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To what deal or agreement are you all referring?

That's part of the issue here. (To be clear, there are many other important aspects of this situation - many other improper or illegal or contract-violative things which Qualcomm has been accused, by numerous parties, of doing and which it has been found, by numerous regulatory bodies, to have done.) According to Apple and others, Qualcomm has long refused to enter into direct licensing agreements on FRAND terms with certain parties - to include Apple, despite the reality that it is required to do so.

Instead, Apple had been paying royalties to Qualcomm through its contract manufacturers. Those manufacturers had licensing agreements with Qualcomm, the terms of which they weren't allowed to disclose to Apple. It was to Qualcomm's advantage to have licensing agreements with those third parties rather than with Apple directly; it was one of a number of things which Qualcomm did - many of which were illegal or contract-violative - which worked together as part of a scheme that allowed Qualcomm to collect greater royalties than it otherwise would have been able to.

The point being, in response to your posts, Apple doesn't have a licensing agreement with Qualcomm which it is now refusing to honor. (That's leaving aside the really that sometimes agreements are entered into under duress, where one party or the other employs illegal or contract-violative tactics in order to, essentially, force the other party to agree to certain terms.)

Apple has had some other agreements with Qualcomm. Some of them are no longer in force. Indeed, their expiration has much to do with the timing of Apple's legal actions. But, at any rate, they weren't direct licensing agreements which Apple is now violating by withholding royalty payments.

Further, there is nothing wrong with withholding royalty payments (for SEPs) in the absence of a licensing agreement if you have acted in good faith to try to reach one. If would-be SEP users weren't able to do that, the process for creating and adhering to industry standards (for, e.g., certain cellular technology) wouldn't work very well. SEP holders would have too much leverage, even when they were the ones acting wrongly - e.g., failing to honor their commitments to license SEP on FRAND terms. They (each of them) would be able to, in effect, shut down other industry participants. They'd be able to greatly constrain competition and demand exorbitant royalties for IP which might not have much inherent value (i.e. where the IP's value came mostly from its inclusion in industry standards, and where they aren't entitled to collect royalties based on such value). That's why SEP agreements generally limit SEP holders' abilities to take actions to stop the use of their IP, even in the absence of licensing agreements, so long as the users of their IP are willing licensees.

Put simply, Apple will pay Qualcomm the royalties it owes when it is determined what those royalties should be. The proper royalties might be the result of, e.g., a negotiation between Apple and Qualcomm or a court's decision. They won't, e.g., be unilaterally imposed by Qualcomm. That is as it should be.
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That's one of the issues. But there are many more.

If someone really wants to understand the situation well, they should probably read for themselves things such as: Court filings (from both Apple and Qualcomm and amici and those form other cases, e.g., the FTC's action against Qualcomm) and the findings of various regulatory bodies.

Many people, of course, don't have time for that and / or don't care enough to. That's understandable. We could bullet point some of the issues, and some of us have elsewhere. But that doesn't really have a lot of value if time isn't taken to explain the various issues, why they create problems (or, e.g., are illegal or contract-violative), and how they have worked together to lead to (what many consider) improper results.

This is spot on. It’s not abnormal to halt payment during litigation in these kinds of patent cases. Apple is basically wanting fair billing on patents that should be FRAND, but Qualcomm does not want to do so specifically with Apple (and I presume other large organizations).

Rather than establishing a consistent patent license rate for all users for some of these essential technologies, it sounds like Qualcomm does FRAND when they want, and ignore it when they see deep pockets, and Apple is willing to challenge it.
 
I don’t understand the technicalities like the rest of you guys do.... but using common sense

Qualcomm has a lot to lose if apple’s lawsuit is valid. Because in that same week that the judge rule in Apples favor. Samsung, Google, HTC, etc is going to be walking in with Fresh lawsuits of their own

I would say it might be cheaper if apple buys Qualcomm if you look at the price of doing it vs loyalty payments projected over 10 years.

But I wonder why Intel never considered taking over Qualcomm... or even AMD

The war chest of patents would certainly have a better home with those 2 companies
 
Qualcomm is charging unfair royalties? But apple is charging unfair prices for their products with obscene profits. they figured out a way to charge more for a Mac mini by putting the word "pro" in front of it.

You should become a lawyer, lol!
Maybe you could get us all cheaper gas prices & less expensive sports cars... you can just cite your “it’s not fair” argument & see how it pans out, legally. =)
 
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Qualcomm is greedy.

So is Apple, Tim.
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You should become a lawyer, lol!
Maybe you could get us all cheaper gas prices & less expensive sports cars... you can just site your “it’s not fair” argument & see how it pans out, legally. =)

Site? You should become a teacher, lol!
 
Qualcomm is charging unfair royalties? But apple is charging unfair prices for their products with obscene profits. they figured out a way to charge more for a Mac mini by putting the word "pro" in front of it.


I heard Apple has been taking people off the street at gun point forcing them into the nearest Apple store and then making them buy stuff. Be careful it might happen to you too. Lol.
 
Seems black-and-white to me. They agree on a price, and Apple pays it. I don't get why Qualcomm claims Apple just didn't pay them $7B they must've agreed upon in written records.
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Apple and Samsung still have a business relationship.
Yeah, but Apple and Samsung's dispute wasn't over the phone supplies.
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Qualcomm is charging unfair royalties? But apple is charging unfair prices for their products with obscene profits. they figured out a way to charge more for a Mac mini by putting the word "pro" in front of it.
The issue isn't Qualcomm's prices being high. Apple claims that Qualcomm charges them extra, and there are other disputes.
 
A deals a deal. Pay up Apple.

I'm sadly not surprise there are already a few people defending Apple on this.

As far as Qualcomm is concerned, Samsung fully agrees with Apple. Samsung is also doing something about it. The other manufacturers also totally agree, but are a bit more afraid.

Admit it, you don't have the slightest clue what kind of deal there is between Qualcomm and Apple.

A deal is a deal, Qualcomm. Stop pestering Apple.
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Apple and Samsung still have a business relationship.
Yes, it's interesting. Apple is Samsung's favourite customer and most hated competitor, at the same time.
 
I just don’t see how this benefits qualcomm. As they can tell. Apple has no provlrkd with moving in another direction. Just rework the deal before it’s too late.
 
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So much fanboyism! Nobody here has seen any agreements or signed documents between the two, hence can’t have any idea what’s really going on.
Apple is no saint. Didn’t they ruin another company recently? The one responsible for manufacturing sapphire glass.
 
I don’t agree with Apple’s pricing, but I don’t go in their store and take things without paying. Funny that they have no problem doing the same thing.

If you don’t like the deal, then try to renegotiate or wait until it is up. Withholding $7 billion in payments is not right. They need to get smacked down for this.
 
So Apple signs a contract and now doesn't want to pay because of "bad terms". Sounds like Apple's lawyer's should have negotiated a better deal.
 
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Imagine if we customers were withholding $7k worth of Apple products because down they road we deemed the prices unfair.
 
As far as Qualcomm is concerned, Samsung fully agrees with Apple. Samsung is also doing something about it. The other manufacturers also totally agree, but are a bit more afraid.

Admit it, you don't have the slightest clue what kind of deal there is between Qualcomm and Apple.

A deal is a deal, Qualcomm. Stop pestering Apple.

Shocking, a Qualcomm competitor agrees with one of their customers.

You're right, I don't have a clue and neither do you, yet you take Apple's side without question. So unbiased :rolleyes:
 
I don’t agree with Apple’s pricing, but I don’t go in their store and take things without paying. Funny that they have no problem doing the same thing.

The comparison you're making (assuming that's what you're doing) doesn't fit this situation well.

Did Apple negotiate a deal with a third party whereby you, in order to do whatever it is that you primarily do in order to generate income, are required to buy those things from Apple? And did Apple, in exchange for that (i.e., in exchange for you being required to buy those things from Apple) agree to do things certain ways? And did Apple then fail to do things those ways, fail to do the things it agreed to do in order to make it such that you had to buy certain things from it?

Further, did Apple do other improper (i.e. contract-violative and, in some jurisdictions, illegal) things which made it such that no one else would be able to sell you other things which you need?

If Apple didn't do those things (and more), then I don't see your comparison fitting the Apple - Qualcomm situation.

If you don’t like the deal, then try to renegotiate or wait until it is up. Withholding $7 billion in payments is not right. They need to get smacked down for this.

As I asked others before, what deal are you referring to? Apple doesn't have a direct licensing deal with Qualcomm. That's part of the problem. According to Apple, other industry participants, and various regulatory bodies, Qualcomm has refused to offer licenses to certain industry participants (to include Apple) on FRAND terms, even though Qualcomm is under contractual obligations to do just that.

Further, some of the deals Apple has had with Qualcomm have expired and that has factored into the timing of the recent legal actions.

To be clear, industry participants are allowed to use SEPs even if they don't have licensing agreements in place (and aren't currently paying licensing fees) if they are willing licensees. At some point, they and the SEP holders need to agree to licensing terms or a court (or some other entity) needs to decide what terms are proper.
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So much fanboyism! Nobody here has seen any agreements or signed documents between the two, hence can’t have any idea what’s really going on.
Apple is no saint. Didn’t they ruin another company recently? The one responsible for manufacturing sapphire glass.

Are you suggesting that both Apple and Qualcomm have lied in their court filings about whether they have a licensing agreement in effect?

We, of course, don't know the details of various agreements between the parties (or even, perhaps, of the existence of some agreements). But I think we can safely assume that, to the extent that both parties indicate in their respective court filings that certain things (which they are both in position to have knowledge of) are true, those things likely are true.
 
A deal is a deal. You pay for the deal you signed. Holding back payments is chicken ****.
haha no wonder they are stuck 2 generations of performance behind Apple now.

not to mention, Samsung Exynos 9810, beats snapdragon 845. (except for the Chinese, they get snapdragon to slightly outpace Samsung, that's a mystery)
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A deals a deal. Pay up Apple.

I'm sadly not surprise there are already a few people defending Apple on this.

And I'm sadly not-surprised that people with actually no knowledge of the issue or the law are having opinions (meaningless of course, but they still sound off). Read some of the well thought responses where people actually know what they are talking about. Education is always a fine thing.
 
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