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Reddit CEO: Apollo-Related Subreddit Blackouts 'Will Pass,' No Significant Revenue Impact So Far

GizmoDVD said:
Since you refuse to answer the obvious question, which is $0.

Rules have changed, and now it's time to pay up or go away.

Which did Apollo choose for its 50,000 subscribers?
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The answer was obvious, the API has always been made free by Reddit.

He’s not been “leeching” anything from Reddit that Reddit didn’t make readily (and freely) available to everyone, so you resorting to ad Hominem attacks just proves that Reddit are clearly in the wrong here.

They had the opportunity to work with 3rd party devs to come to an amicable agreement (or maybe not in the end), but they chose not to.

instead they decided that an app like Apollo should pay $20 million per year.

[Edit] - You could say Reddit are leeches.

Leeching off of the content that their members post.
 
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anselpela said:
Well, I can't fully agree with that, because Apollo was (almost) a shining example of what an iOS App should be. 1. Always following Apple's human interface guidelines so it feels like a native platform app, 2. Always implementing new APIs from the thousands Apple adds each year. The "almost" part is because of the tiny little oversight of....not owning any of the content for which the app was a wrapper. Not even having a contract or agreement of any kind with Reddit. Just using a free API that could disappear at any time. To build a business like that and then actually sell it to customers is not smart, to say the least.
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You're saying that these 3rd party apps, at least the ones I have used like Apollo and Reddplanet, have Reddit sponsored advertising on them? Because last time I checked there was zero advertising, not even the promoted stories that the Reddit app uses to fool people into clicking on advertising. That's really the crux of this entire debacle and why Reddit wants to be able to recoup some of that lost revenue.

Personally I also don't see Apollo on iOS being particularly better than the official app, even the official app resembles and is more true to the website interface much more. That's one thing that to me is jarring, having to navigate the difference in 3rd party apps UI and overall look and feel. Although I haven't used Apollo in a few months because 1) like all 3rd party Reddit apps you can't access chats and that's important to me, and 2) they don't develop for Android (anti-competitive?!? I'm joking...).
 
spinedoc77 said:
You're saying that these 3rd party apps, at least the ones I have used like Apollo and Reddplanet, have Reddit sponsored advertising on them? Because last time I checked there was zero advertising, not even the promoted stories that the Reddit app uses to fool people into clicking on advertising. That's really the crux of this entire debacle and why Reddit wants to be able to recoup some of that lost revenue.
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It‘s not lost revenue.

It was a business decision Reddit made not to charge for the API.

Now, if people were accessing the API without Reddit’s permission, that’s lost revenue.

You can’t lose what you never had (charged for).
 
Azzin said:
The answer was obvious, the API has always been made free by Reddit.

He’s not been “leeching” anything from Reddit that Reddit didn’t make readily (and freely) available to everyone, so you resorting to ad Hominem attacks just proves that Reddit are clearly in the wrong here.

They had the opportunity to work with 3rd party devs to come to an amicable agreement (or maybe not in the end), but they chose not to.

instead they decided that an app like Apollo should pay $20 million per year.

[Edit] - You could say Reddit are leeches.

Leeching off of the content that their members post.
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Great PR by Apollo to get sympathy for a poor millionaire. You seem to have bought it hook line and sinker.

Gravy train is over now, so enjoy the official Reddit app or not. I don't care. Looking forward to the mod exodus in the coming days :)
 
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spinedoc77 said:
You're saying that these 3rd party apps, at least the ones I have used like Apollo and Reddplanet, have Reddit sponsored advertising on them? Because last time I checked there was zero advertising, not even the promoted stories that the Reddit app uses to fool people into clicking on advertising. That's really the crux of this entire debacle and why Reddit wants to be able to recoup some of that lost revenue.

Personally I also don't see Apollo on iOS being particularly better than the official app, even the official app resembles and is more true to the website interface much more. That's one thing that to me is jarring, having to navigate the difference in 3rd party apps UI and overall look and feel. Although I haven't used Apollo in a few months because 1) like all 3rd party Reddit apps you can't access chats and that's important to me, and 2) they don't develop for Android (anti-competitive?!? I'm joking...).
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I said nothing of the sort. No idea where you're getting that.
 
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GizmoDVD said:
Great PR by Apollo to get sympathy for a poor millionaire. You seem to have bought it hook line and sinker.

Gravy train is over now, so enjoy the official Reddit app or not. I don't care. Looking forward to the mod exodus in the coming days :)
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🤣 Right? All I've ever been able to think while using Apollo is "so I can make a basic iOS list view app around anyone else's service, and then actually sell it to people, with no one's permission?"
 
Azzin said:
It‘s not lost revenue.

It was a business decision Reddit made not to charge for the API.

Now, if people were accessing the API without Reddit’s permission, that’s lost revenue.

You can’t lose what you never had (charged for).
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It IS lost revenue, at least they view it as that GOING FORWARD, that's why they are changing their business model. Now they are not going back and charging Apollo for lost revenue last year, or even last week, obviously because they provided their APIs for free, just going forward.

There was a time when 3rd party apps helped Reddit by developing their apps and attracting users (while earning money), and that arrangement was probably conducive to both sides. Times change, business changes, and Reddit now feels they will be more profitable by charging for their APIs and the onus is on developers to figure out business plans around that pricing. I don't get why this is put on Reddit like they have an obligation to provide their API's for free, news flash: they don't. I don't disagree that this was all very sudden, but at the same time things in business pivot very quickly sometimes. Maybe Reddit as an entity will serve its customers much better by reaching profitability rather than trying to cater to those users who want to freeload, that thinking seems to have worked wonders with Netflix.
 
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Azzin said:
[Edit] - You could say Reddit are leeches.

Leeching off of the content that their members post.
Click to expand...
I always love this comment too, seems to be pretty common amongst people supporting this blackout. As if the users own the comments that they chose to post on Reddit. Reddit created the platform and allowed you to post. You posted because they allowed you to, and because other people would see it. Otherwise you could have posted on your own blog which you do own. The moment you post that content to Reddit, it isn't yours anymore. Reddit giving you the ability to infinitely edit/delete said content is a courtesy and user friendly feature, not an implication toward ownership.
 
anselpela said:
I always love this comment too, seems to be pretty common amongst people supporting this blackout. As if the users own the comments that they chose to post on Reddit. Reddit created the platform and allowed you to post. You posted because they allowed you to, and because other people would see it. Otherwise you could have posted on your own blog which you do own. The moment you post that content to Reddit, it isn't yours anymore. Reddit giving you the ability to infinitely edit/delete said content is a courtesy and user friendly feature, not an implication toward ownership.
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Wait until they start protesting about their free right speech, on a privately owned business.
 
AppleWatchGuy said:
I think if Apollo where to not play the victim card so flamboyantly, the 2% would be upset for the removal of their favourite interface, but they wouldn't be as riled up as they are now because they have perceived Apollo as "one of us".
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Yeah Apollo knew how to play this announcement to the maximum affect to hopefully salvage their business. I can't blame them from an operations perspective, but it isn't great from a social perspective as it contributes to the major issues we have right now with sensationalism.
 
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Arsenikdote said:
Yeah Apollo knew how to play this announcement to the maximum affect to hopefully salvage their business. I can't blame them from an operations perspective, but it isn't great from a social perspective as it contributes to the major issues we have right now with sensationalism.
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Granted, the actual blackout is really just a few hundred community moderators that are mad that their tools for moderating are being shutdown by this. So they're going dark for a time to stick it to Reddit. No users anywhere are actually participating or doing anything meaningful, despite what they say online. People will post on website that they are boycotting Reddit and then immediately go visit Reddit right after that.
 
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To anyone that thinks this is some dumb "API" thing that they don't understand or a problem with 3rd-party apps they never used, it's way more than that.

1) Unpaid volunteers created massive amounts of content for reddit in the form of information, entertainment, and big communities using community-built tools. They did all this for reddit for FREE. Reddit may host the forum, but they didn't supply it with its content.

2) After receiving all that content from the community, reddit is now blocking those people and tools.

3) Reddit wants to ensure that it can maximize its profit off of the community's work, and it can only do that by blocking the community's tools and apps.


You don't have to understand "API" or use RIF or Apollo or Narwhal or whatever apps to know that this is a HUGE middle-finger to the users.

I've been using reddit for over 12 years. First with Alien Blue, then the newer Alien Blue, then Narwhal, then Apollo. From a usability standpoint, the official reddit app is a dumpster fire of functionality and lack of features. The official app is simply designed to increase ad revenue, award revenue, and NFT revenue at the expense of all other functionality.
 
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Xenomorph said:
To anyone that thinks this is some dumb "API" thing that they don't understand or a problem with 3rd-party apps they never used, it's way more than that.

1) Unpaid volunteers created massive amounts of content for reddit in the form of information, entertainment, and big communities using community-built tools. They did all this for reddit for FREE. Reddit may host the forum, but they didn't supply it with its content.

2) After receiving all that content from the community, reddit is now blocking those people and tools.

3) Reddit wants to ensure that it can maximize its profit off of the community's work, and it can only do that by blocking the community's tools and apps.


You don't have to understand "API" or use RIF or Apollo or Narwhal or whatever apps to know that this is a HUGE middle-finger to the users.

I've been using reddit for over 12 years. First with Alien Blue, then the newer Alien Blue, then Narwhal, then Apollo. From a usability standpoint, the official reddit app is a dumpster fire of functionality and lack of features. The official app is simply designed to increase ad revenue, award revenue, and NFT revenue at the expense of all other functionality.
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What features is the official app missing that a 3rd party app has and which 3rd party app? I'm curious because I haven't noticed much I can't do, but of course we all use our apps/websites differently. Going in the reverse direction I find 3rd party apps not having access to chats a dealbreaker.

If this is the case then the market will dictate what happens, just as it did when Reddit had overtaken Digg. Maybe it will show anyone doing unpaid content that it may not be a good business model, especially without any contracts or agreements.
 
anselpela said:
I always love this comment too, seems to be pretty common amongst people supporting this blackout. As if the users own the comments that they chose to post on Reddit. Reddit created the platform and allowed you to post. You posted because they allowed you to, and because other people would see it. Otherwise you could have posted on your own blog which you do own. The moment you post that content to Reddit, it isn't yours anymore. Reddit giving you the ability to infinitely edit/delete said content is a courtesy and user friendly feature, not an implication toward ownership.
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Actually you are wrong, anyone who writes something that is original owns that work, it cannot be taken away from them. Others do not own it but they can use it. There a couple of copyright lawyers who have youtube channels that give good advice on what people own and do not own.

Oh and on the topic of if the Apollo dev is a millionaire, who cares. He designed the app, he coded the app and thus has a right to charge people for the work he has done. If the issue of him using something that was given free by someone else is bothering people I am sure there are many examples out there where something was given for free but others came along and found a way to monetize it and profit from it.
 
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Xenomorph said:
1) Unpaid volunteers created massive amounts of content for reddit in the form of information, entertainment, and big communities using community-built tools. They did all this for reddit for FREE. Reddit may host the forum, but they didn't supply it with its content.
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I don't know if you know this, but reddit is doing a favour by allowing users to post/read/engage on a service that they receive as free (subsidized by ads). You make it sound like the users are doing reddit a favour by donating them free content.
 
AppleWatchGuy said:
I don't know if you know this, but reddit is doing a favour by allowing users to post/read/engage on a service that they receive as free (subsidized by ads). You make it sound like the users are doing reddit a favour by donating them free content.
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People aren't going to reddit for the ads. No visits, no ads served. No content, no visits.
 
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