Sounds similar to how Intel was reporting it’s revenue was going to drop and then… Apple Silicon.
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Qualcomm Expects Apple Modem Revenue to Drop Faster Than Expected
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May be Apple decided mmWave is not worth it and don't even bother with mmWave in the US model.
I seriously doubt that… too many phones on Verizon or MVNOs using the Verizon Network. Unless Verizon has decided to phase out mmWave. And, after all the money they have put into it, I doubt that even more. Perhaps when we transition from 5G to 6G. Maybe everyone will decide then that mmWave isn’t needed. But that’s like 2030 or later.
jlc1978
macrumors 604
Could they , sure. Would they, unlikely.
That would requite an undertaking - renting space on towers, having antennas installed, etc.; and even then getting the kind of coverage the big 3 have would be very expensive and likely low margin. Apple would have to compete with the big 3 on price so the would be in a market vastly different from their existing ones. If Apple wanted to be a provider tehy'd have their own MVNO setup.
If satellite was cheap enough and fast enough, they could partner with an operator and create a truly international cell service, if they wanted. I suspect that s low on their priorities.
Given mmWave appears limited in scope and coverage, generally dense urban areas or venues, that is not out of the realm of possibility; it's more marketting than something most users need. I think I've seen TMob's UC a few times, and never. noticed the difference.
SactoGuy18
macrumors 603
I doubt Apple wants to drop mmWave because Verizon invested a LOT of money into that network, especially sports arena and stadium use. As such, the rumored C3 chip will likely include mmWave support.
Much of T-Mobile’s UC service uses mid-band spectrum. Of course, there is some mmWave spectrum being used. But not much by comparison. I think AT&T uses mmWave the least among the big three U.S. carriers and Verizon the most. Verizon has put literally billions of dollars into mmWave facilities. I don’t expect them to give up on it anytime soon. Maybe with the 6G transition.
SactoGuy18
macrumors 603
This was why I actually speculated that T-Mobile USA and possibly AT&T will sell iPhone 18 Pro and iPhone Ultra models with the C2 modem, since most of the faster 5G service is located on 6 GHz and lower frequency bands.
A few things going on here.
1. IF there were such a difference, it would be because VZW wants their iPhones to come with mmWave.
Most of the rest of the world (and other US carriers) don't care. That explains why people thought QC would be used in US and C2 internationally.
2. Why the "unexpected drop" (ie Apple buying fewer modems than QC expected)?
The general consensus is that VZW has told Apple that they can live without mmWave in iPhones. This is probably because C-band n77 is coming online as we speak, and VZW may think that offers enough capacity. (We still have the stadium capacity problem, but if only a generation or so of iPhones go without mmWave, everything will probably balance out.)
3. "Amon chalked up the loss to supply constraints"
This is obvious nonsense that absolutely no-one believes. Like I said, the general belief is that this is all about mmWave no longer being considered essential in the US.
I don’t think Apple 🍎 want’s to have another situation where the Intel Modems go to some carrier’s and the Qualcomm Modems going to Verizon only. Apple had to cripple the Qualcomm modems to make it slower or on par with the Intel modems back then.
But today super high speed may not matter as much as latency and battery efficiency. We’re going to find out in a month or so what Apple’s plans are.
For now I hear the C2 will be in the International only models and the Qualcomm modems will be in the US 🇺🇸 models because of lack of mmWave.
Apple has just started investment on 6G so they won’t have to depend on Qualcomm again in the future. Qualcomm knows it’s about to be over for them real soon. They only have mmWave to hold on to as they have most of the patents for it.
Apple may put the Qualcomm modems in Verizon only and then the C2 in other carriers. I have T-mobile so mmWave does not matter to me. I would rather have the C2 with the battery 🔋 efficiencies and lower latency.
Verizon has a ton of mmWave. A lot of people are using it and not even realizing it since Verizon bundled it in to the 5G UW indicator with n77. I can't see Verizon giving up on their requirement for phones to have it any time soon. If you go to the city of Denver, for example, mmWave is on just about every block downtown.
throAU
macrumors G4
You can literally swap models out for each other as they use a standard API.
e.g., in opencode
LLMs are literally a commodity at this point, and Apple will simply plug in which ever model makes sense.
It would very much not surprise me if at some point Apple expose this to the end user for you to use whichever model you like.
Then why don’t you show us how you code using Gemma4:26B? Surely it’s as good as Claude Opus, right? And good luck asking any of those models listed how to circumvent a ban on a website or any other thing deemed “immoral”…
This isn't CDMA scenario, iPhone would still work perfectly without mmWave. Especially with 3GPP Rel 19. Somewhere along with line they will push 5G Advance with FDD Massive MIMO finally ( hopefully ) working, and that could be something done without the need of mmWave.
It doesn't matter. Verizon has invested in the infrastructure. They're going to press Apple to keep including the technology to use it.
Read what I said.
I'm not saying VZW is "giving up" on mmWave. I'm saying that it's possible that they are willing to compromise with Apple on this issue (for perhaps one or two years). It's likely not catastrophic for them if, say, 20% of their installed base is not using mmWave.
They're not going to compromise. You're a fool if you believe that. The 18 series WILL have mmWave other than the 18e.
You're looking at mmWave as being useless. For those who live in the congested markets that rely heavily on it, it's anything but. There is no replacement for the massive capacity that mmWave adds and customers WILL notice if it's gone, especially those who like to go to concerts and other large events.
I would trade mmWave for being able to simply “have a connection” any day. So many times my phone craps out while my work phone and my iPad are like “of course we have a signal, why wouldn’t we?”
They would have press Apple to continue to use CDMA as well. Not to mention the investment in mmWave isn't anywhere near to the cost of switching.
The thing is, it’s ultimately overkill for sending text messages, scrolling past TikTok silly videos and sending gif memes through WhatsApp… what most people use technology and networks for, even during working hours.
I wouldn’t mind forfeiting mmWave in exchange of better battery life instead.
Until random regulators with their random regulations invent some new random op rules aimed at stunting said evolution towards better products.
Tiny example, I was happy with the settings section having all main Apple apps easily accessible at first glance… now to change some setting on the email app you have to tap and scroll a whole lot more.
Verizon was planning to move away from CDMA. The iPhone 14 was the last iPhone with CDMA and it came out the same year that Verizon shut down their CDMA network. Millions of people rely on mmWave everyday without knowing it as Verizon has it at most major airports and large concert/sports venues as well as on most streets in major metros and unless you speed test, you wouldn't know it because that's how it's designed to function but they would certainly notice the n77 congestion were they to suddenly lose access to it.
Also, the Tata leak earlier this year has pretty much confirmed that Apple is using Qualcomm X80 modems in the US so all of this back and forth is a moot point.
Once again why do you insist on putting words in my mouth? I've defended mmWave on multiple occasions.