Psystar Releases 'Rebel EFI' Software to Enable Installation of Snow Leopard on PCs

[rhpenguin]

So I glanced over all 15 or whatever pages and didn't really see much worth commenting on. Typical fanboy banter. But, I tried the "demo" to boot my retail 10.6 on my Hac (see sig for specs) and it booted flawlessly. I didn't use their app to "setup my devices" because I don't want to pay $50 when I'm completely capable of doing it myself.

Installed PCEFI, added my device ID to the graphics driver and put my audio .kext in /S/L/E. Flawless Hacintosh. I was able to upgrade to 10.6.1 right from System Update. This was certainly easier than the last method I used to install 10.6 (my boot132 cd wouldn't boot SL). I had to install from 10.5.

Anyway, thanks to Pystar for the loader. Quite awesome. And if you do a little reading, you don't have to pay the $50.

 

[macerroneous]

What is Apple thinking?

OK, assuming Psystar is a real company that actually wants to turn a profit by selling a product (as opposed to a shell that was created to bring down the Apple business model), I think what they are doing now makes sense. They figured out they can't make a profit selling unsupported POS boxes with OSX installed. So, now they figure they can make $50 pure profit selling 'borrowed' software instead.

But, I can't figure out what Apple was thinking. This Psystar thing has been going on for a year, so Apple had plenty of time to build "protection" into their Snow Leopard release. How about labeling it "upgrade only". Or, charge $300 with a rebate if you register with your Mac's serial number? Or, put the SLA highlights on the outside of the box.

Instead, they practically give away a full install of what they purport to be the greatest OS on earth! Evidently they want to be pirated. What other conclusion makes sense?

Do you think someone at Apple believes it benefits them if people are running their OS (unsupported) on another company's hardware? Either that or they need to dismiss their legal team!

 

[hitekalex]

So I glanced over all 15 or whatever pages and didn't really see much worth commenting on. Typical fanboy banter. But, I tried the "demo" to boot my retail 10.6 on my Hac (see sig for specs) and it booted flawlessly.

LOL.. my sentiments exactly.. bunch of Apple fanboy sheep equating breaking the EULA with "theft" and "piracy". Quite a sad show really..

 

[nevadadude]

PC Laptop Install of Snow Leopard

I just installed this on my brothers laptop. Works great

Page 21 Entry #516

Would you provide the details on the Brand, Model, and Technical Specifications of the portable computer that you modified with the Pystar-EFI install of Snow Leopard? This would be of considerable help to others contemplating such a hack.

 

[Maximara]

It may be early in the lawsuit, but with 40 other mobile phone companies entering into licensing agreements with Nokia, it's most likely that Nokia has a valid claim and its just business as usual for Apple when it comes to using someone else's IP.

Go read the Universal vs Nintendo case for an excellent counter point to that argument. Just because the majority believes someone has a valid claim doesn't mean they actually do. Despite the majority of people being contacted believing Universal had rights to King Kong it turned out it was public domain--a point proven by Universal's own lawyers.


In this case Apple was paying royalties to InterDigital, Qualcomm, and Tessera. The problem is Qualcomm lost a patent infringement lawsuit to Nokia so there is likely a money issue regarding if Apple owes more for the patents that in good faith it paid Qualcomm to use andwhole whose of fun things the average Joe wouldn't understand.

 

[Maximara]

"Just works"

Do you mean it just works with office 08 and Word being terribly slow, or that they just released an osx fix where lots of users were having stalling issues with safari? Or how about the fact that the MBP runs scorching hot when running bootcamp?

It just works is a marketing ploy. Apple still has their share of problems.

Two of those problems are Microsoft related. Instead of having the fan fun at 2000RPM Microsoft in it typical piece of programming has it run at 1000RMP without the proper driver. As for office 08 and Word well Microsoft again shows is programming genius...

 

[SMCX]

Then they ether will release it soon or really do not use any GPL code.

Bear in mind that all eyes will be over this product now, IF they use GPL code, it will come out rather sooner then later.

Until this is proven, accusations of Psystar violating oss licenses are groundless.

As I said in a previous post, it's not GPL it's worse, the code they used is under APSL.

I've compared the binaries

 

[iofgondor]

This is obviously a fifth column effort funded by some shadow figure from the Windows world or someone with a personal grudge against Apple or one of its top management persons. I hope we eventually find out who the Daddy Warbucks behind all this is. Who could that be?

Maybe apple? trying to see if the market will go for it?

 

[Zaap]

So I glanced over all 15 or whatever pages and didn't really see much worth commenting on. Typical fanboy banter. But, I tried the "demo" to boot my retail 10.6 on my Hac (see sig for specs) and it booted flawlessly. I didn't use their app to "setup my devices" because I don't want to pay $50 when I'm completely capable of doing it myself.

Installed PCEFI, added my device ID to the graphics driver and put my audio .kext in /S/L/E. Flawless Hacintosh. I was able to upgrade to 10.6.1 right from System Update. This was certainly easier than the last method I used to install 10.6 (my boot132 cd wouldn't boot SL). I had to install from 10.5.

Anyway, thanks to Pystar for the loader. Quite awesome. And if you do a little reading, you don't have to pay the $50.

Nice. And no wonder- your Gigabyte UD3P motherboard runs OSX flawlessly as if it were made specifically for it. Most people having trouble with this are probably using random PCs with all sorts of unsupported hardware. As for hardware that's already known to work great for Hackintosh, proof of concept is already there, this is just yet another in a long list of install methods, albeit, easier than most for SL thus far.

Might have to give this a go on my own Gigabyte-based Hackintoshes just to see it for myself.

As for all the *yawn* EULA noise:

I've always found the actual controlling law clause in the Leopard EULA to be quite interesting, IE:

12. Controlling Law and Severability. This License will be governed by and construed in accordance with the laws of the State of California, as applied to agreements entered into and to be performed entirely within California between California residents. This License shall not be governed by the United Nations Convention on Contracts for the International Sale of Goods, the application of which is expressly excluded. If for any reason a court of competent jurisdiction finds any provision, or portion thereof, to be unenforceable, the remainder of this License shall continue in full force and effect.

Any of the "great legal minds" here care to comment? Apple doesn't cite International law, or US Federal Laws, or copyright laws, but specifically California state law, and even narrows that down to agreements between residents of the state. I'm no lawyer, but that reads to me like Apple isn't even trying to pretend they can cite actual national and international copyright laws backing up their EULA.

Also the 'oh, and just in case any of this is unenforceable' clause pretty much sums up the whole can of worms to me- they can state whatever they like in the EULA, but if it's not legally enforceable, then big whoop. Quite simply, if there is no actual law -local, state, federal or international- that prohibits me from installing a copy of an OS I purchaced on hardware I purchaced. That's the real act involved in any of this. Apple's corporate wishes aren't law.

What's the real penalty (based on a REAL law that is, not anyone's imagination) for violating a company's EULA? Voiding liability on Apple's part for having to support OSX or be responsible for it in any way on my hardware. Fine with me. Don't need their support. At their end, the 'penalties' against me for doing so are probably about the same as me removing the 'do not remove' tags off my pillows.

 

[MorphingDragon]

If I were to make a Hackintosh, I'd use something that pulls it off with a bit more finesse. Like EFI-X.

Plus the Phystar Computers looks plasticky.

 

[DirkBreeuwer]

Can someone tell me how psystar is managing piracy of this thing? (So I know weather to buy or to wait for a torrent).

 

[MorphingDragon]

Can someone tell me how psystar is managing piracy of this thing? (So I know weather to buy or to wait for a torrent).

Because according to these posts, no one seems to be able to buy a copy.

 

[-hh]

I don't feel like reading through 20 pages, however here are my thoughts...

1) Apple wouldn't be in this mess if they didn't convert over to Intel a few years ago.

Sort of. Continuing to have used a different CPU would have been a technical barrier, but it wouldn't have really addressed the non-technical (eg, legal) issues. As such, the "problem" would still exist, but without motivation to test it (via the relative ease of an Intel-based Hackintosh), this issue simply wouldn't have occurred in the here & now.

2) The long lawsuit with Psystar is an indication there are complexities to Apple owning the monopoly on where their software is installed.

But which is not unique to Apple: there's just a lot of "Apple Envy" because of the relative ease of availability of clone-able hardware, with OS X as a lusted-after product.

For example, there's a million Ethernet Routers that are a similar monopoly on their installed software...but because the marketplace is slightly different, there's no rush to buy Cheap Router X and hack the great software from Expensive Router Y onto it.

3) Apple really needs to reduce the price of their hardware to easily win this. It's difficult to fathom for MOST folks paying double+ for a mac than a PC.

There's a Catch-22 when it comes to hardware: Apple cannot compete with manufacturing economies of scale if they proliferate from a half dozen to a hundred different product variations.

As such, choosing a PC that's substantially cheaper because it is able to slot "between" Mac models is effectively an unfair comparison because this is artificially contrived to exploit Apple's products being more discrete (less continuous) on the price continuum.

Thus, when we look at the places where Apple does offer products (this is the old "same" comparison), we find that costs are only "double" when significant-to-Apple design factors are totally ignored (eg, form factor). Otherwise, prices are quite competitive...IME, typically within 10-15%. And that difference becomes even less profound when the product's lifespan is considered...eg, $100 on a $1000 laptop that lasts for 4 years = $25/year, or $2/month.

Overall, this isn't such a simple issue that broadly dismissive statements carry much credibility, which means that particularly the common "2x more" mantra only belongs in one place: the killfile.

Simple...
2 x 30 Inch displays on one Apple.
Not apple cinema displays.

All my workstations have 2 x 30 inchers on them...

I can understand there being some degree of interest in economizing with non-Apple displays...but a 30" LCD from a reputable company is still going to be in the ballpark of $1200-$1500 each, so we're looking at roughly $2500-$3000 for a pair of displays. Coupled with a workstation (yes, the exact term used) which costs how much more? Another $2K perhaps?

Being in the ballpark of a $5000 system, it is quite evident that this isn't anywhere close to a generic home consumer $500 machine. Further, its also quite evident that the potential cost difference between a workstation clone and a Mac Pro probably isn't all that large of a percentage...afterall, that $2500-$3000 in monitors won't change a dime. Finally, if this workstation is for use at a business, its all 100% tax-deductible, so the differences in capital costs likey matter even less...particualrly when being used by a skilled knowledge worker where having him come in to work on even but one Saturday can easily cost the company around $500 in overtime costs. Do that for one weekend per month and the annual cost is more than this entire workstation system.

There was a threat that Apple will get customer database from Psystar and hit on end users which purchased the product....

Damn Straight. If it were my IP that was being stolen, I would most definitely go after every possible buyer of those known-stolen goods.

It is very do-able, since server logs will have IP addresses and warrants to ISPs will turn up every customer's name & home address...crosswalked to credit card receipts forms a very solid legal case.

The only question is if fighting a theft in this fashion is a good or bad play ... not on the legal side, but on the side of public opinion. That is a different question.

I do not have to "explain" you anything, I have my reasons.

True, but by speaking up (eg, posting anything), your so-called 'reasons' are being invited for critique. If you don't like that, then you had better go cancel your account and never post again.

AFAIC, you have some preferences which appear capricious and arbitrary, and you appear to be personally assigning a huge amount of significance to what others may very well consider to be a relatively minor difference in capital costs, particularly when its amortized over a 3-5 year lifecycle.


-hh

 

[AlmostThere]

You can't argue with people like that. The sense of entitlement is strong within this one.

He doesn't understand Thomas Jefferson. He thinks "If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." means he gets to pick and choose based on his personal whim.

He has no idea what liberties mean, why the people fought for them and the sacrifices they had to make. Calling me a legalist means this is probably some wannabe punk that thinks he's "anarchist", yet probably has never read any of the works by Emma Goldman or Albert Camus on the subject.

His view of the world is "I get to do anything I want, and nothing should happen to me", when in fact Thomas Jefferson in his quote was describing civil disobediance in which you break the law and hope that you suffer every last consequence of it in order to build a case to have the law overturned. Even anarchists have written and realised that if "one lives outside society, he doesn't expect to be afforded the protections provided by society".

Yet this new generation, with their strong sense of entitlement, believe that it is they who should be sole judge of what is right or wrong. Society should not interfere with them, yet it should baby and protect them when in need. Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you (Disclaimer : yes, I realise the quote is reversed and this is done on purpose to illustrate my point).

That same sense of entitlement is all too present in corporate entities, like Apple (the banking sector and recording industries are also rife with good examples right now).

Your last paragraph could just as much be written about any one of a number of large companies; what the teenager can take through technological means, so companies can through litigation and lobbying.

 

[rhpenguin]

Nice. And no wonder- your Gigabyte UD3P motherboard runs OSX flawlessly as if it were made specifically for it. Most people having trouble with this are probably using random PCs with all sorts of unsupported hardware. As for hardware that's already known to work great for Hackintosh, proof of concept is already there, this is just yet another in a long list of install methods, albeit, easier than most for SL thus far.

Might have to give this a go on my own Gigabyte-based Hackintoshes just to see it for myself.

This machine was purpose built for doing this. Just like the machine before it (P5B/Geforce 7600). I've been doing this since the Intel switch and this is the easiest it's ever been. If you do go with a UD3P and want to take the easy way out, check out this.

To borrow a tagline from another firm, makes it so easy even a caveman could do it.

 

[pilotError]

If I were to make a Hackintosh, I'd use something that pulls it off with a bit more finesse. Like EFI-X.

Plus the Phystar Computers looks plasticky.

EFI-X borrowed from the open source community.

Why bother when you can put in a little effort and get it for free. Besides, the education you get about OS X is nice to have in the long run.

 

[twoodcc]

has anyone actually got this to work?

 

[pdjudd]

That same sense of entitlement is all too present in corporate entities, like Apple (the banking sector and recording industries are also rife with good examples right now).

There is a difference though. When you are a holder of copyright via intellectual property AND you are a business, the law obligates you to be defensive. Apple has to. The law mandates that you either defend your IP or you risk loosing it. You may consider it “entitlement” but the industry sees it very differently. They see it as the effect of having to deal with creative works. THey also see it as a legal requirement of doing business. They don;t defend their property, their shareholders get real angry.

 

[KnightWRX]

That same sense of entitlement is all too present in corporate entities, like Apple (the banking sector and recording industries are also rife with good examples right now).

Your last paragraph could just as much be written about any one of a number of large companies; what the teenager can take through technological means, so companies can through litigation and lobbying.

So you're saying it justifies the teenagers that act outside the law while still using the law as protection, thus applying morals selectively to social rules as they fit because companies work within the system, usually at very high costs, to obtain what the law is theirs ?

I don't see your point. Look at the SCO Group. They have been around for years, tying up the courts and just know we are seeing relief and they are seeing a big black hole. The system worked, but it takes years and a lot of cash. Companies don't just blow up the competition or hack into it to steal code. Hiring lawyers is not the same as going on The Pirate Bay.

But this isn't about Teenagers infringing someone's copyright. It's about another corporation trying to profit without working and people that feel that because it helps them, they should be able to.

 

[opeter]

How many times do we have to say it?

Apple went down this road ages ago, and got absolutely slaughtered (almost went under). Why the hell would they do it again?

Why does Apple do things like this?
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/807095/

 

[ranguvar]

I think it's good that PsyStar now actually sells their own product (as opposed to OS X on PCs). As long as they don't steal from netkas, one could think of their work as a commercial community contribution.

 

[KnightWRX]

Why does Apple do things like this?
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/807095/

What do you mean, patenting things ? I don't quite get what's wrong with that or what that as to do with Mac clones.

 

[pdjudd]

Why does Apple do things like this?
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/807095/

What do you mean, patenting things ? I don't quite get what's wrong with that or what that as to do with Mac clones.

To expand: Apple, like ever other company out there, patents tons of things that never ever see the light of day. I have seen websites devoted to showing such patents that are proposed purely for the purpose of preventing another company from implementing it for good or for bad.

There is absolutely no evidence that this technology exists anywhere outside of this patent. And, as KnightWRX points out, is an irrelevant point.

 

[MacKiddyWiddy]

pystar are unbelievably gay.... apples terms directly say that the os cant be installed on non apple hardware.... and apple will turn awful like windows when they have to be releasing all of these drivers for everything.. i like mac because it is unique and i want it to stay that way!

 

[CQd44]

pystar are unbelievably gay.... apples terms directly say that the os cant be installed on non apple hardware.... and apple will turn awful like windows when they have to be releasing all of these drivers for everything.. i like mac because it is unique and i want it to stay that way!

7/10, would wince again.