Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
PowerBook & eMac EOL'd?
- Thread starter Diatribe
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
darkwing said:
This would cause confusion in the product line. Right now, you can easily look at a PowerBook and tell from what generation it was from. If they, say, used carbon fiber for the new PowerBook G4 they introduce soon and then use it again for the PowerBook G5, there would be some confusion amongst consumers. It wouldn't be a good idea, imo. And anyway, why would Apple want to show a new chassis just to use it later in the PowerBook G5?
-Chase
Guys, why is this a big deal? It just means new PBs are on the way, it doesn't necessarily mean we're getting a G5 / new chassis / etc.
The M######/# number for the 1.25GHz 15" PB did not match either of the 15" Powerbooks introduced in April of last year. New generation products won't have the same numbers as their previous generation counterparts. New Powerbooks, yeah, but don't expect anything wild.
The M######/# number for the 1.25GHz 15" PB did not match either of the 15" Powerbooks introduced in April of last year. New generation products won't have the same numbers as their previous generation counterparts. New Powerbooks, yeah, but don't expect anything wild.
BlackDan said:
No dual-core. Freescale is *rumored* to be *sampling* the 8461D in the "Second Half" of 2005. So no dual-core PBs till WWDC2006 at the VERY EARLIEST. They need an entirely new architecture, the dual-core isn't a drop-in replacement for the 74xx series like the 7448 (First quarter 2005 sampling) is.
Same heat, better performance, same power comsumption, oh, and you forgot, the 8461 chips are arriving 1.5 years after the 970Fx chips so that's a pretty good headstart for engineering 970s into a laptop. The 970FX and the 8461 AND the 7448s all consume about the same.
darkwing said:
Historically, I don't think Apple has EOL'ed old powerbooks just for a speed bump.
So, it's either a DualCore G4 or a G5.
- Maybe IBM is ready with a cool running 970fx
or, FreeScale is ready with the Dual-Core G4.
In the past, Apple has released new Moto chips, and then Moto issues the press release. So, it's possible the G4 DualCore is now ready.
- Or, Apple is upgrading all powerbooks with a better graphics cpu.
- or, across the board much better FSB.
But, they've determined that the current crop of Powerbooks will not be desirable when the new ones are released.
- And, from previous president, the new models don't come out next week but could take up to a Month to show up.
Well, that's my 2 cents, I don't have to tell you to feel free to disagree.
dashiel said:
Agreed! There's no way in hell that Apple can have a G5 based PowerBook right now. The G5 still gets way too hot for a laptop and it uses too much power.
Just because they can fit it in a 2" iMac G5, doesn't mean it can fit in a 1" PowerBook. The iMac G5 has 3 fans in it, plus, the heat sink is taller than most people think. The iMac can use as much power as it needs. It doesn't depend on a battery to power it. It doesn't need to keep its back as cool as a laptop's bottom.
When IBM ships this low powered version of the G5, then you can start thinking about G5 PowerBooks.
panphage said:
Do you have the link to back this BS up?
If a PowerMac that uses this PPC970fx processor requires liquid cooling, then where's the gain in lower temperatures? Why does the iMac G5 need 3 fans? You certainly can't put 3 fans in a PowerBook and expect the battery to last.
MikeBike said:
Apple prolly has some stock stacked up in the warehouses so that will carry them till whenever they release the new ones, i hope we dont see the same thing happen as did with the imacs last year.
qzak said:jesus.. i don't even have a mac yet and i can't get away from this site! been reading it for a few months now, first time posting.
i'm looking to switch to a powerbook but like many others waiting for ANY KIND of upgrade before i go through with it. i watched the stream of MWSF and can't wait to get a 17" PB and test out those new features Tiger will have (once it comes out of course).
i wish Apple was more open on their forthcoming products, i think becoming a mac fan is gonna stress me out too much!
As a soon to be Switcher, do Windows folks get this stressed about rumored updates and such? I never read PC or Windows forums so I don't know. But I've never heard anyone say they were anxious for the next Windows or Intel upgrade. I do hear complaints that new upgrades are worse than previous versions such Windows 2000 vs Win '98.
Just curious
the_mole1314 said:
They didn't screw anyone over, most notably the taxpayer. eMac's are a terrific bargain. A few weeks ago Apple had some edu 1.0 Mhz 5-packs for 499 each. Add some RAM, good to go for a long time.
What am I going to do now? Spend 3 times as much for a G5 iMac, or get 1 GB of ram in a Mini and pay 1022.00... with no monitor, kb or mouse? Come on Apple. Farm out the eMac if you have to. Just keep giving schools the options they need.
Fender2112 said:As a soon to be Switcher, do Windows folks get this stressed about rumored updates and such? I never read PC or Windows forums so I don't know. But I've never heard anyone say they were anxious for the next Windows or Intel upgrade. I do hear complaints that new upgrades are worse than previous versions such Windows 2000 vs Win '98.
Just curious
honestly i've never read pc/windows forums either, never been big on forums. i know people do get very interested in the new version of windows considering, just like for the mac, there are sites that keep track of new versions with every little rumor etc. just like well... this site. hehe
but yeah, computer lovers are computer lovers, just ur preference has been a mac so far, they get excited bout the same stuff
mklos said:
Do a search for my posts. The link to the IBM PDF is in the other powerbook G5 thread.
Here, I did the work for you. You can find Freescale's information here: http://freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/overview.jsp?code=DRPPCDUALCORE including the 8461, 8461D, and 7448. This is the only mention of any timetables for the 8461s I can find. The powermacs require liquid cooling because Apple's system controller is a hot bastard. That's my guess. Do the iMac G5's require massive cooling? No. Maybe 2.5GHz consumes quite a bit more power than 1.4GHz? Maybe IBM's powerconsumption #s turned out totally wrong or are misleading like all other power consumption #s? I really don't know.
So you can take your "BS" and stick it in your #ss.
bye bye emac
I have a strong feeling now that the mini is out that they will do away with the emac. Part of the reason is a space issue. Students don't have a lot of space in the dorms so something like the mini with an LCD monitor(nobody said they HAVE to have a cinema display) makes more sense. Also Apple has the potential of making more money with the need for keyboard/mouse/extras as opposed to the emac coming with everything.
Apple stands to make more profit off the buy by the bit options that the mini offers. Look at the current purchasing generation. It's all about getting the base product and adding on until you get what you want. Have you people not seen the umpteen million Hondas on the road????!?!?
Hopefully the new Powerbooks will come out soon but who knows. I'm just holding with patience on that. My iBook runs fine and I can understand if I had a Pismo or older.
I have a strong feeling now that the mini is out that they will do away with the emac. Part of the reason is a space issue. Students don't have a lot of space in the dorms so something like the mini with an LCD monitor(nobody said they HAVE to have a cinema display) makes more sense. Also Apple has the potential of making more money with the need for keyboard/mouse/extras as opposed to the emac coming with everything.
Apple stands to make more profit off the buy by the bit options that the mini offers. Look at the current purchasing generation. It's all about getting the base product and adding on until you get what you want. Have you people not seen the umpteen million Hondas on the road????!?!?
Hopefully the new Powerbooks will come out soon but who knows. I'm just holding with patience on that. My iBook runs fine and I can understand if I had a Pismo or older.
WHAT THE HECK
Why are you stating useless rubbish like this?
Do you even know/understand what you are talking about? (Doesn't sound like it). I'm sure there were plenty of people like you flapping around on these forums last year saying 'they will never fit a G5 in a 2 inch thick enclosure.
IBM and Apple are on top of this thing, they are world class companies and it isn't rocket science getting a G5 into a portable machine, it's just a bit of clever hardware engineering work. It is not really anymore challenging than getting a G4 into a portable (half a decade ago). They have been working on cooling technology for about 18 months using technology from a US university and then started collabing with Cooligy later on. They have been working with IBM for god knows how long on a low power G5 variant, we will all find out soon enough!
Can you imagine Apples Desktop product lines being stacked with G5 processors whilst their portable line is dying in a corner. All this when their is a major OS release (Tiger, 64-bit) and an opportunity to market their work to the high heavens? They are making a big deal out of 64-bit when their OS isn't truely 64-bit (it's a semi 64-bit system that will be the real thing in a couple of years time). They are using these G5 and 64-bit buzz words to market their work and their 'POWER' portable line is not going to miss out on their 'pre planned' developments and 'pre planned' marketing hype. Apple tend to think ahead of the game (it's what you do in a successful business). If 3 years ago they were talking about releasing a OS that feeds on the 64-bit hype, then they were thinking about a complete 64-bit hardware change. Again this is not rocket science, just business. Something that people tend to forget with Apple.
NOW: Dual Core G4 Is NOT ready! (Freescale ARE Sampling 2h2005)
The Low Power G5 could be ready NOW, IBM and Apple are very secretive about their work and have been working on a portable G5 since Year 1 (Release 2 years after PM release it is the correct timing, if measured against the G4 developments).
If so the G5 is very likely to arrive at WWDC.
Boring 1.7Ghz is all we'll see within the next few weeks.
oh and welcome to Mac 'RUMORS' .com
mklos said:
Why are you stating useless rubbish like this?
Do you even know/understand what you are talking about? (Doesn't sound like it). I'm sure there were plenty of people like you flapping around on these forums last year saying 'they will never fit a G5 in a 2 inch thick enclosure.
IBM and Apple are on top of this thing, they are world class companies and it isn't rocket science getting a G5 into a portable machine, it's just a bit of clever hardware engineering work. It is not really anymore challenging than getting a G4 into a portable (half a decade ago). They have been working on cooling technology for about 18 months using technology from a US university and then started collabing with Cooligy later on. They have been working with IBM for god knows how long on a low power G5 variant, we will all find out soon enough!
Can you imagine Apples Desktop product lines being stacked with G5 processors whilst their portable line is dying in a corner. All this when their is a major OS release (Tiger, 64-bit) and an opportunity to market their work to the high heavens? They are making a big deal out of 64-bit when their OS isn't truely 64-bit (it's a semi 64-bit system that will be the real thing in a couple of years time). They are using these G5 and 64-bit buzz words to market their work and their 'POWER' portable line is not going to miss out on their 'pre planned' developments and 'pre planned' marketing hype. Apple tend to think ahead of the game (it's what you do in a successful business). If 3 years ago they were talking about releasing a OS that feeds on the 64-bit hype, then they were thinking about a complete 64-bit hardware change. Again this is not rocket science, just business. Something that people tend to forget with Apple.
NOW: Dual Core G4 Is NOT ready! (Freescale ARE Sampling 2h2005)
The Low Power G5 could be ready NOW, IBM and Apple are very secretive about their work and have been working on a portable G5 since Year 1 (Release 2 years after PM release it is the correct timing, if measured against the G4 developments).
If so the G5 is very likely to arrive at WWDC.
Boring 1.7Ghz is all we'll see within the next few weeks.
oh and welcome to Mac 'RUMORS' .com
Here, I'm done quoting marketing materials: http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/G5/xserveG5.html Some actual power use stats from some actual running Xserves. Here's the hilite:
Also some poopooing ultra-low-voltage 970FX chips for our imaginary G5 PB: http://www-03.ibm.com/technology/power/newsletter/august2004/article7.html "Today, a functional limitation exists in the 90-nm design, preventing operation below 1.0 V." You can see from this chart that voltage reduction offers better power savings than just stepping the frequency down.
Another guy posted his at a lower voltage but it doesn't show the processor power, just the voltages and currents and my EE isn't good enough (it doesn't exist) to calculate the processor power from that.http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/G5/xserveG5.html said:
Also some poopooing ultra-low-voltage 970FX chips for our imaginary G5 PB: http://www-03.ibm.com/technology/power/newsletter/august2004/article7.html "Today, a functional limitation exists in the 90-nm design, preventing operation below 1.0 V." You can see from this chart that voltage reduction offers better power savings than just stepping the frequency down.
no - roadmaps
Windows users don't need rumours sites - the software and hardware roadmaps are widely publicised beforehand. We knew that Prescott and Nocona and Centrino and Sonoma were coming for many months before the products were actually delivered by the cute guy in the brown shorts....
(Right now I'm trying out systems with XP 64-bit for EM64T, as well as Longhorn for both x86 and x64. The public preview for Avalon (think "Quartz Ultra-Hyper-Extreme") is also available - that's my play project for the weekend.)
Your example "Windows 2000 vs Win '98" is really quite ignorant. Win2K was an upgrade to Windows NT 4 - it was not a path from Win98. Anyone who thought that Windows 2000 was a Windows '98 upgrade was ignorant of the product planning.
According to Microsoft's well publicized roadmaps (I know that's hard for Mac fanatics to grasp) it was clear that Windows XP was the first NT-based system that was meant to be an upgrade for the home-focussed Win9x product set.
Fender2112 said:
Windows users don't need rumours sites - the software and hardware roadmaps are widely publicised beforehand. We knew that Prescott and Nocona and Centrino and Sonoma were coming for many months before the products were actually delivered by the cute guy in the brown shorts....
(Right now I'm trying out systems with XP 64-bit for EM64T, as well as Longhorn for both x86 and x64. The public preview for Avalon (think "Quartz Ultra-Hyper-Extreme") is also available - that's my play project for the weekend.)
Your example "Windows 2000 vs Win '98" is really quite ignorant. Win2K was an upgrade to Windows NT 4 - it was not a path from Win98. Anyone who thought that Windows 2000 was a Windows '98 upgrade was ignorant of the product planning.
According to Microsoft's well publicized roadmaps (I know that's hard for Mac fanatics to grasp) it was clear that Windows XP was the first NT-based system that was meant to be an upgrade for the home-focussed Win9x product set.
Mini Mac
When I bought my 1st Mac (7200/90 Power PC). I had to buy my own Keyboard an mouse. I thought that was stupid considering the $$ I paid. This mini thing could work. If your a switcher that already has a Monitor, Mouse and Keyboard. Does apple included USB adaptors to convert those funny little PC plugs to usb? Thats what they need for the best out of the box experience....
I hope something happens with the Powerbook soon. I'm ready for an update no matter what it is. I alreay have the G5 at home.
When I bought my 1st Mac (7200/90 Power PC). I had to buy my own Keyboard an mouse. I thought that was stupid considering the $$ I paid. This mini thing could work. If your a switcher that already has a Monitor, Mouse and Keyboard. Does apple included USB adaptors to convert those funny little PC plugs to usb? Thats what they need for the best out of the box experience....
I hope something happens with the Powerbook soon. I'm ready for an update no matter what it is. I alreay have the G5 at home.
Finally! An Intellectual Statement
I've talked about 64-bit quite a bit in my other threads. I totally agree with the whole 64-bit thing. But then again 64-bit hardware is always the foundation for 64-bit usage in the future. Before i talked about how the 386 (the worlds first 32-bit PC chip) and how it took 10 years until true 32-bit programs to take a surf (386 was the standard for DOS, Windows 3.0 to 3.1). It's not until Windows NT (a true 32-bit environment), which came out almost the same time as the release of 486. Actually it took 2 generations of CPUs running 32-bit until the true OS came out for it (Windows NT to Windows 95). Apple stating 64-bit processor is telling people, listen... we're setting the groundwork for the 64-bit future. In terms of the technology at this point, semi-64bit OS is a huge innovative advancement compared to the 32-bit evolution in the past. So with a semi-64-bit OS, Apple has provided a governing OS that can boost 32-bit programs to it's fullest potential enabling them to utilize Tiger's semi-64-bit set engines. So yea programs will remain 32-bit and it may mean nothing to us right now, but Tiger is introducing 64-bit useness giving lots and lots of room for awesome programs for the future.
What does 64-bit mean to us, again? It won't be the speed. If speed is what we are soughting after, it's the architecture of the chip handling larger System Bus speeds, and RAM. 64-bit, 64-bit, 64-bit... whatever... what we want is SPEED; 64-bit is attractive to the software developers and OS developers. For us consumers, we want speed. That all lies in the cache of the chip, system bus, ram... But mostly System Bus speeds which will determine the real speed of the computer.
Pringolian said:
I've talked about 64-bit quite a bit in my other threads. I totally agree with the whole 64-bit thing. But then again 64-bit hardware is always the foundation for 64-bit usage in the future. Before i talked about how the 386 (the worlds first 32-bit PC chip) and how it took 10 years until true 32-bit programs to take a surf (386 was the standard for DOS, Windows 3.0 to 3.1). It's not until Windows NT (a true 32-bit environment), which came out almost the same time as the release of 486. Actually it took 2 generations of CPUs running 32-bit until the true OS came out for it (Windows NT to Windows 95). Apple stating 64-bit processor is telling people, listen... we're setting the groundwork for the 64-bit future. In terms of the technology at this point, semi-64bit OS is a huge innovative advancement compared to the 32-bit evolution in the past. So with a semi-64-bit OS, Apple has provided a governing OS that can boost 32-bit programs to it's fullest potential enabling them to utilize Tiger's semi-64-bit set engines. So yea programs will remain 32-bit and it may mean nothing to us right now, but Tiger is introducing 64-bit useness giving lots and lots of room for awesome programs for the future.
What does 64-bit mean to us, again? It won't be the speed. If speed is what we are soughting after, it's the architecture of the chip handling larger System Bus speeds, and RAM. 64-bit, 64-bit, 64-bit... whatever... what we want is SPEED; 64-bit is attractive to the software developers and OS developers. For us consumers, we want speed. That all lies in the cache of the chip, system bus, ram... But mostly System Bus speeds which will determine the real speed of the computer.
t500 said:Does apple included USB adaptors to convert those funny little PC plugs to usb? Thats what they need for the best out of the box experience....
On two of our computers we use spillproof keyboards that need the ps/2 to usb connector (which btw were more expensive than the keyboards), they work fine, however, they do not operate as the apple usb keybards do when booting up and using the keyboard to reset pram, startup from cd or eject disk etc....
The computer does not seem to recognize the keyboard in time to use the keys to control pre-boot functions.
Bad news....
The EOL means that they will release an update soon. I bet in the next few weeks we will see an updated powerbook line. The bad news is that since it is done so quietly it is going to be a minor update (like the previous one). The bet would be for a small Ghz bump (using a freescale), maybe a faster burner(x8) and a faster video chip if you feel lucky.
Regarding the eMac, I think they will kill all together. Or if they don't I don't understand why they don't make a smaller iMac (15') with a G5 1.6 Ghz and make it go under the $1,000 mark - it would be a great replacement for the eMac and eliminate the CRTs from their product line.
2003 was the year of the laptop with the 17', 15' and 12'! That year there was nothing hotter than those laptops - so much that Apple computer sale was mostly laptops! (>50%)
2004 was the year of the desktop with the introduction of the iMac G5, new flat panels for our great desktops, and beefed up PowerMac with Dual all across while reaching 2.5Ghz.
2005 will be the year of ? Apple is entereing the cheap-ass market with the Mini-Mac and the iPod shuffle. This is a big change in the company strategy and I think it might unfortunately drain at first the resources of the dev pipeline to support this effort.
The future will tell, we know Tiger is around the corner and that the powerbook line is way under powered and outdated (I can't believe that an Mini-Mac at $499 is probably only 10-20% slower than the faster powerbook today). IBM is working hard to get some new proc ready for Apple, but my guess is that it won't be anytime soon. Maybe we will be surprised in September in Paris - but to be thruthful I think that the great moment we are all awaiting for will be next year.
This is the sad prediction of a Mac enthusiast!
The EOL means that they will release an update soon. I bet in the next few weeks we will see an updated powerbook line. The bad news is that since it is done so quietly it is going to be a minor update (like the previous one). The bet would be for a small Ghz bump (using a freescale), maybe a faster burner(x8) and a faster video chip if you feel lucky.
Regarding the eMac, I think they will kill all together. Or if they don't I don't understand why they don't make a smaller iMac (15') with a G5 1.6 Ghz and make it go under the $1,000 mark - it would be a great replacement for the eMac and eliminate the CRTs from their product line.
2003 was the year of the laptop with the 17', 15' and 12'! That year there was nothing hotter than those laptops - so much that Apple computer sale was mostly laptops! (>50%)
2004 was the year of the desktop with the introduction of the iMac G5, new flat panels for our great desktops, and beefed up PowerMac with Dual all across while reaching 2.5Ghz.
2005 will be the year of ? Apple is entereing the cheap-ass market with the Mini-Mac and the iPod shuffle. This is a big change in the company strategy and I think it might unfortunately drain at first the resources of the dev pipeline to support this effort.
The future will tell, we know Tiger is around the corner and that the powerbook line is way under powered and outdated (I can't believe that an Mini-Mac at $499 is probably only 10-20% slower than the faster powerbook today). IBM is working hard to get some new proc ready for Apple, but my guess is that it won't be anytime soon. Maybe we will be surprised in September in Paris - but to be thruthful I think that the great moment we are all awaiting for will be next year.
This is the sad prediction of a Mac enthusiast!