PowerPC Macs Are Useless...

[TheShortTimer]

I'm with you regarding online music - having my entire collection dangling on the end of an internet connection with no backup is not a route I ever want to go down.

The same goes for video content. Renting my films and TV programmes over the Internet every month is not an option. There have been situations where streaming services have refused to carry titles that are controversial, have presented films in the wrong aspect ratio and many titles, quite simply, are not even available. Plus, streaming services often only hold the rights to content for a set period.

Tying this into PPC Mac's, even my iBook G3 can play DVDs and a large selection of standard-def video files but Netflix would require the minimum of a Core Duo machine (using Silverlight 4) to view those same titles online: at standard-def. Why would I dispose of my DVDs and Blu-rays for that model? That's without even considering the loss of extras such as audio commentaries, isolated scores, features, deleted scenes and so on.

We're being steered towards a scenario where the consumer no longer owns a physical copy of their entertainment media and this is promoted as "progress." Many of those who applaud this will not realise the implications till it is too late.

 

[Appleuser201]

I used to have an intel Atom powered netbook. That thing was so terrible I think it's outperformed by a Clamshell G3, even on the internet.

I agree that people are too quick to write off aging technology. The work of great people on the MR forums and others have allowed my Mac Pro and white Macbook to see over 10 years of regular use, not to mention PPC macs! My daily driver phone is a Galaxy S5. I think people miss how much money they could save by using a device that's just a couple years older and can still do everything they need.

My new main machine soon will be an eMac G4 1.42ghz which I will easily be able to overclock to 1.5 or 1.67ghz. With 2GB of ram, Leopard installed, photoshop, iMovie, word processing and updated web browsers, this thing will easily be able to handle all my needs even better than my iBook 1.33ghz/1GB already can. Why spend $2000 on a new mac when you can do the same things on something that's $50? I'm not a hardcore gamer or video editor, I just need a basic machine for web browsing, youtube, movie watching (720p) and light photo/video editing which any G4 can easily handle with the right software, as well as Front Row for media.
[doublepost=1567611456][/doublepost]

The same goes for video content. Renting my films and TV programmes over the Internet every month is not an option. There have been situations where streaming services have refused to carry titles that are controversial, have presented films in the wrong aspect ratio and many titles, quite simply, are not even available. Plus, streaming services often only hold the rights to content for a set period.

Tying this into PPC Mac's, even my iBook G3 can play DVDs and a large selection of standard-def video files but Netflix would require the minimum of a Core Duo machine (using Silverlight 4) to view those same titles online: at standard-def. Why would I dispose of my DVDs and Blu-rays for that model? That's without even considering the loss of extras such as audio commentaries, isolated scores, features, deleted scenes and so on.

We're being steered towards a scenario where the consumer no longer owns a physical copy of their entertainment media and this is promoted as "progress." Many of those who applaud this will not realise the implications till it is too late.

There is even something called ''Netflix DVD'' for people who borrow DVD's online (for a monthly fee).
PPC's might not be able to play Netflix (just yet), but any PPC machine with a DVD drive can play any of the hundreds of thousands of movies that can be rented through dvd.netflix.com including all the latest releases like Avengers Endgame.

 

[TheShortTimer]

There is even something called ''Netflix DVD'' for people who borrow DVD's online (for a monthly fee).PPC's might not be able to play Netflix (just yet), but any PPC machine with a DVD drive can play any of the hundreds of thousands of movies that can be rented through dvd.netflix.com including all the latest releases like Avengers Endgame.

Yep, I'm aware of DVD rental services, including Netflix's exclusive U.S. operation but thanks for the reminder. As of 2019, 2.7m people in the U.S. continue to use that service.

The observations were about streaming services in general and the issues arising from media content only being accessible online, which is a model that many companies, especially Amazon are increasingly pursuing.

 

[z970]

I think people miss how much money they could save by using a device that's just a couple years older and can still do everything they need.

And it is for this reason that I think I will never own a "new" phone, computer, or much anything, especially when everything nowadays has a camera, microphone, and SmArT FuNcTiOnAlItY, no matter what it is.

Yeah, no thank you. I'll take the 15 year old technology that respects your privacy and doesn't compromise your securital integrity by including unnecessary sensory apparatuses, management engines, and sneaky terms / agreements chock full of gotchas...

 

[z970]

We're being steered towards a scenario where the consumer no longer owns a physical copy of their entertainment media and this is promoted as "progress." Many of those who applaud this will not realise the implications till it is too late.

Exactly. Nailed it on the head...
[doublepost=1567617260][/doublepost]

My new main machine soon will be an eMac G4 1.42ghz which I will easily be able to overclock to 1.5 or 1.67ghz. With 2GB of ram, Leopard installed, photoshop, iMovie, word processing and updated web browsers, this thing will easily be able to handle all my needs even better than my iBook 1.33ghz/1GB already can. Why spend $2000 on a new mac when you can do the same things on something that's $50? I'm not a hardcore gamer or video editor, I just need a basic machine for web browsing, youtube, movie watching (720p) and light photo/video editing which any G4 can easily handle with the right software, as well as Front Row for media.

Excellent choice, sir.

 

[Dronecatcher]

We're being steered towards a scenario where the consumer no longer owns a physical copy of their entertainment media and this is promoted as "progress." Many of those who applaud this will not realise the implications till it is too late.

I guess the younger generation won't know any different - my daughter plays music all the time but doesn't own any content whatsoever.

 

[Haemoglobin]

And then when Apple remove music from their library or add a new U2 album, people flip, how dare you mess with my music. Did you read your terms of service? No? You don't own that music you bought on iTunes, nope, we can do what we like. Where as anyone tries moving the records out of my house and they'll get a size 9 suppository

 

[Dronecatcher]

You don't own that music you bought on iTunes, nope, we can do what we like.

I don't remember the details now but years back I downgraded my media box, a Core Solo Mac Mini, to an eMac 1.42 - instantly all my bought music from iTunes couldn't be accessed. From that point on I made sure nothing I owned had DRM.

 

[Haemoglobin]

I have purchased two albums via iTunes, but I wouldn't cry if I lost them. Most of my digital music is bought online from reputable sites who don't use DRM. I then stick them on my 1st gen iPod two batteries later and still ticking.

 

[Appleuser201]

Exactly. Nailed it on the head...
[doublepost=1567617260][/doublepost]

Excellent choice, sir.

I have purchased two albums via iTunes, but I wouldn't cry if I lost them. Most of my digital music is bought online from reputable sites who don't use DRM. I then stick them on my 1st gen iPod two batteries later and still ticking.

Still listen to music almost daily on my iPod nano 5th gen, and iPhone 3G (both 8gb models) and they both sound great, I don't use any streaming services or any Apple Music that 1.) requires monthly payment 2.) internet connection

 

[Haemoglobin]

The only annoying thing I had was sourcing another white firewire cable for my iPod or the original white headphones.

 

[TheShortTimer]

I don't remember the details now but years back I downgraded my media box, a Core Solo Mac Mini, to an eMac 1.42 - instantly all my bought music from iTunes couldn't be accessed. From that point on I made sure nothing I owned had DRM.

Remember the suitably chilling story of Anders G. da Silva, whose trio of film purchases vanished from his iTunes account after the content provider told Apple to pull them from sale?

https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/20...-itunes-movies-apple-can-delete-them-anytime/

In short, as da Silva came to find out, we never really “buy” digital content. It’s at best a rental, given the legal control that content sellers keep to themselves and the ease of getting at – and deleting – cloud-stored data. You’re better off buying a DVD, he noted: at least it’s a physical thing that Apple can’t get at unless it sends armed iMilitia.

Emphasis mine.

This is the real reason that Apple was never keen on Blu-ray and has phased out optical drives from their products. They've long desired an eventuality where their online service is our default option to obtain media content because it's a commercial avenue that Apple profits from and can exert absolute control over. They can't send the "armed iMilitia" into your homes to stop you using DVDs or Blu-rays so the next best thing is to remove their availability to you on their products and make you pay for it as a peripheral.

The computer industry has followed their lead and phased out optical drives on most laptops and many desktops. Yes, you can purchase an external drive but shills in the media are effectively crowing that optical formats are dead as of 2019 etc. and the public are falling for this nonsense.

Putting this into the context of PPC Macs, we have a paradox where machines on a platform that is older and has been abandoned by its manufacturer actually possess in many ways, greater functionality than their successors. A computer that's deliberately non-user servicable with soldered RAM, a glued in battery, trackpad and keyboard, that omits an optical drive, has just a single port and can be brought down by a speck of dust, is "useless" to me.

 

[Slix]

For those wondering - all iTunes purchases bought after 2007 when iTunes Plus came around were DRM-free, meaning once you download them, you can move them wherever and copy them to as many computers as you wanted - even PCs, PowerPCs running pre-iTunes Store versions, or however many Macs you want, you can do whatever with them. That's how I made most of the ringtones for my iPhone over the years, from purchased tracks.

Now, the few dozen songs I have that are still DRM-locked from before then... I'm working on those slowly but surely by buying used CDs.

@TheShortTimer hits it right on the head. Owning stuff sometimes just has its benefits. People obviously prefer ease of use and simplicity, but if I own a movie I want to watch more than once, I can pop it in anytime, with or without internet, on any machine that has a capable drive or DVD player and go. Bonus content is usually worth it alone. I usually pull out a PowerPC for DVD playback since it doesn't fuss about it, and the DVD Player controls are so good!

 

[eyoungren]

I guess I just split the difference.

Any music I've ever liked or desired has always prompted me to purchase a record, a tape or a CD. If I don't, then either I don't like that music enough to care or the artist doesn't care enough to provide one. If the latter, then I pay for a download of the highest quality they offer, which I then backup or burn while using other tools to create MP3s.

Since I started buying CDs in mid 1995 my entire library has ultimately been ripped by iTunes to MP3 and the digital copies are located in a variety of places but chiefly exist on Google Play Music.

In 1997 a number of my CDs were stolen, but have since been replaced or are irrelevant enough to me that I've forgotten about them. Again, I get a CD of what I like and then rip it.

I could lose my entire digital library of MP3s tomorrow if Google decided to do something and I'd still have only the music I truly care about because I bought or acquired a physical copy while a digital copy is still sitting DRM free inside iTunes.

If I truly want it, I find a method to obtain it without DRM.

 

[Dronecatcher]

Now, the few dozen songs I have that are still DRM-locked from before then... I'm working on those slowly but surely by buying used CDs.

I had over £1000 of DRM content - it took a long time to output it in real time (the only way) to MP3

 

[pochopsp]

A PowerMac G5 can now play Original Xbox and some very-early alpha Xbox 360 .xex. I'm not joking..
(...)

I have found a nice video of that on Youtube :

 

[sunapple]

I don’t think they are useless at all, unfortunately society has metamorphosed over the years. To the point at which the adage “make do and mend” is almost alien to most under 30. We live in a time where people throw away a year old phone like a pair of old shoes.
To me, I find it frankly disgusting, but what do I know? I’m an ageing 39 year old guy who regularly listens to his 30+ year old records. Because no matter how many people tell me streaming is the way to go. I like the old fashioned human ritual of holding the album in my hand and knowing that so long as there’s power, I don’t need an internet connection to access my music. £9.99 a month for Spotify, £25 for internet, so over £30 a month for easy access to music. Convenient? Yes, cheap it ain’t. A shelf costs less and I just get out the chair on put the album in the hi-fi lol

Apple used to be about bringing computers to people who didn’t realise what they were missing, changing their lives through technology. Least that is the impression one gets from interviews, documentaries, Pirates of Silicon Valley, Jobs etc etc. Woz wanted to make a cool computer for everyone to enjoy, Jobs maybe saw it as an opportunity, a form of expression, who really knows *shrug* One thing for certain, it ain’t the company it used to be. Apple used to be the expensive computer few of my friends could afford, but really wished they had. The first time I used a desktop PPC Performa at collage was 1997, it was light years ahead of the Windows 95 system I had a home.

The only real limitation is software, as other have said. The hardware is more than capable of getting the job done, albeit a little slowler than modern tech on occasion.

I love that people are still using PPC hardware and showing that it's still capable of not only simple tasks, but also a lot of heavier work. However, I don't really agree with the sentiment that I've seen in this thread that everything new, or the even the current society is all that bad (set off by a meaningless internet comment on Facebook...).

Times change, the world is moving forward and that comes with costs (this is not exclusive to Apple BTW). Not owning entertainment media, monthly subscription costs and glued-shut iPhones and Macs are amongst those costs. There are many positive developments too, like increased performance, thinner/lighter and more efficient hardware, an array of new features and lots of convenience in streaming and cloud services.

I respect that people stand by their beliefs and go through considerable lengths to avoid any new developments in tech, staying exactly where they want to be. But with that being said, I think it's not fair to discredit the people who use the latest hardware and put up with said costs, just to enjoy the latest and - supposedly - greatest.

Most people are not capable of replacing their hard drive or tweaking their OS, most people don't even care about what computer they have and get a new one when the old one slows down as they would have done 10 years ago too. iPhones have very long life cycles, they get passed down to family or sold second hand - who trows away phones anyway? Spotify subscriptions are as common as CDs once were and people who listen to playlists or random newly released albums easily spend less money than they would've using iTunes or physical media (one CD a month is easily reached, not counting internet costs which are fairly standard and used for more than music to most...).

I own a 53-year-old car that could get me where I want to go, could very well do a daily commute. However, I much prefer a modern car with modern safety, Apple CarPlay, comfortable ride and enough power to get me on the highway past a lorry. Can't repair my own generator like I did in the old car though, everything is much more expensive too. I guess I'll deal with that while my neighbor drives his classic car to work every day. To each their own

 

[eyoungren]

I love that people are still using PPC hardware and showing that it's still capable of not only simple tasks, but also a lot of heavier work. However, I don't really agree with the sentiment that I've seen in this thread that everything new, or the even the current society is all that bad (set off by a meaningless internet comment on Facebook...).

Times change, the world is moving forward and that comes with costs (this is not exclusive to Apple BTW). Not owning entertainment media, monthly subscription costs and glued-shut iPhones and Macs are amongst those costs. There are many positive developments too, like increased performance, thinner/lighter and more efficient hardware, an array of new features and lots of convenience in streaming and cloud services.

I respect that people stand by their beliefs and go through considerable lengths to avoid any new developments in tech, staying exactly where they want to be. But with that being said, I think it's not fair to discredit the people who use the latest hardware and put up with said costs, just to enjoy the latest and - supposedly - greatest.

Most people are not capable of replacing their hard drive or tweaking their OS, most people don't even care about what computer they have and get a new one when the old one slows down as they would have done 10 years ago too. iPhones have very long life cycles, they get passed down to family or sold second hand - who trows away phones anyway? Spotify subscriptions are as common as CDs once were and people who listen to playlists or random newly released albums easily spend less money than they would've using iTunes or physical media (one CD a month is easily reached, not counting internet costs which are fairly standard and used for more than music to most...).

I own a 53-year-old car that could get me where I want to go, could very well do a daily commute. However, I much prefer a modern car with modern safety, Apple CarPlay, comfortable ride and enough power to get me on the highway past a lorry. Can't repair my own generator like I did in the old car though, everything is much more expensive too. I guess I'll deal with that while my neighbor drives his classic car to work every day. To each their own

I don't believe anyone here is anti-new technology. Okay, most of us here aren't. I use lots of newer tech each day.

What we are however, is anti-obsolescence by design. We are anti-invasion of privacy/rights. We are anti-removal of features for reasons other than advancement of technology (such as restricting users).

New technology offers a lot, but it also comes with restrictions. The 'most people' you mention are willing to accept those restrictions because it's convenient. For the rest of us, convenience isn't necessarily enough. There are other things that older technology provides that benefit us. Stuff that through design has been removed or neutered while talked up as a benefit.

You used a car as an example. I'm going to use Disk Utility since we are talking Macs in this thread.

DU under modern versions of OS X is far less powerful than DU under Leopard/Tiger or before. That's because Apple believes that it should control certain features of OS X and not let you control them. 'Most people' don't care and don't even open DU. But the option to use past features of DU isn't even available to other users (such as us).

Moving on…SIP. Great idea for protecting Macs. Only, if you want to customize your Mac, you start running into problems that can only be solved by disabling SIP (if you can at all in later versions of OS X).

Again, not 'most people'. Fair enough.

But 'most people' aren't in the PowerPC forum of MR. They moved on years ago. We're what's left.

 

[z970]

@eyoungren *SIP (System Integrity Protection)

 

[eyoungren]

@eyoungren *SIP (System Integrity Protection)

Thank you! Fixed.

iPhone on the brain.

 

[sunapple]

I don't believe anyone here is anti-new technology. Okay, most of us here aren't. I use lots of newer tech each day.

What we are however, is anti-obsolescence by design. We are anti-invasion of privacy/rights. We are anti-removal of features for reasons other than advancement of technology (such as restricting users).

New technology offers a lot, but it also comes with restrictions. The 'most people' you mention are willing to accept those restrictions because it's convenient. For the rest of us, convenience isn't necessarily enough. There are other things that older technology provides that benefits us. Stuff that through design has been removed or neutered while talked up as a benefit.

You used a car as an example. I'm going to use Disk Utility since we are talking Macs in this thread.

DU under modern versions of OS X is far less powerful than DU under Leopard/Tiger or before. That's because Apple believes that it should control certain features of OS X and not let you control them. 'Most people' don't care and don't even open DU. But the option to use past features of DU isn't even available to other users (such as us).

Moving on…SIP. Great idea for protecting Macs. Only if you want to customize your Mac you start running into problems that can only be solved by disabling SIP (if you can at all in later versions of OS X).

Again, not 'most people'. Fair enough.

But 'most people' aren't in the PowerPC forum of MR. They moved on years ago. We're what's left.

The examples you mentioned are more specific than what I replied to, coming from a metamorphosed society, but I could understand how those restrictions are reason enough to stay with a system that works.

BTW I'm using a 2018 Mac mini, but if I look to my right there's a perfectly fine G4 Cube sitting in a case. I feel almost guilty that it's sitting there unused for so long, I wish it was on my desk instead of that black box. Read the entire thread, made me very nostalgic again.

 

[Haemoglobin]

I'm not anti progress, I drive a modern car, I have a modern phone and own a reasonable amount of modern technical aids. But neither do I believe all progress is good.

I think the basis of digital media is great as a convenience. But I feel it's intentionally been rigged to give the consumer less rights. DRM-free media is a great move forward, didn't know Apple had done that. I'm surprised, but pleasantly surprised.

 

[2984839]

I'm anti anti-old technology.

 

[Haemoglobin]

I read that and thought anti old technology why are they in here then? Missed the second "anti" didn't I! DOH!

 

[Appleuser201]

I have found a nice video of that on Youtube :

Ive been waiting forever to play GTA San Andreas on the G5...