Police Arrest 141 New York City Merchants in Stolen iPhone Sting

[Shrink]

You've obviously never had your iPhone containing all your personal information stolen. I hope you never do. It's a very terrible event.

Agree ^^^

We're not just talking about just getting mugged for $200 - and that's bad enough. (I was mugged for $65 and a cheap watch - and that was no fun! Scared the living *****t out of me.) All the information contained in the phone, and the potential for accessing credit card and bank accounts make this much more financially costly - not to mention the trauma of being robbed.

Many of the suggestions above might help kill the market for this kind of theft.

Of course, the scumbags out there among us will find something else for which to mug you, but any discouragement is better than nothing.

 

[gnasher729]

This is entrapment, no doubt about it. Apple should demand NYPD put a stop to it. It's bad publicity.

1. Apple should in no way tell the NYPD how to do their job. The police are worried about theft. The items stolen are not Apple's property, so the whole matter is none of Apple's business.

2. I can't see how catching criminals is bad publicity for Apple. Maybe the fact that some people steal iPhones would be bad publicity, but if owning an iPhone causes a risk of being robbed then surely Apple shouldn't hide that from the public? If the NYPD does things to catch criminals and reduce the risk for iPhone owners in the future, that can only be good publicity for Apple.

3. Please read through the posts before yours, and read carefully what the word "entrapment" means. Then think about it for a while. You may learn something. If you then still think it is entrapment, feel free to post _why_ you believe it is entrapment. A useful tool for clarifying your thoughts is this one: Try describing a scenario that wouldn't be entrapment, and one that would be entrapment, and describe how one doesn't meet the definition of entrapment and the other one does.

 

[Kaibelf]

Yep. Stake out the local "Barbershop" and start canvasing those Supermarkets. For god's sake... doesn't the NYPD have anything better to do?

No, they don't have anything better to do than stop an ecosystem of violent criminals. Don't YOU have anything better to do than complain?

 

[JonneyGee]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/9A405)

Two ideas:
1. Not only should carriers blacklist stolen phones, they should confiscate a stolen phone when someone attempts to activate it and then return it to its rightful owner.
2. If you live in NYC, keep your iPhone out of view, use a Bluetooth headset, and wear the phone you used before your iPhone on a belt clip when in public.

 

[FloatingBones]

Gruber recently noted this article where robbers in upper Manhattan were stealing iPhones while eschewing Blackberries and Android phones.

Undermining the marketplace for a high-demand item is one of the best ways to nip this trend in the bud. If there were some other brand or product thieves were targeting, a sting operation targeting that particular item would also be appropriate.

If you live in NYC, keep your iPhone out of view, use a Bluetooth headset, and wear the phone you used before your iPhone on a belt clip when in public.

...or just buy a prepaid phone. This brings a new meaning to the phrase burner phone.

I'm not certain this would be a good idea. If the thief got the idea that you were deceiving him, he could get violent.

 

[Frankie4Fingers]

No, they don't have anything better to do than stop an ecosystem of violent criminals.

Violence? Where is the Violence here?

Don't YOU have anything better to do than complain?

Yeah. Silly me. I guess I could help canvas the area for the missing kid that lives down the block. Or start night patrolling the neighborhood for the rapist that's been hitting our area the last month. (Since the NYPD is too busy booking Sid the 70 year-old barber it seems).

Dude, I don't begrudge law enforcement from fighting crime. But come on... a sting operation on dumbass citizens looking to score an iPhone? (Actually, not looking to score one because it's basically being waved in their face). Since I live here my priorities are different and I can think of better things for my tax dollars to be used for rather than protecting a company's $80b coffers.

 

[alent1234]

Violence? Where is the Violence here?

Yeah. Silly me. I guess I could help canvas the area for the missing kid that lives down the block. Or start night patrolling the neighborhood for the rapist that's been hitting our area the last month. (Since the NYPD is too busy booking Sid the 70 year-old barber it seems).

Dude, I don't begrudge law enforcement from fighting crime. But come on... a sting operation on dumbass citizens looking to score an iPhone? (Actually, not looking to score one because it's basically being waved in their face). Since I live here my priorities are different and I can think of better things for my tax dollars to be used for rather than protecting a company's $80b coffers.

the people stealing the phones aren't asking nicely for them

 

[joeip77]

ATT And Apple allowing stollen iPhones to to put back on there network Sad but True

It is time to create a law in the U.S. that is common in some (not sure how many) develop countries to eliminate the market for stolen phones. Currently in the US, when a phone is stolen, it is only deactivated and blocked by your carrier. If it were deactivated and blocked by all US carriers, then it would immediately collapse the market for stolen phones as the thief just wouldn't be able to sell for as rich a price. Eliminate the price premium and the thieves will not have as much an incentive to steal phones.

Just think how much money is invested into the law enforcement, reporting, and investigating into stolen phones. If the market for stolen phones can effectively be made unattractive, then all that law enforcement costs drop or can be applied to more important matters for society.

Australia does it pretty effectively and this is save consumers a tremendous amount of money because the number of phones stolen is dropping a staggering rates.
http://www.amta.org.au/pages/amta/The.Mobile.Phone.Industry.Statement

This is not true here in the US. I wish it were though

Whats really sad is that 99.9% of the cellphone users that have an iPhone stolen doesn't know that there stollen iPhone can be put back on the network, activated and is being used by someone else (ATT and Apple are making money off of your stollen iPhone) This happened to me, I filed a police report and spoke to Apple and ATT both and was told that the stollen iPhone
Was Not put on the Blacklist so it could not be used on the network anymore. The detective said that they could easily idetify if the the iPhone was back on the network from its imei#, but that they could not do so unless there was an investigation and that the iPhone could be used to solve a more serious crime. It seems that what ATT and Apple are allowing to happen is definatly a crime.
I even had an person at ATT tell me that when she first went to work for ATT that in one of her first staff meetings this stolen phone blacklist was brought up and they were told that this blacklist is no longer used. She has worked in other cell companys for years and the blacklist was always used to keep stollen phones from ever being used on the network again.What I think is Really insane is that when anyone activates an iPhone on iTunes or a person does this in the store, why doesn't ATT or Apples system see the
imei# as stollen and stop it from being used. I will tell you why more$$$$

Sad Stuff

This is how it Suppose to work
This is from Wiki site

The IMEI number is used by the GSM network to identify valid devices and therefore can be used for stopping a stolen phone from accessing the network in that country. For example, if a mobile phone is stolen, the owner can call his or her network provider and instruct them to "blacklist" the phone using its IMEI number. This renders the phone useless on that network and sometimes other networks too, whether or not the phone's SIM is changed

 

[Nunyabinez]

For those who believe this is entrapment:

"In criminal law, entrapment is conduct by a law enforcement agent inducing a person to commit an offense that the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit.[1] In many jurisdictions, entrapment is a possible defense against criminal liability. However, there is no entrapment where a person is ready and willing to break the law and the government agents merely provide what appears to be a favorable opportunity for the person to commit the crime."

This isn't any different than a police woman standing on a street corner dressed like a hooker. If she is propositioned then a crime has been committed. If she walks into a bar and tries to talk a guy into it, it could be seen as entrapment as it is harder to argue that he was a at bar looking for a hooker, whereas the guy who pulls up and asks her if she wants to party has little defense.

I'm sure that the police were given specific language to use like "I have a stolen iPhone I'm trying to sell, do you know anyone who would be willing to buy it?"

 

[aj701]

I've been mugged twice in the past three years (once somewhat violently) in manhattan, all they wanted was my iphone, nothing else. It is hellish, not only is it frightening, but the aftermath is dreadful, it totally disrupts your life. I am glad the NYPD is doing something. I am still irritated Apple does NOTHING. Serial numbers should be reported as stolen once a police report is filed...As soon as a thief connects that phone to itunes it should be detected. Apple has the power to do this.

 

[nick_elt]

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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

This is entrapment, no doubt about it. Apple should demand NYPD put a stop to it. It's bad publicity.

No doubt you also think it's OK to steal music over the internet. Shame!

Thats two totally diffetent arguments

 

[nick_elt]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

This is entrapment, no doubt about it. Apple should demand NYPD put a stop to it. It's bad publicity.

No doubt you also think it's OK to steal music over the internet. Shame!

Thats two totally different arguments

 

[joeip77]

Greed

I've been mugged twice in the past three years (once somewhat violently) in manhattan, all they wanted was my iphone, nothing else. It is hellish, not only is it frightening, but the aftermath is dreadful, it totally disrupts your life. I am glad the NYPD is doing something. I am still irritated Apple does NOTHING. Serial numbers should be reported as stolen once a police report is filed...As soon as a thief connects that phone to itunes it should be detected. Apple has the power to do this.

Apple and Att $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Greed

Whats really sad is that 99.9% of the cellphone users that have an iPhone stolen doesn't know that there stollen iPhone can be put back on the network, activated and is being used by someone else (ATT and Apple are making money off of your stollen iPhone) This happened to me, I filed a police report and spoke to Apple and ATT both and was told that the stollen iPhone
Was Not put on the Blacklist so it could not be used on the network anymore. The detective said that they could easily idetify if the the iPhone was back on the network from its imei#, but that they could not do so unless there was an investigation and that the iPhone could be used to solve a more serious crime. It seems that what ATT and Apple are allowing to happen is definatly a crime.
I even had an person at ATT tell me that when she first went to work for ATT that in one of her first staff meetings this stolen phone blacklist was brought up and they were told that this blacklist is no longer used. She has worked in other cell companys for years and the blacklist was always used to keep stollen phones from ever being used on the network again.What I think is Really insane is that when anyone activates an iPhone on iTunes or a person does this in the store, why doesn't ATT or Apples system see the
imei# as stollen and stop it from being used. I will tell you why more$$$$

Sad Stuff

This is how it Suppose to work
This is from Wiki site

The IMEI number is used by the GSM network to identify valid devices and therefore can be used for stopping a stolen phone from accessing the network in that country. For example, if a mobile phone is stolen, the owner can call his or her network provider and instruct them to "blacklist" the phone using its IMEI number. This renders the phone useless on that network and sometimes other networks too, whether or not the phone's SIM is changed

 

[DougFNJ]

Violence? Where is the Violence here?

Yeah. Silly me. I guess I could help canvas the area for the missing kid that lives down the block. Or start night patrolling the neighborhood for the rapist that's been hitting our area the last month. (Since the NYPD is too busy booking Sid the 70 year-old barber it seems).

Dude, I don't begrudge law enforcement from fighting crime. But come on... a sting operation on dumbass citizens looking to score an iPhone? (Actually, not looking to score one because it's basically being waved in their face). Since I live here my priorities are different and I can think of better things for my tax dollars to be used for rather than protecting a company's $80b coffers.

So you are basically implying the NYPD doesn't multi task I guess? I assume you realize precincts are broken up into divisions that specialize in individual duties. It's not a free for all on jobs where cops volunteer in the morning who is handling murder, another raises their hand to handle violent criminal activies for the day. Each division is very highly trained to handle each job given.

I am also pretty confident that they weren't just walking from door to door to entrap as many businesses as they could to purchase these iPhones, but were most certainly following leads on businesses that already sell stolen goods

 

[PeterQVenkman]

Reminds me of gizmodo buying a stolen iphone. I'm still miffed they didn't go after them harder.

 

[nick_elt]

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Reminds me of gizmodo buying a stolen iphone. I'm still miffed they didn't go after them harder.

Stolen? It was left in a bar.....

 

[CrUmp]

I have a friend who owns a grocery store in Brooklyn, were offered by a possibly undercover cop to buy he's iPhone4s for under $200 a few days ago. he never mentioned that it was stole, all he said was that is an iPhone from AT&T. lucky he didn't buy it because he doesn't know the guy and the phone is too cheap to be real.. In certain area of NY people do sell there own stuff to small stores like that trying to make quick cash. and words like "hot" meant different things for different individuals. people got their iphones and other devices robbed everyday since the first iphone came out. why do you think NYPD doing this now? my guess is the holiday is coming.

 

[markyr17]

Yep. Stake out the local "Barbershop" and start canvasing those Supermarkets. For god's sake... doesn't the NYPD have anything better to do?

I don't understand how you don't understand this...? They are stopping all sorts of different crimes (violence, robbings, and even murders...) at the root! Less market for stolen iPhones = Less people stealing them. Simple.

 

[100Teraflops]

I don't live in The NYC, but isn't there a more important role for the police? I wonder if they have apple shaped badges. He He

 

[irun5k]

Stealing is wrong, but how is this not entrapment.

Maybe it isn't the textbook definition of entrapment, but consider the following:

1. Presumably, the police lied? The phones (assuming they actually showed the goods) weren't actually stolen?

2. How persuasive were the cops? Did they talk someone into doing something after they initially said "no"?

3. Why didn't the police spend their time actually looking for real iPhone thieves? I'd rather see 5 actual theft rings busted vs. 141 merchants arrested for buying make believe merchandise. I realize this would involve doing real police work. It is far easier to just walk around asking people if they want to do something illegal, and then handcuffing them when they say "yes."

4. What about the guy who would have backed out at the last minute? Or the guy who would have had regrets and would have eventually called the police himself/herself? Even if the percentage of this is less than 1%, it could still mean that someone fitting this description was arrested.

At any rate, it seems to me like a good defense attorney could win a case like this.

 

[PeterQVenkman]

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Stolen? It was left in a bar.....

"finders keepers" isn't a legal defense.

 

[irun5k]

I don't understand how you don't understand this...? They are stopping all sorts of different crimes (violence, robbings, and even murders...) at the root! Less market for stolen iPhones = Less people stealing them. Simple.

I disagree that this will have any meaningful impact on the market for stolen phones. In any big city there are countless avenues for rapidly liquidating stolen goods. Often it does not have the formality of a storefront.

 

[jellomizer]

Stealing is wrong, but how is this not entrapment.

Easy. They undercover officer told them it was stolen.
Entrapment would be more like the officer convinced the merchant the products were legit then sold them and then arrested him. Or the Officer threatened the merchant if he refused.

The same thing having a car unlocked with a tracker to catch car thieves.

In essence the bad guy made the decision to break the law. It isn't entrapment it is the guy actively breaking the law.

 

[Frankie4Fingers]

I don't understand how you don't understand this...? They are stopping all sorts of different crimes (violence, robbings, and even murders...) at the root!

iPhones are at the root of murder and violence in NYC? LOL! Dude, you need to get out of Manhattan.

And I re-read the article again... having a hard time finding all the violence and murders relating to the iPhone you speak of. Did you even read the original article from the NYPOST?

 

[dampfnudel]

Even if AT&T, Verizon, Sprint and T-Mobile blacklist stolen iPhones, what about carriers overseas? Those stolen iPhones could find their way to China, Russia or some other country.

I live in NYC (grew up here) and my iPhone stays concealed most of the time, especially on the subway. It sucks that I can't use openly everywhere I go, but that's the reality here. Too many young males walking around, angry, frustrated, feeling like there's no good future for them and stealing to make some quick cash that won't get them far. A sad reality for them and a potentially dangerous/life-altering reality for someone openly using their iPhone on the streets of NYC and other cities. It looks like it reached the point now where Mayor Bloomberg decided to turn up the heat on the NYPD to do something about it. Maybe one of his rich friends had their iPhone stolen at gunpoint.