Now That the iPhone is on Tight Lockdown, is anyone going to buy them anymore?

[pilotError]

My issue with it is that Apple is flirting with the law; specifically with the DMCA provision to allow the consumer to unlock their phone.

Apple's ONLY reason for killing the unlocks was to protect its business model. Pretty much the reason this exception exists in the DMCA, because it benefits nobody but the corporation.

You can believe all the crap they spew about hurting the hardware, its only crap. They didn't want you building your own ringtones without paying for it and they don't want you using anyone but AT&T, because its lost income.

It's the same crap Verizon pulled when they locked down the RAZR when it first came out. Even AT&T didn't try to lock down the ringtones. That worked out really well, I can't believe Apple tried to pull the same thing.

The applications were most likely the unintentional victim of all this, but needless to say, there gone too.

I can't believe how many people continue to allow corporations to trample all over your consumer rights and lie down like sheep and allow it to happen. The consumer paid a lot of money for this phone. It wasn't subsidized by anyone. Just because Apple put words in the EULA doesn't give it the right to trample your right as a consumer. I didn't give them permission to flash advertising at me, but soon, when I walk by a Starbucks, another advertising based icon is going to pop up without my permission. Is this Spam? What happens when McDonalds or Burger King or Larry's Strip-o-Rama gets on board. Maybe I don't want to be inundated with this crap. I paid for it, full price, no subsidies. Where does it end?

The issue is much bigger than Apple allowing me to install a tip calculator or a psuedo GPS capablility. Its about forcing me to pay at every turn without choice.

Baaaah anyone?

 

[notjustjay]

If the cost of the iPhone, at $399, is truly being subsidized by the carriers, then how is Apple selling the iPod Touch for only $299? Surely the $299, and thus the $399, prices reflect a profitable sale. If there is a "subsidy" from the carrier, surely it's purely profit.

 

[TheSpaz]

The only reason I've been delaying a purchase is to decide if I want to hold out for a Rev. B, which is what I do with just about every Apple product....

If everyone wanted to wait for Rev B, why does Apple even bother releasing a Rev A product? Don't you think that it's obvious that Apple thought the iPhone was "ready" when it was released? I'm not flaming you but, it seems like a lot of people have the attitude like "Rev A products from Apple are crap, wait for the second revision to get a working model" That type of logic seems kind of ridiculous. We are NOT beta testers... Apple probably did numerous tests with the iPhone and worked really hard to make it as good as it can possibly be since they make quality products. I don't think their attitude is "Let's just have a sketchy release and not worry about bugs and glitches because it's only Rev A and as we all know, Rev A isn't worth paying much attention to." -- I understand I am being pretty extreme but, people shouldn't be afraid of Rev A products just because SOME people are having problems with them. My Rev A iPod Touch works amazingly well!

 

[cyberddot]

If everyone wanted to wait for Rev B, why does Apple even bother releasing a Rev A product? <snip>

Since your message is likely to be very close to this one I won't quote you entirely, as you didn't quote me entirely. However, if you read the rest of the paragraph that I wrote, I qualify the choice between waiting or not-waiting. At no point did I say that Rev A is 'crap', or that I'll need to wait to Rev B to get a working model. My point is that I can decide if the current model of the iPhone has the feature set that I want, or if I will wait for a new and/or improved feature set. I fully expect most companies to improve upon previous models, I think it's what keeps most of them in business.

Maybe it will help if I restate it as, Rev A of an entirely new product line for Apple probably isn't going to be the best they can offer, nor is the Rev B, or Rev C for that matter, but we all know it's our personal choice as to when we take the leap. I can't wait for the 'Why didn't Apple release the phone like this in the first place?' threads when the newer versions hit the market.

I think the phone is ready, which is why I'll likely be making the purchase this week.

 

[awmazz]

If the cost of the iPhone, at $399, is truly being subsidized by the carriers, then how is Apple selling the iPod Touch for only $299? Surely the $299, and thus the $399, prices reflect a profitable sale. If there is a "subsidy" from the carrier, surely it's purely profit.

Don't try and use common sense in an emotional argument!!

Next you'll be questioning their 'carrier network security' claim, even though the same was done on the iPod touch despite never being able to ever connect to a carrier network.

 

[CybrMike]

Not sure if anyone here has read The Tipping Point, but this is a classic example of a bad move. Effectively, by stopping the unlocking and the hackers, Apple has hurt the people who most promote the brand, the Mavens, the Connectors, and the Salesman. Probably mostly the mavens.

Yes only a small percentage of iPhone owners "hack" the iPhone. Unfortunately for Apple, that same percentage is also the most vocal, effecting the word of mouth epidemic that has helped Apple build its golden halo.

If Apple is smart, and I hope they are, they will release an API and embrace third party development.

If not, I believe they will not be as successful as they otherwise could have been.

 

[gceo]

Silly question. They are selling like hotcakes.

They sold more in the opening weekend than any cell phone in history, and this was BEFORE anyone hacked it.

Now with more competitive pricing, and undoubtedly more apps coming, they are still rocking.

What most people of this forums don't consider is the hundreds of thousands of iPhone users that simply use the phone the way it is.

Now just f'n give me MMS and multi-SMS and I'll continue to be a fan. I'm just growing more impatient.

Seriously though. Just match the features of my old phone, and I'll be happy.

 

[Sobe]

Not sure if anyone here has read The Tipping Point, but this is a classic example of a bad move. Effectively, by stopping the unlocking and the hackers, Apple has hurt the people who most promote the brand, the Mavens, the Connectors, and the Salesman. Probably mostly the mavens.

Yes only a small percentage of iPhone owners "hack" the iPhone. Unfortunately for Apple, that same percentage is also the most vocal, effecting the word of mouth epidemic that has helped Apple build its golden halo.

If Apple is smart, and I hope they are, they will release an API and embrace third party development.

If not, I believe they will not be as successful as they otherwise could have been.

Yes the "hackers help Apple" argument.

They decided that hackers are doing them such a big favor that they locked down the iPhone as tightly as anything.

I'm beginning to realize that the outcry isn't so much that people can't hack the way they wanted but rather perhaps it's a feeling of being personally rejected by a corporation they mistakenly thought they were in some sort of a dysfunctional partnership with.

 

[DylanG]

My issue with it is that Apple is flirting with the law; specifically with the DMCA provision to allow the consumer to unlock their phone.

The DMCA provision only states that it's not a copyright violation under the DMCA to unlock your phone. It doesn't state that Apple is required to make it easy to unlock your phone, just that they can't sue you for copyright infringement if you do so.

 

[Cinemagic]

The DMCA provision only states that it's not a copyright violation under the DMCA to unlock your phone. It doesn't state that Apple is required to make it easy to unlock your phone, just that they can't sue you for copyright infringement if you do so.

This is correct. Prior to the change in DMCA, it was a criminal offense to unlock a phone. Now it is not a criminal offense. You can unlock your phone for use on any network. It is not a requirement that manufacturers provide unlocked phones or even unlock the phone for a customer. When you (in the US) bought the iPhone, you also signed a contract with Apple. If you unlock your phone you have breached your contract with Apple. Technically, Apple could sue you for breach of contract if you unlocked your phone. Of course from a practical standpoint, they would be entitled to recover damages. THe only damages they would have is the lost revenue that they would receive from AT&T. This amount per iPhone makes legal action not a good financial move.

As far as sales of iPhones, let's face it, the number of iPhone users who hack their phones for either use on another network or for 3rd Party apps is a very small percentage. The majority of people on these forums are hackers, but we represent a small percentage of iPhone users. Even with a locked down phone, it's still the best phone / iToy on the market. I love adding 3rd party apps to my iPhone, I think Steve Jobs has beaten Bill Gates in the greed department, and I still love my iPhone - even locked down. People will still buy like it's going out of style. Just wait for Christmas sales.

 

[angrygolfer]

Silly question. They are selling like hotcakes.

They sold more in the opening weekend than any cell phone in history, and this was BEFORE anyone hacked it.

Now with more competitive pricing, and undoubtedly more apps coming, they are still rocking.

What most people of this forums don't consider is the hundreds of thousands of iPhone users that simply use the phone the way it is.

Now just f'n give me MMS and multi-SMS and I'll continue to be a fan. I'm just growing more impatient.

Seriously though. Just match the features of my old phone, and I'll be happy.

Thats what I'm talking about. Steve touted it "the best phone" but does not have all the "phone" features.

 

[sblasl]

I LOVE THIS LINE.

I'm beginning to realize that the outcry isn't so much that people can't hack the way they wanted but rather perhaps it's a feeling of being personally rejected by a corporation they mistakenly thought they were in some sort of a dysfunctional partnership with.

 

[QCassidy352]

I bought the iPhone assuming we'd never see native third party applications. I'm glad that they exist, but they were never a selling point for the hardware itself.

It's not like Apple supported third party applications then suddenly stopped people from using them. Then I'd have a problem with it.

That's my view on the whole thing. I think most people with iphones are not even aware of the 3rd party apps, and among those who are, it's a deal maker/breaker for only a very small %. This board makes every complaint about apple seem greatly magnified, but MR is not exactly representative of the average user.

 

[objc]

Yes the "hackers help Apple" argument.

They decided that hackers are doing them such a big favor that they locked down the iPhone as tightly as anything.

I'm beginning to realize that the outcry isn't so much that people can't hack the way they wanted but rather perhaps it's a feeling of being personally rejected by a corporation they mistakenly thought they were in some sort of a dysfunctional partnership with.

Yes, you have a point there. Real Apple fanatics realize that they exist solely for Apple's benefit and don't question it. I mean, what does Apple owe them for being loyal customers? These childish people have made the unreasonable request that Apple not prevent them (as opposed to actively supporting) from installing applications onto their $600 phone/computer (and it really is a computer -- it runs a computer operating system). I mean, these people act like they actually bought the phone or something. As if the phone is theirs! Ha!

 

[angrygolfer]

Yes, you have a point there. Real Apple fanatics realize that they exist solely for Apple's benefit and don't question it. I mean, what does Apple owe them for being loyal customers? These childish people have made the unreasonable request that Apple not prevent them (as opposed to actively supporting) from installing applications onto their $600 phone/computer (and it really is a computer -- it runs a computer operating system). I mean, these people act like they actually bought the phone or something. As if the phone is theirs! Ha!

NICE!!

 

[mikes63737]

I'll still buy one. I would never have hacked my phone in the first place, so this does not bother me.

 

[objc]

I'll still buy one. I would never have hacked my phone in the first place, so this does not bother me.

iPhone without the ability to develop and use non-Apple apps to me is .... BORING! What does it have? Cell phone. Great, and it's on the crappy ATT network. Verizon in my area has way better coverage. So I'm replacing my wireless service with inferior wireless service and buying a new phone to do it. Cool! What else... iPod. Yeah I have 3 of those -- a 4G, a mini, and a shuffle for working out. Let's see, what else... nice mobile web browser... ok, that would be nice, but is it going to change my life? Doubt it. What else is there? Oh yeah, maps. Great, I can get google maps java app on my Moto phone by flashing different firmware on for Java support. I could also get Opera mini, although the screen really isn't the ideal size for web browsing.

If I can install 3rd party apps, what do I get? SSH client. Very nice. Now I can log into my Sun boxes at work in a pinch if I need to. What else... VNC client. Next time Mom calls and is in a bind, needing to get something working on the computer because she has to send out a document by the end of the day, I can connect up no matter where I am and give her quick help, versus the usual 10 minutes just trying to figure out what's on her screen, or waiting till I get to a computer. There's plenty of other nice things I could do with it too with 3rd party apps that apple will never write. Besides that, there are a lot of fun apps that make the phone much more interesting an appealing -- apps that will make people say, "hey, I want one of those." My GF works with 2 people that have stock iphones and they told her the phone is mediocre. Probably in part because of the limited software on the phone.

But I guess what Apple is telling me is that even though I use a Mac (OS X) computer at work and one at home, if I want to do those things, I should get a Windows Mobile phone instead of one that runs OS X. Hey, at least WM phones are available on EVDO providers. Should be a lot faster than EDGE. It is windoze though, but I guess those people who say that people that do "real work" do it on windoze, may be at least partially right.

 

[divabimbers]

Count me in as one of those that will still be buying an iPhone in spite of the fiasco. I have faith that Apple will release an SDK to make the iPhone more powerful. The only question is when but in the meantime, the iPhone does plenty that it makes a must have for me. I can't wait to try Visual Voicemail when I get it in a week!