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Piracy and Mac OS X
- Thread starter arn
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I dont know, you tell me, what was the point of peterjhill bringing up crimes against humanity, on a forum having to do with piracy?
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posted by peterjhill:
This isn't Yugoslavia that I am living in. I could start some real **** about F**ked up politics by reminding people what the previous government has done. Maybe I should take it easy on you, if you really are from Yugoslavia. Maybe you were oppressed by your government while it committed crimes against humanity. I hope things are better there now.
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posted by peterjhill:
This isn't Yugoslavia that I am living in. I could start some real **** about F**ked up politics by reminding people what the previous government has done. Maybe I should take it easy on you, if you really are from Yugoslavia. Maybe you were oppressed by your government while it committed crimes against humanity. I hope things are better there now.
it was in response to this:
Originally posted by peterjhill
If a politician realizes that their re-election chances are going to go to zero by ignoring some problem, they will react as the public wishes.
Originally posted by peterjhill
If a politician realizes that their re-election chances are going to go to zero by ignoring some problem, they will react as the public wishes.
peterjhill
macrumors 65816
How about some context to that, such as:
You want to talk about politics and governments. You wanted to rumble, let's rumble. Bring it on.
Preliminary Report of a Mass Grave near Vukovar
http://www.phrusa.org/research/forensics/croatia/forvuk1.html
Another Serb mass grave found
Crimes of War Project
There, you like to post links. Chew on these. As for how it is related to the topic at hand, let's see if I get your posts correct:
Pirating software is okay since corporations and governments are corrupt and the laws are bad, so therefore we should ignore them, or defy them valiantly. The US is screwed up because only people and corporations from money really control the law.
My comments about yugoslavia started out as an effort by me to understand how you came to distrust politics so much. Once I thought about it, I came up with the plausible theory that perhaps since you live (or so your location says) in a country where they have had so many problems with corruption, that I could sympathize with your feelings.
So, if you dare to post another message here, tell me, what are your feelings about the possiblity that Apple may implement some sort of anti-theft protection to the OS, and its effects on you.
I am curious.
No, that was his response to the poor getting equal rights in america., and something about lawmakers turning on the rich!
Rower_CPU
Moderator emeritus
Once again, incorrect. It was in reference to the legal implications of piracy as it applies to everyone...stating that poor and rich alike are equally liable, and that politicians do listen to public opinion and not just special interests. But this is off topic...
I'm interested to see your reply to peterjhill's latest post.
oh, if i dare post another message here.....
apple can go to hell, i'm moving to linux. you can go and suck apples, and microsofts pienes.
Rower_CPU
Moderator emeritus
Nice response...I'll have to remember that one next time I get in a scuffle out on the playground.🙄
It seems that all your arguments have broken down, and you have no reply to the questions being put to you. Please join the rest of the piracy advocates who have crashed and burned in this thread...the pile forms to the left.
It seems that all your arguments have broken down, and you have no reply to the questions being put to you. Please join the rest of the piracy advocates who have crashed and burned in this thread...the pile forms to the left.
peterjhill
macrumors 65816
And on that... I'm out. It appears that the interesting debate is over. If this is all there is left of the discussion, I can spend my time better. Heck, cleaning the lint filter on my dryer is more intellectually challenging than our esteemed chuckzee.
Thank you all who came in support of me (Rower_CPU++). I am sure that if Apple does actually implent something that we will all have our little fun chatting about it, right here, same bat time, same bat channel.
Re: Piracy And Mac OS X
Sorry to break up the flame war, but someone had to do it. (Blame the newbie🙄).
When I buy software, I would like to be able to use it on any machine I own - why not implement a single - USER license. Maybe it's not practical for Operating Systems, but for, say, Warcraft III, a traditionally licensed game that costs $60 a pop, why not have me be able to play the game with a personal license anywhere it's installed. Imagine - you fire up Dreamweaver - you can use it in trial mode, or log in with your secure key and access your files and such. It involves central servers, but that's nothing new.
I agree that software is overpriced, but keep in mind the first rule of capitalism - as long as people will buy it for $700, Adobe will keep charging $700. Now, I've pirated a decent amount of software, but I have an exccuse - I'm a guy with a tiny income who has a taste for big apps - And as income increases, I buy them - I registered EV Nova! (Very good deal) and I actually bought Studio MX!
As long as people feel that software is oerpriced/beyond their means they will pirate it (unfortunately) No matter how good it gets, it will always not be enough for some people.
Oh - and for 10.2 - I have two macs, and I will buy one copy, barring extreme security. I am the sole user.
Sorry to break up the flame war, but someone had to do it. (Blame the newbie🙄).
When I buy software, I would like to be able to use it on any machine I own - why not implement a single - USER license. Maybe it's not practical for Operating Systems, but for, say, Warcraft III, a traditionally licensed game that costs $60 a pop, why not have me be able to play the game with a personal license anywhere it's installed. Imagine - you fire up Dreamweaver - you can use it in trial mode, or log in with your secure key and access your files and such. It involves central servers, but that's nothing new.
I agree that software is overpriced, but keep in mind the first rule of capitalism - as long as people will buy it for $700, Adobe will keep charging $700. Now, I've pirated a decent amount of software, but I have an exccuse - I'm a guy with a tiny income who has a taste for big apps - And as income increases, I buy them - I registered EV Nova! (Very good deal) and I actually bought Studio MX!
As long as people feel that software is oerpriced/beyond their means they will pirate it (unfortunately) No matter how good it gets, it will always not be enough for some people.
Oh - and for 10.2 - I have two macs, and I will buy one copy, barring extreme security. I am the sole user.
skunk
macrumors G4
Thin Ice Ahead
You could be opening one hell of a can of worms here. I'd stay with the Apple topic if I were you. US foreign policy has oppressed an awful lot of people, and continues to do so. It doesn't seem to matter who is nominally in power, the same old pay-masters call the shots. Far more Afghani civilians have been killed by American bombs than Americans at the WTC, all in retaliation for attacks carried out by non-Afghanis based in the US. Just don't assume the high ground where crimes against humanity are concerned. It all depends on who is writing the definitions. Axis of Evil, my arse.
You could be opening one hell of a can of worms here. I'd stay with the Apple topic if I were you. US foreign policy has oppressed an awful lot of people, and continues to do so. It doesn't seem to matter who is nominally in power, the same old pay-masters call the shots. Far more Afghani civilians have been killed by American bombs than Americans at the WTC, all in retaliation for attacks carried out by non-Afghanis based in the US. Just don't assume the high ground where crimes against humanity are concerned. It all depends on who is writing the definitions. Axis of Evil, my arse.
central server solution
this seems like the direction things are supposed to go in.
that is, we won't have individual copies of software, we'll simply access "rights" to use things on the server-side.
this of course would solve many piracy issues (tho hacks will be found, of course), but it would make me uncomfortable--companies would be able to track what, when, and how I use software, etc.
this seems like the direction things are supposed to go in.
that is, we won't have individual copies of software, we'll simply access "rights" to use things on the server-side.
this of course would solve many piracy issues (tho hacks will be found, of course), but it would make me uncomfortable--companies would be able to track what, when, and how I use software, etc.
peterjhill,
Since you brought it up ... sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about with regards to Yugoslavia, and are simply parrotting the lies and distortions of the US corporate media. So get off your rah-rah Wall Street high horse and learn the FACTS before placing blame on the innocent victims of what is actually Western military and corporate aggression.
I suggest that you read carefully this site by James Bissett, ex-Canadian ambassador to Yugoslavia:
http://www.deltax.net/bissett/index.html
The destruction of Yugoslavia was a massive crime against humanity undertaken by NATO, in collusion with multi-national corporations and their interests, and the goal was the Third Worldization of this formerly prosperous, autonomous republic. In other words, they wanted to make damn sure that citizens of Yugoslavia would be forced to work in factories for $3 per day - perhaps to make your next Mac, peterjhill.
Now I haven't seen peterjhill, Alex, and the rest of the Anti-Piracy Hysteria Gestapo saying ONE DAMN THING about the MASSIVE piracy and plundering (not to mention murder - guess Alex doesn't question US military aggression or find that "immoral") your country has committed in former Yugoslavia. The mineral wealth the West has already extracted postively dwarfs the next 1000 years of Carracho downloading and crack sites.
Your country does THIS to these people and now you have the balls to lecture to them about the "immorality" of pirating the Holy West's precious software? I realize that you are ignorant of the facts, yet you've also demonstrated that you have no willingness to learn the truth of the matter.
And I'll say it in advance (again), YOU are the one that brought this up, peter.
Since you brought it up ... sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about with regards to Yugoslavia, and are simply parrotting the lies and distortions of the US corporate media. So get off your rah-rah Wall Street high horse and learn the FACTS before placing blame on the innocent victims of what is actually Western military and corporate aggression.
I suggest that you read carefully this site by James Bissett, ex-Canadian ambassador to Yugoslavia:
http://www.deltax.net/bissett/index.html
The destruction of Yugoslavia was a massive crime against humanity undertaken by NATO, in collusion with multi-national corporations and their interests, and the goal was the Third Worldization of this formerly prosperous, autonomous republic. In other words, they wanted to make damn sure that citizens of Yugoslavia would be forced to work in factories for $3 per day - perhaps to make your next Mac, peterjhill.
Now I haven't seen peterjhill, Alex, and the rest of the Anti-Piracy Hysteria Gestapo saying ONE DAMN THING about the MASSIVE piracy and plundering (not to mention murder - guess Alex doesn't question US military aggression or find that "immoral") your country has committed in former Yugoslavia. The mineral wealth the West has already extracted postively dwarfs the next 1000 years of Carracho downloading and crack sites.
Your country does THIS to these people and now you have the balls to lecture to them about the "immorality" of pirating the Holy West's precious software? I realize that you are ignorant of the facts, yet you've also demonstrated that you have no willingness to learn the truth of the matter.
And I'll say it in advance (again), YOU are the one that brought this up, peter.
So are you naive enough to have the "opinion" that a company that has a monopoly, with a product- (Microsoft, office), will be kind to people (if they stop pirating the software), and thus practically give the software away?!
I wouldn't personally advocate anyone pirate software, but it is not up to me to morally judge.
Let's make this easy.
Evaluate the much-hated Windows Product Activation system, which is the same thing that has been presented here.
You've read enough about it. I don't need to repeat it here.
It is hardly a trouble-free system for the end-user as many WinXP users will contest.
You can do your own research from there, just like I did.
TL
Rower_CPU
Moderator emeritus
Except for the glaring fact that peterjhill brought up: the serial # on the mobo.
As any Mac user knows, Apple makes the hardware that OS X will be running on. Implementing a quick check of the serial # would be transparent to the user and would have all the effectiveness of product activation without the mess that MS goes through.
MS tries to create an algorithm based on your hardware, taking into account all the possible hardware configurations, and still giving you some flexibility to install new parts. Some parts (mobo, cpu) will incur an immediate re-activation, since they change too much of the "hardware algorithm".
Apple doesn't have this problem, since there is no way, under the current Apple sales scenario (no clones, etc.) that anyone will switch out the mobo. If for some reason you have to swap it out for technical reasons, you have to send it in to Apple or a certified tech, a documented event that would be easily addressible by Apple as a legitimate reason for reinstall/re-activation.
I'm not a fan of WPA, but in my experience it never caused any problems on my Windows machine. MS made it as painless as possible (heaven forbid you have to call in and and get the 50 digit activation code from them).
I think if anyone could pull this off and make it invisible/noninvasive, it would be Apple.
The whole point of serialization is to prevent casual piracy. The hard-core hackers will crack it...but if it's too inconvenient the average user won't bother. "Product activation" takes this one step further.
reaction brings eloquence
I must say, I haven't seen such good writing on a BB in many a long year.
keep it up y'all. there may not be too many people listening, but you're getting in some good practice!
I must say, I haven't seen such good writing on a BB in many a long year.
keep it up y'all. there may not be too many people listening, but you're getting in some good practice!
alex_ant
macrumors 68020
As a philosophy professor, Pepzhez, does the term "red herring" sound at all familiar?
A Red Herring is a fallacy in which an irrelevant topic is presented in order to divert attention from the original issue. The basic idea is to "win" an argument by leading attention away from the argument and to another topic. This sort of "reasoning" has the following form:
1. Topic A is under discussion.
2. Topic B is introduced under the guise of being relevant to topic A (when topic B is actually not relevant to topic A).
3. Topic A is abandoned.
This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because merely changing the topic of discussion hardly counts as an argument against a claim."
The preceding was copied from http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/.
Two Wrongs Make a Right is a fallacy in which a person "justifies" an action against a person by asserting that the person would do the same thing to him/her, when the action is not necessary to prevent B from doing X to A. This fallacy has the following pattern of "reasoning":
1. It is claimed that person B would do X to person A.
2. It is acceptable for person A to do X to person B (when A's doing X to B is not necessary to prevent B from doing X to A).
This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because an action that is wrong is wrong even if another person would also do it.
It should be noted that it can be the case that it is not wrong for A to do X to B if X is done to prevent B from doing X to A or if X is done in justified retribution. For example, if Sally is running in the park and Biff tries to attack her, Sally would eb jsutified in attacking Biff to defend herself. As another example, if country A is planning to invade country B in order to enslave the people, then country B would be justified in launching a pre-emptive strike to prevent the invasion.
The preceding was copied from the same site above, and it sums up a good part of the horrible logic you've presented throughout this thread.