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In a way Apple have recognised this, and the benefits of having a single person sign off on design, by moving Ive into his current position. One of the key differences between Apple since the the NeXT reverse takeover was having a single gatekeeper to clear things rather than a committee.

Agreed.

Unfortunately, Ive's taste in software design is wildly, um, "different" from Steve Jobs'.

As such, the look and feel of Apple's products has begun to change drastically.

Having a "single gatekeeper" in this case has become a negative (in my opinion). Where Steve had universally appealing taste for both hardware and software (thus making him an ideal candidate for "single gatekeeper"), Ive is really a hardware guy.

Tim Cook "chickened" ;) out of the "single gatekeeper" position of authority here, given he's an Ops guy. He passed the buck to the hardware guy and got rid of one of the primary software guys (Forstall) who actually shared Steve's software aesthetic sense.

The result? iOS 7. Ugh.

Whether you think Tim was brilliant or a fool depends on your position on iOS 7.
 
That is why I'm holding on to iOS6 and Snow Leopard for as long as I can…
Just like my Mac 128. When Scully produced those awful ProFormas I had to switch to Windows.
Scully without Jobs reminds me of Ives and Cook of today.

Honestly, you should probably check your facts:

The original Mac was a huge failure. It wasn't until Jobs was fired and Scully took over that the Mac became a success. It was Scully who really helped Apple transition from the fading Apple II line to making the Mac a success.

Mike Murry was ordered by Jobs to do market research to figure out why the Mac was selling so terribly. People were pretty blunt:

-Small screen
-No color
-No arrow keys on keyboard
-Not expandable
-Not enough memory
-No HD Option

These same issues were brought up during the Mac 128's development. Jobs wouldn't budge.

Scully addressed all of these issues with the Mac 512k, Mac Plus, Mac SE and Mac II line.

The Mac Plus, SE, and II line were some of Apple's most profitable computers during that time period.

This isn't my opinion, look up the sales numbers for yourself...

-P
 
That is why I'm holding on to iOS6 and Snow Leopard for as long as I can…
Just like my Mac 128. When Scully produced those awful ProFormas I had to switch to Windows.
Scully without Jobs reminds me of Ives and Cook of today.

"Ives".
 
In all fairness, that's all well and good, until you weigh the products released prior to Jobs's death and after.

Clearly, as the article states, Steve "cleared everything", in other words, his taste, his preferences, his direction permeated every single aspect of Apple products.

The fact that he is no longer here to do that, and no two people are exactly the same and have the same taste and preferences, is starting to show. So, while the man was brilliant and an effective leader, his micro-managing resulted in him being indispensable. Apple and Steve were "one".

Well, you know, that's all fine until you take off the rose-tinted glasses and look at some of the things Apple did while Steve Jobs was alive:

  • iPhone 4 “Antennagate” in 2010
  • The $200 price drop for the original iPhone soon after it launched
  • The 2005 iPod Nano with the scratch-prone case
  • The cracks in the G4 Cube casing
  • Brushed Metal UI
  • The powerbook (Ti?) that had terrible wifi connectivity because its antenna was inside the metal case
  • The rich Corinthian leather of the Find My Friends app (and many others)

etc. etc.

Also, the company has performed well since Jobs' death (via Daring Fireball's article about the recent Ive interview):

Jobs died on 5 October 2011. Apple’s stock closed at $378.25 that day. On Friday 14 March 2014 (last day of trading before the interview was published), Apple’s stock closed at $524.69. (Even if The Sunday Times Magazine has a two-week lead time, Apple’s price has been hovering around $525 for several weeks.) Apple’s stock was, therefore, as of publication of this interview, up 39 percent since Steve Jobs died.1 I repeat: up 39 percent.

The facts don't support your argument, unfortunately.
 
Well, you know, that's all fine until you take off the rose-tinted glasses and look at some of the things Apple did while Steve Jobs was alive:

  • iPhone 4 “Antennagate” in 2010
  • The $200 price drop for the original iPhone soon after it launched
  • The 2005 iPod Nano with the scratch-prone case
  • The cracks in the G4 Cube casing
  • Brushed Metal UI
  • The powerbook (Ti?) that had terrible wifi connectivity because its antenna was inside the metal case
  • The rich Corinthian leather of the Find My Friends app (and many others)

etc. etc.

Also, the company has performed well since Jobs' death (via Daring Fireball's article about the recent Ive interview):



The facts don't support your argument, unfortunately.

The fact is, you didn't understand my argument. Nothing you say counters it. So here it is even more plainly:

Apple before Steve (product-wise) was and is different than Apple after Steve, given his management style.

Whether that is good or bad (for you) depends on individual taste.

I don't care about how much more successful Apple is, if they don't produce products I want.

My glasses are, and always have been, clear. That is why I use (older) Macs and a (new) Android phone. I'm not tied to Apple by fanaticism. I'm tied to their products, so long as they suit my needs and taste.
 
tell me about it. Crappy windows mobile could do it too, but don't let the youngling hear that those features were pretty standard on every smartphone.

I love how the iphone changed the aesthetic, and gave users a real device that was easy to use, but the iphone took all of 6 years to gain features that a treo 600w and palm tx had by default.

b.s.
 
I have used Logitech mice since the late 90's. But I never see Logitech as an Apple-like company. They most certainly don't pay that much attention to details. They make decent mice with half baked designs, and terrible software. They are still the best imho but they could do so much better.

That's nice, but moot. In the end, Apple isn't the only company that pays attention to detail. That's a fact.

You do realize that Apple had the Newton and Plam@ Treo were just cheap knockoffs of the Newton?

This is false. Wikipedia and Google searches have more information for you on that.

If nothing else, search through the countless threads, forums, and posts where this nonsense has been utterly debunked over and over again.

It's like saying Apple was the first to make the cell phone.

Yeah or things like cut, copy and paste or mms supports which iPhone users were told for years we didn't need (just send a pic as an email attachment) then rolled out as an innovative update that other phones had for years.

Very true. Add to that the ability to change the homepage and lock screen image, which was introduced when? I forgot like iOS 4?

Then there were the more advanced features like wireless device to device transfers and wireless syncing. I could sync my iTunes music library from my 14" iBook to my Palm TX and Palm Treo 650 in 2004 and 2005 just fine . . . it took all night though.

Guess who made the "Mighty Mouse"? Logitech.

It was handme down garbage then. The mighty mouse was the worse mouse to date, even worse than the hockey puck mouse IMHO.

As far as details are concerned Logitech has been killing it with features, battery life, thinness, aesthetic, intuitive use and software controls, build quality, etc. etc. etc.

I sound like a fanboy, but these are all things I like in my products, which is why I buy Apple computers, and Logitech mice and keyboards to go with them.


Proof? Otherwise your full of **it
 
Rubberbanding

Oxford should have added the word.

I scroll on my Android phone in gMail and I'm not sure if i'm at the end of the message list or if my phone is having a problem recognizing my swipe up. My iPhone screen does a little bounce. Not a big deal??
 
Now I know why so many people at Apple have discolored hair or are going bald....the stress must be terrible.
 
Anyone who dismisses the lawsuit and iPhone as just another evolutionary product is being willfully ignorant and probably never created anything in their lives.


in 2001 i had a compaq ipaq and my wife had a dell axim around 2003

both were touch screen
i used to use avantgo app store in 2001 to load apps and sync news for the train ride to work
i used to listen to music on those a little but dedicate mp3 players were better
at the same time there were Palm and other PDA's with thousands of apps
in 2005 there were WinMo phones with outlook and MS Office on them

the big thing with iphone and other smartphones is cellular and wifi connectivity
automatic syncing of contact info via activesync or google sync
the fact that we have Amazon AWS and Google Compute Engine for small developers to have an affordable way to deploy server side apps for their their client apps aka Da Cloud to backup and sync data
 
Apple needs to realize that some people like the skeuomorphism of the iPhone operating system. Sometimes 'plain and flat', is just plain and flat...

I hated it but it but lived with it for 6 generations....your turn now. :D
 
I hated it but it but lived with it for 6 generations....your turn now. :D

Apple needs to realize that some people like the skeuomorphism of the iPhone operating system. Sometimes 'plain and flat', is just plain and flat...

----------



He would probably say: 'Just enough'.

some people like it.
some people hate it.

now, if you gave users CHOICE via theming or skinning.. would that be so horrible?
 
So you think Steve Jobs is the genius that he is, but is incapable of choosing leadership to keep his vision alive? I think that's pretty insulting to Jobs true brilliance, which was talent management/recruiting and having good "taste" in people, not just products.

Scully and the Apple of 1985 was not an organization that Jobs set up himself. First of all, he was much younger and less experienced. Second, the board of directors didn't allow Jobs to have that level of control over the organization. Scully was approved by Jobs to be CEO due to inexperience as well as pressure from the board, who were money hungry types and not visionaries. The only group Jobs assembled entirely himself was the Macintosh team, only 100 people. That was all he was allowed to do.

2014 Apple is a completely different beast than 1985. Let alone the fact that Tim Cook has been Jobs' right hand man for over 15 years while Scully wasn't. This is an organization assembled from top to bottom by Steve Jobs himself. From the leadership to the structure to the culture to the processes, all Steve Jobs. Jobs even created internally the Apple University during his last few years.

To compare Apple today to the Scully Apple is a complete slap in the face to the mighty Steve Jobs you think was irreplaceable. It's just funny to me, people treat him like a God, but then slap him in the face when it comes to his ability to leave his creation in capable hands.

I'm pretty sure Jobs cared about it much more than you. And I'm pretty sure he thought much longer and harder about it than you have. And I'm pretty sure he knows Tim Cook and Jony Ive much better than you.


Still confused as to how Steve is expected to ride herd on these folks from the grave?
 
so the whole sugared watered lined was from a man with his hands tied behind his back by the board?

btw being a greater leader of a company (second time around) has got nothing to do with your abilities to pick your replacements. the ones that complement you may not be your best replacements.

True, but that doesn't mean Steve didn't know what he was doing when he picked Tim. Especially as Tim had filled in for Steve on a number of occasions.
 
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in 2001 i had a compaq ipaq and my wife had a dell axim around 2003

both were touch screen
i used to use avantgo app store in 2001 to load apps and sync news for the train ride to work
i used to listen to music on those a little but dedicate mp3 players were better
at the same time there were Palm and other PDA's with thousands of apps
in 2005 there were WinMo phones with outlook and MS Office on them

the big thing with iphone and other smartphones is cellular and wifi connectivity
automatic syncing of contact info via activesync or google sync
the fact that we have Amazon AWS and Google Compute Engine for small developers to have an affordable way to deploy server side apps for their their client apps aka Da Cloud to backup and sync data

Without Newton, those products might not even exist. Besides, none of those products exactly set the world on fire. And I would say the big thing with iPhone was its UI cos we all know it wasn't about its features or calling ability.
 
some people like it.
some people hate it.

now, if you gave users CHOICE via theming or skinning.. would that be so horrible?

You do realize this is Apple we're talking about...

----------

That attention to small details and perfectionism died with iOS 7 and Jony Ive's train-wreck software "design"

You mean like all the small details and perfection Tim had to apologize for with the maps app? Anyone that thinks Scott Forstall was fired because iOS UI was "skeuomorphic" OR that Jony Ive alone is responsible for current iOS UI is clueless.
 
some people like it.
some people hate it.

now, if you gave users CHOICE via theming or skinning.. would that be so horrible?

Not possible. This is Apple, and if you let "common" people use Winterboard they'll will either get their device in a boot loop and have to restore OR they'll theme it so much, it will take 5 minutes to boot or respring.

In any case, unhappy customers. Apple don't want to give tech support with that.

That's why Android/jailbreaking exists.
 
Still confused as to how Steve is expected to ride herd on these folks from the grave?

It's a legitimate question. The leadership team in place right now was put there by Steve. It was his recommendation to the board that Tim Cook replace him. He told Walter Isaacson that Jony Ive had more operational power at Apple than anyone else but himself. These are the people Steve left in charge to run the company. Unless you agree with Yukari Kane's theory that Steve put Tim in charge so Apple would never be as/more successful as it was when Steve was CEO?
 
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