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As a matter of fact... yes.

I mean, after all, all the Blu Ray players out there also read CDs (30+ years old) and CD-Rs (20+ years old). Nearly any company serious about archiving for the long term has been using archival optical media. I can pretty much guarantee there will be Blu-Ray compatible drives 20, 30, maybe even 50 years from now.

*You* can "pretty much" guarantee it? Ok good. Great. If I have issues in the next half-century finding a Blu-Ray compatible drive that will work with a then-modern computer, I should come find *you* and you'll take care of it? I should only have 3-4 exabytes of data for you to recover by then.

Let me give you a few exercises so you can demonstrate the quality of your 'guarantee'.
  1. Find me a cassette drive so that I can pull some software for an Apple II from it.
  2. Find me a working 8" floppy drive that I can plug into my system.
  3. Find me a punch-card reader that will interface with a Windows 8 laptop.
  4. Now find me some software that will run on my computer (under either OS X 10.8 or Windows 7, your choice) that will allow me to read and recover the data I have stored in a Microsoft Works word processor file from 1993.

These are the issues with what most people think of as 'long-term' archives. Changes to undocumented formats, changes to hardware so profound that you've got to chain 3 or more adapters in order to allow you to plug it in, and that doesn't even guarantee it'll actually do the job at that point. And I'm not even talking about spans of time as long as the life-spans claimed by 'archival quality' optical media today. (Most notably because we weren't using electronic, or even electromechanical, computers yet that long ago.)

The fact of the matter is you *can't* guarantee it. You can't even guarantee that the 'archival quality' disc will last more than a decade. In practice, many 'archival quality' CD-Rs, with manufacturer estimated life spans of 50+ years, failed inside of 10 years despite being stored according to the manufacturer's recommendations. Burnable DVDs are a bit better, but still have the same root issue. Why? Because those life spans are estimated (based on standard tests, yes, but those test give numbers that cannot be verified, because even *pressed* CDs haven't been around long verify a life-span that long). Even 'archival quality' discs commonly have an *unburned* shelf-life of 5-10 years, even the *best* 'archival quality' discs have dyes which will degrade in less than a month of exposure to sunlight.

No, you can't guarantee that *any* individual instance of media will last as long as its manufacturer claims, but no optical media labeled 'archival quality' by it's manufacturer has lived up to those claims in practice yet. (As you said, CD-Rs, one of the earliest wide-spread writable optical formats, are less than 30 years old, and the manufacturers claim terms longer than that for their life spans, though quite a large number of those discs have since failed.) Pressed discs, I'd give decent odds on that front, but pressed discs aren't used or archives. They're used for mass reproduction of the same data on thousands or millions of blanks.

Even with proper storage, the National Archives site recommends that you test your optical archive media "at least every two years to assure your records are still readable", presumably so you can catch the 'bit-rot' in the dyes before it exceeds the capabilities of the format's error correction measures. And this is in their FAQ on how to deal with storing *Temporary Records*.

Professional archival groups are busy looking for *actual* long-term storage solutions, because none of what we have now actually fit the bill.

----------

Apple don't listen to what their customers want; they tell them what they want. In Blu-Ray's case they tell customers that they do not want quality video and should prefer their iTunes service instead.
Company profit margins do not indicate quality, they indicate good tactics.

Consistently high customer satisfaction ratings indicate that Apple *is* giving it's customers what they want. Blu-Ray still isn't consistently selling better than DVD. (In fact, it's usually *out sold* by the same tile on DVD.) Whether you agree or not, the existence of Blu-Ray on computers quite obviously isn't as big a deal to most people as it is to you.

For most people, the video quality of streaming services, such as NetFlix or YouTube has long since surpassed the 'good enough' barrier. Sure, better is nice, but it simply isn't a breaking point for the *vast* majority of people.
 
Apparently people aren't asking for optical drives or sufficient storage any longer, either . . .

Or fast graphics cards... (based on crappy Mac Mini specs and Intel 4000 everywhere). Apparently, if the iPhone and iPad are "good enough" to make Apple the most profitable company on Planet Earth, I guess they figure that Intel 4000 graphics "should be enough for everyone". :rolleyes:

The REAL reason people stop asking for those things is that Apple doesn't freaking LISTEN to their customers and so WTF is the point in asking for something like Blu-Ray freaking 8 years later? It's pretty freaking obvious after freaking EIGHT years that they AREN'T EVER going to include it. Pestering them is a waste of time. But leave it to Phil to use that as marketing BS.

Here's the chain of events:

1> People BEG for Blu-Ray support.

Apple's response? REMOVE ALL OPTICAL DRIVES and then wait a year and announce that people aren't asking about Blu-Ray anymore (yeah, kind of moot when you remove all drives and make the thing paper-thin so there's ZERO possibility of ever having ANY kind of optical drive again. :rolleyes:

2> People BEG for faster graphics so they can do 3D and gaming, etc.

Apple's response? They add support for 3rd party graphics on Mac Mini...then they take it away...then they add it back...then they take it away. Then they say how great the iPad is and that if you want to game, why don't you get Angry Birds (with all forced advertising even after you pay for it) for your iPad. That should be good enough. Then they announce to the world that people aren't interested in gaming on Macs anymore so they remove all Macs from the planet and leave everyone with iPads, the world's fore-most feminine hygiene product. :rolleyes:

3> People beg for an update to Final Cut Pro and Logic Studio

Apple's response? Final Cut X (with the "X" meaning no longer having any professional features). They then create toy versions for the iPad and Garage Band for the iPod and tell everyone how there is no market for professional audio or films anymore and that EVERYONE can be a music star by shaking their iPhone to make farting noises.... :eek:

4> People beg for a Mac Pro that makes the competition look like crap like the good old days.

Apple's response? They charge 2012 prices for a 2008-era Mac Pro that has never been updated beyond the most basic CPU bump and then announce that no one seems to want to buy the Mac Pro anymore and they quit using Final Cut Pro when X came out so they're going to eliminate it the Mac Pro some time in 2020 when the final 2008-era Mac Pro still sitting on the shelf is lost in "The Big One" (earthquake) and so they can finally take it down from their web site.


But HEY! They're making money so they must be RIGHT to do all this stuff!!!! :D
 
Blu ray quality is so much better than itunes copies. Saying that though I don't think I would want an optical drive in my mac. I would rather watch blurays on a TV and use my mac for work stuff. KISS principle applies to my mac for work ethics/aesthetics where as the clutter entertainment mindframe is applied to my TV :p Not like bluray players for TVs are expensive these days anyway.
 
Sorry for the confusion. I was not trying to point out that BR is better than DVD. I was just showing that optical media as a medium is still going strong.

Apple likes telling people what they want. Taking away ALL optical drives (something i'm sure we would all agree Apple would like to do) is saying DVD and BR is crap and iTunes is better.

PEOPLE STILL LIKE/BUY OPTICAL DISCS.

Also BR has the hurdle of convinceing granny "why is BR needed", "DVD looks ok", "Will BR blind me", "Do I need special glasses to watch BR" :)

Ok, I misunderstood. From a technical stand point, Blu-Ray is certainly better than DVD in pretty much every measurable quality. From a consumer stand-point, it seems to be getting close to the tipping point where DVDs will disappear, but it's not there yet.

People still buy optical discs because that's what they're used to. That's already changing, though. From my experience (I'm in my 30s, but I recently went back and completed my degree), 'kids' in college these days, by and large, don't think of optical media first. Their first inclination is downloads or streaming, they fall back to optical when they can't find what they're looking for that way. And face it, there's comparatively little that can't be found for download, free or otherwise, if you're determined. USB drives see more use in good, old-fashioned 'sneaker-nets' than optical media because they're smaller, faster, and frankly they hold more. (The vast majority of data, Blu-Ray movies being the exception, available on optical media is still available only on CD or DVD, and a $10 flash drive will hold 3-8 *full* DVDs worth of data.) By and large, they watch their movies on their computers, among which the laptops often still have sub-1080p displays, even at the larger sizes. When they don't they'll watch them on their TVs or smart phones. They usually don't have large TVs because they're often living in dorms or apartments, where space is a premium, and until you break the 38-inch barrier, 720p is still what you find in many affordable small sets (I was surprised just the other day to discover this is still the case). When down-scaled to 720p, the 1080p iTunes video are virtually indistinguishable from the 1080p Blu-Ray video.
 
Or fast graphics cards... (based on crappy Mac Mini specs and Intel 4000 everywhere). Apparently, if the iPhone and iPad are "good enough" to make Apple the most profitable company on Planet Earth, I guess they figure that Intel 4000 graphics "should be enough for everyone". :rolleyes:

The REAL reason people stop asking for those things is that Apple doesn't freaking LISTEN to their customers and so WTF is the point in asking for something like Blu-Ray freaking 8 years later? It's pretty freaking obvious after freaking EIGHT years that they AREN'T EVER going to include it. Pestering them is a waste of time. But leave it to Phil to use that as marketing BS.

Here's the chain of events:

1> People BEG for Blu-Ray support.

Apple's response? REMOVE ALL OPTICAL DRIVES and then wait a year and announce that people aren't asking about Blu-Ray anymore (yeah, kind of moot when you remove all drives and make the thing paper-thin so there's ZERO possibility of ever having ANY kind of optical drive again. :rolleyes:

2> People BEG for faster graphics so they can do 3D and gaming, etc.

Apple's response? They add support for 3rd party graphics on Mac Mini...then they take it away...then they add it back...then they take it away. Then they say how great the iPad is and that if you want to game, why don't you get Angry Birds (with all forced advertising even after you pay for it) for your iPad. That should be good enough. Then they announce to the world that people aren't interested in gaming on Macs anymore so they remove all Macs from the planet and leave everyone with iPads, the world's fore-most feminine hygiene product. :rolleyes:

3> People beg for an update to Final Cut Pro and Logic Studio

Apple's response? Final Cut X (with the "X" meaning no longer having any professional features). They then create toy versions for the iPad and Garage Band for the iPod and tell everyone how there is no market for professional audio or films anymore and that EVERYONE can be a music star by shaking their iPhone to make farting noises.... :eek:

4> People beg for a Mac Pro that makes the competition look like crap like the good old days.

Apple's response? They charge 2012 prices for a 2008-era Mac Pro that has never been updated beyond the most basic CPU bump and then announce that no one seems to want to buy the Mac Pro anymore and they quit using Final Cut Pro when X came out so they're going to eliminate it the Mac Pro some time in 2020 when the final 2008-era Mac Pro still sitting on the shelf is lost in "The Big One" (earthquake) and so they can finally take it down from their web site.


But HEY! They're making money so they must be RIGHT to do all this stuff!!!! :D

Bravo! Excellent post as usual.
 
I was collecting blu-rays. Have tons but I have been moving away from them because more times than not We end up renting movies online from vudu or etc and most movies i have are on netflix and I tend to be in a different room and dont grab the disc because I can watch it on netflix.

----------

Or fast graphics cards... (based on crappy Mac Mini specs and Intel 4000 everywhere). Apparently, if the iPhone and iPad are "good enough" to make Apple the most profitable company on Planet Earth, I guess they figure that Intel 4000 graphics "should be enough for everyone". :rolleyes:

The REAL reason people stop asking for those things is that Apple doesn't freaking LISTEN to their customers and so WTF is the point in asking for something like Blu-Ray freaking 8 years later? It's pretty freaking obvious after freaking EIGHT years that they AREN'T EVER going to include it. Pestering them is a waste of time. But leave it to Phil to use that as marketing BS.

Here's the chain of events:

1> People BEG for Blu-Ray support.

Apple's response? REMOVE ALL OPTICAL DRIVES and then wait a year and announce that people aren't asking about Blu-Ray anymore (yeah, kind of moot when you remove all drives and make the thing paper-thin so there's ZERO possibility of ever having ANY kind of optical drive again. :rolleyes:

2> People BEG for faster graphics so they can do 3D and gaming, etc.

Apple's response? They add support for 3rd party graphics on Mac Mini...then they take it away...then they add it back...then they take it away. Then they say how great the iPad is and that if you want to game, why don't you get Angry Birds (with all forced advertising even after you pay for it) for your iPad. That should be good enough. Then they announce to the world that people aren't interested in gaming on Macs anymore so they remove all Macs from the planet and leave everyone with iPads, the world's fore-most feminine hygiene product. :rolleyes:

3> People beg for an update to Final Cut Pro and Logic Studio

Apple's response? Final Cut X (with the "X" meaning no longer having any professional features). They then create toy versions for the iPad and Garage Band for the iPod and tell everyone how there is no market for professional audio or films anymore and that EVERYONE can be a music star by shaking their iPhone to make farting noises.... :eek:

4> People beg for a Mac Pro that makes the competition look like crap like the good old days.

Apple's response? They charge 2012 prices for a 2008-era Mac Pro that has never been updated beyond the most basic CPU bump and then announce that no one seems to want to buy the Mac Pro anymore and they quit using Final Cut Pro when X came out so they're going to eliminate it the Mac Pro some time in 2020 when the final 2008-era Mac Pro still sitting on the shelf is lost in "The Big One" (earthquake) and so they can finally take it down from their web site.


But HEY! They're making money so they must be RIGHT to do all this stuff!!!! :D

Wow after a post like this I am kinda surprised that you will still even visit a apple site.
 
You'll also understand why even Windows doesn't support Blu-Ray movie playback out of the box.

But, if you buy a Windows system with a BD drive, the license fees for BD playback are part of the add-on price for the BD drive.

Windows doesn't add the BD license cost to every Windows system - only those with BD hardware.

That's been the Windows business model, possibly since before you were born. MPEG-2 wasn't part of earlier Windows systems - only if you bought the DVD drive did you get MPEG-2.
 
Blu ray quality is so much better than itunes copies. Saying that though I don't think I would want an optical drive in my mac. I would rather watch blurays on a TV and use my mac for work stuff. KISS principle applies to my mac for work ethics/aesthetics where as the clutter entertainment mindframe is applied to my TV :p Not like bluray players for TVs are expensive these days anyway.


It's not just a matter of watching movies...It's a matter of folks wanting to put personally valuable home movies on them for long term storage...
 
A big **** you to HDCP technology

I have a blu-ray drive in my desktop but apparently my pristine condition 23" Apple Cinema display is not good enough to play a blu-ray video despite having a 1920x1200 resolution

Thankfully 1080p Video runs flawlessly on it

HDCP must die!!!
I got a box from some Chinese company that does a perfect job of removing HDCP from HDMI or DVI sources. I'm so glad it worked because my Apple TV wouldn't work on my TV because of HDCP. @#$% you, Intel, for subjecting us to this nonsense.
 
HDCP must die!!!
I got a box from some Chinese company that does a perfect job of removing HDCP from HDMI or DVI sources. I'm so glad it worked because my Apple TV wouldn't work on my TV because of HDCP. @#$% you, Intel, for subjecting us to this nonsense.

Welcome to the Pirate Club.
 
I dread the day I can't get a physical disc from the store of my favorite new film packed with special features in a nice collectable case. I prefer that over the digital downloads that are full of DRM and other crap. I realize discs have copy protection as well but at least I can easily just pick it up off a shelf and go to a friends house without any problems. I just like buying something I can hold in my hand. Until the prices on DD include ALL the features present on the typical Blu-ray release, I won't even begin to think about going that direction. The quality just isn't the same either. A 25-50GB disc with super high bit-rates just doesn't compare to a 4-5GB 1080p master from iTunes. Some might not see the difference, but I do and I prefer having the Blu-ray and likely will for a really long time.
 
and "hear" the difference

Some might not see the difference, but I do and I prefer having the Blu-ray and likely will for a really long time.

Don't forget that the BD often has an eight-channel 24-bit 96Khz discrete digital soundtrack - when the crappy Itunes download has severely compressed stereo.

"OK" video with crappy audio is a crappy movie.
 
I don't have a bluray player in my house at all. Bluray movies are overpriced and inconvenient. I much prefer netflix streaming. The image quality is sharp enough for me.

They are not inexpensive, but I do not know whether over priced is the correct term. What they most certainly are is bizarre! You buy a DVD, and you get a Movie on DVD. You buy a Blue Ray and you get the Movie on DVD, a Digital Copy Blue Ray, a Movie on DVD. It just seems so strange. Just give me a BlueRay Disc.

I bought a Sony Blue Ray, because I needed an HDMI capable DVD player for my flat panel, and use it mostly for Streaming on Amazon Prime. I do buy Blue Ray Discs, but only those that come with the Digital Copy. I load that in to iTunes Match and then put the disc away. I realize that some people can tell the difference, but Dolby Digital via digital still sounds pretty good to me and I only have a 47 inch TV.

As for my Mac, the only reason I wish it had blue ray is when I want to hack a video off the disc and on to my mobile device. Turns out I can buy an external for under $60 on Amazon and so have no need for an internal. To be honest, I cannot remember the last time I put an optical disc in my iMac or my Macbook. I move most of my files around on a 128GB USB Flash drive or on Dropbox and Google Docs. My videos and music are also stored "in the cloud."
 
Blu-ray is amazing. You are insane if you like streaming over it.

Okay you're only insane if you watch movies with TV speakers or a "sound bar." Or have grown up on over compressed HD cable and DTV. Or have a TV under 46". I'm casting quite a wide net I realize, but I recognize you need to be a real fan of film viewing for this post to matter.

The best looking streaming service I've experienced is ironically Microsoft's XBOX (Zune) rentals. They are 1080p and generally 9GB files and look nearly identical to Blu-rays. However, like ATV, they are only DD5.1 for audio. So the audio sounds harsh, compressed, and generally crappy. The image, though, is banding and motion block free. Something ATV is NOT.

YES Blu-rays are too expensive. This is why I wait and buy them used from Amazon for around $8 to $9 shipped (cheaper than buying from iTunes). For that you get a full technical quality film and extras. Plus it's already "backed-up" being in a disc format. I play them on an amazing $69 Sony player I bought at Target. It's fast, simple to use, and does many other things.

I love my ATV, don't get me wrong, it's use is great for renting movies. I also love using it for my music needs. Blu-ray is a beautiful looking and sounding format and should not be dismissed. It doesn't even have to be expensive. Just shop smart.

**Yes, some movies do look better with iTunes HD and some are only available in iTunes, in HD. This is not common though. Some Blu-rays, sadly, were given crappy transfer and inferior MPEG encoding routines. Again, not all that common.

P.S. Love this site! I had to bail on another popular Mac site due to the ridiculous ads screwing up my iPad viewing!
 
This is just Apple acting as a company. They are trying to force users to get media with itunes. Same way Sony was trying to force gamers to support bluray. None of this is about the customer.
 
Or fast graphics cards... (based on crappy Mac Mini specs and Intel 4000 everywhere). Apparently, if the iPhone and iPad are "good enough" to make Apple the most profitable company on Planet Earth, I guess they figure that Intel 4000 graphics "should be enough for everyone". :rolleyes:

The REAL reason people stop asking for those things is that Apple doesn't freaking LISTEN to their customers and so WTF is the point in asking for something like Blu-Ray freaking 8 years later? It's pretty freaking obvious after freaking EIGHT years that they AREN'T EVER going to include it. Pestering them is a waste of time. But leave it to Phil to use that as marketing BS.

Here's the chain of events:

1> People BEG for Blu-Ray support.

Apple's response? REMOVE ALL OPTICAL DRIVES and then wait a year and announce that people aren't asking about Blu-Ray anymore (yeah, kind of moot when you remove all drives and make the thing paper-thin so there's ZERO possibility of ever having ANY kind of optical drive again. :rolleyes:

2> People BEG for faster graphics so they can do 3D and gaming, etc.

Apple's response? They add support for 3rd party graphics on Mac Mini...then they take it away...then they add it back...then they take it away. Then they say how great the iPad is and that if you want to game, why don't you get Angry Birds (with all forced advertising even after you pay for it) for your iPad. That should be good enough. Then they announce to the world that people aren't interested in gaming on Macs anymore so they remove all Macs from the planet and leave everyone with iPads, the world's fore-most feminine hygiene product. :rolleyes:

3> People beg for an update to Final Cut Pro and Logic Studio

Apple's response? Final Cut X (with the "X" meaning no longer having any professional features). They then create toy versions for the iPad and Garage Band for the iPod and tell everyone how there is no market for professional audio or films anymore and that EVERYONE can be a music star by shaking their iPhone to make farting noises.... :eek:

4> People beg for a Mac Pro that makes the competition look like crap like the good old days.

Apple's response? They charge 2012 prices for a 2008-era Mac Pro that has never been updated beyond the most basic CPU bump and then announce that no one seems to want to buy the Mac Pro anymore and they quit using Final Cut Pro when X came out so they're going to eliminate it the Mac Pro some time in 2020 when the final 2008-era Mac Pro still sitting on the shelf is lost in "The Big One" (earthquake) and so they can finally take it down from their web site.


But HEY! They're making money so they must be RIGHT to do all this stuff!!!! :D

Thanks for writing my rant.

I knew that if I were to search this thread for 'Mac Pro', I'd find "...Customers who aren't asking for Phil to lie to us..."

And with the onset of bandwidth caps by the ISPs, the "future" of streaming everything to/from the Cloud will only be affordable to the Top 1%. The BoD at Apple should be required to use their products for a month with a plain old DSL connection to discover just what they've done.


-hh
 
Or fast graphics cards... (based on crappy Mac Mini specs and Intel 4000 everywhere). Apparently, if the iPhone and iPad are "good enough" to make Apple the most profitable company on Planet Earth, I guess they figure that Intel 4000 graphics "should be enough for everyone". :rolleyes:

The REAL reason people stop asking for those things is that Apple doesn't freaking LISTEN to their customers and so WTF is the point in asking for something like Blu-Ray freaking 8 years later? It's pretty freaking obvious after freaking EIGHT years that they AREN'T EVER going to include it. Pestering them is a waste of time. But leave it to Phil to use that as marketing BS.

Here's the chain of events:

1> People BEG for Blu-Ray support.

Apple's response? REMOVE ALL OPTICAL DRIVES and then wait a year and announce that people aren't asking about Blu-Ray anymore (yeah, kind of moot when you remove all drives and make the thing paper-thin so there's ZERO possibility of ever having ANY kind of optical drive again. :rolleyes:

2> People BEG for faster graphics so they can do 3D and gaming, etc.

Apple's response? They add support for 3rd party graphics on Mac Mini...then they take it away...then they add it back...then they take it away. Then they say how great the iPad is and that if you want to game, why don't you get Angry Birds (with all forced advertising even after you pay for it) for your iPad. That should be good enough. Then they announce to the world that people aren't interested in gaming on Macs anymore so they remove all Macs from the planet and leave everyone with iPads, the world's fore-most feminine hygiene product. :rolleyes:

3> People beg for an update to Final Cut Pro and Logic Studio

Apple's response? Final Cut X (with the "X" meaning no longer having any professional features). They then create toy versions for the iPad and Garage Band for the iPod and tell everyone how there is no market for professional audio or films anymore and that EVERYONE can be a music star by shaking their iPhone to make farting noises.... :eek:

4> People beg for a Mac Pro that makes the competition look like crap like the good old days.

Apple's response? They charge 2012 prices for a 2008-era Mac Pro that has never been updated beyond the most basic CPU bump and then announce that no one seems to want to buy the Mac Pro anymore and they quit using Final Cut Pro when X came out so they're going to eliminate it the Mac Pro some time in 2020 when the final 2008-era Mac Pro still sitting on the shelf is lost in "The Big One" (earthquake) and so they can finally take it down from their web site.


But HEY! They're making money so they must be RIGHT to do all this stuff!!!! :D

I think you left out Tim and Phil telling Johnny boy everything you design has to revolve around people depending completely on us be it iTunes (no more drives), custom builds for more RAM or a dead (early life span) battery (guess we are limited here also), limit what you think people would like/need (HDMI on all models) for inputs because with all that extra room now make everything thin because most people today have thin skin as well.

Oh and the reason the glare is 75% less, that's the wool over your eye's free of charge of course :p
 
This again??

We're not STILL talking about optical discs, are we? I dumped my Blu-Ray player back in 2009, soon after buying it as an early adopter. I've been saying it on here for 3 years: physical media is DEAD. Blu-Ray will NEVER have the market penetration that DVD had. When I first said that in these forums a couple of years ago, I was attacked and ridiculed. Now that the Blu-Ray industry has publicly acknowledged this fact, I don't hear the disc fans admiting they were wrong.

It's a digital, online, streaming world. There will always be hobbyists with their Blu-Ray collection right next to their Laserdisc collections reciting all the great technological specs of their discs. But the world won't be listening. We'll be watching our content over Netflix, Hulu, iTunes, etc, and living our lives free of the clutter and time-suck of those cumbersome old discs.
 
Thanks for writing my rant.

I knew that if I were to search this thread for 'Mac Pro', I'd find "...Customers who aren't asking for Phil to lie to us..."

And with the onset of bandwidth caps by the ISPs, the "future" of streaming everything to/from the Cloud will only be affordable to the Top 1%. The BoD at Apple should be required to use their products for a month with a plain old DSL connection to discover just what they've done.


-hh

The next one will be Phil saying Pro's don't ask for a Mac Pro anymore because they moved to other brands like Dell & Adobe and all that aluminum was a huge cost to manufacture for such a case that has drawers like what you put your silverware in…

I feel like I'm seeing Packard Bell back in the day with them telling everyone you can only have X amount of RAM, GPU and so on. No more moving forward, just dust off the past as the new or next gen will never know what hit them :cool:
 
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