While I want to love Palm, this is all so similar to Opera constantly moaning and whining about their nonexistent market share. If they invested all that time they spent whining into say, iduno, marketing maybe? - who knows, maybe they would have more then 0.5% market share.
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Palm Reports Apple to USB Compliance Organization Over iTunes Syncing Issues
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Then how did itunes recognize the Pre as an ipod and why is it now recognizing the Pre as being made by Apple?
Easy. Just make the Pre look like an iPhone. No hacking of iTunes needed, as iTunes thinks its talking to an iPhone and will happily chug along.
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nclarkn
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This is Palm trying to capitalize on Apple's work. Apple is the one who designed iTunes and made it what it is, and Palm is trying to edge itself in. The reason Apple only allows iPods to connect to iTunes is so that the company actually makes money. Its widely known that Apple doesn't make much from selling songs and that it relies upon the relationship between iTunes and the iPod to make the revenue it does.
Yeah but you know what? It's Apple's product. If they want to block Palm, it's within their rights to do that. Palm is an unauthorized device.
Apple is going to win this game. Palm needs to recognize that now rather than later or else they are going to blow a bunch of money on this.
Palm should be spending that money on a product that actually competes with iTunes, or team up with a different company to provide the same types of services. Create a REAL product rather than piggybacking off someone else's without permission.
I have a Pre and appreciate Palm going out of their way to maintain iTunes operability...since I had iPods and iPhone 2g AND 3G prior to this I'm used to managing my media in iTunes for years now. Being able to plug in the Pre and continue to use iTunes is a huge plus.
My guess is Palm is trying to bait Apple into this debate/battle since it can easily lead into anti-trust/monopoly law suits against Apple for not allowing 3rd party devices to sync with iTunes and the content that YOU OWN as a user.
It's no different than if Apple would only allow Apple branded USB Hard drives to work with Mac and you couldn't use Seagate or Western Digital, etc. Then people would be bitching, I don't see this being any different.
Watch out Apple...it's a slippery slope.
My guess is Palm is trying to bait Apple into this debate/battle since it can easily lead into anti-trust/monopoly law suits against Apple for not allowing 3rd party devices to sync with iTunes and the content that YOU OWN as a user.
It's no different than if Apple would only allow Apple branded USB Hard drives to work with Mac and you couldn't use Seagate or Western Digital, etc. Then people would be bitching, I don't see this being any different.
Watch out Apple...it's a slippery slope.
wow...
i used to have respect for Palm and thought they had some great products. this borders on being pathetic. besides the fact that the Pre is on Sprint (a MAJOR drawback for me), Palm's new lack of dignity has totally turned me off to the idea of getting a Pre.
i used to have respect for Palm and thought they had some great products. this borders on being pathetic. besides the fact that the Pre is on Sprint (a MAJOR drawback for me), Palm's new lack of dignity has totally turned me off to the idea of getting a Pre.
Yep.So you hack itunes to pretend you're and ipod and then report Apple? The audacity of these folks.
Exactly.
It has in my eyes. I was a longtime Palm user, and was recommending the Pre to a lot of people who didn't want/couldn't get/weren't good candidates for the iPhone. No longer. I have lost a lot of respect for them. If they had used the iTunes info the way all other devices are allowed, or gotten permission from Apple, I would have been happy for both companies, but not only to spoof iTunes the first time, but to redo it after Apple expressly cut out their entryway is bad form, and bad business. I'm really disappointed in them.
Instant Karma for not allowing Fire Wire Cables to Work
Frankly, I agree with people's opinions that Apple should be confident in their product. They should let Palm Pre have access. Growing up with Apple Computer in the last 20 years I was so frustrated by how Microsoft/Windows developers would close things down to apple computers. iTunes should be left open. I think its victory enough that most Windows users use iTunes.
This misuse of Vendor ID is instant Karma for not allowing me to use my multiple firewire-> ipod connectors to charge or exchange data on my iphone 3GS.
Frankly, I agree with people's opinions that Apple should be confident in their product. They should let Palm Pre have access. Growing up with Apple Computer in the last 20 years I was so frustrated by how Microsoft/Windows developers would close things down to apple computers. iTunes should be left open. I think its victory enough that most Windows users use iTunes.
This misuse of Vendor ID is instant Karma for not allowing me to use my multiple firewire-> ipod connectors to charge or exchange data on my iphone 3GS.
The only reason they are doing this is for their names to be in the news, companies in desperate situations do desperate things.
iTunes and iPod/iPhone syncing is a proprietary closed-system. Apple does not have to open it up to anyone. iTunes is software made to control a specific device. Just like cellphones and blackberries have software that is used only for the specific device it was made for.
With that said, I like watching this go back and forth. It keeps it interesting.
With that said, I like watching this go back and forth. It keeps it interesting.
Heh, Palm is just trying to muddy the waters here.
They are the ones violating the terms of their agreement with the USB organization.
I do hope there's some kind of resolution that lets the Pre, and other devices, sync with iTunes. Today, I like iTunes and I have an iPhone. But I don't like being locked in. At some point I'll probably want to use a different brand of phone with iTunes.
They are the ones violating the terms of their agreement with the USB organization.
I do hope there's some kind of resolution that lets the Pre, and other devices, sync with iTunes. Today, I like iTunes and I have an iPhone. But I don't like being locked in. At some point I'll probably want to use a different brand of phone with iTunes.
This is not misuse of the Vendor ID.
iTunes/iPod is the exact same thing as Motorola software working on Motorola phones only.
iTunes/iPod is the exact same thing as Motorola software working on Motorola phones only.
I agree they are baiting Apple, they didn't seem to make any bones about their own violation of the USB spec. I don't see the problem with Apple not allowing a Palm device to sync with iTunes though.
If I own a song I bought and subsequently downloaded from the iTunes store, how does that translate into "I loaded it on my Palm and now Apple is obligated to let me connect to iTunes with this unsupported device". I'm not seeing the connection I guess.
They may OWN the content, that doesn't mean Apple is legally obligated to let them sync with iTunes does it?
OK, based on what I'm reading here:
If I was part of the USB Compliance Organization I'd probably call Palm on my iPhone, tell them what they are doing is explicitly in violation of the license they signed and unless they stop, we'd pull their USB license altogether and that I'd get back to them on the more gray area Apple's refusal to allow open access to iTunes via USB meanwhile letting them run out of cash before calling them back.
- Palm is DEFINTIELY in the wrong by spoofing Apple's ID - something Apple applied and paid for fair and square
- Apple MAY BE in the wrong by not complying with the spirit of USB interoperability
If I was part of the USB Compliance Organization I'd probably call Palm on my iPhone, tell them what they are doing is explicitly in violation of the license they signed and unless they stop, we'd pull their USB license altogether and that I'd get back to them on the more gray area Apple's refusal to allow open access to iTunes via USB meanwhile letting them run out of cash before calling them back.
Frankly, I agree with people's opinions that Apple should be confident in their product. They should let Palm Pre have access. Growing up with Apple Computer in the last 20 years I was so frustrated by how Microsoft/Windows developers would close things down to apple computers. iTunes should be left open. I think its victory enough that most Windows users use iTunes.
This misuse of Vendor ID is instant Karma for not allowing me to use my multiple firewire-> ipod connectors to charge or exchange data on my iphone 3GS.
I think you guys are missing the point here....
The question isn't what Apple SHOULD do with their products (in terms of opening them up, etc). The question should be "Is Palm going about this the appropriate way?"
Just because a company (i.e. Apple) doesn't do something the way you want is irrelevant. You have to take what products they have, and how they work, at face value and LEGITIMATELY find a way to work with them. If you can't (because Apple is stubborn, monopoly, etc) then you need to come up with a different business plan or sue.
This back and forth cat and mouse game by Palm is not a business plan. It's more like a 15 year old kid going "damn, I can't get in that way, let's try this" when trying to hack AOL in 1994.
Why does everyone here seem to have a problem with other devices being able to sync with iTunes to move content that WE the CONSUMER have purchased from Apple? I don't really consider what Palm has done here to be hacking. iTunes was created by Apple to be a content manager/sales portal of digital content. Maybe I'm missing something here but I would think Apple would greatly benefit from selling content for use on other devices. It's unreasonable to expect everyone in the world to use an Apple device so they might as well make money off them with content.
Truth be told, I doubt Apple has an issue with it as well, I think the underlying issue is that the Palm Pre has been developed by former Apple people. So this is probably just a case of grown-ups acting like children with the consumers getting screwed while they feud. For the record, I'm not a Palm user, I own the iPhone 3G plus 3 iPods and many Mac machines.
Truth be told, I doubt Apple has an issue with it as well, I think the underlying issue is that the Palm Pre has been developed by former Apple people. So this is probably just a case of grown-ups acting like children with the consumers getting screwed while they feud. For the record, I'm not a Palm user, I own the iPhone 3G plus 3 iPods and many Mac machines.
So... Apple is at fault for Palm's ripping off Apples Vendor ID and using it against the rules? A bit of the pot calling the kettle black.
Sounds like it is PALM that will be getting the smack down soon, not Apple.
Sounds like it is PALM that will be getting the smack down soon, not Apple.
How is it a monopoly? Is iTunes the ONLY place you can buy your music? Is iTunes the ONLY media center software for PCs? Does that mean the Zune software should start syncing with the iPhone too? I have a Nintendo Wii, why can't I play my Wii games on my Mac? I guess Nintendo is a monopoly, right?
It's not like there aren't other phones out there that seem to do just fine. How about Blackberrys? They sync just fine without having to go through iTunes. Having a hack that makes the Pre look like an iPhone is just pure laziness, plain and simple. If they're too lazy to create their own sync software then I don't see the Pre sticking around for the long haul.
They ripped off Apple's vendor ID making the computer think the Palm Pre was an iPhone. How is this not hacking?