Report Examines Labor Violations at Apple Supplier's Malaysian Plant

[jlasoon]

No major politician in the US is a socialist. Paul Wellstone was the last one I can think of that might have had some left wing beliefs, and even he was quite conservative on many critical issues. I just laughed when they were trying to call Obama a "socialist" and a "communist". The accusation was utterly ludicrous for someone that in any European country would be a mid range conservative. And no I don't believe the two US parties are different. Red/Blue US Conservative/US Liberal, Republican/Democrat are as meaningful as Ford/Mercury. Underneath they are the same corrupt conservative right wing corporate profit uber allis machine. It's why I packed up and left the US 8 years ago. I'm just watching the rot from afar.

So as far as your concerned we haven't destroyed the world economy enough? How far left do you want to go? Maoism? Leninism? Marxism? Maybe Hugo Chavez left or Trotsky left? Screw all this lets go all out with Carlos Marighella guerrilla marxism. That should fix the problems.

I've never understood the want or need to control.

 

[GadgetGav]

(Slightly off topic, more a commentary on MacRumors)

Are we just supposed to pretend that we didn't all just see that picture last month in the stories about the new custom build Motorola phones? I know it's captioned as being in Fort Worth, TX, so really what's the point of putting it there? OK, it's a Flextronics plant but it has nothing to do with the story. I doubt the WSJ gave permission for it to be used in this story either, but tagging it as "courtesy of the Wall St Journal" is an easy CYA move.

 

[jqc]

Stop tooting your horn. 100 million people aren't working in this country, Social Security Disability utilization is at an all-time high, 47 million are on food stamps, student loans are at record highs, government debt is skyrocketing, we have unfunded liabilities at a $100 trillion and you want more money for education.

Unfortunately there's more to this paradigm than meets the eye.

But I'd love to get your take on today's economy. What skills do I need to succeed? What do you recommend jqc?

Did you read my post? Your points - government debt, trillions in unfunded liabilities - support why i said "tell [the government] to stop bickering and actually get something done".

I said invest in education. That doesn't mean blindly spending money to raise government debt. This can take many forms. They 47 million on food stamps? how about providing those 47 million with options to go back to night school to learn a trade thats more in demand in their local area? how about finding ways to make it more affordable to get a higher education in fields that matter more in today's economy, like science, physics mathematics, etc.? Millions out of work? why? because they don't have the skills that employers demand? So lets find a way make it easier for our population to get those skills.

There are are many ways to "invest" in education.

To answer your specific question, I think the specific skill YOU need to succeed is reading COMPREHENSION.

 

[firewood]

Don't the foreign governments have any role in setting labor standards in their countries?

They do. Unfortunately, the standards inside some of the worst factories contracted to Apple are so much higher than the rest of the country, that the governments can't afford bring the rest countries factories and farms (some run by that very government!) up to that standard.

What Apple could do is offer these countries some financial incentives (more Apple stores !?) for throwing some of these jokers/brokers in deep dark jail cells for attempting to collect their illegal job brokering fees and interest from these unsuspecting workers.

 

[citi]

As the industry leader, which they happily celebrate, they should be setting an example for everyone else. Not to mention their CEO is happy to support liberal ideas and individuals when it suits him.

They are not the industry leader in devices manufactured, just profit margins and poularity. Samsung should be setting the example. Not to mention the CEO has nothing to do with this conversation and you shouldn't use him in your argument when it suits you.

 

[bstpierre]

The weird thing here is that if they need to hire 1500 employees fast, the best way to do that is to pay bonuses to, not collect fees from, the workers. The money is flowing in the wrong direction. Apple should be paying bonuses to the manufacturers who can staff up and the manufacturers should be paying bonuses to the recruiters who are able to get a lot of good workers and those recruiters should be paying signing bonuses to get those workers. So much for the law of supply and demand!

 

[Santabean2000]

I've lived in Singapore; what people need to understand is that this is how everything in South East Asia runs.

The construction workers 'imported' to build everything - condos, shopping malls etc usually have a 3 yr contract. The first year's wages pay for the flight over, the 2nd yr they save, and the 3rd year pays for their flight home.

Domestic helpers (maids) can get paid as little as S$300 a month (about US$5 a day) for often 13-15hr days. And although they're supposed to be given Sundays off, that often doesn't happen either.

And yet construction workers and maids are queuing up to come over still. What they make is peanuts to the 1st world, but worthwhile in theirs. The inequity runs so much deeper than just an Apple story.

Apple would have to overthrow governments to make a tangible difference to people in this part of the world.

 

[tongxinshe]

Makes you think it's more about trying to knock Apple down than actually help abused workers.

This, definitely this!

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Apple could put and end to this tomorrow if they cared to. They need to write their contract such that the payments will be reduced if certain labor conditions are not met.

For examples, the company (Foxcon) is required to pay loads to brokers out of profits. The practice would stop overnight with conditions like that.

And the youth raping priests have long totally disappeared in the US.

 

[apolloa]

No idea why anyone on here is outraged, we ALL help to enforce this modern capitalist world, minimise operating costs, maximise profits, workers suffer in some instances greatly. And we ALL very happily and willingly throw money at these corporations who express these practices regularly.

 

[macass]

Your average public educated low information simpleton.

This clearly NOT just an Apple problem but as someone else said, they *could* take the lead and do away with this crap. They could EASILY afford to make the stuff here - sure, it'd get the panties of the investors all twisted up and turd-stained but who really cares about investors anyways? I sure dont.

And, yes...the extra pay and benefits would have to come out of the profits. Uh oh. That means profit would have to drop to a paltry eleventy three trillion billion from the preferred 14.6 eleventy trillion billion. Its famine out there, I tell ya.

How great would it be for the US economy if everything that was sold here was also made here? Holy crap - the middle class would be booming with great jobs available to anyone that was willing to work. Great benefits, booming local economies, a HUGE tax base, etc, etc. Oh wait, I just described the 1950's There is a reason why THAT was the best of times.

I guess its not instyle to say this because you get labeled a socialist.... but.... It'd be nice if there was better distribution of company profits amongst everyone that works there. Nowadays it seems like 8-10 people make zillions of dollars and the rest fight over ever-diminishing wages & reduced benefits.

Off my soap-box now, thanks for listening.

Your average public educated low information simpleton making comments about economics that they know nothing about.

 

[mbh]

If Apple terminates a contract with Foxconn, or threatens to terminate and gives them a big fine, Foxconn you bet will somehow find a way to give its workers those 10 minute breaks and not go out of business.

My point is Apple is an industry leader, and has great influence financially and socially. It can use that influence and force companies to improve labor practices.

And it is doing so. Unfortunately stuff like this doesn't happen overnight. Realize that Foxconn has some sway here too. There aren't that many companies that can do what Apple needs done. Just because Apple says jump it doesn't mean that it actually happens right away, or at the height Apple demanded. It's a process. As long as they are moving in the right direction, I think Apple should be given some credit for doing things other large customers of these suppliers are not doing, rather than constantly being made a scapegoat.

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What Apple could do is offer these countries some financial incentives (more Apple stores !?) for throwing some of these jokers/brokers in deep dark jail cells for attempting to collect their illegal job brokering fees and interest from these unsuspecting workers.

Or the government could do it on their own, without the bribe from Apple. Or maybe Microsoft could chip in. They have billions in the bank too and give lots of business to these suppliers. Somehow it's always Apple's responsibility to do the right thing and everyone else gets a pass.

 

[BrockC]

This is really depressing. Makes my "1st world problems" look miniscule.

 

[gnasher729]

This is strictly criminal activity of the broker. Essentially a con job on an uninformed worker.

Apple isn't really involved. Just as they would not be legally involved if you were dumb enough to purchase an iPhone from a witch or troll who asked for your firstborn child in return as their broker fee, and you agreed.

It's up to Nepal to throw the criminal con men in their own country in jail. It would be illegal International imperialism for Apple security to go into Nepal and take over for their police department.

1. Apple is involved. The have contracts with their suppliers that force the supplier to refund these payments to their workers. (I would assume that the supplier will put something similar into their contracts with the agents that they use).

2. Nepal, on the other hand, has really nothing to do with this. I have no idea what makes you think the Nepal government should do anything about con men in Malaysia.

 

[Colino]

Agreed. Apple has done everything it possibly can to ensure best possible conditions at its suppliers - just look at their pedigree.

Sole blame is on all these other companies.

Ya, Apple is the only one using these plants to build products.

It's all Apple's fault. HP, Samsung, Acer, Moto, etc., etc., all use air conditioned plants in the US where emplyees work from the comfort of a Lazy Boy reclinder for $60 an hour working just three 7 hour days a week but get paid for 40 hours.

 

[vvswarup]

They are not the industry leader in devices manufactured, just profit margins and poularity. Samsung should be setting the example. Not to mention the CEO has nothing to do with this conversation and you shouldn't use him in your argument when it suits you.

Actually, multiple reports claim that Samsung has overtaken Apple in profit as well.

 

[mattbaar26]

I find it quite sad that many of these responses are quick to defend Apple and question why other companies are not in the headlines. If you really believe Apple is the best at making the products you buy, they should be held the most responsible. I'm not saying the other companies aren't to blame, but Apple is the biggest so naturally, they are going to be the target. It is good that Apple is targeted for this, more people will be inclined to read the article and see how their iDevices are really made.

That being said, I don't think it is the major tech companies that are to completely blame, it is definitely on the suppliers to not be doing this brokering. The major companies do have a responsibility to investigate their suppliers though.

 

[NoneOfYourB]

As the industry leader, which they happily celebrate, they should be setting an example for everyone else. Not to mention their CEO is happy to support liberal ideas and individuals when it suits him.

What are they supposed to do?
Send private police troops to malaysia?

 

[Winni]

As the industry leader, which they happily celebrate, they should be setting an example for everyone else. Not to mention their CEO is happy to support liberal ideas and individuals when it suits him.

Exactly. Supporting some anti-discrimination bill doesn't cost anything - but salaries do.

 

[gnasher729]

I find it quite sad that many of these responses are quick to defend Apple and question why other companies are not in the headlines. If you really believe Apple is the best at making the products you buy, they should be held the most responsible. I'm not saying the other companies aren't to blame, but Apple is the biggest so naturally, they are going to be the target. It is good that Apple is targeted for this, more people will be inclined to read the article and see how their iDevices are really made.

I find it quite sad that apparently you just read the headlines and nothing else. Follow the link to the PDF file in the article, and you will find exactly what Apple is doing about these situations. It is only due to Apple that in previous similar cases workers have received several million dollars of refunds, and there is no reasonable doubt that these people in Malaysia will get their money back as well. That is if they are working on contracts with Apple. If this "Apple supplier's Malaysian plant" has actually nothing to do with Apple (for example if the supplier has a plant in China building things for Apple and one in Malaysia building things for Samsung), then Apple's contract with the supplier would likely not apply to them.

Now you are welcome to find what other companies are doing and posting your results. I know Microsoft's written policy is that they put similar terms into their contracts as Apple, but leave it up to the supplier to tell them if they follow these terms or not.

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Actually, multiple reports claim that Samsung has overtaken Apple in profit as well.

Multiple reports comparing Samsung pre-tax profits and Apple after-tax profits. And of course Samsung makes a bit of money making refrigerators, Dyson vacuum cleaners, and so on. Although Dyson will want a bit of money off Samsung for copying their vacuum cleaners and using their patents without permission and paying.

 

[Padaung]

Well I disagree.
If you have to pay someone to get you a job right there that should raise a flag.
I never once had to pay a HeadHunter money to find me work. Your Resume should speak for itself.
And he can't be that stupid and didn't realize when the recruiter kept asking for more money to just walk away? No he was greedy and thought he would buy his way to a job making him just as crooked as the recruiter.

Practices such as this are widespread in many industries. Just because you have never had to do something, doesn't mean others haven't. Also, just because you may live in a country where work is well paid (or at least a minimum wage is in place), workers have rights, and a legal system is in place which allows you to seek affordable advice doesn't mean others have such luxuries.

Often the employee may be asked to to paying the first fee, and then the recruiter asks for more money and says they won't get the promised job otherwise, and that their first payment has become non-refundable. So the employee pays the extra money to make sure they get the job because they are already out of pocket and can't afford to not get the job - it becomes a spiral of massive debt for the employee.

Unfortunately it is not just the electronics industry that has this problem. The shipping industry has too, but they are doing everything they can to stamp out such practices.

Much like the poor Apple employee, seafarers could be stranded abroad with no job, no rights, and no passport through no fault of their own. They were often told to lie about any fees they may have paid to get the job, and would work for over a year at home to pay off said fees. MLC2006 is working hard to stop this happening in the maritime industry, the electronics industry as a whole needs to find similar solutions.

I'm sure Apple factories are not the only ones having problems such as these, but because Apple is an industry leader such incidences are more likely to be reported. It is good that Apple works to rectify such practices when it becomes aware of them.

 

[notjustjay]

The weird thing here is that if they need to hire 1500 employees fast, the best way to do that is to pay bonuses to, not collect fees from, the workers. The money is flowing in the wrong direction. Apple should be paying bonuses to the manufacturers who can staff up and the manufacturers should be paying bonuses to the recruiters who are able to get a lot of good workers and those recruiters should be paying signing bonuses to get those workers. So much for the law of supply and demand!

Unfortunately it is the law of supply and demand at work, combined with human greed.

Imagine I come into your town and offer dream jobs -- high pay, full benefits, and you don't even need any skills or experience, I'll provide all the training. A dream come true for many unemployed or poorly employed workers in your area, right? So I open my recruitment office and I get flooded with thousands upon thousands of applicants. How am I going to process them all? Maybe I get a little bit greedy and say "All I need now is the $1000 application fee". Thousands of people are still lining up, cash in hand. So maybe now it's $5,000. And so on...

 

[gnasher729]

I'm sure Apple factories are not the only ones having problems such as these, but because Apple is an industry leader such incidences are more likely to be reported. It is good that Apple works to rectify such practices when it becomes aware of them.

Just saying: "Apple factory" usually means "a factory producing things for many companies, one of them being Apple". Sometimes it means "a factory owned by a supplier who produces things for many companies, one of them being Apple, even though the particular factory mentioned has nothing to do with Apple".

As an example, "300 workers at Apple factory threaten suicide" - that was 300 workers afraid of losing their jobs because Microsoft lowered XBox production.

 

[Smaugg]

how does tim sleep at night ? besides on his million dollar bed sheets

He probably feels content with himself. Don't forget to consider the big picture. Among the horror stories such as this one, Apple creates directly and indirectly many thousands of jobs, which, undersirable as they may seem to you, bring real money to families in countries where having a proper paycheck is nothing short of a priviledge. For most of these workers the alternative of a factory job is squeezing a subsistence for themselves and their families from a few square meters of mud. Given a choice most would choose the paycheck that comes with the factory job. Tim is probably conscious of this and is happy of Apple's contribution to progress in the developing world. My impression is that he also is quite a decent guy who strives to stamp out abuses such as the one described in the article.