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Phil Schiller Claims Customers Aren't Asking for Built-In Blu-Ray Anymore
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I think the combination of local hard drives and cloud even with that amount of data is about the best combination. The chance of your building burning, plus Google, Amazon, Apple (whomever your cloud supplier is) going down at the same time are extremely low. (ok if there is a Zombie Apocalypse all bets are off)
The other better option would seem to be the hard drive shuffle. The drive gets backed up at select intervals and goes to another physical location. Personally the cloud sounds better but i did do the shuffle thing for a while. BR Disks as archival seem like they would be more apt to degrade.
Which is exactly why we have Blu-ray...
Or you could just install a Blu-ray player in your computer...
Im sorry, but I'm not ready to give up physical media yet, probably not ever. Digital formats are nice for the convenience factor, but I like having the ability to let my friends or siblings borrow movies and vice versa, not to mention the massive audio and video quality boost of blu-ray over streaming or compressed video. The day movie studios start putting vouchers in my blu-rays to make it so I cant lend them out or borrow them is the day those greedy bastards become irrelevant to me, but for now I'll stick with my physical discs.
Comrade!
What are you talking about? As Apple has shown us, people like you are called consumers for a reason. We can't have you making stuff on your own. As our iPod, iPad, and now Retina MacBooks have shown, your destiny is already set as a consumer of content. You need to come to the iTunes store for all your entertainment needs. We even took away your iDisk and website access so you'll stop posting videos in your iWeb Blog. You Photo Stream should be sharing enough for you!
Not saying Apple's in the right, but there are alternatives to burning discs for friends/family.
- Encode the video to h264/High (AVC) video limited to L4.1, in a mp4 container with AAC, AC3, or DTS audio.*
- Copy the video file to flash drives.
- Hand out flash drives to friends.
- They can play it back on their PC or Mac in many video playback apps, or if they have a decent blu-ray player, can pop the flash drive into the port on the front of their player and watch them on the living room screen. Most players that support computer file formats will support AVC and these audio formats in up to 5.1 channel.
* - For more limited hardware playback devices, use h264/Main and limit to 720p and 2-channel AAC. Or for real basic, use XviD in AVI container and stereo MP3 for audio.
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Was there a single post in this thread that pointed out the following:
1. The people asking for Blu-ray playback support in OS X are not necessarily the same people who want Apple to provide built-in Blu-ray drives in their computers. They are two separate issues. I could care less about built-in Blu-ray drives. What I do care about is built-in codec and software support for Blu-ray playback. Most people in this thread are erroneously conflating the two, including Phil Schiller himself.
2. Apple optical drives suck, and always have, therefore, getting rid of them was a good thing. Anyone who knows the slightest thing about optical drives (hello, my fellow CDFreaks/MyCE!) knows that the slim style drives that Apple used in every machine except for the Mac Pro don't even remotely compare to what are often termed half-height drives, the kind that can only be installed in a full size desktop machine or a 5 1/4" external enclosure. Not only that, but they are the part that is absolutely and without a doubt the most prone to error and failure. Good riddance. If you care about optical media, then you shouldn't give a damn about Apple optical drives.
1. The people asking for Blu-ray playback support in OS X are not necessarily the same people who want Apple to provide built-in Blu-ray drives in their computers. They are two separate issues. I could care less about built-in Blu-ray drives. What I do care about is built-in codec and software support for Blu-ray playback. Most people in this thread are erroneously conflating the two, including Phil Schiller himself.
2. Apple optical drives suck, and always have, therefore, getting rid of them was a good thing. Anyone who knows the slightest thing about optical drives (hello, my fellow CDFreaks/MyCE!) knows that the slim style drives that Apple used in every machine except for the Mac Pro don't even remotely compare to what are often termed half-height drives, the kind that can only be installed in a full size desktop machine or a 5 1/4" external enclosure. Not only that, but they are the part that is absolutely and without a doubt the most prone to error and failure. Good riddance. If you care about optical media, then you shouldn't give a damn about Apple optical drives.
After thinking about how things are likely to go over the next couple years I am starting to wonder if some things are such a big deal, if movies are not involved I rarely use optical media and if they could truly add more power to the system and battery life that would be great however Apple is a little to worried about how thin something is, what could they have done by removing the optical drive on the macbooks keeping the same form factor and giving it more power in any way that is needed.
I know everyone likes lightweight systems and all, we also like to be able to do more, I doubt anyone would care if it was the same size with even more battery life.
I know everyone likes lightweight systems and all, we also like to be able to do more, I doubt anyone would care if it was the same size with even more battery life.
Bluray sales are still rising
Contrary to the belief that many hold that bluray is on the way out - Reuters just posted a report yesterday that stated that sales of high-definition Blu-ray discs climbed 13 percent from a year earlier. And that all physical media rose for third straight quarter. And that physical media still outsells downloaded content.
And, as others have said, if you have a decent setup there is no comparison between the bluray and the downloaded version.
Also, are you so sure your DRM'ed Apple downloaded purchases are future proof?
I think Apple missed the boat on this one - they could have styled the mac mini as an HTPC (now the mac mini doesn't even have discreet graphics) and they have forgotten about all the pro users - why doesn't Schiller just admit they won't ever release a Mac Pro update, too, while he is at it?
Contrary to the belief that many hold that bluray is on the way out - Reuters just posted a report yesterday that stated that sales of high-definition Blu-ray discs climbed 13 percent from a year earlier. And that all physical media rose for third straight quarter. And that physical media still outsells downloaded content.
And, as others have said, if you have a decent setup there is no comparison between the bluray and the downloaded version.
Also, are you so sure your DRM'ed Apple downloaded purchases are future proof?
I think Apple missed the boat on this one - they could have styled the mac mini as an HTPC (now the mac mini doesn't even have discreet graphics) and they have forgotten about all the pro users - why doesn't Schiller just admit they won't ever release a Mac Pro update, too, while he is at it?
However, it's nice to have a single source for both home and computer (iPad etc.) viewing. I prefer purchasing the best possible quality (that is, BD) and ripping it for my watching it on my iPads. No need to purchase the same movie twice and I do have the best quality possible.
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What I find most funny about the split within this thread is that those supporting Apple's case against Blu Ray are some of the same people whining in other threads about wanting "latest & greatest".
In other words, here we have a strong argument being made for "good enough": iTunes video quality is "good enough". iTunes audio quality is "good enough". "I" don't want best quality (picture & sound) because "good enough" is good enough for me.
But, do those people have the iPhone 5? Why isn't the iPhone 4s or 4 "good enough" for smart phone purposes? Why isn't a 2010 or 2011 Mac "good enough" for computing purposes? Why isn't the iPad 3 "good enough" for tablet purposes? iPad mini is DOA to some because it doesn't have retina (high) resolutions but BD is "the past" because iTunes is "good enough"??? There's a TON of comments over in the iPad threads whining how iPad 3 is now outdated or obsolete even though it still can do everything an iPad 4 can do.
In all of that, Apple is basically implying that we need the "latest & greatest" and thus we want it. However, in this particular topic, Apple is arguing against "latest & greatest"- instead suggesting that iTunes quality is "good enough" and some of us happily just follow our supreme leader... and offer up a ton of supporting, diversified spin to try rationalize "good enough" over "latest & greatest".
The best analogy which can be found in history right on this site is how so many here argued that 720p HD quality was "good enough" right up until Apple rolled out theTV3 with 1080p. Then, where did all those people go, because I see so few of those "720p is good enough" arguments after Apple decided to embrace the higher standard. Those people were so passionate in their "good enough" arguments right up until Apple deemed 1080p as THE new HD standard. Then, they were gone. Actually, their argument was gone (soon some of them were gushing about how much better things were at 1080p).
Obviously, I'm in the camp where maximum quality picture & sound (via BD) trumps very real benefits like max-convenience of iTunes video. Sure I have an
What I'd like to see? If Apple is so anti-BD (and they very obviously are), how about upgrading the quality of iTunes media- or at least giving us an added iTunes media option- to at least match BD in both picture & sound? How about making a digital download cost a little less than a disc purchase? How about facilitating a way to actually and fully own an all-digital purchase like we can own a disc purchase (so that I could sell it to someone else, give it away to someone else, will it to someone else, etc)? Then, it wouldn't be a 1000+ posts argument of "good enough" vs. best quality, it would be an argument of best quality + better convenience vs. same quality. Then, Apple could "win" and we could all feel good about it.
As usual, great post from you.
It's laughable how diligently Apple fanboys / zealots defend Apple's latest blatant lie here too.
Ugh, they aren't asking because we've gotten the ****ing message, had I known this issue was still on the table 6 years after Blu-ray came out, I would've told you how much I wanted Blu-ray again *******.
LOL, this. Kind of.
I think some people have lost sight of the fact that it's not black and white between iTunes download quality and full 1:1 blu-ray quality.
Watching latest "The Walking Dead" episode (1080p) on my Apple TV, the quality is ok and sound is ok too. Good content is more important than some spec on a paper sheet to me. I also have bluray player which i used to watch Avatar, so used it only once.
I have mid range AV Receiver and some mid range KEF speakers. It is certainly good enough to appreciate a HD soundtrack on a movie.
Sometimes I watch movies on my Blu-Ray player - sometimes I watch them on my 27" iMac.
I personally would appreciate not having to buy them twice to do this. At the moment if I want to watch a movie on my iMac I need to rip it first and store the rip. That means to watch this movie I have to (a) take the time to rip it and (b) find the space to store the rip.
Wouldn't it be so much more straightforward to just be able to stick the disc in my iMac and play it?
As it stands I have bought no video from iTunes and I have no intention of doing so until they offer something as good as Blu-Ray.
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If Apple started competing on content I would lap it up.
Even SD stuff tends to be overpriced and lacking in extras. If I buy a DVD it is chock full of extras. I don't always watch everything but on some I do.
I am a big Dr. Who fan and when I buy a Dr. Who DVD I watch every single extra. I can buy the DVD with the extras online for less than Apple will sell the iTunes download sans extras.
I just can't get my head around those people willing to spend more for less.
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Very valid point.
"We'll be watching" in the future, but not now. And you will still be ridiculed. Streaming services still cannot match the content selection of physical media and the quality of Blu-Ray. You will be ridiculed for at least 3 more years.
And by the way, Blu-ray is digital, not analog.
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I have always seen convinient win over quality.
1. Betamax was better than VHS but VHS had all the moveis so was convinient and cheaper.
2. See how DAT struggled though it was better then compact cassette
3. mp3/acc are poor than CD and CD is poor compared to Records but digital files are replacing the physical media. cos its convinient.
4. Youtube video quality was poor in the early days, but it became so popular, cos video always played even on 256kbps line, how convinient, now we have option to watch 1080p and even 4K if we can afford the bandwidth.
5. a digital video download and stream will always be prefered by the vast majaority as it is convinient.
BUT there will always be people that will buy DVDs and LDs and Records and Blurays. And the problem of Apple is that they makes so limited hardware that they just barely can offer what majority of the people would prefer.
(I hate that SD slot position in the new iMac2012, its funny, its so very much like Apple, only they can make such stupid decision)
1. Betamax was better than VHS but VHS had all the moveis so was convinient and cheaper.
2. See how DAT struggled though it was better then compact cassette
3. mp3/acc are poor than CD and CD is poor compared to Records but digital files are replacing the physical media. cos its convinient.
4. Youtube video quality was poor in the early days, but it became so popular, cos video always played even on 256kbps line, how convinient, now we have option to watch 1080p and even 4K if we can afford the bandwidth.
5. a digital video download and stream will always be prefered by the vast majaority as it is convinient.
BUT there will always be people that will buy DVDs and LDs and Records and Blurays. And the problem of Apple is that they makes so limited hardware that they just barely can offer what majority of the people would prefer.
(I hate that SD slot position in the new iMac2012, its funny, its so very much like Apple, only they can make such stupid decision)
They don't?
If they would support Blu-Ray the Mini would be an awesome HTPC.
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And those of us that have the money to spend on a REAL home theater system also tend to be the ones who go the HTPC route, because there are many software players, features evolve all the time, you've got tools like AnyDVD, and they can play ANYTHING in ANY FORMAT without waiting for firmware updates that may or may not ever come.
I have a $1000 Oppo player and I never use it; I use the HTPC. Set top players can NEVER match the flexibility of an HTPC and that's why those of us that use them, do.
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Right, because file formats never change and become obsolete.
As you directed this post at me I feel inclined to reply.
As a matter of fact I fully bought the Apple mantra of the early 2000s (I guess the time you were still on Windows machines or not in the age to decide which product to use). I considered my Mac computer to be the digital hub of my media experience. I got accustomed to all stupid decisions in the long run being the cryptic way, iPhoto organizes media, being the fact that if you don't opt out of that (or set up a shared folder) you have every MP3/AAC in several copies for each user, being the sheer idiocy that in the first years you had to shove off the DRM of iTunes content if you had two users with differing iTunes accounts set up on the machine. Oh sorry...went off topic.
So being the digital hub in my living room the Mac was the one machine that took all those media files and organized it. That's why people like me are so disappointed with no BluRay in a Mac Mini because this would be the killer HTPC!
You seem to be a Mac user from later times. You are probably one of those guys that doesn't remember the time when we got a free @mac.com eMail adress. That's why you don't understand my mindset.
Currently Apple's stance is to make "iTunes in the cloud" your new de facto digital hub - granted you give up all your privacy. Did you know that Facebook and Google automatically take the rights to your private pictures when you upload them?
I want my digital hub back and I want to remain private. That's why it's settled, a new Windows8 HTPC will enter my living room soon.
Cinema Display: 2560x1600
rMBP: 2880x1800
HTPC -- attach computer to big screen
Why does Front Row exist?
Why do Mac computers have a remote?
Why can computers play back video, why does OSX come with a DVD player, why can Mac computers watch content from the iTunes movie store, if you're not supposed to watch videos on a computer?
And yet getting an external BD to hook up to your TV is not either expensive or a big deal.
I was quite sure that it got removed in Lion/Mountain Lion.(?)
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What's wrong with your tv? Watching a movie even on an imac is not the greatest cinema experience. The imac could be 4k resolution it wouldn't matter if your still watching 1080 content.
But that wasn't even my point in the first place. I watch all of my movies from the ipad or macbook connected to my tv. The quality is fine for me. I was just pointing out to the people that wanted a blu ray player on their Mac and they were saying how much better the quality is. If you buy blu rays for the quality you will have a blu ray player separate to your Mac
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Blu-Ray Debate
Let me weigh into this whole debate by stating what I feel about all this. As a musician, many years ago, I was burning CD's and using physical backup media such as Zip drives. I don't see a massive need for Blu-Ray drives as my backup needs would easily eclipse 54 GB or however much a BR disc holds. I now have two external drives, one for audio files/sample libraries and one for Time Machine. Whenever I work with clients face-to-face, for a fair portion of them, they'll bring their own USB stick and get me to drop the file(s) in there. Physical media is a thing of the past as far as working with clients is concerned.
Secondly, for sure, you lose things like extra features you get when you buy the majority of iTunes movies, but for me, the quality is fine. It's the same thing with music. I get a much bigger variety of stuff from the iTunes Store than I would ever get in a local CD or DVD shop. The quality of music downloaded from the iTunes Store is excellent. No matter whether I pump it through my Sonus Faber speakers or play it through a car stereo system, the quality is fab. Because of iTunes Match, I now have a secure offsite backup of all my music.
Because I have a very small apartment, I don't have the space to store all my CD's, so that's where digital media is brilliant. Now don't get me wrong. A CD is a beautiful thing to look at, but where would I store them all if my CD collection gets even larger? Maybe if I buy a bigger place down the track, I might think about taking them out of storage, but for the moment, I'm a huge iTunes Store user.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents.
Let me weigh into this whole debate by stating what I feel about all this. As a musician, many years ago, I was burning CD's and using physical backup media such as Zip drives. I don't see a massive need for Blu-Ray drives as my backup needs would easily eclipse 54 GB or however much a BR disc holds. I now have two external drives, one for audio files/sample libraries and one for Time Machine. Whenever I work with clients face-to-face, for a fair portion of them, they'll bring their own USB stick and get me to drop the file(s) in there. Physical media is a thing of the past as far as working with clients is concerned.
Secondly, for sure, you lose things like extra features you get when you buy the majority of iTunes movies, but for me, the quality is fine. It's the same thing with music. I get a much bigger variety of stuff from the iTunes Store than I would ever get in a local CD or DVD shop. The quality of music downloaded from the iTunes Store is excellent. No matter whether I pump it through my Sonus Faber speakers or play it through a car stereo system, the quality is fab. Because of iTunes Match, I now have a secure offsite backup of all my music.
Because I have a very small apartment, I don't have the space to store all my CD's, so that's where digital media is brilliant. Now don't get me wrong. A CD is a beautiful thing to look at, but where would I store them all if my CD collection gets even larger? Maybe if I buy a bigger place down the track, I might think about taking them out of storage, but for the moment, I'm a huge iTunes Store user.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents.
I think blu-ray for nature documentaries like Planet Earth or Frozen Planet is an outstanding use of the format, used in conjunction with a large high spec Tv, it can be breath taking.
But on action movies where the detail allows you to see the make up on Bruce Willis's face?...no thanks.
But on action movies where the detail allows you to see the make up on Bruce Willis's face?...no thanks.
Sometimes I have to burn a cv/dvd for my car or for work. At the end of the day it is a shame having such a wonderful screen and be unable to watch the occassional dvd. I think one of the main reasons why apple is getting rid of them is to reduce warranty claims.