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Official Complaints Over '4G' Marketing of New iPad Taking Hold in Europe

I actually work in the UK advertising industry (high end video post production) and whilst our clients sometimes find the advertising regulators a pain I for one think they are an imperative mechanism in protecting the consumer. Advertisers cannot make spurious unsubstantiated claims or mis-represent their products. Any TV commercial would have had to be passed by Clearcast (formerly the BACC) so I'm guessing Apple's iPad is "legally" in the clear, however Apple, to my mind, are on thin ice with the way they have emphasised the iPads 4G capability in their marketing materials. I think the regulators will now look at the emphasis placed on this feature in territories that are incompatible or do not support the feature.

I'm not entering into this whole Europe Vs US thing, however I'm glad that we have regulators here in the UK protecting consumers.
 
Rodimus Prime said:
fine print like that is not an acceptable excuse for false advertising.
The 4G LTE part should not be used in any country except where it will work end of story. That is only in the US and Canada. No where else in the world.
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I have mentioned this before. It is a mobile device. Don't you think people have a right to know it has 4G capabilities? If they never mentioned it, I am pretty sure these same people would be all like, "But I didn't know I could take my iPad to a different country where 4G is available."
 
andyjam said:
Apple can't have it both ways... They can't come out blazing with a marketing campaign partially centred around the 'WiFi + 4G' line, then in the fine print state that this critical feature isn't supported anywhere outside North America. It's frankly ridiculous...

Some might be interested to know that Apple's lawyers here in Australia have come out with the "HSPA+ is 4G" line, yet this is clearly contradicted by Apple's fine print, which itself defines 4G as LTE.

The biggest problem - the lack of new features Apple has included in this iteration. I'm not complaining, I think it's an awesome product and I just got one the other day. But the only new things here really are the Retina Display and 4G capabilities. There's also the A5X, but even Apple realises that they can't boast about this beyond "four times the graphics capabilities". To lose the ability to quip "4G" around the world is effectively halving Apple's marketing strategy with this update IMO.

Will it be an issue for them trying to sell this device, absolutely not. They will see anyway, so I don't get the issue with doing the right thing by the consumer. If this was Samsung or Nokia or anyone, Apple would be all over it...
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I would have to say that the mass of the marketing has more to do with the display. Isn't that why 99.9% of people bought it?
 
sclawis300 said:
I have mentioned this before. It is a mobile device. Don't you think people have a right to know it has 4G capabilities? If they never mentioned it, I am pretty sure these same people would be all like, "But I didn't know I could take my iPad to a different country where 4G is available."
Click to expand...

Yes people have that right, but don't scream out loud that "it can all over the world" and whisper (while holding your hand for your mouth) "not in your country and most of the countries in your area"
 
From reading these articles I take it that consumers in Europe and Australia simply would not tolerate handset makers and carriers referring to 3G+ as 4G. Here in the US the misuse of "4G" is rampant. In fact, Apple has been the best about distinguishing what US carriers call "4G" from "LTE". Even when they conceded to AT&T to put the "4G" marker in the banner for HSPA+, they also added a different marker (LTE) to distinguish LTE from HSPA+. Verizon must have loved that since their 4G is 100% LTE.

When Samsung first started running their Galaxy SII "Next Best Thing" commercials the Samsung girl says "Why don't you just get a 4G phone?" in taunting the girl in the iPhone line. In reality, most Galaxy SII models run the same HSPA+ as the iPhone 4S does, but the difference was that Apple was not calling it 4G and their competitors took advantage of that.

I think if the US had cracked down on the misuse of 4G early on then we would not have the mess we have here. I applaud European and Australian consumer groups for actually standing up for clarity on this matter.

I personally think that Apple should highlight the really fast DC-HSDPA for Europe and say "up to LTE when traveling in North America". Though I think their marketing does in fact call out "up to LTE" with a footnote stating that its only available when in the US and Canada and with specific carriers, they should just pull it out of the footnote that LTE only matters in the US or Canada. I don't even think Apple's LTE will work in China without a hardware refresh, but I could be wrong on that.
 
I think it is a stretch to say Europe is behind the US in 4G technology. LTE is in fact available in much of Europe. The problem is... the frequency used in each market differs, there is no set standard. So... if we agree that you can advertise LTE compatibility as '4G', then the device being advertised as '4G' should be able to use LTE technology within the markets it is being advertised in!

Hopefully, Apple thinks this through a bit more when it comes time to launch a '4G' iPhone. There are already 4G phones operating in other markets. Apple claims that the new iPad can access all types of network infrastructure, but if their devices cannot access different frequencies across different markets (assuming the world does not agree to one standard frequency), then they will lose a large market share to competitors.
 
Good. I'm glad this was raised. It was totally wrong of Apple to completely out it as a 4G product knowing full well that the UK does not have 4G connectivity yet and won't have 'til at least next year.



Although now thinking about it, the UK ad says "super fast WiFi". Which some people here, admittedly, do have. But it's still not 4G.
 
sclawis300 said:
I would have to say that the mass of the marketing has more to do with the display. Isn't that why 99.9% of people bought it?
Click to expand...

I think 99.9% of people are buying this because it's a new Apple product TBH.

I'd agree that the display is the key feature, but Apple hasn't been shy about talking about how they've included the capability to use 4G LTE networks. There's no denying that it's been one of their key marketing points for this devicde.
 
Therbo said:
Its not possible because American networks won't use the same technologies and frequencies as the rest of the world.
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Wrong. You lose.

It is not possible because we -- all of us -- cannot agree on single standards. Blaming the Americans alone is missing the point.

Blame all of us and you're closer to the guilty party.

The few that think that gain anything is the backward carrier industry.

Can anyone imaging the "industry" coming up with the GSM standard and the amazing explosion that followed? It took government regulation to make it happen.

Why can't replicate the same world-wide? Blame our poor, sorry, cash-starve, lobby-sensitive representatives.
 
rum said:
Wrong. You lose.

It is not possible because we -- all of us -- cannot agree on single standards. Blaming the Americans alone is missing the point.

Blame all of us and you're closer to the guilty party.

The few that think that gain anything is the backward carrier industry.

Can anyone imaging the "industry" coming up with the GSM standard and the amazing explosion that followed? It took government regulation to make it happen.

Why can't replicate the same world-wide? Blame our poor, sorry, cash-starve, lobby-sensitive representatives.
Click to expand...

Huh?

Regulation does happen, why do you think all phones sold in Europe work with all networks in Europe? Its regulation.

Similar regulation does not exist in the US, thats why you have things like CDMA, AWS etc now.
 
I think part of the problem is that the iPad won't work on the EU 4G at all. It's not that it depends on availability, but it just doesn't work. I'm a fairly technical person and I almost fell for that.
I did check my local phone company's 4G network and apparently there is 4G coverage where I live, work and pretty much along my commute.

Now, this might a bit stupid but in my book you can't sell a product: super mobile iPad 4G (1)

(1) doesn't include 4G

There have to be repercussions otherwise companies will go berserk with this kind of stuff: new supercool fridge with freezer (1) for only $999.
(1) doesn't include freezer.

The problem goes on: Apple lists phone companies that provide data plans on their website. If you got the homepage of one of those companies and check for 4G coverage, you might get a green light. Now wouldn't it be reasonable that the 4G data plan with the iPad 4G actually supports 4G?


Sure there is some fine print. But come on. I personally don't think that the customer has to know the frequencies that their country uses. If a company advertises a feature in a country, it has to work there, well at least in my book.
Otherwise you will constantly have to check online if the new product actually works where you live.

And it doesn't matter if that is in Europe, the USA, Japan or on the moon. If you buy a product at home, it has to work there as advertised. If you buy it somewhere else, that's a different story.
 
4G is a valueless marketing term

spcdust said:
I actually think if Apple are using the 4G capability of the new iPad to be a major part of their marketing strategy in countries that do not have 4G infrastructure in place then it's a fair point to bring them to task on this. It is somewhat dishonest to prominently highlight a feature that is incompatible / unavailable in a territory.
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4G is a useless marketing term created by the carriers and hardware manufacturers to sell product because they are clearly not holding themselves to any standards body definition of the term.

The only way, in my opinion, you could reasonably argue you are selling a 4G device would be if the device supported over 100Mbit/s to 1Gbit/s throughput as defined by ITU. The technology that can support those standards are WiMax and LTE Advanced neither of which are commercially widely available.

So unless the world wants to get serious about the use of terms like 4G and hold them to some official standard, 4G is just saying it isn't last year's model. Companies like AT&T don't want the customer to be too knowledgeable about the products (GSM, UMTS, GPRS, HSPA+, LTE) they offer or they might start having to compete on a level playing field and make fact based arguments.
 
I'm English. If I'd purchased the new iPad I'd have already known what to expect because I ALWAYS read footnotes if they are present. A footnote means a catch and if the person does not pay mind to the footnotes clearly stating the 4G speeds are only available in the US then the fault lies mostly with the consumers. I see nothing misleading. They say fast speeds UP TO 4G. They do not promise that YOU will receive 4G connection speeds, they only mention they support up to 4G in some areas. I'm sorry, but while I am no fanboy and do not think Apple are perfect with all their decisions (no company is), I do think that this "issue" is absolutely ridiculous does it REALLY alter the experience that much? I doubt it. As far as I'm concerned Apple have done nothing wrong. The whole thing is stupid.
 
sclawis300 said:
you know what they say about people who assume. I would probably not buy it because I would have read the disclaimer. And clearly you have not looked at the UK website. Maybe you should check it out. Also, pretty sure it is printed on the box too. Also, show me an advertisement that says it is 4G in a country that it does not work.
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From Apple's UK website. They're selling it as "Wi-Fi + 4G" with all the carriers listed right next to it. Yes, there's a disclaimer. So legally, yes, Apple is probably fine. That doesn't mean that it's not misleading. It most definitely is. All Apple has to do is change it to be "Wi-Fi + xxxx" (whatever it can connect to in these other countries that it's marketed in). It's a simple change to their website, and it's the right thing to do.

Apple, in it's marketing, the styling of its stores, and its products, have created this image that they're "better." Things "just work" and Apple customer service is well-known for being excellent. This misleading marketing does tarnish that image, to an extent. It's a disservice to their customers. They need to fix this problem. It's not too much to ask that the marketing for the iPad be clear and directed towards the country that they're selling it in.

 
At no point has Apple ever claimed that the new iPad works on all LTE networks around the world - they specifically pointed out that this applied only to carriers in the US & Canada.

What they do claim is that it will connect to 4G networks, which is true based on the ITU's revised specification which now includes so-called 3.5G technologies such as HSPA+.

The only reason for all the brewhaha over the issue is because other countries (as well as others on this forum) feel that only LTE qualifies as true '4G', even though this no-longer holds true since the ITU revised the standard.
 
Tali said:
There have to be repercussions otherwise companies will go berserk with this kind of stuff: new supercool fridge with freezer (1) for only $999.
(1) doesn't include freezer.
Click to expand...


I appreciate your opinion, but there are two problems I see here.
1) Bad analogy (the freezer would have to work somewhere to be comparable to the iPad)
2) Free markets ensure that there will be repercussions. You're not required to buy it. For this reason, I find the government regulations ridiculous in Europe.
 
The ASA should take concern here. The iPad is specifically advertised as being 4G even though it cannot possibly get a 4G signal in the UK. It may specify US and Canada in the small print but they don't make it clear at all. It's intended to be misleading.
 
PerfectDB said:
At no point has Apple ever claimed that the new iPad works on all LTE networks around the world - they specifically pointed out that this applied only to carriers in the US & Canada.

What they do claim is that it will connect to 4G networks, which is true based on the ITU's revised specification which now includes so-called 3.5G technologies such as HSPA+.

The only reason for all the brewhaha over the issue is because other countries (as well as others on this forum) feel that only LTE qualifies as true '4G', even though this no-longer holds true since the ITU revised the standard.
Click to expand...

That's not really what's going on. The issue is that other countries have what they call '4G' networks. The iPad claims that it has '4G' but it's not the kind of 4G that works in these other countries. So by advertising that it's '4G' it sounds like it will work on the 4G network in those countries, but really it won't. It's misleading.
 
Therbo said:
Regulation does happen, why do you think all phones sold in Europe work with all networks in Europe? Its regulation.

Similar regulation does not exist in the US, thats why you have things like CDMA, AWS etc now.
Click to expand...
It's regulation, I agree. I even said as much.

I don't think the issue is the Americans but rather the toothless, pathetic standard bodies than cannot standardise a single tech (or a simple frequency) for worldwide use.

There's no political will. Europeans don't care (enough), Americans don't care (at all). The rest of the World takes notice and moves on.

I also agree that Apple with its new and North American -only "4G" iPad isn't helping the situation. They deserve all the flak they're getting.
 
AustinIllini said:
For this reason, I find the government regulations ridiculous in Europe.
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You realise that wireless technology only made a significant leap forward once government regulations imposed a standard, namely GSM?

Don't take my word for it. Just try to remember the sort phones being marketed to Americans only a few years back. Awful pieces of kit.

Too much regulation's as bad as too little.

----------
Therbo said:
The ETSI standardises GSM.
Click to expand...
Yes, they do.

Does it work worldwide? It does not.

It's a "standard" (noun) that is not "standard" (adjective) everywhere.

The issue is not a technical problem.
 
sclawis300 said:
I have mentioned this before. It is a mobile device. Don't you think people have a right to know it has 4G capabilities? If they never mentioned it, I am pretty sure these same people would be all like, "But I didn't know I could take my iPad to a different country where 4G is available."
Click to expand...
Then put it in the spec page not in the advertisement.

It does not belong in the advertisement in any shape and form. Apple is making it a huge part of their advertisement which is the problem. No one is saying anything is wrong with putting it in the spec page.
 
flyingember said:
this hasn't been true since 2010 when the group that defines what 4G is changed their minds.

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right. because HSPA+ is officially 4G

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they have three different 4G technologies supported by the ipad.

----------



HSPA+ is a 4G technology according to the standards org that says such thing.
The 4S supports HSPA+
Click to expand...

Nobody changed their minds. The 4G term is undefined.
 
j800r said:
I'm English. If I'd purchased the new iPad I'd have already known what to expect because I ALWAYS read footnotes if they are present. A footnote means a catch and if the person does not pay mind to the footnotes clearly stating the 4G speeds are only available in the US then the fault lies mostly with the consumers. I see nothing misleading. They say fast speeds UP TO 4G. They do not promise that YOU will receive 4G connection speeds, they only mention they support up to 4G in some areas. I'm sorry, but while I am no fanboy and do not think Apple are perfect with all their decisions (no company is), I do think that this "issue" is absolutely ridiculous does it REALLY alter the experience that much? I doubt it. As far as I'm concerned Apple have done nothing wrong. The whole thing is stupid.
Click to expand...

Foot notes are good for clarification, to express the conditions in more detail but it's not ok to use foot notes to make a complete bait and switch like Apple is doing here.
 
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