Powerbook and PowerMac Updates - October 19th?

[barthrh]

I remember this- and it wasn't about editing images either, it was about organizing them. A professional version of iPhoto, not a Photoshop competitor. Contact sheets, RAW support, etc.

That's exactly how I remember it. iPhoto is nice as an all-in-one, but it does not work as well as I'd like it to if you use an external editor. I would expect that a "Photo Pro" organizer would nail that functionality.

 

[dongmin]

This is what Steve said at WWDC anyway. PMs = 2007.

Actually, no. He never mentioned any specific timeframe for any specific product. It's the rumor and media sources that have been filling in the gaps. As far as the official Apple party line goes:

First Intel Macs by WWDC 2006 -- meaning in could happen at the show or before.

Completed transition by end of 2007 -- most people are assuming that the Power Macs and Xserves will be the last to make the transition, hence the rumors that Power Macs will come at the middle or end of 2007.

 

[chromos]

Am I the only one who is still waiting on an ordered Power Book? I ordered my PB on the 1st of October... 15" 1.67ghz 128 video, and originally it was suppose to be shipped on or before the 4th. Apple is still telling me that they are processing the order. So does that mean that they are upgrading my laptop and are just waiting to realese the info (whenever they do) before they start building it? I have never heard of anybody having to wait this long for a PB; I'm sure its happened but I'm a bit surprised. Anybody have any input, at this point I would almost rather have my laptop the way I ordered it then wait for a whole month, especially since it was a replacment to my dropped Dell. Not to mention i'm deployeed and it will probably take another month to receive it after its been sent. Deployeed without laptop = suck fest.

Hey kodeman,

I've been watching PB ship times for quite a while now, and I saw that on Oct 2 the 15" BTO time was "2-3 weeks". A bit after that it dropped to "1-2 weeks", and now "5-7 days". The stock configuration had remained at around "24 hours" until yesterday, when it changed to "3-5 days". It certainly looks like the PB is counting down to a launch next week; perhaps it has been waiting on the GM for the 10.4.3 update (which may even be released today?). It sounds like you got caught in the transition between models.

My guess is that Apple will contact you and give you the option of changing your order to the new model...

 

[simon.brunner]

In my profession, we have been using powerbooks that are 2-3 years old and they are more than adequate for all kinds of audio/video work.. you have to have good peripherals like SCSI drives to make it rock. So I am curious as to what kind of power users are out here.. who keep lusting for the latest powerbook. Same with the PMG5.. studios still use G4 powermacs ..maxed out and they handle audio/video applications with ease.

So, are you lusting for a power increase in the PBooks/PMs because of.. what? Its like a bunch of people who look at the newest Porsche and go "Oh yeah!! nice update!!!" and if you ask them "Are you going to buy this?" they go "No, we just like to comment and whine..."

Java/J2EE development using a decent Java IDE like Eclipse or Intellij IDEA, Oracle 10g database and a J2EE server plus some other apps like Firefox, Terminal etc. is no fun at all on a G4 Powerbook. There are many java developers which aren't happy with the performance of the current Powerbooks (including me with 1.67 GHz and 1.5 GB RAM). And depending on your codesize, it's not waiting 10 instead of 4 seconds for the compilation of the app but something like 2 minutes versus 30 seconds...

 

[Durendal]

I smell bullcrap all over this one. The 7447A has a FSB of 166mhz. What the hell would be the point of stuffing DDR2 into that bottleneck? Even the 7448, which has a 200mhz FSB, would be questionable. And they will be using a 7448. I can't imagine there being so many problems that they wont even bump the speed up with a better processor.

 

[tekmoe]

i think we will all be surprised with the powerbooks that apple will release in the very near future...............

 

[cal6n]

Was that for real? That's funny but somone is going to lose their job! It's gone now though

Hey, did you hear? Oxford University Press have removed the word "Gullible" from their dictionary.

 

[danielwsmithee]

I hope SO!

On a serious note--the USB dongle modem on the new iMac kind of pissed me off...they wouldn't do that with the PB would they?

Edit: changed .3 gHz to .03 gHz.

I hope they do Modems are so last year and just add to the size and number of ugly ports! I would see them possibly providing one for free with the powerbooks as many used modems when on the road still.

 

[joser]

powemac updates!!

well, heres my $.02 cents on what i think..... for the powermac we will see a dual core 3.0 ghz pci-e video card and new memory at pc4200 ddr!!

 

[igetbanned]

Java/J2EE development using a decent Java IDE like Eclipse or Intellij IDEA, Oracle 10g database and a J2EE server plus some other apps like Firefox, Terminal etc. is no fun at all on a G4 Powerbook. There are many java developers which aren't happy with the performance of the current Powerbooks (including me with 1.67 GHz and 1.5 GB RAM). And depending on your codesize, it's not waiting 10 instead of 4 seconds for the compilation of the app but something like 2 minutes versus 30 seconds...

IMHO something else is wrong with java in general.

I don't know if the codebase has reached it's 'bloat point of no return' or what, but java is slow on most platforms these days.

 

[lcde]

I agree to an extent...my biggest wish is PCI-X graphics, but I somehow doubt the PB will get it. More likely we'll get an ATI 9800 that doesn't require additional R&D. I still would have liked to see the 7448, because although the actual gHz increase is pathetic the chip does have a 200 mHz FSB compared to the 167 FSB in the 7447A. The 7448 also reportedly uses much less power, which bodes well for heat and battery. It also would make slightly better use of the DDR2 ram, although even the 7448 wouldn't be able to use it to its full advantage. The DDR2 seems overkill to me, like something Apple threw in because it was easy and because it made the update look a little more "full," especially if we find ourselves stuck at 1.67 gHz 7447As until Intel.

PowerBook Speed Dump 2005

I'm kind of afraid now to purchase the PB. If they are having problems in the development how many problems will be in the product?

I want PPC. Mainly for geekdom.

 

[wdlove]

Actually, no. He never mentioned any specific timeframe for any specific product. It's the rumor and media sources that have been filling in the gaps. As far as the official Apple party line goes:

First Intel Macs by WWDC 2006 -- meaning in could happen at the show or before.

Completed transition by end of 2007 -- most people are assuming that the Power Macs and Xserves will be the last to make the transition, hence the rumors that Power Macs will come at the middle or end of 2007.

That sounds good to me. It will be an interesting next two years.

 

[eric_n_dfw]

IMHO something else is wrong with java in general.

I don't know if the codebase has reached it's 'bloat point of no return' or what, but java is slow on most platforms these days.

and what's your basis for that opinion?

edit: I ask because many developers whould beg to differ. Check these comparisons: http://www.idiom.com/~zilla/Computer/javaCbenchmark.html

Java can be faster than C/C++ due to JIT, runtime optimization.

 

[nagromme]

Isn't it true that Apple won't be switching the PowerMacs until end of 2007 as addressed by Steve Jobs?..

He never said that--I can see the Xserves being the last to change in 2007, while everything else goes Intel in 2006. Wouldn't surprise me.

Also, even if Apple DID intent that the PowerMacs stay PPC through 2007, they are free to accelerate their schedule if things are going well on the hardware (and apps) front. AI suggests that they are doing that very thing. Can't read too much into that, but I hope so!

I especially like the idea that POWERBOOK STAFF may have been pulled off of PPC PowerBook projects to work on Intel products!

Don't bet on it. Windows may run on the Devo boxes ... may ... however, I'm sure Steve doesn't want to makes his boxes vulnerable to Windows viruses, nor to give Bill Gates an angle into his company. JMO

Apple has already said they won't stop Windows from running on Macs. (It already does, at reduced speed, after all.) Apple won't support it or HELP make it easy, either--but someone will. And I bet it will be Microsoft. They already have VPC for Mac, and VPC for Windows PCs. A version of VPC for Intel Macs seems like a no-brainer, and not something Apple could easily stop.

Nor would they want to. The safety net of knowing you COULD by Windows for your Mac is a nice comfort zone for switchers. And it's not going to kill Mac OS: people won't buy a Mac and WANT to use Windows. They'll just do it if they HAVE to. Much like they now own VPC or a second PC if they have to. (Which is increasingly rare. 5 years ago I HAD to have a PC to work with my Windows customers. Now I don't.)

If anything, I think MS would be smart--long-term--to block Windows on Mac. But I don't think they'll be that smart. I think they'll help

As for viruses, if you boot to Windows that's your funeral, and Apple won't encourage that. But VPC running off a virtual HD is much safer: the virus can't harm the parts of your drive that you don't explicitly let Windows access. (Plus it's better than dual-booting because you can use ALL your apps, Mac and Windows, TOGETHER. And VPC launches instantly--not so Windows by itself.)

A VPC that uses multi-homing sounds interesting to me too.

 

[digitalbiker]

does anyone know yet....

will powerbooks with intel be able to run BOTH Mac OS X AND Windows XP?

Colorado School of Mines requires Win. XP - but I have an iBook now, and I'd like to purchase a powerbook for college....

No, they won't. And it's highly unlikely this revision of powerbook will be intel. To run windows, you have no choice but to buy a windows machine (other than VPC... which is way slow.)

Why do you say that? I think there is a better than 60-40 chance that the new Intel Macs will also be able to run windows. Apple will only restrict OSX to run on Macs not the other way around. I imagine we will see many people dual booting their machine with Windows & MacOSX.

I agree that this revision will not be an intel version but that isn't what was asked.

 

[lcde]

As for the PowerBooks, those upgrades sound pretty good as well, but I'm concerned when they say there may be no processor improvements.

Although its HIGHLY unlikely the MPC8641D is a 1.67 Ghz Dual core with 1MB of cache. This would be NO increase in speed but a huge boost in power. Plus i think they run pretty cool

Anyway... here's to dreaming:

MPC8641D
HD display
Dual Layer DVD-RW
iSight
biometrics?
PCIe

Getting pretty tired of my 900Mhz Intel Laptop (heh with dead battery )

 

[iGuy]

fax modems are still very useful in today's business world

I hope they do Modems are so last year and just add to the size and number of ugly ports! I would see them possibly providing one for free with the powerbooks as many used modems when on the road still.

is everyone on this board under the age of 10?

just because you don't have a use for it doesn't mean others don't

if we have become so self-focused that we can't even consider needs other than our own, then let the meteor come, we've outlived our tenancy on this planet

~dmg

 

[FCPnewbie]

Dual, Dualie

I think they should market this thing as the "Double Duce"
Put some flames on the side, lower it, and have the start up tone changed to "Lowrider".
When you open up the side there needs to be a picture of Jules Winnfield (Samuel L. Jackson, Pulp Fiction) staring back at you, emblazened with the words, "Bad Mother #%&*#$".

Yep, thats what they should do...

 

[themacman]

I'm kind of afraid now to purchase the PB. If they are having problems in the development how many problems will be in the product?

I want PPC. Mainly for geekdom.

they wouldnt realse a product with problems. Im shure the pb they realase will have very little to no bugs at all.

 

[hayesk]

and what's your basis for that opinion?

edit: I ask because many developers whould beg to differ. Check these comparisons: http://www.idiom.com/~zilla/Computer/javaCbenchmark.html

Java can be faster than C/C++ due to JIT, runtime optimization.

The reasons they give as to why Java should be faster can apply to C/C++ as well. For example, in the GC section, they say GC can allocate memory in the same space as recently allocated memory, thus improving cache hits. Can't malloc do the same?

 

[4God]

Ship times moved again....

Well, as of right now (8:53AM PDT) the 15" & 17" Powerbooks as well as the PowerMacs have a 3-5 day ship time. An indication of things to come? I've missed a few pages in this thread, sorry if this was posted already.

 

[igetbanned]

and what's your basis for that opinion?

edit: I ask because many developers whould beg to differ. Check these comparisons: http://www.idiom.com/~zilla/Computer/javaCbenchmark.html

Java can be faster than C/C++ due to JIT, runtime optimization.

Because I've used different java IDEs and different java based software, on both Win and Linux, and the bigger the program, the slower it runs.

And that link is pretty useless, some of it's sources are no longer available.

 

[ktlx]

No, no and no. I'm talking about PROCESSORS, not ISA's. Processor is not an ISA. Pentium 4 is not an ISA. but a CPU that implements certain ISA's. Opteron is not an ISA, it's a CPU that implements certain ISA's. You talk about ISA's, I talk about processors, and the two are two different things.

This is what you said:

If the develop for Dothan, all their software will run just fine on Merom, just faster . But if the would develop for merom (for example), they might grow accustomed to capabilites that would not be present in all future Macs (since some of them would use Dothan).

Speaking about "developing code" for a certain processor is non-sense. You develop code to a particular set of features supported by an ISA. AidenShaw is 100% correct in his explanation.

His example of the Athlon 64 is perfect. To say you develop code for Clawhammer or Winchester or San Diego makes absolutely no sense. You develop code for x86-32 or x86-64, using SSE2 or SSE3, etc. If you don't believe me, take the time to read a compiler manual. It will show all of the tweaks and flags a developer gets.

When Apple moves to Intel and what CPUs they select decides what the lowest common denominator will be. It won't be "Dothan" or "Mermom" or "Yonah", it will be x86-32 with SSE2, x86-32 with SSE3 or x86-64 with SSE3. The choice is critical because if the choice becomes x86-32 with SSE2, then the top end machines will be crippled without even fatter binaries that also include an x86-64 with SSE3 version.

 

[noel4r]

How much faster will the Dual Core PowerMacs be? Which programs will benefit from it?

 

[eric_n_dfw]

The reasons they give as to why Java should be faster can apply to C/C++ as well. For example, in the GC section, they say GC can allocate memory in the same space as recently allocated memory, thus improving cache hits. Can't malloc do the same?

Yes, but the GC takes the complexity of that out of the developers' hands.

Some would argue it leads to lazy programmers who rely to heavily on the GC though -- I'd agree, but that's not Java's fault. (Those same programmers are probably the ones who would probably be causing memory leaks and other bugs in C )