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How the hell is an 11 year old getting to the store to buy a gift card? Driving? :rolleyes:

I don't know about where you live, but where I live we have this thing called public transportation. We have shuttles, buses, subways. They'll take you right to the mall.

Also where I live every single grocery and convenience store has racks of gift cards for sale, including those from Apple. Now, again, I don't know your circumstances, but when I was a kid I'd sometimes have to go grocery shopping with my mom. It was boring so I'd ask if I could go to the magazine section. Of course, I did so via the candy aisle, picked up a bar, and bought it. I'd think a kid could do the same with an Apple gift card. No?
 
Maybe it should set it self as the champion of grumbling wankers?
There certainly seems to be a lot of them.

But even if ALL men were pro booby apps - the other half of the population would still find them an immature waste of time, effort and developer skill.

I ask again - how many people would you let play on your iPad if you knew there were dozens of apps where wouldn't say "Hey Mom - check THIS out!"?

Do you invite our mother or your boss into your bedroom to show them the latest move you and your girlfriend/wife just discovered? There are all kinds of things I do that neither my mother or my boss need to know about (but they both probably do them:rolleyes:)
 
Fine.

Just have a completely walled-off Adult section... where none of the apps can be in main lists. Then developers are happy, 99.9% of iPhone users (who are adults) can have freedom of choice, and the kids -- by god the kids are protected from the horrors of boobies!
 
Hi Phil,

Why didn't you just sort your ratings and categories out?
Surely part of your silly approval process is to check and enforce correct ratings?
You still could have made your 'save the children' marketing rant just by hiding all (all?) the adult/offensive/whatever content by default, had a little tickbox, and everyone would have been happy.
 
It seems everyone is forgetting that the developers actually went to the effort to code an application, get it approved, and made plans for other applications. Now Apple comes along and yanks your whole revenue stream out from under them.

Of course R&D is a risk that every product developer takes, not just iPhone apps. Then they have to find a distributor that will accept the product. Then if the product makes it to the store there is no guarantee that the store will keep it on the shelf for 5 days. That is the retail world.
 
Fine.

Just have a completely walled-off Adult section... where none of the apps can be in main lists. Then developers are happy, 99.9% of iPhone users (who are adults) can have freedom of choice, and the kids -- by god the kids are protected from the horrors of boobies!

Rather pointless since the target for these apps is 12 year olds.
 
Which would be perfectly fine if the App Store wasn't the sole source of purchasing and installing applications.

Because of this inherent monopolistic system, this behavior will NOT stand for very long, particularly if Apple obtains a dominant marketshare of the smartphone and/or tablet market.

This censorship and blocking of access to desired applications and/or content because of some vocal minority's complaints is bad enough.... Using their monopoly power to block competitors products from reaching the consumer market (ala Google Voice, Firefox, Windows Live sync, RSS Podcast apps etc) is likely illegal.

Although I love the iPhone 3GS and appreciate Apple's long history of innovation, this nanny-state authoritarian crap has to go, and I hope the FTC breaks up the App Store monopoly.

Reminds me of the "but we're not going to sit here and listen to you badmouth the United States of America!" speech from Animal House (and makes about as much sense).
 
The day they begin to poison OSX with this crap (App Store for OSX would be the start), I start a project to migrate my home / office workstation infrastructure from Apples back to Windows or Linux.

Jobs is absolute control freak who will, eventually, limit the ability of apple to expand. Sure, now market share is all soaring but the reason is much more in competitors weakness, not the apple's strength.

Game is changing with Android maturing and Windows 7 out of the door.

Jobs better watch out.

I would disagree... jobs knows how to capture a product and make it appealing to the everyday user. The people that come on these boards and complain about the closed architecture of the iPhone and its App Store are a very small minority of apple consumers. The majority of consumers don't even realize they have the option to jailbreak, or that the app store is limited in the apps that are allowed in. All these people see is a "must have" device that is simple and easy enough for just about anyone to pick up, and they see that there are hundreds of thousands of apps that they can download to help them do things they never thought of as possible on an iphone.

This is why many people often look at apple as "innovators" or "the first" but that is often not the case. Apple is just usually the first to come out with and market to the masses. Even though app stores have existed on phones before none were able to do what apple did.

I think that apple is starting to realize that computers and applications have advanced much too quickly for your average consumer. Sure gadget and tech enthusiasts have no problems following the latest and greatest, but your average joe has no idea what a megapixel does, differences between hd tv sets, how to properly spec out a computer for their needs, etc.

Apple knows that this market exists. These people arent looking at the iphone spec sheet and comparing bullet points, instead they are easily swayed by what is "in" and the media. Apple has managed to make their product (iPhone) so easy to use for masses and made it a "must have" item. Now your average consumer isn't going to be upset about the lack of tethering, or backgrounding, or what have you because they are still so mesmerized by this big touch screen and all of these crazy apps that they CAN have. You need to realize that most consumers who buy these products are not looking at how they can't do this or that or this, instead they are looking at oh wow, i can check this on my phone now? neat! Oh hey, i can finally do that from my phone... check this at, all that my phone CAN DO!

This is why, even though i do agree, the ipad is heavily crippled, it will still be a success. Tons of people already want the thing, and a million teens are gonna start asking for early xmas gifts when they see all their friends with ipads at starbucks. Apple is making a product that is very simple and easy to use. How many other platforms can you install a program with one button click? Want to remove it, hold and click one button. They made it very simple and natural to use rather than having to dig through clunky interfaces and multiple menus to get to the info you want. I think that we will start to see a lot more of this model in the desktop space. I don't think it will be as closed as the iphone, nor the only option to d/l apps on a mac, but i think apple will certainly release some type of desktop app store. An easy place for customers to find programs, and they can buy and install with one simple click. This ease of use is what is going to help apple gain a ton of market share. How many people get confused and screw up their computers because they end up downloading a bunch of spyware, don't know how to install things, can't connect to a network, etc. By dumbing down their products apple is able to appeal to all of these consumers because they are more worried about not having to deal with a machine that is freezing all the time than not having copy and paste....

Apple is successful because they are able to appeal to a wide audience, and they do it very well. This new app store model has really taken off, apple would be dumb not to try this in a desktop space. Sure people on here and other tech sites will rant about how horrible it is, too locked down, i can't do this, blah blah blah.... but 90% of the rest of america is going to say oh ****, computing that i understand and can use... sign me up!
 
I don't know about where you live, but where I live we have this thing called public transportation. We have shuttles, buses, subways. They'll take you right to the mall.

Also where I live every single grocery and convenience store has racks of gift cards for sale, including those from Apple. Now, again, I don't know your circumstances, but when I was a kid I'd sometimes have to go grocery shopping with my mom. It was boring so I'd ask if I could go to the magazine section. Of course, I did so via the candy aisle, picked up a bar, and bought it. I'd think a kid could do the same with an Apple gift card. No?

If your 11 year old is hopping on a subway and going to a mall by themselves, and you're not even checking to see what they bought with their money (which you likely gave them as they don't have a job) then you're a terrible parent and your kid seeing some fully clothed boobs on their iPhone is the least of their troubles.
 
Apple once again is alienating the developer community.

I'm sorry but Apple is in the wrong here, and these apps shouldn't have been pulled, and yes this is censorship that we shouldn't be okay with, even if we don't want these apps personally.

These apps should be allowed on the store, but only visible if you have parental controls switched off.
 
I, as a parent, control what my son does...I don’t leave it up to Apple. Apple does not need to “parent” me.

I'm a parent of three kids under 10, and I don't leave it up to Apple either, but I do welcome help in controlling their access to things that are age inappropriate. When they added parental controls to the iPod Touch it instantly guaranteed three sales for us. I set up our firewall to allow access for only the apps I want them to use.

If people have been complaining that the current rating/parental control system wasn't working well enough, then Apple felt they had to do something else.

My personal preference would be creating an adult section of the app store and making sure the age ratings worked 100% of the time.

Apple can see the sales metrics on iPods/iPhones and apps. When you first connect a new iPod to iTunes, it asks for data on the user. I'm sure there are a large number of them being used by kids under 10 and Apple wants parents to feel as comfortable as possible about their kids using the device. From a business perspective, that's far more important than any availability of sexually oriented apps.
 
Think about it. This would make it more likely to be a success since Apple is demonstrating to Schools they are willing to control the content to meet a specific set of standards.


And aapl's not even controlling content--just the apps which are built on aapl's sdk and sold on its app store.
 
I can not beleive you purchased the iPhone for applications that have been removed. I would bet by your presence here, that you have had an iPhone since before they had applications for the phone.

The App Store is a little over a year old, these are the growing pains that will happen.

Yep, bought the 3g and 3gs day one.

Doesn’t change the fact that apps that were available to people that just purchased iPhone’s (that I don’t need, don’t want, and would never purchase) are gone. Not everyone can decide to go elsewhere without some big financial penalties in hardware and contracts. I just get tired of hearing People say over and over that here are choices when people are tied into contacts and have made investment in hardware.

But once again I don’t care about these particular apps…I care abut what Apples actions say about what may happen in the future. What happens when any app supporting MS is pulled…or any app related to streaming music?
 
Apple once again is alienating the developer community.

I'm sorry but Apple is in the wrong here, and these apps shouldn't have been pulled, and yes this is censorship that we shouldn't be okay with, even if we don't want these apps personally.

These apps should be allowed on the store, but only visible if you have parental controls switched off.

says who? No law that says apple has to allow porn in THEIR store. There are many places around that do not sell porn, doesn't make it a bad business decision. You don't complain when you don't see backdoor sluts 9 at your local grocery store, why would you when it's not on the app store. If you want porn on your iphone there are plenty of ways to get it. Apple is fully allowed to dictate what is and is not sold in their store, just like if you owned a gas station you could decide to carry one brand of chips over the other, you could stock porn mags, or you could not.
 
Apple once again is alienating the developer community.

I'm sorry but Apple is in the wrong here, and these apps shouldn't have been pulled, and yes this is censorship that we shouldn't be okay with, even if we don't want these apps personally.

These apps should be allowed on the store, but only visible if you have parental controls switched off.


Wrong. Actually, the developer community welcomes the elimination of the crap apps. And it's not censorship. It's just deciding how you allow your sdk to be used and what you will sell on your app store. If you want something more, jailbreak it.
 
I bet there is one app that he will not be banning any time soon.... cookbook apps.

Oh, and if women don't like them, don't look or buy them. I don't use the apps myself, but if I want too, provided the images don't have under-age children, then its my privilege. Too bad you are offended, if you are, don't look.

What if it is a Cookbook with a recipe from Argentina for Fried Bull Testicles?
Could be offensive to men? :apple:
 
If your 11 year old is hopping on a subway and going to a mall by themselves, and you're not even checking to see what they bought with their money (which you likely gave them as they don't have a job) then you're a terrible parent and your kid seeing some fully clothed boobs on their iPhone is the least of their troubles.


Personally no kids yet, sorry. But when I was a kid (12-15) I took the subway w/ friends all the time. My parents did not act like the gestapo and ask if I bought anything when I came back. I regard them as great parents, and I don't think I turned out so bad myself.

But back to the point I was making in my last post... you said how would it be possible for a kid to get to the store to buy a gift card. I just told you. It's not that difficult.
 
Apple's Store. Apple's choice of what to allow in the store. Just like Walmart or any other store.
If you don't like it, don't buy an iPhone.
No... if you don't like the fact that Wal-Mart doesn't carry the cereal you want, or if Joe's Grocery doesn't stock kosher products or if McDonald's doesn't have anything on the menu that a vegetarian could eat, you talk to the owner. "Don't buy an iPhone" is just as simple-minded as "If you don't like what the president is doing, move to Canada". Taking your business elsewhere should be the last resort, not the first.

My concern about this is less as a consumer than as a producer. No, I'm not a developer of boob-wiggling apps; I'm a cartoonist. Yeah, yeah, I heard Schiller say that the people who create content for their products aren't their first priority; the people who buy them are. I get it. But that content helps to drive those sales.

The comics industry has been longing for something like the iPad. Comics creators are producing material that people seem to really enjoy reading. But between the costs of publishing, and limited distribution channels, it's hard to find an audience and stay in business. The web is a partial solution, but lots of people don't like to read sitting at a computer. A device like the iPad, with a retail system like iTunes that would enable readers to easily buy comics and support their favorite creators, and enable those creators to get paid for their work... it's just what the doctor ordered.

But comics aren't just for kids. Look at a book like Watchmen, which sold hugely last year. Complete with Dr. Manhattan's penis. Now, Apple would probably give Watchmen a pass, since it's an acclaimed book by a major writer. But what about when it was new? What about "the next Watchmen"?

Back during the McCarthy era, the comics industry was confronted by angry parents upset that some of the books being published weren't suitable for children. The "Comics Code" was set up, which limited the range of comics that could be distributed through the stores where people commonly bought them. Because kids shopped there. "You can still get what you want other places," older readers were told. But people didn't want to go to head shops and mail order to get comics with a little nudity or swearing or adult themes. Those books stopped being published. It took a couple decades before publishers were willing to defy the Code and resume publishing comics for people who'd outgrown childish jokes and slugfests.

Apple isn't just a software and music distributor anymore. They're becoming a movie and book distributor. With all due respect to musicians, that's a bigger cultural responsibility. Apple is under no legal obligation to carry anything, of course. But if they chose to apply the equivalent of the Comics Code to the iPad, to keep the entire system suitable for children, they'll be making it less suitable for adults. Furthermore, they'll be doing a disservice to the publishing industry, which wants to embrace the iPad, but fears that they'll be putting a lot of effort into a system that restricts them from selling the material they believe their customers would enjoy reading.

Prose publishers have more alternatives; the Kindle and Nook work well enough for most of their books. Comics publishers want color, a more hands-on interface, etc. The iPad is IT.

Or it would have been, if not for Apple giving in to the chorus of "think of the children", the rallying cry that nearly killed the comics industry a few decades ago (and a host of other evils). I'm now hearing comics creators using the phrase "it would've been" about the iPad. They're giving up on it, looking elsewhere, for a reader and distribution system that gives them the freedom to give their customers what they want.

Isn't that how a free press in a free market is supposed to work? Why doesn't Apple want to be part of it?
 
I would disagree... jobs knows how to capture a product and make it appealing to the everyday user. The people that come on these boards and complain about the closed architecture of the iPhone and its App Store are a very small minority of apple consumers. The majority of consumers don't even realize they have the option to jailbreak, or that the app store is limited in the apps that are allowed in. All these people see is a "must have" device that is simple and easy enough for just about anyone to pick up, and they see that there are hundreds of thousands of apps that they can download to help them do things they never thought of as possible on an iphone.

This is why many people often look at apple as "innovators" or "the first" but that is often not the case. Apple is just usually the first to come out with and market to the masses. Even though app stores have existed on phones before none were able to do what apple did.

I think that apple is starting to realize that computers and applications have advanced much too quickly for your average consumer. Sure gadget and tech enthusiasts have no problems following the latest and greatest, but your average joe has no idea what a megapixel does, differences between hd tv sets, how to properly spec out a computer for their needs, etc.

Apple knows that this market exists. These people arent looking at the iphone spec sheet and comparing bullet points, instead they are easily swayed by what is "in" and the media. Apple has managed to make their product (iPhone) so easy to use for masses and made it a "must have" item. Now your average consumer isn't going to be upset about the lack of tethering, or backgrounding, or what have you because they are still so mesmerized by this big touch screen and all of these crazy apps that they CAN have. You need to realize that most consumers who buy these products are not looking at how they can't do this or that or this, instead they are looking at oh wow, i can check this on my phone now? neat! Oh hey, i can finally do that from my phone... check this at, all that my phone CAN DO!

This is why, even though i do agree, the ipad is heavily crippled, it will still be a success. Tons of people already want the thing, and a million teens are gonna start asking for early xmas gifts when they see all their friends with ipads at starbucks. Apple is making a product that is very simple and easy to use. How many other platforms can you install a program with one button click? Want to remove it, hold and click one button. They made it very simple and natural to use rather than having to dig through clunky interfaces and multiple menus to get to the info you want. I think that we will start to see a lot more of this model in the desktop space. I don't think it will be as closed as the iphone, nor the only option to d/l apps on a mac, but i think apple will certainly release some type of desktop app store. An easy place for customers to find programs, and they can buy and install with one simple click. This ease of use is what is going to help apple gain a ton of market share. How many people get confused and screw up their computers because they end up downloading a bunch of spyware, don't know how to install things, can't connect to a network, etc. By dumbing down their products apple is able to appeal to all of these consumers because they are more worried about not having to deal with a machine that is freezing all the time than not having copy and paste....

Apple is successful because they are able to appeal to a wide audience, and they do it very well. This new app store model has really taken off, apple would be dumb not to try this in a desktop space. Sure people on here and other tech sites will rant about how horrible it is, too locked down, i can't do this, blah blah blah.... but 90% of the rest of america is going to say oh ****, computing that i understand and can use... sign me up!

Beautiful. I want to disagree sooo much, but cant. :apple:
 
Of course R&D is a risk that every product developer takes, not just iPhone apps. Then they have to find a distributor that will accept the product. Then if the product makes it to the store there is no guarantee that the store will keep it on the shelf for 5 days. That is the retail world.

We are talking about software/ You can publish your app to websites such as MacUpdate and VersionTracker. Say, if for some reason MacUpdate rejects your app ( highly unlikely!) then you can find another website that will.

Now this is where iPhones differ - if Apple reject, then your stuffed. All that investment wasted. There is no alternative ( I'll ignore jail breaking, because its unofficial).
 
Double Standard

The iPad is expected to be popular amongst families and schools which could object to such applications.

So reading between the lines: If schools object to the devices (which are showing the apps), schools will ban the devices (like many schools already do for things like cell phones, Playboy mags, toys, guns, etc) and Apple won't sell any iPads.

Apple has a point about the above fear...but rather than wake up to the reality that 8year old kids won't be buying the iPad, Apple would rather ban all the "dirty" apps instead of putting an Adult button on the device or something similar.

So since Apple is banning most nudy material, what about the movies and tv shows like Seinfeld, Friends, Desperate Housewives, The Bachelor, and Family Guy (all which are on iTunes!!!) that have any sexual references, dirty words, "inappropriate" content? And the Playboy app still lives on? What about the NY Times occasional news articles about sex? Yea, like that will ever be banned. What about science and biology books/magazines that dare talk about reproductive organs?

Apple has a double standard here...on many levels.

-Eric

p.s. and yes, back in the day friends brought in dirty mags in high school...and when they got caught, you think the parents/school blamed the backpack manufacturer?! No, they blamed the 16year old for stealing/buying the magazine in the first place. The blame was on the PERSON DOING THE WRONG...so different from our society since 1990 when everyone has to blame someone else or a company.
 
What if it is a Cookbook with a recipe from Argentina for Fried Bull Testicles?
Could be offensive to men? :apple:

I think the appropriate response to that would be "bollocks" ;).

Anyway, stuff you Apple with your bare-faced hypocrisy. My iphone is going onto ebay. A Nexus One will make for a superior user experience.
 
Oh, and if women don't like them, don't look or buy them. I don't use the apps myself, but if I want too, provided the images don't have under-age children, then its my privilege. Too bad you are offended, if you are, don't look.

This is not about "just looking". Some of the developers were spamming the store with apps that have nothing but two or 3 photos of bikinis. And by spamming I mean rendering the newly released apps list in EVERY category useless. These guys were submitting these apps to even categories like social networking and references. They essentially took over a big part of the app store. Hotix studios were releasing 12 apps a day. Not a month or a week. A day.
 
To all you people who cry that this is not censorship... or a monopoly on the app store let me paint a bigger picture.

Smartphone Industry is like the the USA= USASP(United States of American Smart Phones) LOL...

In the "USASP" we have 6 states... Andriod, Iphone OS, Windows Mobile, Blackberry OS, Symbian OS, Maemo..

Andriod, Windows Mobile, Blackberry OS, Symbian, Maemo have multiple locations to buy "apps" or stuff(internet/store).... just like in real life... if a store does sell what I want I can go to another store IN MY STATE....

Iphone OS only allows me to go to one store in that state and that store banned stuff from me that I want without any reason...

I cant move because its hard to move to another state because of my contracts, investments, etc....

IF THIS scenrio happened in real life, would it be censorship? would it be fair?
This is exactly why people are complaining on this site, it starts here at "porn" like apps.. or "duplicating like functionality" but where does it end??
 
So reading between the lines: If schools object to the devices (which are showing the apps), schools will ban the devices (like many schools already do for things like cell phones, Playboy mags, toys, guns, etc) and Apple won't sell any iPads.

Apple has a point about the above fear...but rather than wake up to the reality that 8year old kids won't be buying the iPad, Apple would rather ban all the "dirty" apps instead of putting an Adult button on the device or something similar.

So since Apple is banning most nudy material, what about the movies and tv shows like Seinfeld, Friends, Desperate Housewives, The Bachelor, and Family Guy (all which are on iTunes!!!) that have any sexual references, dirty words, "inappropriate" content? And the Playboy app still lives on? What about the NY Times occasional news articles about sex? Yea, like that will ever be banned. What about science and biology books/magazines that dare talk about reproductive organs?

Apple has a double standard here...on many levels.

-Eric

p.s. and yes, back in the day friends brought in dirty mags in high school...and when they got caught, you think the parents/school blamed the backpack manufacturer?! No, they blamed the 16year old for stealing/buying the magazine in the first place. The blame was on the PERSON DOING THE WRONG...so different from our society since 1990 when everyone has to blame someone else or a company.


Wake up. It's not about banning content which is accessible on safari. And it's not about banning devices coming into schools. It is about cutting deals with schools for massive sales, and not having aapl's apps being intended for purposes with which aapl doesn't want to be associated.
 
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