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iRun26.2

macrumors 68020
Aug 15, 2010
2,123
345
Broadwell ULX is just 4.5W TDP, and will allow fanless x86 laptop. It is however still sometime away, so I don't see this rumored update happening "soon".

Could Apple be getting these special Broadwell parts well before other manufactures? I do agree that 'soon' sounds too early. Maybe, however, Apple earned special bargaining power from Intel by threatening them with the (realistic) possibility of replacing their ULV Intel processors with ARM based AX parts .
 

Bibbler

macrumors regular
Jun 23, 2007
188
0
The Mon Valley!
Without a doubt there will be a very good X86 emulator and a very careful migration platform.

So let me get this straight. You believe that not only will OS X be ported to ARM and run decently, but it will also be able to emulate an Intel processor at a workable speed.

I think you must have some secret knowledge of major breakthroughs in ARM processors in the past year.
 

unobtainium

macrumors 68030
Mar 27, 2011
2,597
3,859
You're right, I am jumping the gun at a rumor. But it's a rumor with leaks! :p

Seriously though, I'm just frustrated at Apple's boneheaded moves lately (well, not that boneheaded, they're making money hand over fist). I'm just slowly being pushed out of their ecosystem as I don't like any of their recent product decisions. Not ONE.

Me and Apple are increasingly out of sync, and while Apple will be fine, I'm sure, I'll be left with old hardware, the memory of how things used to be, and the pain of imagining what could have been if Steve hadn't died.

I think Apple is still moving forward exactly as it would have under Jobs. The iPhone 5 and 5s were very solid but predictable updates to the 4/4S. The iPad Air is about as nice a form factor as a tablet could have with current technologies. The retina MacBook Pro models are gorgeous and in line with what has come before. The unnecessarily thinner iMac is textbook Steve Jobs.
 

xmichaelp

macrumors 68000
Jul 10, 2012
1,815
626
Yeah let's just keep fragmenting all the product lines. And let's keep pretending like iPad "Air" makes any sense. This is exactly what screwed Apple before Steve came back. Then he streamlined the whole product line and made it appealing and things got better from there. Seems to me like Apple hasn't learned its lesson.

If a 12 inch Macbook Air happens, chances are it will replace the 11 and 13. There's no way Apple will have 11, 12, and 13 inch sizes at once.
 

iRun26.2

macrumors 68020
Aug 15, 2010
2,123
345
Yeah let's just keep fragmenting all the product lines. And let's keep pretending like iPad "Air" makes any sense. This is exactly what screwed Apple before Steve came back. Then he streamlined the whole product line and made it appealing and things got better from there. Seems to me like Apple hasn't learned its lesson.

It could replace both the 11" and 13" MBA possibly transforming them both into a 12" MBP. That would be streamlining.

But I hope not. I want the 11" and 13" MBA to continue and this new 12" to be ultra portable (and be more expensive than a MBP). I don't see that happening, though.
 
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ctyrider

macrumors 65816
Jul 15, 2012
1,025
591
Could Apple be getting these special Broadwell parts well before other manufactures? I do agree that 'soon' sounds too early. Maybe, however, Apple earned special bargaining power from Intel by threatening them with the (realistic) possibility of replacing their ULV Intel processors with ARM based AX parts .

Apple getting special treatment from Intel is very much possible, and had happened in the past. However, even if we assume Intel gives them 2 months jump on the competition - we are still talking September release. So there is no way Broadwell MacBook refresh is "around the corner".

So let me get this straight. You believe that not only will OS X be ported to ARM and run decently, but it will also be able to emulate an Intel processor at a workable speed.

I think you must have some secret knowledge of major breakthroughs in ARM processors in the past year.

It's either that or he is talking out of his butt. If I was a betting man, I'd go with the latter :rolleyes:
 

swingerofbirch

macrumors 68040
I just got a new 13" rMBP 2.4 GHZ i5, with 16 GB RAM.

The fans are super noisy when the screensaver comes on. It's just the regular screensaver with pictures zooming in and out.

Is this normal?

Also, I tried playing Trine 2 at full resolution and it got too hot and laggy to play. The computer got really hot.

It's kind of related to this thread, with the idea that there could be a fanless MBA.
 

xmichaelp

macrumors 68000
Jul 10, 2012
1,815
626
The only thing I care about is that the top end MacBook Pro have user replaceable ram and storage. Don't want to pay over $3k for a computer with ram that will likely crap out right after the 3yr warranty is over. My 2013 Mac Mini is just under 1 year old and is already on its 3rd set of ram sticks.

It would cost less to just upgrade the RAM once when you order it than replace it three times...
 

goobot

macrumors 603
Jun 26, 2009
6,489
4,376
long island NY

iRun26.2

macrumors 68020
Aug 15, 2010
2,123
345
Uh huh, like this?
http://www.cultofmac.com/248603/iphone-5ses-are-bending-in-peoples-pockets/
And I don't see it as abuse since people normally do it and most phones withstand just fine.

There's a limit before thinner and lighter becomes delicate and fragile. Physics law, baby.

I'm sure that someone 15 years ago would look at today's 11" MBA and think it would be science fiction to think of them as bring sturdy and reliable. (And they certainly are!)

There are constantly new materials being invented that have special new properties (that don't break the lees of physics).
 
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deadwalrus

macrumors regular
Feb 16, 2011
149
11
If this rumor is true, I don't see the point of keeping the 11" and 13" Airs. Sounds like this is a perfect replacement for both... It also simplifies the decision making process for consumers and reduces costs for Apple.

With a 12" retina haswell MBA, what's the point of the rMBP 13"? An extra 1", 1 lbs, and $500?
 

iRun26.2

macrumors 68020
Aug 15, 2010
2,123
345
With a 12" retina haswell MBA, what's the point of the rMBP 13"? An extra 1", 1 lbs, and $500?

1 pound is enormous! How can you think that that doesn't matter to someone else just because it doesn't matter to you???

1 Inch is also not negligible in my mind. I'd pay a lot more for a 11" MBA that had a slightly bigger screen or smaller footprint.
 

thelookingglass

macrumors 68020
Apr 27, 2005
2,138
633
Here's a thought: fan-less design almost certainly means ARM chip. Could this be the iPad Pro people were rumoring about many months ago? A Chromebook competitor that completely blows Chromebooks away?
 

melendezest

Suspended
Jan 28, 2010
1,693
1,579
I think Apple is still moving forward exactly as it would have under Jobs. The iPhone 5 and 5s were very solid but predictable updates to the 4/4S. The iPad Air is about as nice a form factor as a tablet could have with current technologies. The retina MacBook Pro models are gorgeous and in line with what has come before. The unnecessarily thinner iMac is textbook Steve Jobs.

Perhaps you're right (I knew that "if Steve were alive" line was going to bite me).;)

I agree at least hardware-wise Apple's direction may have been the same. But I'm not sure 100% he would've killed the 17" MBP.

However, I do-not-believe Steve would've let iOS 7 out the lab, let alone the door, or kicked Forstall to the curb.

Still, I'm in the same spot. Out of sync with Apple. It sucks.:mad:
 

iRun26.2

macrumors 68020
Aug 15, 2010
2,123
345
Here's a thought: fan-less design almost certainly means ARM chip. Could this be the iPad Pro people were rumoring about many months ago? A Chromebook competitor that completely blows Chromebooks away?

Chromebooks are stupid. They are like netbooks which Apple (wisely) never tried to compete with.
 

iSayuSay

macrumors 68040
Feb 6, 2011
3,792
906
Lighter doesn't always mean more delicate and fragile. And if they replace it with a stronger material then they can make it thinner.

I'm sure that someone 15 years ago would look at today's 11" MBA and think it would be science fiction to think of them as bring sturdy and reliable. (And they certainly are!)

There are constantly new materials being invented that have special new properties (that don't break the lees of physics).

Well maybe if Apple redesigned a slimmer profile MBA with titanium unibody, along with sapphire display glass. And I think for $999 it should.

But I don't see it anytime soon, not as long as Sir Jony in helm of design department. Alumineeyum and glass it will always be. While Al looks and feels nice, I never think of it as a premium material.

And as far as my experience takes, iPhone 5/5S is less sturdy than 4/4S. They dent, scratch, ding, even bent easier due to the excessive use of thinner and lighter soft metal called aluminum.
I never mind the weight of 4/4S. I'd take steel band anyday. And it speaks for itself. Has been using 4S for more than 2 years and it looks almost as brand new. Not so much with my colleagues' 5/5S.
 

deadwalrus

macrumors regular
Feb 16, 2011
149
11
1 pound is enormous! How can you think that that doesn't matter to someone else just because it doesn't matter to you???

1 Inch is also not negligible in my mind. I'd pay a lot more for a 11" MBA that had a slightly bigger screen or smaller footprint.

Reading comprehension: a 12" rMBA that is 1 lbs lighter, $500 less, nearly the same processor, with a 1" smaller screen -- who would be buying the 13" rMBP?
 

iRun26.2

macrumors 68020
Aug 15, 2010
2,123
345
And as far as my experience takes, iPhone 5/5S is less sturdy than 4/4S. They dent, scratch, ding, even bent easier due to the excessive use of thinner and lighter soft metal called aluminum.

I agree. My nearly two year old iPhone 5 looks very abused (and there's no way I'd but a protective case). I hope iPhone 6 is better!
 

MikhailT

macrumors 601
Nov 12, 2007
4,582
1,325
...I'm all in about thinner and lighter, but when I buy a $999 piece of electronic, I would expect it to be a bit sturdier.

Why wouldn't it be sturdy? Stronger materials have been developed that's much lighter than the current alloy they're using.

No touchscreen laptop in sight? Not surprised since Apple never wanted to take that route for the most part. But messing with my Asus Q501LA touchscreen laptop on Mavericks (hackintosh), the launchpad is so nice going through the app menu, feels just like an iPad or iPhone.

edit: I'm just saying, it feels too good swiping through the Launchpad for me to think Apple isn't working on something here. I'm open to being wrong though.

But, as for real applicable use, who knows...

Apple and Jobs already clarified a few times they will never do this.

The trackpad is the best solution for this. Expect the trackpad to get smarter over time, possible an LCD in there. Heck, they can expand it horizontally to make it possible to write with a stylus.

Holding out your arm on the screen is just going to tire you quickly, you'd be quicker to use the keyboard/trackpad throughout the day.

Fanless? That implies it won't be using an intel chip to me.. this very well might be the coming of Mac's switching over to ARM, right in time with Jony Ive's rumored OSX redesign..

Apple has never not transition to a new CPU architecture when it is weaker than the previous one. ARM will not catch up to Intel for another several years, therefore ARM is not coming to Macs any time soon.

Intel is quickly reaching the power efficiency levels than ARM is quickly reaching the performance of Intel. ARM actually have more to lose than Intel if they don't keep pushing the boundaries in the next several years.

As for fanless, the upcoming Broadwell ULX chips are not going to require fans. It is possible that Apple will have exclusive early access to this.

You have three possibilities.

It's an ARM chip. I kinda find this doubtful.

It's an Intel Atom chip. It's backwards compatible with x86, but gives you roughly the same power as an ARM chip. Basically, it'd be a really fancy netbook, so I doubt that'll happen.

It's an i3 or i5, underclocked slightly and with turbo boost disabled so it doesn't generate any nearly as much heat under processor intensive tasks. This seems the most likely to me.

The upcoming Broadwell ULX chips don't need fans, it's very power efficient.

The next MBA is not going to be an ARM based, enough with this nonsense already. Even assuming Apple miraculously ports MacOS and all of its bundled apps to ARM (there have been zero rumors to that effect) - they would immediately break all 3rd party app ecosystem that exist in MacOS X world. What are you going to run on that ARM laptop? iPad apps? Not happening.

FYI: iOS is the ARM version of OS X, it just doesn't have the Cocoa UI recompiled for ARM, which won't take much. Their iWork/iLife apps would already be ready to go considering majority of the codebase is already available on the iOS platform.

However, I agree, ARM won't be coming to Mac anytime soon. But that doesn't mean Apple doesn't have this in a special lab at their R&D already. Just like Intel version was running next to the PPC version for 5 years before it was revealed.

But I don't see Apple releasing something that is not sturdy. Period.

Okay? Lighter and thinner does not mean less studier. Stronger materials can be used instead.

Broadwell ULX is just 4.5W TDP, and will allow fanless x86 laptop. It is however still sometime away, so I don't see this rumored update happening "soon".

I wouldn't be surprised to see Apple have early access to it. There were samples already available back in Sept, 2013. http://www.anandtech.com/show/7322/a-closer-look-at-broadwell-its-new-small-form-factor-package

Yeah let's just keep fragmenting all the product lines. And let's keep pretending like iPad "Air" makes any sense. This is exactly what screwed Apple before Steve came back. Then he streamlined the whole product line and made it appealing and things got better from there. Seems to me like Apple hasn't learned its lesson.

Huh? You do realize such a 12" MBA would get rid of both 11"/13" MBAs? They'll streamline it to make it 12" MBA and 13"/15" rMBP. Far less than before with 11"/12" MBA, cMBP, 13"/15" rMBP.

Would it be possible to have an Intel emulator running as a layer?

To do that, you need a quicker CPU, not a weaker one like the ARM. There's no point of doing this. Intel'll get to the power efficiency requirements faster than ARM'll get to the performance requirements.

Could Apple be getting these special Broadwell parts well before other manufactures? I do agree that 'soon' sounds too early. Maybe, however, Apple earned special bargaining power from Intel by threatening them with the (realistic) possibility of replacing their ULV Intel processors with ARM based AX parts .

Yes, they've done this a few times in the past.

So let me get this straight. You believe that not only will OS X be ported to ARM and run decently, but it will also be able to emulate an Intel processor at a workable speed.

I think you must have some secret knowledge of major breakthroughs in ARM processors in the past year.

OS X already have been ported to ARM, it's called iOS. The main differences are front end, CocoaTouch on iOS vs. Cocoa on OS X.

With a 12" retina haswell MBA, what's the point of the rMBP 13"? An extra 1", 1 lbs, and $500?

Storage, more memory, extra ports, and so on. Don't expect this 12" to have the same spec expandability as the 13" rMBP.
 
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melendezest

Suspended
Jan 28, 2010
1,693
1,579
1 pound is enormous! How can you think that that doesn't matter to someone else just because it doesn't matter to you???

1 Inch is also not negligible in my mind. I'd pay a lot more for a 11" MBA that had a slightly bigger screen or smaller footprint.

Seriously?? 1 Pound? Maybe for a hand-held device, but not really for a laptop that you have to set down to use. But hey, to each his own.

I'd rather Apple add to their portfolio than take away. Unfortunately, it's not in their M.O.

I can see how they'll kill a larger screen for a smaller one; they've done it before. And I HATE that. A bigger screen is more useful than a small one. Period. We're not talking about TB displays here. In addition, the 12" PowerBook nostalgia is a bit misguided here; the form-factor was completely different. I just don't understand it.

Apple's constant downsizing is incredibly unnecessary. This is not the 90s. Apple is not on the edge of collapse. It is at it's most successful. They should EXPAND the lines to cater to different segments. A 3 on 3 setup for each product, like they had in the past, could be successful and makes perfect sense.

13", 15", 17" MBP
11", 13", 15" MBAir
21", 27", 30" iMac
3.5", 4", 5" iPhone
iPad mini, 9.7" Air, 12" Pro

Still focused, but market cornering. They have the money to do this. Loosen the reigns Apple!!!
 

50voltphantom

macrumors regular
Jun 23, 2011
177
0
I agree with a lot of the posts saying a 12" MBA would replace the 11" and 13". This makes perfect sense as a one-size-fits-most entry-level Mac note book, just like the old white MacBook. I also agree with the post saying it would be the current 11" form factor with an edge-to-edge (or close to it) display. I'd almost put money on this happening. There needs to be a little more differentiation to the average consumer between say, the current 13" MBA and the 13" rMBP.

Also, the current stock configurations of the 13" rMBP are ridiculous.

The 13" rMBP with 4GB RAM for 1299? Who is buying this turd?
 
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