Refresh of 15" and 17" but not of 13" -- is it possible?

[gonnabuyamacbsh]

I hope it gets removed. There are three computers that are 13", one of them needs to be removed, and I think the 13" should be it.

I am sure that the people who buy the 13" would complain for a month then move onto the white MB.

As far as the 13" MBP not being 'pro' - it isn't, but the naming works. Think about it, when an average consumer comes into the store (knowing little to nothing about the meaning of technical specifications) and they see two computers: $999 white plastic computer and a $1199 aluminum computer. The $1199 one has 'Pro' written on it and it appears more sturdy. Of course, the consumer is intrigued by the 'Pro' naming and they see - only 200 bucks more! I'm definitely going for that. Boom, Apple just scored 200 bucks.

I wouldn't buy the white MB and I don't think many others would either. Just move on to another manufacturer.

 

[NickZac]

They are as likely to kill the 17" MacBook Pro as they are the Mac Pro, and really, for the same reasons, neither machine is likely to go anywhere as they have no other machine that does what they do. Between the white MacBook and the 13" Pro, there is a redundancy, save for FireWire (which most consumers looking for a 13" Mac don't even know about) and Aluminum, they are the same computer under the hood. You could kill one, or merge the two with little trouble, if any. As for your claims that they'd be bankrupt, that implies that they were bankrupt before the advent of the 13" Pro, which, I'm sorry, is completely ridiculous.

I never said the 17 was getting discontinued nor did I say the Mac Pro was nor did I say the 13 inch MBP was. Discontinuing any is a bad business idea and is going to lose customers. Do you think Apple wants to lose money? The MBP all together is only a part of Apple's profit, but killing the 13 is a terrible business decision. They are not in business to see if they can get record low laptop sales figures. My talks about bankruptcy was to show that YEARS ago, Apple was in bad shape when Jobs was gone and now they have about $50 billion cash. Since Jobs came back, he has kept the lineup basic enough to avoid customer confusion. They have 3 13 inch models because they sell and they all meet niche markets. Historically, 3 models with some similarity is not a threat for customer confusion and this forum shows it. Dell, and others, have many, many computers that are pretty much the same. You stop making products that DON'T sell...not ones that do. While the 17 MBP and MP cater to its own specialized market with reliable sales expectations and figures, the 13 inch MBPs sell very, very, very well. Why would you stop either?

 

[Yebubbleman]

Since Jobs came back, he has kept the lineup basic enough to avoid customer confusion.

This I'll buy.

They have 3 13 inch models because they sell and they all meet niche markets.

This I won't. You also contradict the first sentence with how wrong the second one is.

The only niche market being served is the education market who will, ten times out of ten, go for whitey over the other two. To everyone else, you could easily pick between any of them; the only one of the two that is specifically for people that the other one isn't necessarily is the MacBook Air. Some need that portability, others would rather have a complete computer. Otherwise you could sell a white MacBook over a 13" Pro or vice versa to just about anyone. I've done it both ways to many people, none of them know the difference or care. To them, the fact that they're on a Mac is far more important than what color is that Mac or whether it's plastic or Aluminum. I think very few people actually pay attention to the material used. They might pay attention to the color differences between the two, but that's it.

As for the argument of "ZOMG, if they kill the 13" Pro, they'll lose so many customers!!!", first off, if they were to only drop the "Pro" name, but otherwise reintegrate it into the "MacBook" line, they'd lose 0 customers. Those three letters only mean something to those needing a machine to do tasks that can be described by those very same three letters. Secondly, if they discontinued the damn thing outright, if there were any customer loss, it'd be minimal, if any at all, especially if they were to reintroduce a black MacBook, as unless we're talking about people only buying a Mac because it's shiny, people will just default to the next lowest one or go higher to the 15" MacBook Pro. It's not like a majority of those customers would just disappear if that machine did so too. Some might, sure. Enough to make Apple go bankrupt? You must be joking.

Historically, 3 models with some similarity is not a threat for customer confusion and this forum shows it.

This forum isn't representative of anything other than what happens when you cram a crap-ton of opinionated Mac fanatics into a forum and have them go back and forth on their opinions, predictions, and predictions which are subconciously heavily based on opinions. It's representative of nothing other than the refresh needs to happen so we can all stop talking about the MacBook Pro for a year and then (hopefully, more intelligently) discuss the future of the next Mac in line for a refresh, or, y'know, go on about how we like the "new" MacBook Pros. Either or.

 

[NickZac]

The only niche market being served is the education market who will, ten times out of ten, go for whitey over the other two. To everyone else, you could easily pick between any of them; the only one of the two that is specifically for people that the other one isn't necessarily is the MacBook Air. Some need that portability, others would rather have a complete computer. Otherwise you could sell a white MacBook over a 13" Pro or vice versa to just about anyone. I've done it both ways to many people, none of them know the difference or care. To them, the fact that they're on a Mac is far more important than what color is that Mac or whether it's plastic or Aluminum. I think very few people actually pay attention to the material used. They might pay attention to the color differences between the two, but that's it.

As for the argument of "ZOMG, if they kill the 13" Pro, they'll lose so many customers!!!", first off, if they were to only drop the "Pro" name, but otherwise reintegrate it into the "MacBook" line, they'd lose 0 customers. Those three letters only mean something to those needing a machine to do tasks that can be described by those very same three letters. Secondly, if they discontinued the damn thing outright, if there were any customer loss, it'd be minimal, if any at all, especially if they were to reintroduce a black MacBook, as unless we're talking about people only buying a Mac because it's shiny, people will just default to the next lowest one or go higher to the 15" MacBook Pro. It's not like a majority of those customers would just disappear if that machine did so too. Some might, sure. Enough to make Apple go bankrupt? You must be joking.

This forum isn't representative of anything other than what happens when you cram a crap-ton of opinionated Mac fanatics into a forum and have them go back and forth on their opinions, predictions, and predictions which are subconciously heavily based on opinions. It's representative of nothing other than the refresh needs to happen so we can all stop talking about the MacBook Pro for a year and then (hopefully, more intelligently) discuss the future of the next Mac in line for a refresh, or, y'know, go on about how we like the "new" MacBook Pros. Either or.

1) If they remove the 'Pro' from the 13, that's fine. It is very different in its buyers from the 15/17 and never was a powerhouse as the other 2. That is different than discontinuing it outright. I don't care if it is labeled 'Weiner Book' as long as the size stays the same, the outer casing is metallic, the display is LED backlit, the HD can be upped to a SSD, and the keyboard lights up...and of course OSX and Apple related programs that I prefer over others.
2) Perhaps most people don't know the difference between the MB and MBP...that makes me kind of sad but I will give you the benefit of the doubt as I have never sold them. I like to think that isn't the case but I won't argue you on that and we will see what actually happens with Apple. I do agree if you see a black MB that, well, it will sell like, ah, condoms at a sex party?
3) I am not saying that discontinuing the 13 will cause Apple to go bankrupt. If I worded it that way I apologize as I never meant to say that. Apple could discontinue ALL laptops and push themselves into the entertainment world more and probably do just as well. I am, however, saying that discontinuing what is currently the 13 inch MBP will lose business and even if it is small as you say, why are you going to let that happen since your R&D costs have already produced the product? The 13 inch MBP currently exists and compared to a full overhaul, putting a few different parts is well, cheaper. The existing design, other than the CPU/GPU/and a few ports of the computer is still modern...the physical look of the MBP doesn't need to change. It is a HUGE hit. Even if continuing the 13 inch will bring you say $500 mil more a year, why would you stop it?
4) Two and a half seconds after SB is in the newer MBP, then it is going to be 'when is the next MBP with IB coming out?'...but we all know this

 

[Yebubbleman]

1) If they remove the 'Pro' from the 13, that's fine. It is very different in its buyers from the 15/17 and never was a powerhouse as the other 2. That is different than discontinuing it outright. I don't care if it is labeled 'Weiner Book' as long as the size stays the same, the outer casing is metallic, the display is LED backlit, the HD can be upped to a SSD, and the keyboard lights up...and of course OSX and Apple related programs that I prefer over others.

I guess, I'm more generally predicting that there will no longer be a 13" Mac laptop called "MacBook Pro". Whether it'll be reintegrated into the "MacBook" line as the higher-end alternative to whitey, or whether it'll disappear altogether, I couldn't predict. I'm sure well-thought out arguments for either scenario could be presented.

2) Perhaps most people don't know the difference between the MB and MBP...that makes me kind of sad but I will give you the benefit of the doubt as I have never sold them. I like to think that isn't the case but I won't argue you on that and we will see what actually happens with Apple. I do agree if you see a black MB that, well, it will sell like, ah, condoms at a sex party?

Hold up a second. More importantly, sex party? Screw Apple laptops, we need to be focusing on the next refresh of sex parties!

Otherwise, yeah, I agree, ideally, these things are spelled out better, though I know people who only know the differences between the two computers by the exterior color, and that's both brilliant marketing and really sad for humanity.

3) I am not saying that discontinuing the 13 will cause Apple to go bankrupt. If I worded it that way I apologize as I never meant to say that. Apple could discontinue ALL laptops and push themselves into the entertainment world more and probably do just as well. I am, however, saying that discontinuing what is currently the 13 inch MBP will lose business and even if it is small as you say, why are you going to let that happen since your R&D costs have already produced the product? The 13 inch MBP currently exists and compared to a full overhaul, putting a few different parts is well, cheaper. The existing design, other than the CPU/GPU/and a few ports of the computer is still modern...the physical look of the MBP doesn't need to change. It is a HUGE hit. Even if continuing the 13 inch will bring you say $500 mil more a year, why would you stop it?

It's more the issue that somewhere since the initial move to Unibody, Apple's marketing screwed up (shocking, I know) and by late 2009 there were two different 13" laptops with the same logic boards (save for the SD slot and FireWire port), and to have these machines be in two different product lines makes no sense whatsoever. I'm not saying that they won't sell a product that won't serve those needs, I'm saying that they already have one, and to either discontinue one or merge the two simplifies their marketing and doesn't hurt their sales.

4) Two and a half seconds after SB is in the newer MBP, then it is going to be 'when is the next MBP with IB coming out?'...but we all know this

True facts. I'm already waiting for the MBP refresh after this next one!!! (Kidding, I could care less.)

 

[retrorichie]

Oh man, I hope it they do rename it to "Weiner Book"