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PPC Mac Gaming Thread

Thanks again, I passed that hurdle but now there's a new error message:

dyld: Library not loaded: /usr/local/lib/libX11.6.dylib
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I did some Googling and it's connected to X11 not being installed but I can see its icon in the Utilities folder.
 
Attached the x11 libs. Copy them to /usr/local/lib/ . This might work, but i fear when that guy built xmame he didn't mpkg it (where it includes all required files to run), and it's going to be missing many more files. At any rate install these and give it a shot. If you receive more error messages, i'd give up on it, or install macports and build it yourself so that it's done properly. :)

Cheers
 

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wicknix said:
Attached the x11 libs. Copy them to /usr/local/lib/ . This might work, but i fear when that guy built xmame he didn't mpkg it (where it includes all required files to run), and it's going to be missing many more files. At any rate install these and give it a shot. If you receive more error messages, i'd give up on it, or install macports and build it yourself so that it's done properly. :)

Cheers
Click to expand...

Much appreciated. Your fears have been realised because even with everything present in the right places, XMAME still reports that it cannot find the lib that has been copied into the correct location! All the other PPC MAME variants they'd offered have the same issue. 😂 😮 I haven't seen anything like this since my misadventures with bugged Windows drivers. Needless to say, I've given up on that.

Moving on...

Via SMS Plus v.132 on my G3/500:

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The performance is ok, nothing more. MasterGear seems better but is probably hindered by being run through Classic instead of OS 9 natively.
 
Anybody here get Shadow Warrior to work on OS X? When I try to play it on my iBook G3 and G4, the menus are frozen but I can still move through them, but when I start the game it crashes instantly.
 
retta283 said:
Anybody here get Shadow Warrior to work on OS X? When I try to play it on my iBook G3 and G4, the menus are frozen but I can still move through them, but when I start the game it crashes instantly.
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Just tried it with my iBook G3 running Tiger and I have the same problem. With Classic, I'm able to get as far as selecting the options and then starting a new game but then it crashes and returns me to Tiger. I think that it requires OS 9 to work correctly.

Speaking of First Person Shooters, Dark Forces also requires OS 9 for the best results. It does run under Classic but the frame tearing and sluggishness makes it effectively unplayable.

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TheShortTimer said:
Just tried it with my iBook G3 running Tiger and I have the same problem. With Classic, I'm able to get as far as selecting the options and then starting a new game but then it crashes and returns me to Tiger. I think that it requires OS 9 to work correctly.

Speaking of First Person Shooters, Dark Forces also requires OS 9 for the best results. It does run under Classic but the frame tearing and sluggishness makes it effectively unplayable.

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I get a lot of frame tearsing and glitchy things when I play any of the iD Software games like DOOM. I think these shooters need OS 9 to work properly.
 
retta283 said:
I get a lot of frame tearsing and glitchy things when I play any of the iD Software games like DOOM. I think these shooters need OS 9 to work properly.
Click to expand...

It certainly seems that way. When it comes to older Mac gaming titles (up to 2001), Classic simply isn't up to the task to do them justice. For example, even the PPC enhanced version of The Fate of Atlantis, which itself is hardly taxing for the G3/G4/G5 CPU series', suffers from so many issues under Classic (jerky and flickering graphics and a constant hour glass) that it's unusable and this is on a Sawtooth with a 1.25Ghz CPU and 1.5GB RAM!

In contrast, it works perfectly under the Mac OS X version of ScummVM on my comparatively puny G3/500 with 640MB, so that shows you how inefficient Classic is in this respect. To really get the best out of PPC gaming, I'll have to restore OS 9 to my PPC Macs that can run it.
 
z970mp said:
@TheShortTimer I've found that if you already have a .wad, ZDoom is really great. - Their website even continues to host the final version for PowerPCs...

https://www.zdoom.org/downloads
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I tried it on my G3/500 and it ground the computer to a halt. Even just trying to scroll up and down on the menu page was agonisingly slow and when I eventually managed to start a new game, it ran at about 6 frames per minute. :O

Does it require a G4 as the minimum?
 
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TheShortTimer said:
I tried it on my G3/500 and it ground the computer to a halt. Even just trying to scroll up and down on the menu page was agonisingly slow and when I eventually managed to start a new game, it ran at about 6 frames per minute. :O

Does it require a G4 as the minimum?
Click to expand...

It's Doom, so you would think it requires very little to run smooth...

I've only tested it on a G5 and Pentium III 600, and it ran great on both. Very smooth.

This is very strange... Could you try a different OS on your G3 and see if it runs?

EDIT: I just remembered reading somewhere that the Doom shareware .wad and the Doom Ultimate .wad (which is what I have) can have varying results across different engines.

So, maybe ZDoom isn't a good solution for the shareware .wad, but should be used for the Ultimate .wad, at least as far as Doom 1 goes...
 
z970mp said:
It's Doom, so you would think it requires very little to run smooth...
Click to expand...

That would be the logical conclusion. I remember playing Doom at full speed and full screen on a 486DX2/66 in the mid 90s but it will not work on a 2001 G3/500.

PrBoom won't even launch and Doomsday crashes due to failing to find OpenGL, even though it's present...

z970mp said:
I've only tested it on a G5 and Pentium III 600, and it ran great on both. Very smooth.

This is very strange... Could you try a different OS on your G3 and see if it runs?
Click to expand...

What do you have in mind? A dual boot with Panther? I think ZDoom requires Tiger. Also, my 10GB HDD has less than 3.5GB so I'd need to replace the drive with a larger one before I can set up an additional OS.

z970mp said:
EDIT: I just remembered reading somewhere that the Doom shareware .wad and the Doom Ultimate .wad (which is what I have) can have varying results across different engines.

So, maybe ZDoom isn't a good solution for the shareware .wad, but should be used for the Ultimate .wad, at least as far as Doom 1 goes...
Click to expand...

I've tried several different .wad files and the performance is unchanged. The sluggishness feels a thousand times worse than Windows 95 with 4MB on a 386: yes, that bad. :oops:

However, on the bright side, I did manage to get this working:

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It's a Mac OS X universal binary port for Tiger and later. You can download it from here.

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I had to lower the game resolution from 1024x768 to 800x600 on my G3/500 because of slowdown, which is perplexing because the original DOS release worked on a 286 and blazes along under a 386/SX and Doom Legacy, which is far more graphically intensive, runs at full speed using the maximum resolution! Nonetheless, this is great stuff. :)
 
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@TheShortTimer Very, very strange...

I would test the Ultimate .wad if you can, available off Steam or the Doom Wiki. Otherwise, we must get to the bottom of this.
 
@z970mp I've tested the Ultimate .wad and the result has been identical.

So that you can see exactly what happens, here's a short video that I made with my phone. The sluggishness leads to the wrong option being selected and so I have to restart the game and when the level eventually loads, you'll note the low frame rate and movement and this is despite me keeping the directional keys held down, something that ordinarily would cause constant and rapid activity.

 
@TheShortTimer I wasn't doubting you.

I wish they had more information available about that Mac download. Maybe ZDoom 2.8 takes specific advantage of AltiVec? - To be fair, I've only tested it in Leopard. Maybe this is a Tiger issue?

If one of the older versions from the Archive section doesn't work, perhaps we should label DooMLegacy best for G3s or Tiger and ZDoom for G4s / Leopard and up...
 
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@z970mp Oh no, that video was for you to see first hand just how bad it was, as my description really didn't do it justice. 😂

Yeah, there isn't much information beyond details of which folders you need to create. Being persistent and perseverate to point of masochism, I went through the archive of Mac releases and tried the earliest version: 2.6.0 and it wouldn't even start. Neither would 2.6.1.

In for a penny, in for a pound, I refused to give up and then tried 2.7.0 and behold! :D

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There's a tad of slow down occasionally but it's really minor and I prefer this port to DoomLegacy because it has greater functionality and accuracy.

I think that you're right that 2.8 requires AltiVec in some capacity and it also very likely uses routines that the ATI Mobility in my G3/500 either lacks or cannot cope with. Shall we label ZDoom 2.7.0 best for G3s/Tiger and subsequent versions best for Leopard and the G4/G5s? :)
 
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There's also 2.7.1. Did you try that, or is it the same case as with 2.8?
 
Just tried 2.7.1 and I can confirm that it also works. :)

Odd that the versions older than 2.7.x do not run. At least we have confirmed the availability of two releases that are compatible with G3s and Tiger. 👍
 
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An id Software hat-trick. :)

GLQuake, powered by the DarkPlaces engine on my G3/500.

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This was interesting case. It needs a G4 or better for fluid gameplay: on my Mini this screams along but visibly struggles on the G3, particularly during intense moments of combat against multiple enemies. The sluggishness was so severe that I found myself unable to respond quickly enough to enemy attacks and was killed in situations where ordinarily I would've prevailed.

It seemed odd, given that the original system requirements of Quake and of that GLQuake on the Mac are hardly demanding. Perhaps the coding for the DarkPlaces engine is inefficient or relies on AltiVec for increased performance.

Not wanting to give up too easily, I downloaded from "The Garden" the Mac OS X GLQuake version by Fruitz of Dojo and the difference in performance is like night and day. :D The same game now runs like lightning on my G3 and I was rapidly reminded of what a joy Quake is to play.

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Hopefully this information is helpful to PPC gamers so that they know which versions of titles will work best on their machines, especially those towards the lower scale of specs.
 
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Just got around to testing ZDoom 2.8.1 in Tiger, and can confirm a slow down, even on my mighty G5. Tried 2.7.1, and it was smooth as butter.

Perhaps it's not an AltiVec issue after all, but being that 2.8 released in 2016, it's logical to assume it might have needed newer libraries that Tiger didn't have. But 2.7 from 2013, did not.

EDIT: Added.
 
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Thanks for the confirmation @z970mp. I'm definitely sticking with 2.7.1 in that case. :)

Is it possible to set up MacMAME to run directly from Terminal but without invoking the GUI frontend? I suspect that doing so would free up a considerable amount of CPU cycles towards the emulation and game performance.

I've succeeded in browsing to Applications and then selecting "Show Package Contents" with the MacMAME application, from which I find my way to Contents and MacOS and then I've dragged the MacMAME executable into the Terminal.

From there I then type:

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Instead of MacMAME proceeding to load the game, it instead loads the launcher from which you can select the game of your choosing.

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Is this just the way that MacMAME was programmed or is there some way to override the launcher and force it to go straight to the game?
 
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