Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

No ZFS Support in Leopard?

Zfs Is Included

ZFS is most definitely included because one of the main features of Leopard relies on ZFS. I am speaking of Time Machine, (the backup system included with Leopard) the "snapshot" feature of Time Machine is actually one of the main features of ZFS. That has been one of the advertising points of Time Machine, the ability to take Snapshots of a hard drive which ZFS is known for. ZFS is surely the driving force behind Snapshot.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/leopard/features/timemachine.html
 
Toki said:
ZFS is most definitely included because one of the main features of Leopard relies on ZFS. I am speaking of Time Machine, (the backup system included with Leopard) the "snapshot" feature of Time Machine is actually one of the main features of ZFS. That has been one of the advertising points of Time Machine, the ability to take Snapshots of a hard drive which ZFS is known for. ZFS is surely the driving force behind Snapshot.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/leopard/features/timemachine.html
Click to expand...

From what I've read the previously released Leopard alphas/betas only included Time Machine support for HFS+ and not for ZFS filesystems.
 
Toki said:
ZFS is most definitely included because one of the main features of Leopard relies on ZFS. I am speaking of Time Machine, (the backup system included with Leopard) the "snapshot" feature of Time Machine is actually one of the main features of ZFS. That has been one of the advertising points of Time Machine, the ability to take Snapshots of a hard drive which ZFS is known for. ZFS is surely the driving force behind Snapshot.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/leopard/features/timemachine.html
Click to expand...

not sure on your logic there. yes ZFS could make Timemachine work even more seamlessly, but it certainly isnt a requirement.
 
uhm... for all those ready to bite jobs' head off, you do realize that even sun has yet to release a non-beta version of solaris that boots off a ZFS partition right? and sun not only invented it, but has had their hands on the final product for almost 18 months now.

zfs also has fair few problems relating to fragmentation of the hard drive, and slow performance when writing small files (really small though like under 50 bytes). zfs in undoubtedly cool, but from what i've read it's not ready for a prime time boot partition for a user base of 20 million.

having said that apple may very well have solved these problems on the BSD, but i am, to say the least skeptical. zfs for an external drive in 10.5 might happen, zfs for boot? no way.
 
Toki said:
ZFS is most definitely included because one of the main features of Leopard relies on ZFS.[/url]
Click to expand...

Nope: Time Machine relies on the hardlinks to folders, a new
feature of HFS+ in Leopard.

There was a public video from the WWDC '06 "State of the Union"
which clearly explained that.
 
I think I'll just stick with Tiger. <--- Things I never imagined I'd say. I see no incentive for me to spend $200 dollars on what appears to be minimal tweaking at best. Apple had set the climate to blow Vista out of the water, and it didn't really happen. I thought maybe I was just expecting too much - but judging by the drop in Apple stock today, I guess others agree. Tiger has been the most reliable and dependable OS I've ever used, and nothing I've seen today has convinced me to abandon it. Quite a string of letdowns lately.
 
Great :mad: This was the #1 big wait-for feature for me. I wish Apple would work harder to maintain the technological advantage that they have had since they started OS X. Nowadays Microsoft is rapidly catching up.

I'd prefer if they spend their times on this, than on expanding Photo Booth making it able to look like a shark in iChat. Very disappointing.
 
You can do Time Machine on pretty much any filesystem that supports system hardlinks and rsync. There are a lot of (admittedly less elegant than Time Machine) existing incremental file system backup schemes already out there - I've been using one to back up my MBP onto a Linux box.

The only tricky part, really, is the HFS+ extended attributes.
 
Westside guy said:
[...]

The only tricky part, really, is the HFS+ extended attributes.
Click to expand...

Errr... Actually UFS and ZFS both have extended attributes... just ssh on your friendly Solaris box and do a "man runat".

I think you will be enlightened.

Ino!~
 
i too thought zfs was the only redeeming feature of leopard. I was apalled this morning when sj spent 10 minutes showing off ichat. please. no one gives a crap. especially not at a developers conference.

i just hope that when the devs get their hands on their dvds to proof will be in the pudding. i don't even need bootable zfs, just the ability to do raid-z would be a godsend!

speaking of which, is it at the end of the week or today when they get their dvds? meaning, when can we expect hands on reports of the 'feature complete' build?
 
melchior said:
speaking of which, is it at the end of the week or when they get their dvds? meaning, when can we expect hands on reports of the 'feature complete' build?
Click to expand...

Developers have already received their new Leopard discs.
 
dashiel said:
uhm... for all those ready to bite jobs' head off, you do realize that even sun has yet to release a non-beta version of solaris that boots off a ZFS partition right? and sun not only invented it, but has had their hands on the final product for almost 18 months now.
Click to expand...

From what I've watched of the releases of Java, they're pretty leisurely about tech incubations. Like Sun thinks they have billions of years to burn developing stuff, and people will just sit and wait. But instead they get hot under the collar and move on to the next cool tech.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
:D
 
Whatever Apple's plans are for ZFS, I don't think the plans would change because of the earlier leak. I do think Steve might change his presentation based on the link though.

Brandon Sharitt said:
I wouldn't be entirelly surprised to see somesmall form or ZFS support, though I'd be more surprised to see boot support or especially the default file system.
Click to expand...

Yeah, ZFS doesn't support boot volumes. Perhaps the Sun guy just got a bit too wound up?

It would make sense to put ZFS on a user partition though, allowing us to backup our files and our applications online - a real separation between the user and the OS. Doing this would also allow us to move our files and our applications to any Mac, though that Mac might have different hardware and slight differences in OS setup (version 10.5.2 vs 10.5.3?).



It would be the start to a shift towards our data & apps.
 
SeaFox said:
From what I've watched of the releases of Java, they're pretty leisurely about tech incubations. Like Sun thinks they have billions of years to burn developing stuff, and people will just sit and wait. But instead they get hot under the collar and move on to the next cool tech.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
:D
Click to expand...


tend to agree, though java development seems to be better on *nix and windows than os x... so in some regards, it is selective.
 
It will be a big shame if there is no ZFS support in Leopard at all. Having it as a bootable filesystem always seemed a bit unlikely since Sun aren't there yet themselves in a final release, but I guess not impossible.

I would still like the option to use ZFS, perhaps retaining a small partition on the first disk for everything other than /Users then spanning /Users over a ZFS volume.

I wish they'd make a formal announcement one way or the other, I need some new disks and this is delaying being able to make an informed decision.
 
melchior said:
tend to agree, though java development seems to be better on *nix and windows than os x... so in some regards, it is selective.
Click to expand...

Aw, no comment on the pun stuffing. :p

No, but seriously, though. ZFS and resolution independence in the UI were two things I was looking for. Because they're two features that really kick sand in Microsoft's face. Aero is underwhelming and WinFS was vaporware, even with all the delays.

The top secret Finder has been:
  • a redesigned sidebar
  • gratuitous use of animation
  • built-in remote access and
  • a "glass" menubar.
thus far.

Photocopiers, indeed.
 
alana22 said:
I think I'll just stick with Tiger. <--- Things I never imagined I'd say. I see no incentive for me to spend $200 dollars on what appears to be minimal tweaking at best. Apple had set the climate to blow Vista out of the water, and it didn't really happen. I thought maybe I was just expecting too much - but judging by the drop in Apple stock today, I guess others agree. Tiger has been the most reliable and dependable OS I've ever used, and nothing I've seen today has convinced me to abandon it. Quite a string of letdowns lately.
Click to expand...

Lets wait until the developers post on here with opinions of what they think of 10.5
And Steve said it would be $129.
I just sure hope that it turns out to be everything I expect & more.
 
h, well then ta hell with this. I'm going out right now and buying a Vista PC


for realz. yes, ZFS would have been great, but I can not remember the last time Apple said "Oh, people really want this, it's fully functional, so ummm, lets leave it out"
 
According to Steve, Leopard has 300+ new features of which he showed 10 in yesterday's keynote. I think that Apple is playing it very close to the vest so that they'll have plenty to tout at release time in October.
 
synth3tik said:
h, well then ta hell with this. I'm going out right now and buying a Vista PC

for realz. yes, ZFS would have been great, but I can not remember the last time Apple said "Oh, people really want this, it's fully functional, so ummm, lets leave it out"
Click to expand...

We just talked about that. They left out one brand of video cards a bunch of people really wanted, and put in another brand a different group of people wanted, all because another bonehead exec said "hey, there's new towerz comin' peoples and WE'RE IIIIIN!"

If they're going to insist on being the ONLY maker of Macintoshes, I think they should offer a wider selection of products. Like more video card models in BTO options, along with more diversity in computer offerings. *cough*midrange tower*cough*
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back