Powerbook G4 1GHz/Superdrive

[Mr. Anderson]

So this would make it a Rev D or E? I've lost track.

I'm thinking I'd like to upgrade mine, but it won't be possible anytime soon, I'll just have to be envious for a while......the super drive would be great - I'm drooling already.

D

 

[Blackcat]

Originally posted by sparkleytone


wrong.


in OS X, all apps can take advantage of MP. thats why dualies are a huge improvement in OS X. Just play with a MP machine with the CPU monitor on, and run any app. SMP support in the kernel.

No, OSX can't make apps MP aware but it can manage properly threaded apps efficiently. If the app itself is not multithreaded it will gain nothing by having more CPUs.

However, while a single CPU system is running everything on one G4, a dual CPU system won't be slowed down by an app that's not multithreaded because it can use the other G4 for the rest. Run 3+ non multithreaded apps and things might slow again.

Fortunately, most modern apps are multithreaded so OS X can do it's thing.

 

[iShater]

Originally posted by Blackcat

I'm guessing the Ti800 will drop to 667 price but may stay the same specs, but a new Ultimate 1Ghz model with Superdrive will be added. Either on Sept 26 or Oct 1.

I hope there is some sort of a price drop for the entry level. $2,449!! 😱

The last configs I believe were starting at 2199 or was it 2299? that was more reasonable.

 

[dongmin]

Originally posted by Blackcat

I find rumour snobbery deeply childish. MOSR is as accurate as any other site, that's what the R means. If it was called MacOS Facts then sure, they're crap. I particularly dislike the attacks on Meader himself. People run rumour sites for fun, that's all.

I disagree. Yeah they're all "rumor" sites but some are more reliable than others. Some sites, like Thinksecret, are consistently right on and have reliable sources, and some, like MOSR or Spymac, completely make their stuff up.

Personally, I'd wait to see what other sites report before getting too excited about what MOSR is claiming.

 

[blackpeter]

Originally posted by iShater


I hope there is some sort of a price drop for the entry level. $2,449!! 😱

The last configs I believe were starting at 2199 or was it 2299? that was more reasonable.

Yeah, me too. An 667 or 800 would be just fine for me at the right price.

 

[Blackcat]

Originally posted by dongmin


I disagree. Yeah they're all "rumor" sites but some are more reliable than others. Some sites, like Thinksecret, are consistently right on and have reliable sources, and some, like MOSR or Spymac, completely make their stuff up.

Personally, I'd wait to see what other sites report before getting too excited about what MOSR is claiming.

Well, MOSR has been the last to report this, it's been here, AI, SpyMac, ATAT and o'Gradys for 4 months or more. But Rumours cycle anyway, the recent iPhone thread here was copied from AI, ThinkSecret regurgetated a SpyMac story last week etc etc. Nobody knows the truth except Apple.

As for SpyMac, they've become accurate enough for Apple legal to get upset but are mostly a news site now.

 

[awrootbeer]

lol you guys, let's talk about the actual rumor, not the credibility of the source. As pointed out, the name of the site contains an R, not an F.

I think they will go to 1Ghz, but forget Sdrives.

Peace out.

 

[robguz]

Originally posted by Yosh


That's not really true. A 1 Ghz TiBook would perform all non MP aware tasks as fast as a Dual 1 Ghz tower and, as it stands, MOST applications do not take advantage of dual processors. With respect to the 800, I'm not sure what you mean. The 800 Mhz TiBook DOES have a 1MB L3 cache. If you are saying the desktop 800 did not, you are correct. However, the desktop 800 was not Apple's fastest offering when the 800 TiBook arrived - the dual 1Ghz Quicksilver was released about 3 mos before the 800 Mhz TiBook and the dual 1Ghz had 2 MB of L3 cache per processor.

As I worded it, I said the 800 tower lacked the L3 , not the Ti. I did not argue portables should be the same speed as the fastest desktop. I argued they should be at least as fast as the slowest tower. A single 800 is a bit slower than the DP 867 in some things, and much slower in anything using DP or even using the finder or multitasking even with non-DP programs.

I was actually just playing with an 800 at the Apple Store an hour ago. And while it's not a slouch, it isn't zippy either. On simple things like using the finder and launching programs, the 800 iMac felt a bit faster (maybe because of the faster HD in it). Because of the 4200 RPM internal drive in the Ti, program launching felt even slower than on my Ti 550 with an IBM 40GNX drive in it. I actually thought iPhoto might have crashed since it took several seconds to finally be ready to use. I'm suprised Apple hasn't done more to spur Ti sales such as dropping the prices in light of 5 months since the last speed bump and the much faster speeds and lower prices of the competition.

 

[Yosh]

Originally posted by sparkleytone

in OS X, all apps can take advantage of MP. thats why dualies are a huge improvement in OS X. Just play with a MP machine with the CPU monitor on, and run any app. SMP support in the kernel.

Yes. OSX can take advantage of MP, but the improvement is not "huge". Just look at the benchmarks. There are some apps where the dual processors make a significant difference, but not many. Sure MP helps when you are running several apps, with different tasks running in the background. But, when running one single non MP aware application, OSX does not automatically divide the workload between the 2 processors.

 

[Yosh]

Originally posted by Blackcat


I find rumour snobbery deeply childish. MOSR is as accurate as any other site, that's what the R means. If it was called MacOS Facts then sure, they're crap.

"Rumor snobbery" has nothing to do with it. MOSR and all the wilder rumors sites can do whatever they want. But, the reality is, when people start believing in their rumors - which have been 100% inaccurate for a very long time - it only ends up causing resentment against Apple and lowers sales as people are waiting endlessly for these alleged super systems which never appear.

OTOH, a site like ThinkSecret has posted rumors which have proven to be fairly accurate and helpful.

Don't you think it's getting ridiculous when people begin to give advice on what systems to buy and what systems to wait for based on completely unfounded rumors? In dispensing this advice some people state these rumors as if they were absolute certainties. That hurts EVERYONE. It discredits the person giving the advice, takes away current sales for Apple, causes the person who is asking for the advice to wait unnecessarily and causes resentment when Apple does not live up to these ridiculous expectations.

 

[Blackcat]

worst case...

So, lets assume the new Powerbook does not have a Superdrive...

What are the options for burning DVDs? I can't find any reviews of the Formac Devideon system, and the Lacie drive doesn't have authoring software. Are there others?

 

[daRAT]

The superdrive is a must, those books are high end, and have no dvd recording ability, it seems a logical step to me. As for a 1ghz processor, that seems a bit much (re; cooling), unless Apple has a liquid cooling system in the works (I believe Toshiba makes a liquid cooled notebook), and Apple is a inovative company.

The superdrive and a faster video card seem reasonable for a upgrade. I would be more interested in Ibook updates, a Ibook is where I am leaning toward 😛

Finally, who cares if it is rumors or fact? At least we can pass the time having fun speculating between upgrades 😀

 

[Over Achiever]

Originally posted by daRAT
As for a 1ghz processor, that seems a bit much (re; cooling), unless Apple has a liquid cooling system in the works (I believe Toshiba makes a liquid cooled notebook), and Apple is a inovative company.

Lets see, of 1 GHz is too hot, imagine what a dual will do!😛

Anyway, a liquid cooled laptop is possible, but not practical. It'd be nice because it can dissipate heat (c'mon duals!😎) but it'd draw too much power. Laptops need to be energy efficient...liquid cooling will stay in desktops where they stay on the desk.

As for the energy efficiency question...the superdrive will draw quite a bit of power, no? I understand they will be in laptops though, but I doubt Pioneer has made a superdrive that can fit in the tibook...other laptops...quite possible. Just look...laptops are chunking up to 2.2" thick!

 

[daRAT]

Actually, a New Hampshire company several years ago came up with a passive system (I am going by memory here), of a two chambered "pillow" that had dieelectric fluid that when heated to a certain temp changed state to a vapor and passed through a barrier taking the haet with it, then when cooled changed state again to a liquid and somehow got back to the lower chamber to once again begin the cycle. Forgive me, but it has been awhile since I read the article. I did find a few links to other liquid cpu cooling projects, and liquid cooling units. They are tricky it seems.


Sorry for the OT post 😀

 

[guenesis]

daRat,

Your memory serves you correctly. I do know of a chemical called perfluorocarbon, trade name Fluorinert, that belongs to a class of heat transfer media used for cooling electronics. It does have a high dielectric strength. What you've basically described is a refrigeration cycle, which uses mechanical or heat energy to bring about a change of state in a refrigerant, which in turn removes heat from a location where it is objectionable to a location where it ain't.

Apologies to all for my OT reply to an OT post. 🙂

 

[daRAT]

Originally posted by guenesis
daRat,

Your memory serves you correctly. I do know of a chemical called perfluorocarbon, trade name Fluorinert, that belongs to a class of heat transfer media used for cooling electronics. It does have a high dielectric strength. What you've basically described is a refrigeration cycle, which uses mechanical or heat energy to bring about a change of state in a refrigerant, which in turn removes heat from a location where it is objectionable to a location where it ain't.

Apologies to all for my OT reply to an OT post. 🙂

I knew my memory wasn't that bad 😛

Yes I knew it was a refrig cycle, what I failed to describe is that it was a passive system, no mechanical means for fluid movement. I am having flash backs to my engineering exam now 😛

Again apologies for the OT ...🙄

 

[nixd2001]

Originally posted by Yosh


Yes. OSX can take advantage of MP, but the improvement is not "huge". Just look at the benchmarks. There are some apps where the dual processors make a significant difference, but not many. Sure MP helps when you are running several apps, with different tasks running in the background. But, when running one single non MP aware application, OSX does not automatically divide the workload between the 2 processors.

From what I've seen, this holds true when the code being executed is actually within your application. But as soon as it starts talking to NS/Cocoa classes, Apple have the chance to think about spawning multiple threads. In particular, when it comes to anything to do with with graphics, I think Jaguar does a good job. Try a simple single threaded app that does some graphics work (like displaying any results) and the CPU meters seem to go up in parallel. Apple have long operated an approach of putting as much work as they possibly can within classes/code they control, which permits this sort of optimisation - I think this is a sensible move on Apple's part as it gives them tremendous flexibility.

 

[iShater]

Re: worst case...

Originally posted by Blackcat
So, lets assume the new Powerbook does not have a Superdrive...

What are the options for burning DVDs? I can't find any reviews of the Formac Devideon system, and the Lacie drive doesn't have authoring software. Are there others?

Well, here's a question. Can non-superdrive equipped Macs burn VCDs through bundled software?

Apple has been pushing the TiPB for a while as the ultimate portable studio. But without a DVD burner, I am assuming all files had to be stored on the HD until taken to a "homebase" where there is a superdrive Mac. Correct?

 

[Postal]

I'm more interested in the iBook rumours, myself. They're not TOO plausible, and I'm sure a few people would object to increasing the size of the base model (many buy the 12" for the whole subnotebook ability), but I'd love it if a 14" widescreen was available... baby TiBook! 🙂

 

[kuzelnik]

I said it first

Remember me? I said about 2 weeks back that Powerbooks were coming in October. This was from a friend who works at Apple. I'm glad that this is slowly being confirmed by other "sources".

My "inside person" now also mentions that there is a possibility they might not get the SuperDrive to fit properly and they have considered an external FireWire version (powered through the FW bus).

This wouldn't be so great for those who are drooling for an internal drive (for all the obvious reasons), but it would be great for all existing Powerbook owners (or any laptop with FW for that matter) to be able to get a slim, portable SuperDrive (Ti design, of course).

I hope to get some more inside info over the next week or so . . . 🙂

 

[Kilchzimmer]

Re: worst case...

Originally posted by Blackcat
So, lets assume the new Powerbook does not have a Superdrive...

What are the options for burning DVDs? I can't find any reviews of the Formac Devideon system, and the Lacie drive doesn't have authoring software. Are there others?

I had looked into that option as well with the PowerBook (ext. DVD burner) but my biggest hangup was that, besides paying for the additional cost of an external DVD burner, I would also have to dish out the $1,000 for DVD Studio Pro to make use of it, not to mention having another program to learn (with a bit of a learning curve) .... when the iDVD software included with Mac OSX would suit my purposes just fine.

- Tim

 

[shadowfax]

i think there are a number of things apple needs to do to its powerbook line ASAP... for me, sans winXP, an IBM thinkpad with that radeon 9000 mobility is a serious head turner... not to mention displays on PCs with those ultra XGA screens with so many pixels... and that good ol' DDR ram and high-clocked P4's... i won't advocate any PC laptop, for obvious reasons (incl. heat, batt. life, size)--but the powerbook line benches on being a desktop replacement with the size and weight of an ultraslim... for it to fall so far behind the apple desktop line and PC desktop replacements... something has to give. i think it should be obvious, as so many are saying, that apple has got to update this thing in October. it can't wait till January. that would be totally unfeasible. look what's happening to nVidia because it skipped its processor cycle. uncool. who's going to spend 3200$ on a laptop with only a 32 MB video card... the same price that everyone had to pay almost six months ago for the same thing? that would be unthinkable for any other tech company. i know this is how apple does things--it has a slower upgrade turnaround--but something's got to happen very soon.

the only problem is, if my outlook counts for anything, that powerbook isn't some arbitrary laptop with good specs. people who buy them don't say, "well, i could have gotten the dell or the compaq for just as good a price.. it was kind of a toss up;" people fall in love. it's not all about performance, at some level. i hope apple doesn't bank on that.. i think it should be rewarding user loyalty rather than taking advantage of it... which would be the plain and simple fact of what they would be doing in holding new PBs till MWSF Jan.

i really hope this thing is right; it makes perfect sense, and i want to cash in with a 1 GHz model with the 9000, lol. the 167 MHz bus would be nice too, but if there are heat and power issues, i say to hell with it. same with the superdrive, though i can imagine that would be a major selling point... the powerbook is pitched to a market of users, it seems, very willing to spend vast amounts of money for cool things, or the companies of professionals who actually need something like that... as long as i don't have to pay for a superdive on the one i buy; that's far too expensive.

 

[moby1]

This sounds much more plausible

Originally posted by kuzelnik

My "inside person" now also mentions that there is a possibility they might not get the SuperDrive to fit properly and they have considered an external FireWire version (powered through the FW bus).

This wouldn't be so great for those who are drooling for an internal drive (for all the obvious reasons), but it would be great for all existing Powerbook owners (or any laptop with FW for that matter) to be able to get a slim, portable SuperDrive (Ti design, of course).

I just cannot beleive that they could fit that monster Superdrive into a Ti.

An Apple branded external FW solution seems much more reasonable and it'd generate more cash flow since existing Ti owners and even some desktop or iMac owners might pounce on it.

I'd probably buy one too.

 

[solvs]

A GHz CPU, and 64 MB video card, would be nice. And needed. Soon. But I'm trying not to get my hopes up. As far as the Superdrive, what if they did the same thing they did with the combo drive. Release the 1 GHz, 64 MB with a new combo drive and add a DVD-R later. Hey, it could happen.

I was gonna buy an iBook in a couple of months and a Tower later, when I could afford it (now that Towers can have larger than 137 GBs - 200 GBs be darned, Maxtor 320s here I come), but I guess now I could buy a PB. When it has the Superdrive, at least as an option.

I can always get an external 200 GB+ hard drive to play with.

Portable video editing!!! Though I'd still love a faster iBook. The TiBook just seems so fragile for a portable (and HOT). Plus, the 800 just isn't attractive enough for me right now, and it's way too expensive. But if I'm carefull with a GHz Ti (and get a lap protector, or not put it on my lap), and get an external monitor, I think I'd be happy.

Especially if it was ~$3,000.

As far as the MOSR thing is concerned, read some other posts about them to see how we feel about their credibilty. Especially with the recent post they had about wanting someone to send them a Radeon 8500 with ADC (for those keeping track, there is no such creature). Makes them look relaly credible.

For the record, they may be doing it for fun. But they do get paid for it (advertising). And they are putting this out as fact. It's not. Even if everything they say comes true (HA!), it's just speculation. A lot of people aren't taking what they hear with the grain of salt they should be. IT"S NOT EVEN A RUMOR, they ARE just making stuff up based on what they've read from other sites.

And SpyMac lost most of their credibiltiy with the whole iWalk thing. At least they've learned their lesson. If MOSR was to be belived, we'd have had Dual 1.6 G5s a year ago.

No wonder Apple is pissed at the rumor sites.

 

[Blackcat]

Re: This sounds much more plausible

Originally posted by moby1


I just cannot beleive that they could fit that monster Superdrive into a Ti.

An Apple branded external FW solution seems much more reasonable and it'd generate more cash flow since existing Ti owners and even some desktop or iMac owners might pounce on it.

I'd probably buy one too.

It fits nicely with Apple killing off OWCs external iDVD compatibility patch. There was no reason to unless they either had their own version ready or were about to release a Superdrive Powerbook.