Our Lady of the Underpass, part 2


leekohler

macrumors G5
Original poster
Dec 22, 2004
14,162
19
Chicago, Illinois
jayscheuerle said:
He should have spray painted a big penis there and the diptych would have been complete...
Ha-ha! Yes! That would have been great. Seriously though-I'm glad someone finally did it. :)
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
leekohler said:
Ha-ha! Yes! That would have been great. Seriously though-I'm glad someone finally did it. :)
That will be the same feeling microsuk lovers have when someone finally hits OSX with a virus, and to distrupt the "cult" of apple.
 

PlaceofDis

macrumors Core
Jan 6, 2004
19,232
4
leekohler said:
The difference is-we aren't fools. :)
exactly, and they will be pissed when it gets patched to quickly too :D


OT: meh, its a stain, im surprised it hadn't washed away by now, but then again its been rather dry around here too
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
Hey wait a minute, what's that I see..............could it be..........is it...........it's the Virgin Mary on your house! Really I see it, look, on the front of your house, and over there on you other guys building...........wow, hope nobody comes to burn it down. :eek:
 

leekohler

macrumors G5
Original poster
Dec 22, 2004
14,162
19
Chicago, Illinois
stubeeef said:
Hey wait a minute, what's that I see..............could it be..........is it...........it's the Virgin Mary on your house! Really I see it, look, on the front of your house, and over there on you other guys building...........wow, hope nobody comes to burn it down. :eek:
You are ON today, man! :)
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
I was not into the whole stain thing, but what real harm was it that some people saw something that made them feel good.

It is always easy to destroy, much more so than to create, the painter man was just another version of a troll.
 

leekohler

macrumors G5
Original poster
Dec 22, 2004
14,162
19
Chicago, Illinois
stubeeef said:
I was not into the whole stain thing, but what real harm was it that some people saw something that made them feel good.

It is always easy to destroy, much more so than to create, the painter man was just another version of a troll.
Uh, gee- I though it was really frightening that a bunch of grown adults would go and pray to a salt stain on an underpass and that the mainstream media would actually cover it. Doesn't say much for our collective IQs. Also says bad things about where this country is heading.
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
leekohler said:
Uh, gee- I though it was really frightening that a bunch of grown adults would go and pray to a salt stain on an underpass and that the mainstream media would actually cover it. Doesn't say much for our collective IQs. Also says bad things about where this country is heading.
That is what no one here gets, they weren't praying TO a salt stain, they were praying TO God, and to the Virgin Mary. The stain made them think about someone important to them.
Like I pointed out in the previous post, becareful which destroyers you cheeron, for the next sighting might be on your house.
 

leekohler

macrumors G5
Original poster
Dec 22, 2004
14,162
19
Chicago, Illinois
stubeeef said:
That is what no one here gets, they weren't praying TO a salt stain, they were praying TO God, and to the Virgin Mary. The stain made them think about someone important to them.
Like I pointed out in the previous post, becareful which destroyers you cheeron, for the next sighting might be on your house.
Oh no- I get it. It just really scares me. BTW-can't you pray to God anytime, anywhere? Why do you need to stand in front of a salt stain and disrupt traffic to do it?

And- if people started standing outside my house praying to a stain on my paint, it would immediately be painted over, believe me.
 

emw

macrumors G4
Aug 2, 2004
11,177
0
stubeeef said:
I was not into the whole stain thing, but what real harm was it that some people saw something that made them feel good.

It is always easy to destroy, much more so than to create, the painter man was just another version of a troll.
I agree that the guy who did the defacing was in the wrong - whether it was this or a billboard promoting Longhorn. In fact, although I might think these people are a little crazy for seeing this, I have no issue with them finding some solace in a random salt stain.

The issue I saw was that the state (in the form of police, barricades, traffic control, etc.) took it upon themselves to disrupt the lives of others (those wanting to use the underpass for that it was created) in favor of the relative few who wanted to pray to this vision.

This is, after all, public property, not private grounds.
 

leekohler

macrumors G5
Original poster
Dec 22, 2004
14,162
19
Chicago, Illinois
emw said:
I agree that the guy who did the defacing was in the wrong - whether it was this or a billboard promoting Longhorn. In fact, although I might think these people are a little crazy for seeing this, I have no issue with them finding some solace in a random salt stain.

The issue I saw was that the state (in the form of police, barricades, traffic control, etc.) took it upon themselves to disrupt the lives of others (those wanting to use the underpass for that it was created) in favor of the relative few who wanted to pray to this vision.

This is, after all, public property, not private grounds.
Amen! No pun intended. :)
 

MongoTheGeek

macrumors 68040
emw said:
The issue I saw was that the state (in the form of police, barricades, traffic control, etc.) took it upon themselves to disrupt the lives of others (those wanting to use the underpass for that it was created) in favor of the relative few who wanted to pray to this vision.

This is, after all, public property, not private grounds.
I was under the impression was that the state was doing crowd control and trying to make a semblance of organization. Just sorta to keep the peace in a non specific way. I am sure they do the same thing for other spontaneous memorials that pop up.
 

Chip NoVaMac

macrumors G3
Dec 25, 2003
8,889
25
Northern Virginia
stubeeef said:
I was not into the whole stain thing, but what real harm was it that some people saw something that made them feel good.

It is always easy to destroy, much more so than to create, the painter man was just another version of a troll.
So true. When we need it, we tend to find Faith is the strangest of ways.

It may have been a salt stain, but it provided comfort to those that may have needed the comfort. And who is to say how visions are to appear? It distresses me that so many are unwilling to allow acceptance for what others see as potential proof of their Faith.
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
leekohler said:
Oh no- I get it. It just really scares me. BTW-can't you pray to God anytime, anywhere? Why do you need to stand in front of a salt stain and disrupt traffic to do it?
You don't need an image, and not being Catholic, which I believe most of these people were, I don't get alot of the symbology of their practices. I often pray as I stand, did so twice today as a good friends husband died in his sleep last night.

And I don't promote the going around and making alters at underpasses, I think the beauty of nature is a much more awesome display of God than this image was.
emw,While I am not sure if the state was promoting the display with their actions or just trying to keep people safe, I don't condone the whole thing, but am more ticked at the guy who painted over it, or at the rejoicing of it. The state doesn't need to get into the business of setting up alters for everyone everywhere, but imagine the mess if it had not done some work to make things safer, traffic might have been much worse.
 

Chip NoVaMac

macrumors G3
Dec 25, 2003
8,889
25
Northern Virginia
emw said:
The issue I saw was that the state (in the form of police, barricades, traffic control, etc.) took it upon themselves to disrupt the lives of others (those wanting to use the underpass for that it was created) in favor of the relative few who wanted to pray to this vision.

This is, after all, public property, not private grounds.
And there lies the problem. How do we balance the needs of all with the needs of the few. Do we only allow our own beliefs to be accepted, and reject those that we don't understand or accept?
 

leekohler

macrumors G5
Original poster
Dec 22, 2004
14,162
19
Chicago, Illinois
Chip NoVaMac said:
So true. When we need it, we tend to find Faith is the strangest of ways.

It may have been a salt stain, but it provided comfort to those that may have needed the comfort. And who is to say how visions are to appear? It distresses me that so many are unwilling to allow acceptance for what others see as potential proof of their Faith.
You know- I usually agree with you, but a salt stain as potential PROOF of one's faith? PROOF? Come on- that's a stretch.

And again- I really don't care what makes people happy, but I don't think you should be disrupting traffic flow and using state resources to do it. If the guy who painted over it is getting fined, every one of those people should be fined for disrupting traffic flow.
 

jsw

Moderator emeritus
Mar 16, 2004
22,819
41
Andover, MA
jayscheuerle said:
He should have spray painted a big penis there and the diptych would have been complete...
I wasn't sure what you meant there until I saw a better view of the image.

Looks like an ad for The Vagina Monologues.

I would suspect that, assuming a God in the Judeo-Christian form, He'd be able to not only fashion a more lifelike rendition but might, stunningly enough, make one that actually looked like a woman of the time and place (Jerusalem, Roman times), as opposed to a Renaissance-oriented white woman.

The only signs I want to see preserved on public throughways are ones telling me road names and directions. I think the defacement was wrong - as all defacements are - but I couldn't care less that a salt stain was removed.

I don't mind that people find solace in such things - except that it disturbs me that intelligent beings can see this as a sign of anything except evaporation.
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
leekohler said:
You know- I usually agree with you, but a salt stain as potential PROOF of one's faith? PROOF? Come on- that's a stretch.

And again- I really don't care what makes people happy, but I don't think you should be disrupting traffic flow and using state resources to do it. If the guy who painted over it is getting fined, every one of those people should be fined for disrupting traffic flow.
As mongo pointed out, what about other spontaneous memorials, for Elvis, Sid Vicious, John Lennon, or anyother to that matter? This whole thing would have dissapeared faster without the media attention, but that is the way these things work.
 

emw

macrumors G4
Aug 2, 2004
11,177
0
Chip NoVaMac said:
And there lies the problem. How do we balance the needs of all with the needs of the few. Do we only allow our own beliefs to be accepted, and reject those that we don't understand or accept?
I am in no way rejecting their beliefs, nor am I condoning the actions of the person who painted over the stain.

But what if I see the Virgin Mary in an asphalt patch on I-90? Should I expect the police to barricade off a lane for me so that I can stare at it? What about providing escorts to people who want to cross traffic to get over there?

What if I saw Satan in that patch? Or some other religious icon? Or of a non-mainstream religion? Would the state have done the same thing, or would they have kicked me out and told me to go home?

I remember when there was a big panic when people thought they saw Satan in smoke from the WTC burnings on 9/11. Billions of random patterns occur throughout the world every day - and we're always trying to attach a face to them.
 

jsw

Moderator emeritus
Mar 16, 2004
22,819
41
Andover, MA
Looking some more, now I'm sad it's gone. Clearly it was a picture, not of the Virgin Mary, but of Obi-Wan Kenobi. Look at it. See - it's a Jedi. See the beard? Use the picture below for reference.