Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Peter,

I know firsthand that Microsoft sells their software for virtually nothing in the University of Texas system, which is why all University of Texas bookstores sell MS software to students super cheap: $20 for current version of Windows, $7 for Office ($15 for Mac Office last time I checked), etc. That, to me, seems much more reasonable and realistic than, say, Apple selling FCP to students for $250 or more or OS X for $79.

Now which of the above do you think students are going to be more likely to pirate? I doubt any students are going to waste their time copying and burning MS Office when it would cost them $7.

I did ask the Microsoft software rep at the university about this and she said what I thought she would say: MS would rather sell their software at a tiny or nonexistent profit margin (I'm sure they must also receive some tax incentives for programs such as this) to students when the alternatives are 1) rampant piracy, or, much worse, 2) students begin to use something other than MS products.

Yes, this is the dirty little secret no one has yet mentioned here. MS, Adobe, Apple, et al. would rather you be using an illicit copy of their software than a legit copy of someone else's software (but don't expect that to be announced on their shareholders' reports or websites any time soon), particularly with regards to university students who, as a whole, tend to have little spending money as students but will (potentially) have lots of disposable income after graduation. From MS's point of view (to name one example), app loyalty will be determined during their formative educational years. Believe me, they'd much rather you use a pirated copy of Windows than, god forbid, free Linux. Because once one has graduated and is making all that lovely money, your legitimate purchase is likely to be what you know and are familiar with. I don't know how correct that line of thinking really is (like the rest of their demographic reasoning), but this IS the way they think of it.

Certain software developers may be posting such simplistic arguments about piracy taking food out of their families' mouths, so why aren't you using the same logic with MS's loss leader education pricing? I'm sure an honest marketing person will tell you that piracy does indeed have some benefits to their business plan - wider distribution of the product in question, a wider, knowledgable user base, creation of app loyalty, potential future purchasers, etc.

Interestingly, the Micrsoft rep said that MS took a perverse pride in their wares being the most pirated in all of the world, bragging to me that the Chinese prefer illicit copies of Windows over open source Linux. And I'm sure it fills Adobe's hearts with pride to see Photoshop all over Carracho instead of MacGIMP. But that's the mysterious world of big business for you - what they fear most is being ignored completely.
 
This is going to be fun 😀

Originally posted by Pepzhez
Peter,
I know firsthand that Microsoft sells their software for virtually nothing in the University of Texas system,
Well, first off, Microsoft does not "Sell" their software to the school. They license it to them. For the prices that you mention below, it sounds like they have an open campus license agreement. The interesting thing about their new license, is that it is no longer perpetual, but must be renewed every two years. Also if you leave the University (eg. graduate) you must remove the software from your computer. If you do not, you will be in violation of the license agreement, and thus would be breaking the law.

which is why all University of Texas bookstores sell MS software to students super cheap: $20 for current version of Windows, $7 for Office ($15 for Mac Office last time I checked), etc. That, to me, seems much more reasonable and realistic than, say, Apple selling FCP to students for $250 or more or OS X for $79.
This is very similar to the point I made above, people are more likely to steal something that has a higher value, or if they can steal enough of it to make the risk (which in reality for an individual stealing software for their own use is pretty damn small) worth their while.

Now I think that most people would agree with me that their is a huge difference between MS Office and Final Cut Pro. MS Office is pretty much a requirement for a college student, where FCP is a professional video editing tool. It is like the Photoshop vs Adobe Elements arguement. Apple makes iMovie and gives it away with the OS. It will satisfy most users needs. People who need FCP are either serious hobbyists or professionals. Either of those groups probably respects the fact that they are getting their money's worth for the product. The L33t hax0r who wants to have FCP or PS probably does not "need" either product. They use it for fun, but if they steal a copy of it, obviously don't respect the company who makes it enough to compensate them for making a product that is so compelling to steal.

Why would someone steal something that cost $7? So what is the point of your comment below?

Now which of the above do you think students are going to be more likely to pirate? I doubt any students are going to waste their time copying and burning MS Office when it would cost them $7.

I did ask the Microsoft software rep at the university about this and she said what I thought she would say: MS would rather sell their software at a tiny or nonexistent profit margin (I'm sure they must also receive some tax incentives for programs such as this) to students when the alternatives are 1) rampant piracy, or, much worse, 2) students begin to use something other than MS products.
I am sure that MS has alot of pressure from the Universities and schools to keep the licensing price cheap. If they didn't, there is enough demand for an "office" like product, that a competitor would find an easy entrance to the market.

Already, MS has lost out on the file, print, and email server market in Universities. Why would they pay a fortune for client access licenses, when they can run samba, printcap, and any number of imapd services?

Yes, this is the dirty little secret no one has yet mentioned here. MS, Adobe, Apple, et al. would rather you be using an illicit copy of their software than a legit copy of someone else's software (but don't expect that to be announced on their shareholders' reports or websites any time soon),
So if they don't mention it, how did you find out about this secret? Or is this just speculation on your part? I am not saying that there isn't a kernel of truth, but I would not base an arguement in a debate on such supposition. It wouldn't hold much in a courtroom.

particularly with regards to university students who, as a whole, tend to have little spending money as students but will (potentially) have lots of disposable income after graduation.
...because they have all these student loans that they need to pay off while trying to find a job... Because they now feel that they can afford to pay $995 (or whatever) for FCP, because they like to play around with it.

From MS's point of view (to name one example), app loyalty will be determined during their formative educational years. Believe me, they'd much rather you use a pirated copy of Windows than, god forbid, free Linux. Because once one has graduated and is making all that lovely money, your legitimate purchase is likely to be what you know and are familiar with. I don't know how correct that line of thinking really is (like the rest of their demographic reasoning), but this IS the way they think of it.
It is fairly hard to buy a computer that runs Windows, and not have a license to run it. So why would you "use a pirated copy of Windows"? The more concerned companies are the hardware companies. Dell (dude) and gateway don't want you getting hooked on a Mac. Microsoft makes very little money from OS VAR licenses. They will make pretty much the same amount for either version of Office.

So, basically, I haven't seen any compelling arguements yet...

Certain software developers may be posting such simplistic arguments about piracy taking food out of their families' mouths, so why aren't you using the same logic with MS's loss leader education pricing? I'm sure an honest marketing person will tell you that piracy does indeed have some benefits to their business plan - wider distribution of the product in question, a wider, knowledgable user base, creation of app loyalty, potential future purchasers, etc.
They are not running a loss leader pricing scheme. They have a bulk price. It is a common business practice, and not just in the software business. If you are going to buy 1 can of coke, you will pay more per can than you would if you bought a truckload of coke. These companies certainally tolerate some amount of piracy. They certainally would rather not have any, but at some point there is a negative return on value for cracking down on piracy. It costs money to have lawyers take people to trail to seek civil damages. Too much intrusiveness into a customers life will cause an increase in negative opinion. This does not mean that they are excited that their product is being stolen.

Interestingly, the Micrsoft rep said that MS took a perverse pride in their wares being the most pirated in all of the world, bragging to me that the Chinese prefer illicit copies of Windows over open source Linux. And I'm sure it fills Adobe's hearts with pride to see Photoshop all over Carracho instead of MacGIMP. But that's the mysterious world of big business for you - what they fear most is being ignored completely.
Who in Microsoft takes that pride? Bill Gates? Hum, I wonder why it is the most pirated software? Could it be that the majority of computers run the software as a possible OS? As I stated above, Linux is not suitable (yet) for the average computer user. They like having some amount of support. Your suppostion of Adobe's feelings, again, has little merit in this discussion. I don't think that Adobe feels too threatened by G.I.M.P. Although it is a nice piece of software, I doubt that a company that relies on Photoshop for their core critical business functions, would be satisfied with software that does not have a paid staff that will aggressively support their software. There is a big difference in the expectations when you pay money for software, compared to something that is given away. Not to dis open source software, I love it, I think that it is great. But when you pay for software, their is an understanding that if their is a bug, that their is a phone number for you to call to report it, and that their will be a programmer whose job is to fix the problem ASAP, not "when they get time to fix it"
 
Yes, that's a pretty well-known fact, Pepzhez. I can see the problem if by selling software cheaply MS is being anticompetitive, but the thought of people getting "hooked" on MS software seems absurd. (Proprietary document/media formats etc. aside.) This is why open standards are such a good thing, and why Microsoft should be strongly pressured (perhaps by government intervention - that's another debate) to conform to them. As long as the playing field is level, the best product will win out.

The fact that the Chinese mostly prefer pirated copies of Windows to free Linux kind of makes me want to snicker at all the hairy "information wants to be free and Linux is a great desktop OS" GNU hard-liners. (Even though I am a Linux user myself.) I really don't like Microsoft at all, but they do seem to by and large make the most desirable software. If they didn't, nobody would be pirating it.
 
Originally posted by peterjhill


That way I don't have to see 50 lines of crap posted by a moron.


That "crap" that i referred to, was written by the selfless Richard Stallman who founded the GNU Project in 1984. He is the principal or initial author of GNU Emacs, the GNU C Compiler, the GNU Debugger GDB and parts of other free software packages. He is the President of the Free Software Foundation.

www.gnu.org


I don’t understand how your avocation to the blind allegiance of the "Law", and the Company, and the State..
has benefited anyone or anything but the status quo.


In other words what have you done lately for anyone that gives you the right to call Mr. Stalmans views "crap"----


I don’t expect you to answer; I know you buried your head in the sand. MORON!
 
Are we supposed to treat RMS' philosophy as if it's word from on high because he's a hairy, filthy, out-of-touch computer geek, or because you say so?

Yeah, I'm going to take THIS guy seriously:
 

Attachments

  • saintignucius.jpg
    saintignucius.jpg
    31.4 KB · Views: 407
Very good quote

Thank you Chuckzee for posting that piece by Richard Stallman. I agree entirely. And I think the reactions from Rower CPU, alex ant and peterjhill are shameful. Sheer, arrogant bigotry. Posting a picture of someone who obviously has (a) a sense of humour about themselves and (b) far more profound insights than yourselves, with the clear intent of ridiculing them for their appearance, shows that you are both morally and intellectually bankrupt. You should wash your mouths out and go away and have a serious think about your values. What a bunch of all-American d!ckheads...
 
And one more thing

Why don't you post a picture of Stephen Hawking with some witty, derogatory comment about cripples?
 
Re: And one more thing

Originally posted by skunk
Why don't you post a picture of Stephen Hawking with some witty, derogatory comment about cripples?

Do you have something against people with physical disabilities? I am sure that Dr. Hawking would balk at being referred to as a "cripple"

What does Scott Evil call his dad? Ass
 
Re: Very good quote

Originally posted by skunk
You should wash your mouths out and go away and have a serious think about your values. What a bunch of all-American d!ckheads...

Just when you almost made a valid point...🙄
 
You obviously don't get it

I see I should have put that word in quotes, as my sarcasm clearly went right below your primitive radar. Why do you describe Stallman as "filthy"?

(Small autobiographical note: my son was confined to a wheelchair for several years before he died)
 
It's late

Much as I'd love to continue this little chat, it's 4.30 am here, and I'm off to bed. Take your time...
 
Re: You obviously don't get it

Originally posted by skunk
I see I should have put that word in quotes, as my sarcasm clearly went right below your primitive radar. Why do you describe Stallman as "filthy"?

(Small autobiographical note: my son was confined to a wheelchair for several years before he died)

I'm sorry to hear about your son. That's something that every parent dreads, and is not easy to deal with.

I think you need to discriminate better as to who has made which comments. You're lumping us all together, saying we all said the same thing. Simply not true, my friend.
 
Re: You obviously don't get it

Originally posted by skunk
Why don't you post a picture of Stephen Hawking with some witty, derogatory comment about cripples?

Do I really even need to answer that.
skunk Thank you Chuckzee for posting that piece by Richard Stallman. I agree entirely. And I think the reactions from Rower CPU, alex ant and peterjhill are shameful. Sheer, arrogant bigotry. Posting a picture of someone who obviously has (a) a sense of humour about themselves and

"A sense of humour about themselves." That's an interesting way of describing it...
(b) far more profound insights than yourselves,

What insights do you speak of? I could write bloated, meandering, nonsensical manifestos advocating the equivalency of software to free speech just the same as RMS does. The only thing is that I don't, because I think it's a nutty idea.
with the clear intent of ridiculing them for their appearance,

Yes, it was a brainless reply to a brainless post on chuckzee's part. It was easier and, I thought, more humorous to ridicule him for his stench and ... eccentricity than to open up the can of worms that going full-on against his ideology would entail. Although I'm still willing to go there if need be.
shows that you are both morally and intellectually bankrupt.

I love buzzphrases. Hold on for a sec while I shift my paradigm...
I see I should have put that word in quotes, as my sarcasm clearly went right below your primitive radar. Why do you describe Stallman as "filthy"?

Because he is. It was obviously more of a ha-ha than a serious argument against his philosophies. Kind of like your calling me a ******** was probably more of a joke at my expense than anything else, I hope.
(Small autobiographical note: my son was confined to a wheelchair for several years before he died)
I'm sorry to hear that - my sympathies. You're certainly reading far too much into my post if you saw in it any disparaging of the physically disabled, though.

Alex
 
Alex, I do happen to agree with you (didn't think you'd ever hear that from me, did you?) that it is absurd - re: people getting "hooked" on MS's or any other vendor's software. Go tell that to the MBA's and marketing execs who perpetuate this ridiculous line of thinking, not me.

As for you dismissing Stallman's essay on the basis of you-don't-like-the-way-he-looks-therefore-you-can't-take-him-seriously (and "filthy"? How so?) ... well, that's just plain asinine - and yet another indication of why I advised you to take a logic course and learn fallacies of argument.

You've failed to consider the content of the essay completely. Did you even read it at all? Deal with the issue at hand, boy, because unsubstantiated and distorted, prejudicial distractions aren't going to cut it in conversation with intelligent adults.
 
Originally posted by Pepzhez
Alex, I do happen to agree with you (didn't think you'd ever hear that from me, did you?) that it is absurd - re: people getting "hooked" on MS's or any other vendor's software. Go tell that to the MBA's and marketing execs who perpetuate this ridiculous line of thinking, not me.

By the way, I think you'd be surprised at just how much you probably do agree with me on quite a few other topics, but that has gone over your head in your almost religious zeal to cast me as an evil ______ (insert evil thing here).
As for you dismissing Stallman's essay on the basis of you-don't-like-the-way-he-looks-therefore-you-can't-take-him-seriously (and "filthy"? How so?) ... well, that's just plain asinine

As I said in response to skunk, I dismiss Stallman's equation of software to free speech because I think it's dumb. That isn't to say I don't respect it - I just mostly don't agree with it. My posting of his picture as whatever he was dressed up was only intended as a laugh. Don't take it as a serious argument, because it wasn't. I have plenty of other serious arguments against RMS's philosophy that are in no way based upon his cleanliness or hairyness.
and yet another indication of why I advised you to take a logic course and learn fallacies of argument.

I would, but they apparently don't teach your screwed-up brand of logic up here. I'm still waiting for you to get back to me on the red herring and two-wrongs-make-a-right fallacies you set up earlier, but apparently it's easier for you to abandon them and pretend they never happened.
You've failed to consider the content of the essay completely. Did you even read it at all?

Of course. The GNU Project's philosophy is solid. It has held up for nearly two decades. It's just that I happen to not agree with it. There's really not much more to it than that. I recall saying in a previous post that I'd love to debate RMS's position point-by-point, but I've changed my mind now that I think about it, because to do so would be a tremendous waste of time, as thousands have wasted their typing fingers hashing it out in the past without anything to show for it. Debating free software vs. closed software is like debating Catholicism vs. Protestantism: It's a holy war waiting to happen.

Although I disagree with RMS on a number of issues, I do respect his opinions. What I wish is that his supporters would respect the fact that is is conceivable that others could have opinions that actually DIFFER without being labeled "smug, self-righteous corpo-apologists" as chuckzee so inanely put it. Just to speak for myself - I think anyone who labels ME a "corpo-apologist" definitely doesn't know me very well.
Deal with the issue at hand, boy, because unsubstantiated and distorted, prejudicial distractions aren't going to cut it in conversation with intelligent adults.
(Just a side note: That was an AWESOME conclusion, easily an 8 out of 10 - could have been a 9 if you had run it through the grammar checker first.)

What is the issue at hand? I fear that this thread has entropied to the point where nobody knows what the hell they're arguing for anymore. I recall that originally it was "Piracy and Mac OS X," but now it's... Towing the GNU Party Line? Is that it? Please help me somebody.
 
Originally posted by alex_ant
What is the issue at hand? I fear that this thread has entropied to the point where nobody knows what the hell they're arguing for anymore. I recall that originally it was "Piracy and Mac OS X," but now it's... Towing the GNU Party Line? Is that it? Please help me somebody. [/B]
Thank you!

IMO It all comes down to this:

If you can't afford 10.2, don't buy it. Keep using 9.2 or 10.1.

If you feel Apple's lack of an upgrade discount is unfair, complain to Apple and/or bitch and moan here, but stealing from Apple is not a productive form of complaining - it's stealing. (No matter what your morals are) (And, yes, I feel that their July 17th hard cutoff sucks - one of my best friends bought a TiBook recently and is pissed about it too.)

Don't like Apple's EULA's - get YellowDog Linux or something.

Apple spent a ton of money on 10.2 development, they have to recoupe some of it and make a profit. If they don't profit, they go out of business. Distributing copies of 10.2 without paying Apple for it is stealing from them. Is this really so hard to understand?

Apple MUST profit or else they cease to exist.

-Eric S.
 
(sigh) I tire of this also. Alex, I never did state that "two wrongs make a right" or set up any such arguments. The problem here is that you are convinced that what you believe is right ("because it's the law") and all dissenting opinion can only be "wrong", branding those who may find these matters problematic - or (god forbid) worthy of reappraisal and questioning - as "immoral" or whatever. You have been the one lording your moral superiority over others.

Here is the essential difference between us, I believe: you feel entitled to judge others' behavior, based on a received, simplistic "moral" standard which you have never been able to justify. In fact, you act quite defensively when pushed into questioning your ideas. You do not take mitigating circumstances into consideration (and, yes, they are relevant to the original topic: who pirates and why). The myriad reasons for piracy are not simple, yet you insist on treating it as such. ("It's illegal, so don't do it.") If you do not want to look at the underlying issues then why bother to contribute to the thread?

I surmise that you are quite young and have led a sheltered life. Certainly your lack of awareness (and obstinate refusal to accept the truth of the situation) and lack of empathy with how the majority of the world's people live reflects more ignorance than arrogance, to be certain. Or maybe you are the leader of your campus chapter of the Young Republicans, I don't know.

Now I do not feel so morally superior in that I can judge the character and "morality" of someone running illicit software. I previously posted that I am not the district attorney or the minister of justice or a part of the Apple legal department. What's it to me? And, really, what's it to you? Apple is still going to charge you lots of money for their precious software whether piracy stops tomorrow or piracy increases 1000%. And that has always been one of my points here: the software companies scream "piracy!" for use as the centerpiece of their straw man argument, viz. "we have to charge so much because people are stealing it." No, they are going to charge so much whether it is pirated or not.

But I have said the same thing in endless posts throughout the course of this thread. I have nothing else to say on the subject, and I do not see the point in an endless flame war with you.

And sorry if my phrase seemed a bit grammatically awkward. If it's such a problem for you, we can decree that all of our future posts will be in my native German. Or French or Dutch, if you prefer.
 
Your English is better than that of most posters here, Chuckzee. I also think this thread is just about through, but it's covered some interesting ground. Not that anybody seems to have changed their tune, but it's been a slice, nonetheless.
 
Originally posted by Pepzhez
(sigh) I tire of this also. Alex, I never did state that "two wrongs make a right" or set up any such arguments.

Are you sure?
The problem here is that you are convinced that what you believe is right ("because it's the law") and all dissenting opinion can only be "wrong", branding those who may find these matters problematic - or (god forbid) worthy of reappraisal and questioning - as "immoral" or whatever.

That's so totally not true. I encourage questioning everything. You would generally advocate breaking an unjust law (depending on the law and one's socioeconomic status, I guess), whereas I would generally advocate changing it. I think that, in this case, software piracy is, based in part upon its illegality, wrong. And I believe socioeconomic status is irrelevant here. I guess that's something we'll just have to agree to disagree on.
You have been the one lording your moral superiority over others.

My own morals have never been a part of this. For all anyone on Macrumors but myself knows, I could be the least moral person in the world.
Here is the essential difference between us, I believe: you feel entitled to judge others' behavior, based on a received, simplistic "moral" standard which you have never been able to justify. In fact, you act quite defensively when pushed into questioning your ideas.

Well, sheesh, I've never gone about articulating an entire system of morality before! It doesn't sound like a lot of fun. To simplify, I never said simply that "piracy is immoral" - I said "piracy is immoral to anyone whose sense of morality is based even loosely on respect for the law." Which I agree might be inaccurate in the (VERY LIMITED) circumstances in which breaking the law is justified.
You do not take mitigating circumstances into consideration (and, yes, they are relevant to the original topic: who pirates and why). The myriad reasons for piracy are not simple, yet you insist on treating it as such. ("It's illegal, so don't do it.") If you do not want to look at the underlying issues then why bother to contribute to the thread?

I agree they're not simple, and I certainly don't insist on treating them as such. It's not that I don't want to look at the underlying issues. I do. It's just that I am reluctant to mix what should be with what is.

"It's illegal, so don't do it." That's right. Instead of doing it, question why it's illegal. Get the debate flowing, discuss, change, help work out something fairer and more equitable and work to get the new plan implemented so that you won't have to look to piracy anymore. That's my position. And I think your position is quite similar - it seems to differ from mine only in the short term. You would say, "In the meantime, until you stop getting screwed, it's OK to pirate." (Depending on how much money you make and where you live and how many hours/week you work and how many children you support and so on and so forth, I guess - I could inquire as to the formula you use to calculate all this in determining whether or not one's circumstances justify piracy, but I won't.)
I surmise that you are quite young and have led a sheltered life. Certainly your lack of awareness (and obstinate refusal to accept the truth of the situation) and lack of empathy with how the majority of the world's people live reflects more ignorance than arrogance, to be certain. Or maybe you are the leader of your campus chapter of the Young Republicans, I don't know.

You are able to infer all this based upon my views on one issue? Your guesses are approximately 13% correct. Perhaps I threw you off because I don't subscribe to each issue the left wing tells me to. Which is not to say I have any love for the Young Republicans or that I'm not actually quite overwhelmingly liberal, to your great surprise I'll bet.

(I'm just curious - how did you come to the conclusion that I have "a lack of empathy with how the majority of the world's people live?" Of all the insults I've received in this thread, this is the only one that bugs me.)
Now I do not feel so morally superior in that I can judge the character and "morality" of someone running illicit software. I previously posted that I am not the district attorney or the minister of justice or a part of the Apple legal department. What's it to me? And, really, what's it to you?

Kind of a detatched view, I suppose, but to each his own.
Apple is still going to charge you lots of money for their precious software whether piracy stops tomorrow or piracy increases 1000%. And that has always been one of my points here: the software companies scream "piracy!" for use as the centerpiece of their straw man argument, viz. "we have to charge so much because people are stealing it." No, they are going to charge so much whether it is pirated or not.

This is the problem that has spawned the discussion that has been overshadowed by all the flaming. I agree 100%.
But I have said the same thing in endless posts throughout the course of this thread. I have nothing else to say on the subject, and I do not see the point in an endless flame war with you.

Feel free to bow out at any time.
And sorry if my phrase seemed a bit grammatically awkward. If it's such a problem for you, we can decree that all of our future posts will be in my native German. Or French or Dutch, if you prefer.

What, no Latin?
 
words of wisdom from Pepzhez
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I surmise that you are quite young and have led a sheltered life. Certainly your lack of awareness (and obstinate refusal to accept the truth of the situation) and lack of empathy with how the majority of the world's people live reflects more ignorance than arrogance, to be certain. Or maybe you are the leader of your campus chapter of the Young Republicans, I don't know.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
alex_ant's excellent reply
You are able to infer all this based upon my views on one issue? Your guesses are approximately 13% correct. Perhaps I threw you off because I don't subscribe to each issue the left wing tells me to. Which is not to say I have any love for the Young Republicans or that I'm not actually quite overwhelmingly liberal, to your great surprise I'll bet.

(I'm just curious - how did you come to the conclusion that I have "a lack of empathy with how the majority of the world's people live?" Of all the insults I've received in this thread, this is the only one that bugs me.)
I am with you there. I was kind of peeved also. I must be a democrat, since I didn't waver from my support for Pres. Clinton. I have been a democrat since I told my parents to vote for Jimmy Carter in 1976 (when I was 7 years old). I am certainally not a far left wing liberal, though. I am a middle of the road democrat. I would certainally never vote for our current president. I disagree with almost everything he has done since he has been in office. I disagreed with much of the Gulf War, even though I was serving in the Navy at that time.

As for a lack of empathy, I disagree, as would anyone who knows me personally. I have run out of patience for college students I see begging for money on the street. Get a fricking job. I am not going to give my hard earned money so that some punk can get a case of beer and a bag of weed.

I do care about how the majority of the people in this world live. What can I do about it? I can vote for people who are willing to do something about it with the collective might of the US economy behind them. Pirating software sure won't help someone who lives in a village in a 3rd world country that doesn't have running water.

BTW, ignoring Mr. Pepzhez does not mean that I am ignoring the global community. As for not respecting Mr. RMS, he is a little to far out there for me. And most of all I don't take the word of just anyone for the truth, unless I can research it myself. I know full well that the American media does not tell us everything. I know about all the hundreds of thousands of Iraqi soldiers that were massacred (ms?) during the Gulf War. I know how that information was not covered during the news very well, if it all. I do seek out other sources of news. I enjoy listening to the BBC news over the Internet. It may be just as bad as US news, but it is a little different, as the English care more about Europe than America does.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.