unibody macbooks came out and people on these very same forums were furious about the removal of firewire. And how long it took for Apple to finally give the macbook a decent video card.

I also find it funny that some of Apple's products main selling points are the very fact they are compatible with Microsoft products. iPhone supporting MS Exchange, iPods are PC compatible, and iWork supporting MS Office documents.

 

[APPLENEWBIE]

I know that some people with poor eye sight want larger screens, but buying a cheap HP with a low quality screen isn't going to help. Sub $700 laptops just don't compare to MacBooks, let alone MacBook Pros.

What you get is the lowest quality of everything! the Worst screens with viewing angle of a few degrees, bad black levels and washed out colors. Terrible battery life. Machines which are so heavy they are not portable. Make so much noise that watching a movie is impossible. Really bad internal speakers. Awful bundled software/spyware. + lots of other badness.

Why a 17" notebook? Size matters.

 

[linesma]

Thank you for that, I appreciate your comment (and I agree with you 100%). Again, I took it differently along with other comments and misread your intent and online dialog.

On another note, this argument/discussion will go on and on. As with most discussions, comments begin with opinions/facts, then evolve into more impassioned debates, and (as it seems to be unfolding) slowly transition into personal debates and then attacks between those left in the thread. I bow out.

That is ine if the best ideas I have read today. With that in mind, I humbly bow out myself. Thank you all for the information.

 

[grumps]

Value

I find all these discussions about the 'cost' of Macs hilarious. None of it matters. There is a similar long running one here in Australia regarding the differential between the price here in Australia compared to the US according to the exchange rate at any given time. That makes me laugh too.

Get this. Apple charge what they do for their machines because they can. They put a price tag on the machine and they sell it. Someone buys it. In fact lots of people buy them. In fact more people have bought them each year for the last few years. In fact compared to other brands Apple computers have been selling proportionately more each year. This happens because people think the value of the Mac is greater than what Apple want them to pay for it. Some other people don't so they buy something else.

Apple is a business, not a charity. They have to make a profit. They do make a profit. They don't have to feel bad because some people don't value or don't have enough money to buy a Mac.

That's about it really. Nothing more nothing less.

Get over it. Apple got over it a while back.

Value>Price=Sale
Value<Price=No sale

 

[McGiord]

17" = big.
Average consumer thinks big is good.
Average consumer does not understand the distinguishing features between

I see many people thinking: if a 17" is cheap then 15" or 13" are even cheaper.

 

[jamesryanbell]

Why a 17" notebook? Size matters.

So does portability. It's all just what the individual wants.

 

[Blue Velvet]

Your journo friend is very wise to replace that piece of junk iBook: they were terrible.

But it suited her perfectly. It was small and relatively light, had good battery time, a full keyboard, ran all the apps she needed to get her work done. What more does a journalist need, after all? She only ditched it because the screen got cracked when she didn't once protect it properly.

The only drawback to the HP for her, was not knowing anyone personally who could fix it.

 

[Nyy1126]

I can bet she has an iPod in that VW.......

 

[awmazz]

huh?

Yea, I'm going to plunk down an extra $500 or $1000 to buy a Mac on a "user experience" that is supposedly (I think you are trying to state) better than Windows? <begin sarcasm>I forgot how different it is on Windows XP/Vista to surf to my favorite websites, or do my online banking, or read my Yahoo mail, or upload my photos to Shutterfly, or print my resume, or rip some music in iTunes, or organize my music on iTunes, or chat with my friends using AIM. Golly, I should run out right now and spend that extra money because gosh golly the Mac "experience" is just so much better for my examples above. <end sarcasm>

Get real.

I have several Macs currently running and I don't do any of those things you mention on any of them except for the website visiting and online banking (which are two in the same anyway, in my mind). We are clearly not the same as each other when it comes to defining 'user experience'.

So you have essentially 1 reason left why Apples are more expensive than PCs...the case...you know, that plastic/metal stuff around your laptop and desktop. Yeah, that's right. So Apple creates some sexy and nice looking computers...I undoubtedly agree...but for all that extra money? Psst...spend the saved money on something else like a new flatscreen tv or whatever else tickles your fancy.

Again we differ greatly because I don't see it as saving money at all by not buying a Mac and buying another brand instead. I see it as wasted money.

And yes, I am very happy to pay more for good industrial design. In fact, I insist on it as one of my primary purchasing criteria. You obviously aren't and don't. Different strokes. I'm actually thankful we all don't think about or perceive things the same way. How boring would that world be?

 

[phinsup]

That's the only place they can attack Mac, considering the economy I think it might actually be effective.

 

[GenNovE]

Is like you guys dont get it. Some of you are so stuck on the whole apple is better ********.

Microsoft is targeting the demographic that apple have tried to steer away (Regular Joes) We all know apples demographic is not within the same range of microsofts.

To the average person what matters is what is the best bang for the buck not the latest graphic card etc. THE WAY THEY SEE IT IS WHY SPEND 1K ON A LAPTOP WHEN I CAN GET ANOTHER 13" FOR 300 BUCKS CHEAPER.

300 is a lot to save because then they can compare and say i spend 1k on one laptop or 700 for a windows based and along with the remianing 300 can go towards SAVINGS!!! OR COMPUTER, BAG PRINTER ETC.

Microsoft is simply targeting their current share. They are attacking apples prices because DUH! they are expensive period. Microsoft is doing what everybody knows already. IS NO SECRET

I think this ad is simple and effective.

And by the do you guys honestly believe the regular user know anything about resolution? (diffrence bwteen 1000-100 ethernet?)
I know countless amount of people on both macs and windows that have 15"-17" laptops and they run the resolution at low res because at its maximum everything is too small.
THEY LIKE THE IDEA OF HAVING A BIG SCREEN BUT KNOW NOTHING ABOUT REOSLUTION TRUST ME.

I HAVESEEN IT AT THE GENIUS BAR, PERSONAL EXPERIENCE.

So many arguments to defend apple but I cant believe that apple users in general believe they are the "shiet" but are so one track minded to anything apple.
Tht is far from being the "shiet" if you cant even use your left and right brain accordingly.

 

[NoSmokingBandit]

I can bet she has an iPod in that VW.......

Why would that matter? iPods are competitively priced, even if most people buy them for the "omg its an ipod" factor. Are you really trying that hard to defend your e-p3n?

 

[quixotic]

If it's all about the cheap...

then why bother with windows or a mac? Get a stripped down refurb laptop on ebay and install FreeBSD on it. Or go to WalMart and get a laptop with Ubuntu on it. Your OS upgrades are then going to be free, not $120 and up.

Besides, cost of ownership doesn't end with buying the laptop, you still got to get the software you need to do your work, and that ain't cheap either (office alone is $200 something). So while you're at it, load up your cheap laptop with free software like OpenOffice, GIMP, Ardour or whatever else you need.

Again, if you only care about price, you can do MUCH better. Besides, open source software can be just as good if not better at some tasks, hell even OSX is based on an Unix OS (Nextstep).

 

[Anuba]

The Cayenne, introduced in 2002, shares its entire chassis with Volkswagen Touareg, which is built at the factory in Bratislava.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bratislava

Yeah, those SUVs brought out the worst in every manufacturer because it took some of them by surprise, and they had to rush models to market. A Saab 9-7X is a very poorly masked Chevy Trailblazer.

But it's a loooooooooooong way from Bratislava to China, and Chinese build quality truly is the worst (especially when it comes to cars). People say it will get better, like the quality of Japanese goods, but they're not taking into account some important cultural differences, one being that the Chinese don't give a squat about tomorrow. This has to do with the almighty yet whimsical government, they can make a decision that will force you to close your factory the next day, either by pulling government support for no apparent reason or by deciding they want to build a sports arena where your factory is. This "no tomorrow" sword that's hanging over them has resulted in manufacturers basically doing anything that gets them through the day, whether it be replacing aluminium with garbage or padding baby food with rat poison. They make up for the miserable build quality by doing it so cheap that manufacturers like Apple can afford to replace your iPhone 4-5 times before it hits the point where it would have been cheaper to build them in some other country where it costs a little more but the quality is less flakey.

 

[NT1440]

Why would that matter? iPods are competitively priced, even if most people buy them for the "omg its an ipod" factor. Are you really trying that hard to defend your e-p3n?

Whats with the random insults?

 

[davemoore666]

Did you ever think that perhaps the average consumer doesn't NEED any of the additional features of a 17" MBP, and therefore saves himself an otherwise wasted $2000, by instead getting the HP?

That's a valid point, but I don't think that's the point of the ad.

This ad plays on the computer shoppers insecurities to KEEP THEM OUT OF THE APPLE STORE. Oh, your not "cool enough" and "you don't have enough money" are pretty persuasive on the insecure shopper.

Over the past 10 years, I've told many friends considering a Mac who were unsure, "Look, buy the Mac. If you don't like it after a month or two, I'll give you what you paid for it and then give the Mac to my cousin or nephew in school." No one has ever taken me up on it, but I do have a lot of friends now who LOVE their macs. And these aren't power users, a lot of them are older. They don't get those trialware pop-ups asking them if they want "Super Symantec Pro" or "Advanced Symantec Pro" all the time. They stop getting viruses and their computers work when they turn them on.

Mac users never say "I need to take a class" My mom has a macbook to run AOL on now. No viruses or scary adware popups for her now either.

I see this as a very effective ad by Microsoft to combat losing customers to a superior operating system.

 

[skaertus]

Answering aggressively by catching up with CSS2.1? Oh great.

I don't like IE either. But no one can deny Microsoft is making an effort here.

If Microsoft buys Yahoo, oh boy will they have the best search engine 1995 could buy.

Microsoft would still be behind Google if it bought Yahoo! However, Microsoft has enormous economic power and it can spend a lot of money. It could catch up with Google in a few years. Not easily, but it could.

Film at 11.

Look here: http://www.techflash.com/Microsoft_Mac_Office_77_37139129.html