I agree with most of what you said, except related the simplified supply chain to lower costs. Apple was at the mercy of Intel and had been forced to endure their inability to release chips on time and resolve their thermal issues. Apple has proven it could be done and has accelerated the output significantly.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Qualcomm's M1 Rival to Be Available in PCs by Late 2023
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
I agree with most of what you said, except related the simplified supply chain to lower costs. Apple was at the mercy of Intel and had been forced to endure their inability to release chips on time and resolve their thermal issues. Apple has proven it could be done and has accelerated the output significantly.
True, the article mentioned M1, but that will seriously be out of date by the time this chip is shipping. I’m just guessing, but I bet they set their sights higher than fist gen. But then again, you have to walk before you can run, so is their first offering a years old equivalent? Sounds terrible if it is.
WowwGentlemen at Samsung, start your Geekbench juicy cheats for this new chip now!
Geekbench bans Samsung flagships for cheating - Inquisitive Universe
Lol, no. You did not read the headline wrong. Geekbench bans Samsung flagships for cheating. A bit of introduction is needed here and I’ll oblige. [...]inquisitiveuniverse.com
The ARM version of Windows does have an equivalent, it’s not as fast as Rosetta 2 but it’s not terrible either. Also it handles 32 bit apps, which is nice for backwards compatibility
BUt MS has to support all of those as well because there are significantly more applications that were built and developed for windows over the years that buisnesses rely on. Signficantly more buisnesses use Windows and or windows Server to handle loads internally.
So any type of "rosetta" for windows would need to be more complex.
The reason Rosetta Works well with MacOS is that over time Mac simply just was like. welp.... we wont let 32 bit apps run now, we wont let this run now etc ertc. Then with monty and M1 They simplified what rosetta 2 had to do.
Windows on the other hand supports lots of legacy applications. And a lot of those applications are not build on mac and no other alternative exists.
Windows already many years back had a somewhat decent arm version of windows on the surface 2 RT. But that is only if the application was built for the ARM version of it. Decently power efficient. But there was not a market to keep developing the arm platform back then. The newer Surface with the newer ARM chips have a built in translator that runs dog slow. The sheer process of trying to make all legacy applications compatible is going to be a monumental undertaking compared to rosetta 2.
I would bet that AS bootcamp will exist shortly after a retail version of ARM Windows is out, the M* machines are already set up to allow multi-boot, and ARM windows runs just fine in a virtualized env on AS macs right now. Based on Apple’s statements they dont have a problem providing boot camp on ARM, the blocker is winows licensing
Siri collects less data, means less data for improvement. Tradeoff I’ll take, though it is frustrating. I wish Apple would launch some sort of large scale program where they pay people to collect data, I wouldnt be interested but I’m sure a lot would and it would help improve Siri
Apple could use the competition. I was surprised to learn that the latest MSI flagship laptop destroys the MBP Max in performance. Sure, it runs hot and the battery lasts half as long, but the Max runs hot too and most people I know run their laptops plugged in when they’re doing heavy duty work.
Wouldn't we fully expect a competitors ARM chip being released in 'late 2023' to be better then Apple's 2020 M1 chip? I find this article confusing because by 2023, Apple will likely have the M2 or maybe even early M3 chips out. The apple chips mentioned in this article will be 2-3 years old by then. This article gives us very little in terms of specifics on chip performance IMO.
Qualcomm's answer to Apple silicon will be available in devices by late 2023, the company's CEO said earlier this week (via Tom's Hardware).
In November last year, Qualcomm announced plans to build next-generation Arm-based System on Chips (SoCs), designed to rival Apple's M-series chips, for the PC market. The chips are "designed to set the performance benchmark for Windows PCs" and are being developed by the Nuvia team. Qualcomm said that it will directly compete with Apple's M-series chips, including the M1, M1 Pro, and M1 Max, and hopes to lead the industry for "sustained performance and battery life."
During the company's latest earnings call earlier this week, Qualcomm President and CEO Christian Amon said that the Nuvia team was progressing toward its goal of developing a significant leap forward for Arm processors. Amon added that the first Nuvia-designed processor will be "going after the performance tier" and that Nuvia-powered Windows laptops are on track to be available to customers by late 2023.
The timing seems to indicate a slight delay compared to the original 2023 timeframe set out by Qualcomm last year. The company previously said that sample Nuvia chips would be available to device manufacturers by August 2022, but now that expectation has been broadened to the second half of 2022, with particular emphasis on the debut of the first consumer Nuvia devices in "late" 2023.
Qualcomm acquired Nuvia, a chip startup company founded by ex-Apple chip designers, for $1.4 billion in January 2021. The former Apple engineers wanted to create Arm-based SoCs specifically for servers and target the always-connected PC (ACPC) market with a chip that could compete with the M1, but now the team's aims seem to have been significantly broadened.
By late 2023, Apple is expected to be well into its M2 series of chips. The company may have even introduced the first M3 chips by the time the first Nuvia chips come to market.
Article Link: Qualcomm's M1 Rival to Be Available in PCs by Late 2023
They hope to compete with M1 in 2023? thill then apple is already improved and more innovated the M Series that the Qualcomm chip is vastly outperformed on release.
Qualcomm's answer to Apple silicon will be available in devices by late 2023, the company's CEO said earlier this week (via Tom's Hardware).
In November last year, Qualcomm announced plans to build next-generation Arm-based System on Chips (SoCs), designed to rival Apple's M-series chips, for the PC market. The chips are "designed to set the performance benchmark for Windows PCs" and are being developed by the Nuvia team. Qualcomm said that it will directly compete with Apple's M-series chips, including the M1, M1 Pro, and M1 Max, and hopes to lead the industry for "sustained performance and battery life."
During the company's latest earnings call earlier this week, Qualcomm President and CEO Christian Amon said that the Nuvia team was progressing toward its goal of developing a significant leap forward for Arm processors. Amon added that the first Nuvia-designed processor will be "going after the performance tier" and that Nuvia-powered Windows laptops are on track to be available to customers by late 2023.
The timing seems to indicate a slight delay compared to the original 2023 timeframe set out by Qualcomm last year. The company previously said that sample Nuvia chips would be available to device manufacturers by August 2022, but now that expectation has been broadened to the second half of 2022, with particular emphasis on the debut of the first consumer Nuvia devices in "late" 2023.
Qualcomm acquired Nuvia, a chip startup company founded by ex-Apple chip designers, for $1.4 billion in January 2021. The former Apple engineers wanted to create Arm-based SoCs specifically for servers and target the always-connected PC (ACPC) market with a chip that could compete with the M1, but now the team's aims seem to have been significantly broadened.
By late 2023, Apple is expected to be well into its M2 series of chips. The company may have even introduced the first M3 chips by the time the first Nuvia chips come to market.
Article Link: Qualcomm's M1 Rival to Be Available in PCs by Late 2023
You are glossing over a lot if you say there isn’t much difference. Also you completely missed the context of my statement.
Last edited:
they hope to match the perfomance of the M1 Series chips by 2023 with thair Chip. However the M1 is already been out some year and apple has already made M2 maybe M3. So Qualcomm tries to at least compete with the several years old M1 Chip by 2023.
you are very wrong. x86 / x64 are very different in design Structure and Architecture. RISC/CISC has nothing todo with Compatibility Layers, they are complete different instruction sets. The Problem with x86/64 is not the Legacy ISA, its the whole design it self. One issue is the Power Inefficiency and the huge amount of Heat Generated.
Apple doesn't need to Support 32Bit apps cause they dropped support for them back in Catalina already long time ago.
yep as Craig Stated apple has created the way for other systems to run on M1 chips. the ball is in Microsoft's court to make a move but there stupid OEM Licensing of Windows on ARM is the only reason why there is no Windows Bootcamp on M Series Macs
With better software optimization, there are quite a few possibilities for major speed leaps with the same hardware. There is native code and there is good native code.
If they make a competitive SoC, it will likely not sell if all those games and apps that exist for x64 Intel and compatible AMD Ryzen CPUs won't run on it. It will be just a better Surface model with incompatible hardware.
The QUALCOMM team is the same core team who started Apple silicon. We have no idea wh other talent they have recruited. We know from the cloud space that the Microsoft team is very good. Money is a part of what gives you the right people.
Part of it. Also, Apple’s team formed all the way back in 2008.
They started with 32-bit emulation only, and (I think) fairly recently added 64-bit.
Ok, that's fine if pricing is well below apple. Android making real change for the many.
Let's hope Microsoft's OEM license contact ends the day before WWDC.
I have one specialized windows only app for my new hobby that I would like to run in a Windows VM at a decent performance.
I have one specialized windows only app for my new hobby that I would like to run in a Windows VM at a decent performance.
The other side of this coin is “you can’t run old apps that might still be perfectly useful and your business might depend on.”