Okay, Tim this is ridiculous. (Mini-Rant)

[Mojo1]

I Hear You But...

When I travel to Europe I have to pay in Euros vs. dollars so I wind up paying more. What's up with that? Why won't everybody let me spend my perfectly good dollars?

I'm working with a web designer in England and I pay her in pounds. It costs me more per hour than using a U.S. designer... Not to mention the PayPal fees and conversion rate.

I feel your pain!

 

[Cubytus]

So am I the only one who doesn't think it is ridiculous you cannot order international keyboards off the Apple website here?

I'm not saying they should keep these things in stock, build them to order 4-6 week wait, charge a premium, fine. Just not even offering the option appears egregious, given their ability to do so, and don't seems rather stupid.

Count me in. Actually, if you delete all key markings, there are only a few different shapes of keyboard Apple actually uses: the LONG [Enter] key, and the VERTICA one. Essentially, I can't get used to the horizontal one since my finger always lands on it exactly between the QWERTY and ASD rows.

Buuuut, why don't you find out what the price would be to "change" the keyboard. I imagine apple stores in germany must come across the guy who has a badly damaged keyboard and wants it replaced.
Maybe that´s closer to the 100 dlls you want to spend? Call them and tell them what they would charge for a replacement keyboard!

Unfortunately that´s all I have. With pre unibody mbp you could have changed the top case but with unibodies Im not sure what your options are.

I asked because I once considered to buy a refurbished MacBook Pro, and I type a lot. Since the whole top case needs to be replaced instead of just the keyboard, rate is closer to $250.

If space constraint isn't an issue, just buy a wireless german keyboard to go along your US-keyboard Mac

It's less clear why they offer French and not e.g. German. That's just bad luck for you unfortunately.

On the other hand, if you bring a new (less than 6 month old) laptop to germany, you have to declare it at the border and pay the MwSt and maybe some customs fee. So it's not a big difference really.

How come there's actually a FRENCH keyboard available in the US?? Where??? It's the exact reason I gave up on buying a refurb MacBook.

It seems there are still unjust laws in Germany :S

Their logistics network works because it is streamlined. You start putting exceptions in the chain for the one person in the US who actually wants a keyboard in a non-North American language, and the whole system will collapse in disorganization.

Read my reply above. Although there are only a few "key hole patterns" on a MacBook (Pro/Air), the keyboard itself must be one of the first components assembled before the board is installed. Taking orders for different keyboards would require keeping laptops in parts until an order is placed.

Or, divert a made-for-Germany laptop and redirect it to the US. I think this would lead to unacceptable delays for the customer in the US, as well as too much hassle to know exactly where is THE German laptop among thousands of other US laptops.

 

[Freyqq]

just set the keyboard to german..

 

[iThinkergoiMac]

If you absolutely must see the keyboard, but the MBP in the States and then purchase a German top cover and replace it. A lot of work, but possibly cheaper...

 

[DePaulBlueDemon]

No, I'm a fan of the 19% VAT.

I just think it is ridiculous that Apple doesn't have some option to order a computer with an international keyboard with a major foreign language. It is not as if I am asking for Farsi here.

There are just as many German speakers as Farsi speakers (word-wide average of 90-100 million people).

 

[dima39]

Laser engraving

Same problem in Russia - price for MBP higher at 30+%.
Solution - laser engraving RUS keyboard layout, spent around 20$

 

[ixodes]

When choosing Apple, one is best off if they just accept that Apple puts the company first, making all decisions to suit themselves.

Americans are an easy group to sell to...

 

[jeremyshaw]

For the silly person who asks why there is French kb. How many languages official in Americas? English in USA & Canada, along with a few territories. Spanish about everywhere else. Portuguese in Brasil. French in the French colony in. South America, and in eastern Canada.


For OP, get one from German online retailer? They should sell them to USA, though might have to pay pretty penny to import. Use current weakness of EURO to get better exchange, I guess, lol.

Sent from iPhone and all that other stuff.

 

[Rampant.A.I.]

There are just as many German speakers as Farsi speakers (word-wide average of 90-100 million people).

Uh huh. How many of them are here in The United States?

Wikipedia:
Main language(s) English 82.1%, Spanish 10.7%, other Indo-European 3.8%, Asian and Pacific island languages 2.7%, other languages 0.7% (2000 census)[1]

^ German language speakers are some fraction of that 3.8%.

Since you asked:

Why in God's name does Apple not offer computers in the States with more keyboards than just French, Spanish, and English?

I explained:

Point being, demand is going to dictate the product's availability in the 'states, and I'd wager there aren't a lot of German speakers in the US who want a German-only keyboard.

Your other option is to get a keyboard cover and switch layouts as mentioned above, which I think is a practical solution for a $2000 machine and a native English speaker.

It's a pretty reasonable conclusion: Apple is going to import what there's a demand for. There's probably not much demand for German language UMBP keyboards in the United States.

Of course, you could try calling Apple and seeing if they'll import a German language keyboard for you.

Personally I'd buy a $15 key overlay, go into preferences > keyboard layouts > english and change it to German, but that's just me.

 

[thundersteele]

I forgot about Canada. Yeah, english, spanish, french makes sense for the north american market. However, now I see that there's also a japanese keyboard available...


Oh, btw, the last two years I was using a swiss keyboard set to english. Took me a few weeks, then I just stopped looking at the keyboard

 

[kasakka]

There isn't really anything you can't type on the English keyboard by simply changing the layout. I use both English and Finnish keyboards on my English layout keyboard and there have been absolutely no problems and you can easily change between the two. I use the English for coding.

 

[dusk007]

The annoying difference ist eh shape of the enter, shift key and the one missing key on the US keyboard layout.
I could care less about what label is actually on the keys but getting used to different shaped keys sucks. I also bought my MBP in Germany just for the resale value.

That said. I absolutely hate the German keyboard Layout and Apples somewhat different version is even worse. It sucks for programming an everything save writing prose.
I run öäü via option key and use a mostly English like layout but with Z and Y still at the QWERTZ places. So much better. I don't get why so many people still care what is printed on those keys?

Apple could just make one of the L shaped keybaords available in the us. They can print chinese characters on it for all I care or make it black keys but I want the extra key and the shapes I am used to.

If people care for labels than the company in china that makes those key caps should just offer some custom labels and ship them in sacks to wherever. I doubt that costs much the machine probably print out such caps but the thousands in no time. They are probably not allowed to do so without Apple's say so.

 

[MrCaff]

So Tim,

I'm moving to Germany this May for school. I've had my MBP since mid 2008, when the first uni-body MBP released. The computer is great, but given its age, its relative inability to play well with Lion, I'm wanting to purchase a new MBP when it releases this year with a German keyboard on it.

I want to give your company money for a product is willingly sells, however, I have no interest paying for it in Euros, as that ~ 30% premium will do nothing except line Apple's pockets with my money. Why in God's name does Apple not offer computers in the States with more keyboards than just French, Spanish, and English? The German keyboards are produced in the exact same factory as the English keyboard are. Furthermore the product cost for each is almost the exact same. So why the 30% premium?

Please provide an avenue for me, or other students to procure a MBP with a German keyboard at an American price, or for the first time I will pirate a Apple product, and do it guilt-free buy purchasing a PC laptop and installing Lion on it.

--A loyal customer, who is slightly disenfranchised at the moment

Uhh, you do realise that if you buy a mac and take it to an apple store within 14 days they will put any keyboard on it you want. Usually same day. I had the same problem and they put a Japanese keyboard on my mac no questions asked. You clearly are just looking for something to complain about so try getting all the facts first mmkay?

 

[416049]

Why don't you buy your laptop as a refurb on the german site its in the store section bottom part called generaluberholte macs, or come to denmark and check out our prices cuz we would have every right to complain as-well as here it is 1210€ instead of 1149€

 

[Rampant.A.I.]

Wirelessly posted (iPhone 4s: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

So Tim,

I'm moving to Germany this May for school. I've had my MBP since mid 2008, when the first uni-body MBP released. The computer is great, but given its age, its relative inability to play well with Lion, I'm wanting to purchase a new MBP when it releases this year with a German keyboard on it.

I want to give your company money for a product is willingly sells, however, I have no interest paying for it in Euros, as that ~ 30% premium will do nothing except line Apple's pockets with my money. Why in God's name does Apple not offer computers in the States with more keyboards than just French, Spanish, and English? The German keyboards are produced in the exact same factory as the English keyboard are. Furthermore the product cost for each is almost the exact same. So why the 30% premium?

Please provide an avenue for me, or other students to procure a MBP with a German keyboard at an American price, or for the first time I will pirate a Apple product, and do it guilt-free buy purchasing a PC laptop and installing Lion on it.

--A loyal customer, who is slightly disenfranchised at the moment

Uhh, you do realise that if you buy a mac and take it to an apple store within 14 days they will put any keyboard on it you want. Usually same day. I had the same problem and they put a Japanese keyboard on my mac no questions asked. You clearly are just looking for something to complain about so try getting all the facts first mmkay?

Maybe so back when the keyboards were removable with a coupIe of tabs. To get to the keyboard on a unibody MacBook Pro, you have to take the entire machine apart, which to my knowledge the Apple Store won't even do. They ship it out to Apple. Unless you're just talking about replacement keys being snapped on, but the German keyboards I'm aware of have differently shaped keys.

 

[MrCaff]

Wirelessly posted (iPhone 4s: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)



Maybe so back when the keyboards were removable with a coupIe of tabs. To get to the keyboard on a unibody MacBook Pro, you have to take the entire machine apart, which to my knowledge the Apple Store won't even do. They ship it out to Apple. Unless you're just talking about replacement keys being snapped on, but the German keyboards I'm aware of have differently shaped keys.

Nope, they will take apart the machine and install the keyboard you want because there is no other way to do this offered by apple. The Japanese keyboard was different to the UK one but they did it all for me within an hour. I'm not saying you'll get the same service but they will definitely do it.

 

[dusk007]

Nope, they will take apart the machine and install the keyboard you want because there is no other way to do this offered by apple. The Japanese keyboard was different to the UK one but they did it all for me within an hour. I'm not saying you'll get the same service but they will definitely do it.

That sound insteresting. Where did you do that and what did they charge you nothing for the fun? Or was it an error on their part in the first place?

If I could choose I would want an International English keyboard or one with blank keys no labels but right shaped keys. Wouldn't be any point if they charge the price of a top case with keyboard.

Is the japanese a upside down L shaped enter key or the flat US.
UK afaik is like the internation eng. with L shaped enter.

 

[Lunfai]

Best bet would be to go to your nearest Apple shop and ask, I'm sure they will give a reasonable answer if you tell them that you just can't afford or don't want to pay for the premium price. I heard a story where someone who wants to buy an iPhone in there country would be more expensive then buying a cheap plane ticket and buying it in another country, currency conversion is very annoying.

If you don't live near a store, don't call customer support, but call the nearest Apple store. It might be worth the effort to go out on your way and go there instead of buying for the premium import taxes.

 

[biohead]

Ok, so you mention your Pro in the US is $1,800 yes? And that in Germany it's €1750. Now, Germany require you to pay VAT (At 19% according to this thread), which takes that $1,800 up to $2,142.

From April 2011, the USD to Euro rate has ranged from 0.6737 low, to 0.7900 high. So that $2,142 could change from anywhere between €1,443 to €1,692. Bearing in mind import taxes have to be paid by Apple, you're paying just €58 more at the top end of the scale.


Today the rate is 0.7722, so an equivalent of €1654. Which is still less than €100 more regarding taxes.

Your post, #6 in the thread, clearly states you'd be OK with Apple charging $100 premium - well there you have it. Do your maths right.

 

[alphaod]

Extinct keyboard layout v keyboard that is used be over 100 million people, America's 2nd or 3rd largest trading partner (depending on your barometer), and the single largest economy in Europe.

Yes, clearly your point has merit and is persuasive.

Dvorak is far from extinct. And why is that Apple has to offer you a German keyboard layout and not a Dvorak keyboard layout? Isn't that a bit bigoted?

 

[Alaerian]

Your post, #6 in the thread, clearly states you'd be OK with Apple charging $100 premium - well there you have it. Do your maths right.

You must be new to the internet. Surely you know that logic has no place here.

 

[borisiii]

I wonder if OP has tried calling 1-800-MY-APPLE... I would be surprised if ordering a MBP with a German keyboard isn't possible. They sell all kinds of things over the phone that, for whatever reason, they don't sell on the website, such as older operating system versions, various cables, manuals etc.

Otherwise, consider upping your ram to 8GB, buying an SSD, and reinstalling lion. Then buy the German version of the Apple Bluetooth keyboard. That solves your keyboard issue, and you will have a mac that will feel snappier running lion than any off-the-shelf configuration late 2011 MBP.

 

[orfeas0]

This forum isn't run by Apple, and Tim Cook will never see this message. Even if you email it directly to him tcook@apple.com, it will be read by a subordinate and promptly deleted.

Your admission of piracy on a public forum is rather stupid, and if you intend to send this to Apple's CEO, even more so.

The premium is not due to the keyboard, you know? It's actually due to the importation fees from bringing an American product into your country. Buy a MBP with the english keyboard in the US by the internet, and when all the shipping, import duties and taxes are all said and done, you'll have spent just as much as buying locally.

I wouldn't say so... It's mostly because of the taxes in europe.
I mean I bought my macbook air pretty cheap (880euros) , and without taxes that's 715euro (927$). That's even cheaper than in america!
So before blaming apple for their price in Europe, blame the country it's sold in for their stupid Vat.
And don't expect apple to sell their laptops with keyboards for every language, that's just dumb.
Go pirate it, noone cares (seriously). So you'll have Lion, on a wintel machine, without the multi-touch trackpad. Big deal. I would prefer running windows7 or ubuntu on such a machine than Lion, since the latter is optimized for use on their machines.

 

[ggg05a]

I find it funny, that so many of you automatically jump to the typical "fanboy" Apple is always right conclusion.

Apple is dropping the ball here. It would be logistically pretty easy to divert a pallet or two of MBP's with a German/Russian/Farsi/pickyourmajorlanguage to the states, and offer them for sale via the website.

--or--

It doesn't take rocket science to pay some 12 year old kid to pick up a MBP off the "Too The Fatherland" Bin in China and place it in "To the USA" bin.

If Apple can do this for Spanish, French, and Japanese, why not German? I mean, they are one of our largest trading partners, they are holding up the entire European economic-ecosystem at the moment, and there are more than 100,000,000 speakers in Europe, not to mention the ~10,000,000 speakers here within the States. Furthermore, a QWERTZ keyboard can do everything a QWERTY can do, however a QWERTY cannot do everything a QWERTZ can do, absent missing keys, or hitting Opt+u+ vowel, or Opt+S for the ß.

And for those of you who says my math is incorrect,

1750E = $2,275 (@ 1/1.3)
$1,800 = $1,800 (purchased on sales tax holiday, or next time I'm in Portland)

$1,800 < $2,275.

Now, I do realize that the 1750E price includes the 19% MwSt., however I don't understand Apple's net gain by forcing those who want a Germanic keyboard to pay Germany's MwSt. One would think they would try to be as price competitive as possible, and essentially forcing non-residents to pay the MwSt. + flight to Europe to procure a German MBP is rather ridiculous.

Sorry, if Dell, HP/Compaq, Acer, Sony can do it, I *know* Apple can do it too.

 

[Shredder-]

just FYI: If you buy a macbook in the states and ask for a foreign keyboard, they'll do it for free right after your purchase. my norwegian friend did this. and i did this asking for a swedish keyboard. i simply pay for the american one, and right of the bat i go ask "can i get a swedish keyboard please?" and they go "yeah sure, its gonna take us 1-2 days, we'll call you" and then you just go pick it up. true story, I'm not joking.

edit: this has to be done while physically purchasing it. i was located in the states. dunno if it works through ordering online