'Palm Pre' Smartphone Announced: WebOS, Wireless Charging, App Store

[SactoGuy18]

Any phone with a physical keyboard is just going to be another looser to the iphone. Why is is so hard to understand that those stupid chiclet keyboards for handheld devices are a dead end? Apple got it absolutely right with the all touch screen approach. The only possible improvement would be addition of handwriting recognition, which should be nothing more than a software upgrade.
The only thing that a physical keyboard adds is unwanted thickness and more opportunities for something to break. Apple is exactly right that getting rid of the keyboard to keep the phone thin enough to comfortably fit in ones pockets is the right choice. Having an on-screen touch keyboard instead of a slide out also makes the device much more practical to use for short, casual tasks, which is the whole point of a handheld device. On top of that, all the extra mechanical parts are really just more things to have break.

The problem is that with business users, they just can't use the type of "shorthand" typing you see with SMS cellphone messaging. As such, a real keyboard or its equivalent is mandatory, and that's why the Blackberry or the Palm Treo (and soon Pre) with its REAL keyboard are still so popular. That's why I do see Apple seriously looking at going to an haptic response touchscreen for its next-generation iPhone (which offers much better "feel" when typing out messages and still keeps all the advantages of the iPhone you mentioned) so the iPhone with a "beefed up" Mobile Me service can become a serious competitor against Blackberry and Palm Treo/Pre models.

 

[dguisinger]

The problem is that with business users, they just can't use the type of "shorthand" typing you see with SMS cellphone messaging. As such, a real keyboard or its equivalent is mandatory, and that's why the Blackberry or the Palm Treo (and soon Pre) with its REAL keyboard are still so popular. That's why I do see Apple seriously looking at going to an haptic response touchscreen for its next-generation iPhone (which offers much better "feel" when typing out messages and still keeps all the advantages of the iPhone you mentioned) so the iPhone with a "beefed up" Mobile Me service can become a serious competitor against Blackberry and Palm Treo/Pre models.

Okay, stop smoking crack. I'm a business user. I have never once typed shorthand on the iPhone. Some people I tell you what, why on earth do you think a screen would force shorthand? It f*n predictive types so its actually faster to type the full word most of the time. Now, if Apple would only add grammar based predictive typing it would make it even better, but its still very good for business users.

 

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Any phone with a physical keyboard is just going to be another looser to the iphone.

Who says? and why? I find chicklet keyboards much easier to type on (and I can type 45 words per minute on my iPhone, so don't give me that "you're just not used to it crap")

Why is is so hard to understand that those stupid chiclet keyboards for handheld devices are a dead end? Apple got it absolutely right with the all touch screen approach.

BuuuuuuullSh**
Who says they're a dead end? If that were true they wouldn't be so popular in phones like the sidekick, Voyager and blackberry. Apple did not get it right, the corrective text is horrible, especially since it refused to learn words, like F***, *sh**, yo, other slang words...

The only possible improvement would be addition of handwriting recognition, which should be nothing more than a software upgrade.

What? handwriting tech has been around forever and isn't really in any devices anymore... hand writing tech is dead

The only thing that a physical keyboard adds is unwanted thickness and more opportunities for something to break. Apple is exactly right that getting rid of the keyboard to keep the phone thin enough to comfortably fit in ones pockets is the right choice.

Man, you looooove Steve Jobs don't you? "Apple is exactly right"
Since when is a physical keyboard "unnecessary?"

Having an on-screen touch keyboard instead of a slide out also makes the device much more practical to use for short, casual tasks, which is the whole point of a handheld device.

No it doesn't. It makes it more complicated. If it were practical anyone could figure it out. I hand my iPhone to someone who has little experience with it and they have no idea how to use it. I have to give a ten minute tutorial before they can type their name.

Sure, the iPhone is great for typing, "Sure, LOL. I would love to see a movie tonight! I have nothing to do other than look trendy"

Where with any other smart phone you can do more than social networking.

On top of that, all the extra mechanical parts are really just more things to have break.

I'll give you that, but with the iPhone, if the touch screen dies (just one piece of the over all phone) you need to get a whole new phone. Where with any phone with a keyboard if one piece dies you're only losing that one piece and you can put off phone repairs for a while. Where with the iPhone you're screwed until you can get a whole new phone.

Given that my first smartphone is an iphone, I have to call nonsense on anybody who thinks a chiclet keyboard is easier to use than Apple's virtual keyboard.

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA soo.... you're making all of these assertions based on nearly ZERO experience with other phones? Niiiiiiice!

They aren't. I find them harder to use. It's just that all the Crackberry addicts are accustomed to chiclet keys and too set in their ways to understand the superiority of the virtual keyboard.

hmmmm... let's have a typing challenge between you and a power crackberry user. Who can type faster? Ahhhh right there a good blackberry user can type faster on their phone than an iPhone user.

Finally, it's not just that I don't want a chiclet keyboard myself, I don't want anybody else to have them either. Where I work, there are countless people in countless meetings clattering away on their stupid little keyboards on company provided Crackberries. The faint but constant 'click-click-click' is very irritating and distracting. The iphone with it's totally silent operation has been a breath of fresh air.

BS! The rubbery tiny keys on smart phones are silent and provide a little physical feedback with each press. The iphone on the other hand has that stupid speacker that insists on making very loud pop noises, usually a ten at a time two seconds after you're done typing

All these junk smartphones like the Crackberry, the G-1, and now the Pre make as much sense as hanging onto a teletype terminal in the age of GUI's.

hahaha! Yeah, because Apple got it perfect and juuuuuust right. We really need a slow laggy keyboard over a physical one. I'd say that using a physical keyboard is more like typing on... well... a keyboard on a home computer vs. using some clunky slow handwriting tablet hooked up to your PC.

On a different note, will somebody please explain all the crying about AT&T? I don't see how there is enough difference between any of the cell providers for consumers to care about at all.

Because Verizon has more coverage and better service. The very tech around CMDA has better "cell breathing" than GSM, and scales better too.

AT&T has crap coverage where I live and every time I try and use my iPhone at my house (I live in an very populated Portland suburb, definitely not the middle of no where) I am reminded of how bad AT&T is, where when I had verizon I never dropped a call.

I had been a Verizon customer since they were GTE, but when the iphone came out I switched to AT&T without hesitation. I have no regrets. They cost the same or less than I would pay for the closest equivalent from Verizon, they are polite to deal with, they don't have a bunch of stupid hidden charges like Verizon did for some of the smartphone models I looked at, and their coverage is just fine. I live and work far out in the suburbs of a secondary urban market and often travel to a wide variety of semi-remote and remote locations. I rarely ever have trouble getting either a phone or data signal, except when I am inside some metal lined rooms in the interior of some buildings. I can understand loyalty to a particular brand of phone, but I just don't get all the loyalty or hostility towards certain signal provider brands. I can think of few things that are more fully commoditized than cell phone service. The only thing I can figure is that all the AT&T haters are really just trolls who work for Verizon, Sprint, T-mobile, etc. who are worried about their jobs due to all the customers AT&T is poaching because of the iphone.

Gah! You have no idea what you're talking about! Why did I even take the time to respond!?

 

[knightlie]

that, things looks like a iPhone nano....but ugly...
very ugly..kinda good camara and it has flash, copy and paste and kinda expensive..but the iphone is so SEXY!
LET the competion begin, since this is a real business machine

If it's less than £360 on PAYG, I can put my Tesco Mobile SIM in it and it'll fetch emails, it can look however it likes. Flash is irrelevant, that's no loss to me. As you say, lets hope this stirs up Apple for the next iPhone.

Funny, I didn't think Palm would survive long enough for another platform release. I always liked Palm stuff.

 

[SkyBell]

Wow, this thing looks fantastic. I gotta be honest, given a choice between this and an iPhone, this would win by a landslide.

I've used an iPod Touch for a while now, and the on screen keyboard does not impress me. I'd much rather have something physical to press and something I don't make so many mistakes on.

 

[niemo810]

Yeah! Go Palm!

I've been a palm guy off and on since the beginning and I can't wait to get my hands on one. It's about time they reinvented themselves. Palm OS 5 was getting very ugly, very slow, and very old.

I'm glad it has a physical keyboard. Honestly I don't care how much practice anyone does on a touchscreen keyboard. Nothing beats feeling the keys. Unless you can't feel anything...or don't have fingers...yeah there's really no excuse.

I don't want to start pissing fanboys off here, but I really think this thing has the iPhone beat.

I mean after all, it does have picture messaging, copy/paste, USB mass storage, A2DP stereo bluetooth, etc. Not that that's any surprise though, I mean why would any smartphone manufacturer leave such important and common features out? (ahem... Apple?) The iPhone is just proof that people will buy anything as long as it has an apple on it. *sigh* I should make a hardware/software company that has a ****ing watermelon for a logo. I'd make billions of dollars.

...and to think I almost bought an iPhone! I would be crying right now...

Time to ditch the 700p!

 

[sushi]

Wow, it's looks nice.

Agree it's the first smart phone that will give the iPhone some competition.

As for those who say it looks ugly, you obviously do not understand Palm. Palm is all about practical use. This phone definitely meets that criteria.

Sure the iPhone is nicer looking. That's Apple's approach.

Bottom line, Palm is back. Looks nice.

 

[Indy21]

LOL... Apple can't even get PUSH out the door.

When the Pre ships with all this nice hoopla, and Apple has done nothing but sit on their asses by then, goodbye iPhone.

Yea, no kidding! Apple better have something big coming up by June, ya know, with all those version 1 owners contracts ending and hoping for the next best thing, some may decide to jump ship!

I'm just interested in seeing what will happen, I mean, Steve (if he's better by then) can't just get up there and say "ok, you know all that sh*t you've been seeing in this palm whatchamacallit...well, now we got all that too..." and just copy them. They may have to go above and beyond. And I'm glad that (hopefully) this means the game is on for this summer.

Palm, you do your thang. Apple pay attention.

So....
AT&T has the iPhone (right now the reigning king)
Verizon has the Blackberry Storm (a good competitor if it's gets a much needed software update)
T-Mobile has the G1 (The most open platform, the geeky favorite)
aaaaand Sprint has the Pre (the seemingly superior phone)

This is quite the interesting battle.

Yes...yes it is my friend, and it's GREAT!

 

[powers74]

combo

The only problem I see with all these new smart phones is they don't have itunes. The iphone is a really really great phone but itunes is part of why the iphone is so great. Ad a mac to your iphone and it's a hard combination to beat.

It really is the combination that makes it so sweet. I actually just got off the phone with a friend who hates - well "doesn't understand" Apple, but is thinking about getting an iPhone based almost solely on a third party app. Every time I start telling people how great the iPhone is it always strikes me as amazing how brilliant the system is. From iTunes to iCal to Address book to Mail, it all works so beautifully together and like no other smartphone out there - despite it's shortcomings. It really is kind of neat having been using Macs for nearly ten years now to have seen the way Apple has used the resources they had to build the system they have now and the way they are able to tie it all together. The way they have grown organically yet been so structured an methodical about it is really, very impressive, and what Apple has now is an enviable business scheme which has yet to see a worthy competitor.

My sister in law has the storm. Does she listen to music on it? No. Does she use the calendar on it? No. Does it work perfectly with the contacts on her PC? No. Does she use it to surf the net? No. I used it. the UI is underthought and the "tactile feedback" is annoying, not useful. Not to mention it looks six years old. My guess is this new Palm, like the rest of their stuff these days will be DOA. That's just me.

 

[ecoons]

wow

for those who say "wow, how ugly" take a look at it next to the iPhone. About 1/3 of the way down http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/08/palm-pre-in-depth-impressions-video-and-huge-hands-on-gallery/

Also, for those saying that the screen is smaller, this IS true, but it LOOKS awesome (the rounded corners) AND you don't have to worry about a pop-up keyboard that takes up half the space. One of the best things (imo) is that it has a smaller footprint than the iPhone, and albeit a little thick, but that makes it easy to hold in the hand.

Just my 2c

 

[Indy21]

Oh and did I mention I'm absolutely stoked with all this news erupting this week!

I've been locked into T-Mobile contracts since the first iphone was released and have watched it evovle the last couple years with it's ups and downs but regardless vowed this is THE PHONE I'm after as soon as I can switch to AT&T.

Well, my contracts are UP with T-Mobile and this is just overwhelming news this week with all the talk of faster processors, confirmed timelines, newer, better, faster competitors phones coming soon.

Definately an exciting week so far and for now I am counting down the days for June to get here.

I can't wait to see what's next!

 

[ecoons]

forgot to mention that it is Sprint, which means it (at least in my case) is a much cheaper alternative to AT&T! and seems to have better service

 

[Zadillo]

With developers limited to HTML/CSS/JavaScript. how exactly will they be able to develop some of the full rich applications possible on the iPhone or Android? Certainly a number of things could be duplicated, but how would one write, say, a video player (even something like the popular Core Media player available for the old Palm OS)? How would someone develop something like the iPhone version of X-Plane, as another example?

I definitely agree the OS looks very slick, and should be very good at what it is capable of, but it seems like part of that is being accomplished by having a very limited development platform. Palm has been pretty vague on a lot of the details about exactly what options developers will have.

Aside from that, there are other questions - how will it handle media syncing? What will be the new "Palm Desktop" (considering what a mess the old Palm desktop software was), and how will it compare to iTunes?

I think to some degree we've been dazzled by the UI and slickness, but I just wonder about some of these issues.

 

[EuphAple]

Who says? and why? I find chicklet keyboards much easier to type on (and I can type 45 words per minute on my iPhone, so don't give me that "you're just not used to it crap")



BuuuuuuullSh**
Who says they're a dead end? If that were true they wouldn't be so popular in phones like the sidekick, Voyager and blackberry. Apple did not get it right, the corrective text is horrible, especially since it refused to learn words, like F***, *sh**, yo, other slang words...


What? handwriting tech has been around forever and isn't really in any devices anymore... hand writing tech is dead


Man, you looooove Steve Jobs don't you? "Apple is exactly right"
Since when is a physical keyboard "unnecessary?"


No it doesn't. It makes it more complicated. If it were practical anyone could figure it out. I hand my iPhone to someone who has little experience with it and they have no idea how to use it. I have to give a ten minute tutorial before they can type their name.

Sure, the iPhone is great for typing, "Sure, LOL. I would love to see a movie tonight! I have nothing to do other than look trendy"

Where with any other smart phone you can do more than social networking.


I'll give you that, but with the iPhone, if the touch screen dies (just one piece of the over all phone) you need to get a whole new phone. Where with any phone with a keyboard if one piece dies you're only losing that one piece and you can put off phone repairs for a while. Where with the iPhone you're screwed until you can get a whole new phone.



HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA soo.... you're making all of these assertions based on nearly ZERO experience with other phones? Niiiiiiice!



hmmmm... let's have a typing challenge between you and a power crackberry user. Who can type faster? Ahhhh right there a good blackberry user can type faster on their phone than an iPhone user.


BS! The rubbery tiny keys on smart phones are silent and provide a little physical feedback with each press. The iphone on the other hand has that stupid speacker that insists on making very loud pop noises, usually a ten at a time two seconds after you're done typing


hahaha! Yeah, because Apple got it perfect and juuuuuust right. We really need a slow laggy keyboard over a physical one. I'd say that using a physical keyboard is more like typing on... well... a keyboard on a home computer vs. using some clunky slow handwriting tablet hooked up to your PC.


Because Verizon has more coverage and better service. The very tech around CMDA has better "cell breathing" than GSM, and scales better too.

AT&T has crap coverage where I live and every time I try and use my iPhone at my house (I live in an very populated Portland suburb, definitely not the middle of no where) I am reminded of how bad AT&T is, where when I had verizon I never dropped a call.


Gah! You have no idea what you're talking about! Why did I even take the time to respond!?

Do you love your life?

 

[X38]

The problem is that with business users, they just can't use the type of "shorthand" typing you see with SMS cellphone messaging. As such, a real keyboard or its equivalent is mandatory, and that's why the Blackberry or the Palm Treo (and soon Pre) with its REAL keyboard are still so popular. That's why I do see Apple seriously looking at going to an haptic response touchscreen for its next-generation iPhone (which offers much better "feel" when typing out messages and still keeps all the advantages of the iPhone you mentioned) so the iPhone with a "beefed up" Mobile Me service can become a serious competitor against Blackberry and Palm Treo/Pre models.

I don't see how not wanting to type SMS "shorthand" style messages has anything whatsoever to do with "needing" a physical keyboard. I use my iphone for business as well as personal use all the time and send plenty of email using the virtual keyboard. Just like millions of other people. There is no reason whatsoever (other than habit) to have a physical keyboard in a handheld, pocket sized device and plenty of reasons not too.

Sorry, this Pre thing is just going to be another also-ran. Given Palm's current position, it has a few admirable traits, but is too little too late. That's if it were actually on the market now. Given that it won't actually be available until Apple and probably all the other players have yet another new generation on the market, it is hard to imagine this thing capturing significant market share. In a year or two, this announcement will probably be seen as the end of Palm.

 

[Digital Skunk]

forgot to mention that it is Sprint, which means it (at least in my case) is a much cheaper alternative to AT&T! and seems to have better service

No, it is better service. Not to mention faster 3G, insurance, unlimited text and data, or all of it for $100.

Paired with the Sprint Network, this phone may just be the best save for people's love of iTunes and its smallish screen.

For me those are still points to consider. I do hope that it has a great music player on board, or Apple gives me the option to upgrade my already purchased music to iTunes Plus.

With developers limited to HTML/CSS/JavaScript. how exactly will they be able to develop some of the full rich applications possible on the iPhone....

Like iFart?

I joke.

 

[powers74]

touch

Who says? and why? I find chicklet keyboards much easier to type on (and I can type 45 words per minute on my iPhone, so don't give me that "you're just not used to it crap")



BuuuuuuullSh**
Who says they're a dead end? If that were true they wouldn't be so popular in phones like the sidekick, Voyager and blackberry. Apple did not get it right, the corrective text is horrible, especially since it refused to learn words, like F***, *sh**, yo, other slang words...


What? handwriting tech has been around forever and isn't really in any devices anymore... hand writing tech is dead


Man, you looooove Steve Jobs don't you? "Apple is exactly right"
Since when is a physical keyboard "unnecessary?"


No it doesn't. It makes it more complicated. If it were practical anyone could figure it out. I hand my iPhone to someone who has little experience with it and they have no idea how to use it. I have to give a ten minute tutorial before they can type their name.

Sure, the iPhone is great for typing, "Sure, LOL. I would love to see a movie tonight! I have nothing to do other than look trendy"

Where with any other smart phone you can do more than social networking.


I'll give you that, but with the iPhone, if the touch screen dies (just one piece of the over all phone) you need to get a whole new phone. Where with any phone with a keyboard if one piece dies you're only losing that one piece and you can put off phone repairs for a while. Where with the iPhone you're screwed until you can get a whole new phone.



HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA soo.... you're making all of these assertions based on nearly ZERO experience with other phones? Niiiiiiice!



hmmmm... let's have a typing challenge between you and a power crackberry user. Who can type faster? Ahhhh right there a good blackberry user can type faster on their phone than an iPhone user.


BS! The rubbery tiny keys on smart phones are silent and provide a little physical feedback with each press. The iphone on the other hand has that stupid speacker that insists on making very loud pop noises, usually a ten at a time two seconds after you're done typing


hahaha! Yeah, because Apple got it perfect and juuuuuust right. We really need a slow laggy keyboard over a physical one. I'd say that using a physical keyboard is more like typing on... well... a keyboard on a home computer vs. using some clunky slow handwriting tablet hooked up to your PC.


Because Verizon has more coverage and better service. The very tech around CMDA has better "cell breathing" than GSM, and scales better too.

AT&T has crap coverage where I live and every time I try and use my iPhone at my house (I live in an very populated Portland suburb, definitely not the middle of no where) I am reminded of how bad AT&T is, where when I had verizon I never dropped a call.


Gah! You have no idea what you're talking about! Why did I even take the time to respond!?

Sooooo.... You have an iPhone because......?

 

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Do you love your life?

I love dispelling misinformation, and bringing down fanboys.

Did you make an account just to add things like that?

 

[Indy21]

Do you love your life?

Yea no joke. Hahaha, I usually just ignore post like that but.....d@mn dude. Chill the f*ck out!

 

[kobefan234]

What does wireless charging mean?

 

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Sooooo.... You have an iPhone because......?

because... I like the phone, and the OS.
Sure, I hate the keyboard (although I have gotten used to it and am a very proficient typer on it) but over all it's a joy to use. Also, it easily syncs with my .Mac account and my Mac, so it was sort of necessary.

Don't get me wrong, I love my iPhone and will be using it for at least the next two years, but I can't stand people talking about it like it's the end all best phone, just because Jobs says so.

If I see a better phone (like the Pre) I'll be one of the first to admit it.

 

[Digital Skunk]

I love dispelling misinformation, and bringing down fanboys.

Did you make an account just to add things like that?

Don't worry TLJ. I think he did.

The poster you quoted was the worst iPhone junkie I have seen in a while.

With the typical, "I don't like this product because it doesn't have ALL the things the iPhone has even though it does a lot of things better." type of post.

It seems that you have to either love the iPhone and bash everything else, or be flamed for liking something else and not the iPhone.

 

[LiveForever]

From all these threads this must have something.

I'm just glad iphone has some serious competition as apple have been resting on their laurels a bit.

I will stick with my iphone as I love it but I want them to do more and this will give them a kick.

 

[Zadillo]

No, it is better service. Not to mention faster 3G, insurance, unlimited text and data, or all of it for $100.

Paired with the Sprint Network, this phone may just be the best save for people's love of iTunes and its smallish screen.

For me those are still points to consider. I do hope that it has a great music player on board, or Apple gives me the option to upgrade my already purchased music to iTunes Plus.

Like iFart?

I joke.

Well, of course something like iFart would be easy to do on the Pre - I know you're joking, but still, I think it is a larger question. I have no doubt that a lot of sort of throwaway apps will be similarly possible. My question would be, how big of a deal will it be that the more complex apps possible on Android or the iPhone wouldn't really be possible?

Even with the old Palm OS, devs were able to develop some pretty impressive apps like TCPMP for video playback - and Android would make it pretty easy too; but not sure how one would do an app like that with the Pre.

I can't help thinking Palm is holding something back - that they will be making it possible to develop full native Pre apps just like one can with Android or the iPhone. It just seems like it will be a limiting factor otherwise.

I would still have other questions too; what will battery life be like? The multitasking is great, and the very fast processor is great - but we've seen what the iPhone 3G's battery life is like even with limiting multitasking/etc. (outside of things like having music playing in the background). And the G1 has had battery life complaints too; how will the Pre fare?

 

[Zadillo]

From all these threads this must have something.

I'm just glad iphone has some serious competition as apple have been resting on their laurels a bit.

I will stick with my iphone as I love it but I want them to do more and this will give them a kick.

I don't know that Apple specifically has a history of "resting on their laurels". By all rights, if that were true, Apple would have done that with the original "classic" iPod; they had the dominant music player, and even some fairly hefty competition didn't really do much to knock it.

If Apple were resting on their laurels, they would not have completely raised the bar with the iPhone - they would have continued making incremental improvements (imagine if the current iPod classic was still the only iPod Apple made, rather than what the iPhone and iPod touch are capable of).

The fact that we haven't seen any dramatic iPhone developments publicly revealed doesn't mean that Apple is just resting on its laurels, but simply that it is being as secretive as always.