Researchers Disclose iPhone and iPad Location-Tracking Privacy Issues

[charlituna]

This is a huge concern because of the use by law enforcement of the Cellebrite device to download and scrutinize the data in cell phones.

I would be less concerned about the device and more about the laws/rules that allow them to ask you for your cell phone when you are stopped for speeding etc. They should have to have a warrant or probable cause. But it seems like they have neither and are just demanding your phone. But this kind of access, including this Apple list, only works if you turn over your phone to anyone or lose it. Without that, the informations existence is moot since it isn't calling out to anywhere on its own and giving it up

 

[KnightWRX]

The granted patent describes exactly what is stored in the db... Instead of hysteria people should think a little more before becoming Jawas.
They have simply developed a method of accurately triangulating the devices position based upon (probably 4) towers.

And both my points has nothing to do with what is in the DB, it has to do with the lifetime of this content in the database. I know what is in there, I just don't want it to be kept indefinitely, nor do I want it in the backups on my Mac, as probably a lot of the people that aren't happy this in thread want.

I also want it to be disabled if I ask it to.

After all the press this is generating, I'm sure Apple will tone done the logging/lifetime to acceptable parameters and then we'll be able to all Move Along and be happy with our shiny toys once again.

 

[Trauma1]

I love all the dopes quoting various disclosures in agreements that we've agreed to. Just because something is written into terms of an agreement, does not make it lawful. Apple could put in their T&Cs you agree to allow Apple to shoot you dead if you jailbreak your iPhone. Do you think that would be OK too since you agreed to allow it?

Well now we know you're not an attorney, or at least a good one.

 

[heisenberg123]

we have been "tracked" long before iPhones were around, we like these features when they benifit us (find my phone, gps, maps, etc.) but dont like the other side of what the info does to our privacy.

if you like to me more anonymous you need to limit how often you "connect" to the internet or gps systems, all that info can be used both ways.

dont get me wrong i hate the whole big brother world we are becoming and i think people should stand up against it but stop using all these neat gadgets is the start to stopping your privacy from being evaded, you cant have it both ways

 

[mlemonds]

I have read through the thread and it says that the data is not stored in the CDMA phones.

Can someone confirm that in the CDMA iPhone that the tables labeled cdmaxxxx are empty?

see attached

 

[boyced]

64bit machine needed, i make a 32bit build for you will be up in a few minutes

done:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1881429/MyPhoneTracker-32bit.zip

thanks that works, which iphone backup is used? is it possible to select?

 

[metsjetsfan]

Are there some people out there who like this? Like living on the grid.

 

[heisenberg123]

Are there some people out there who like this? Like living on the grid.

better question would be how do you expect to stay off the grid if you own all the devices that connect to it?

 

[citi]

It says I have been in Vegas, I haven't been to vegas since the early 90's. Fail

Uh, they told you the iDevices were magical. That's just how good Apple's software is.

 

[metsjetsfan]

Hasn't living on the grid saved some people in criminal investigations when they were accused of something they didn't do. I remember this with something on facebook.

 

[wonderspark]

http://datasecurityblog.wordpress.com/2011/04/21/ios-trackergate-not-new-but-still-disturbing/

 

[kdarling]

The granted patent describes exactly what is stored in the db... Instead of hysteria people should think a little more before becoming Jawas.
They have simply developed a method of accurately triangulating the devices position based upon (probably 4) towers.

That patent is about quickly looking up nearby towers using a database stored on a server... not the client.

I really doubt there's an internal database. Just imagine how many millions of cell towers are out there. Even my locations, here in Malawi, were very accurate. There has to be data passed back and forth.

Yes, I think there must be data being passed.

Why does the phone have to get in touch with Apple? There's no reason to... I wouldn't be surprised if each cell tower antenna has it's location coded into it.

No, towers do not give out their coordinates. That's a carrier secret, for a bunch of reasons. Moreover, in some places carriers used to swap cell ids every day just to prevent the use of cell id locating methods by anyone except those who paid the carrier.

So we're missing a big piece of the puzzle here, which is how the device is deriving the coordinates that are being stored.

--

Normally Apple collects cell and hotspot data each time a GPS location request is fulfilled, and sends the combined info back to Apple. Note that the user is paying for that data transfer, which was okay with unlimited data, but not so okay if they're on a lower limit plan.

--

I wonder if the database collection is related to the late night mass transfers that some people see. Perhaps the code is silly stupid and sends the entire database each time, not just an increment.

Something is missing from the picture here.

 

[Clutch21]

Yawn, you can encrypt your iOS backups with a single click in iTunes. Also iOS itself does offer encryption if you enable data protection.

The only problem here of course is the fact that is these are not enabled by default, but I don't think they have to unless someone feels it is necessary. I do think Apple should warn people about the risks of running unencrypted.

This is sort of like people freaking out over the fact that Foursquare or Facebook Places can be used to track people. Although people tend to have to opt in to use those services, tracking is simply not a big deal to some people.

Wake me up when there is an actual security threat here. The data points aren't even that accurate, at best they tell you the general area where someone has been, not precise locations.

I think it's hilarious how you yawn, but if this was google you'd be all upset.

Additionally 4Sq and FB are opt in. This isn't opt in or opt out. I can allow or disallow my location to be stored or shared, Everyone with an iPhone 4 cannot stop this from happening.

Furthermore, not encrypting the file is just plain dumb. What kind of a shotty operation is Apple running these days. They obviously care not for the users data. They care only for the marketing value. Enjoy your iPhone.

 

[Clutch21]

Gawd you're an ass.

I don't mind being tracked because I don't care if people know. I have nothing to hide. If I would have something to hide, it probably would be to people who don't have access to the information at all.

It's only in my close social circles where I might want to keep a lid on things they know. But who the hell cares if someone I will never come into contact with, directly or indirectly, has access to a file which shows where my phone has been?

Way to make a problem out of nothing.

If google did this you would be singing a different tune. Guaranteed. Prove me wrong. lol fanboy.

 

[Clutch21]

I'd sure hate for the guy who steals my phone to then have :

- My home address and work address
- A full history of my routine with precise times of departure/arrival and where

Section 4B says that the location data is kept in a way that makes it non-identifiable to me. Well, if it's sitting on my phone, it identifies me pretty well. Seems this consolidated.db is running afoul of Section 4b, contrary to what people are stating here.

The simple fact is, this file should be regularly flushed by the OS. Why is it keeping a full history ? What purpose does a full history serve, with such ridiculously small polling window ? Why is it continually polling anyhow ? It should poll my location only when I am using a service that requires it then and there, otherwise it should not be collecting location data and storing it.

There is obviously something amiss. I suspect this is more a bug than anything and that it shouldn't retain the data indefinitely.

As for anyone spouting off "I have nothing to hide", I dare all of you to read this essay by someone much more qualified in the field of privacy than you obviously are :

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=998565

abstract :

Well Said!

 

[Clutch21]

If you've got nothing to hide, what's the problem?

So then can I see your credit card bills from last year? you have nothing to hide right?

Can I see where you live, work, frequent? So I can build a plan to rob your house? You've got nothing to hide right?

 

[aperry]

we have been "tracked" long before iPhones were around, we like these features when they benifit us (find my phone, gps, maps, etc.) but dont like the other side of what the info does to our privacy.

if you like to me more anonymous you need to limit how often you "connect" to the internet or gps systems, all that info can be used both ways.

dont get me wrong i hate the whole big brother world we are becoming and i think people should stand up against it but stop using all these neat gadgets is the start to stopping your privacy from being evaded, you cant have it both ways

Oh sure, now let's explore this little leap you've presented us. So your point is that we've been tracked like this all along. Can you explain why "find my iphone" , gps, or maps needs to store my complete location history in an unencrypted file regardless of whether I'm actually using those apps?

Pretty sure Find My Iphone only gives me the last known location of my device. Similarly Maps only shows me where I am, not a complete history. And while some Navigation programs would optionally track everywhere I've been, it's only while the app is running and it's usually an option (and 100% optional to kill the app or uninstall it). Of course, this little consolidated.db location tracking is not optional.

Soooo, your logic is pretty weak. In fact nothing else on the iPhone works this way, nor does it need to. And therefor no, we should not just accept that it's okay for Apple to do this.

 

[heisenberg123]

So then can I see your credit card bills from last year? you have nothing to hide right?

Can I see where you live, work, frequent? So I can build a plan to rob your house? You've got nothing to hide right?

sure if you knew what your doing your could see peoples credit card info, steal their identity, find out where they live, this info on the iphone is not any easier to access then finding out info about people who do even own an iphone

 

[Clutch21]

Encrypting the database file on the device would not provide any decent protection, as the iOS software itself would have to have the decryption key to be able to write to this file.

I see your point but not necessarily true.

http://sqlcipher.net/

 

[aperry]

So then can I see your credit card bills from last year? you have nothing to hide right?

Can I see where you live, work, frequent? So I can build a plan to rob your house? You've got nothing to hide right?

No one should have anything to hide, right? I mean, why should I care that some thief who steals my laptop and finds photos of my beautiful wife and kids now also has the location of my home? After all, I have nothing to hide in this pleasant world. I should have no concerns that a thief knows what we look like, where we live and when I'm out of the house.

 

[Clutch21]

sure if you knew what your doing your could see peoples credit card info, steal their identity, find out where they live, this info on the iphone is not any easier to access then finding out info about people who do even own an iphone

No, but it's quite convenient. More convenient then it should be.

Everyone knows you encrypt personal information. OH BUT WAIT! It's not personal because it doesn't contain any "Personal" information.

Which is pretty stupid, because obviously if I get your phone, I know who you are, I know who your friends are, I know your social likes.

And now!! Da Da DA!!!! I know where you live, work, and frequent.

Sure I can find that all out other ways, but why bother. Apple makes it so easy. There's an "consolidated.db" file for that.

 

[heisenberg123]

Oh sure, now let's explore this little leap you've presented us. So your point is that we've been tracked like this all along. Can you explain why "find my iphone" , gps, or maps needs to store my complete location history in an unencrypted file regardless of whether I'm actually using those apps?

Pretty sure Find My Iphone only gives me the last known location of my device. Similarly Maps only shows me where I am, not a complete history. And while some Navigation programs would optionally track everywhere I've been, it's only while the app is running and it's usually an option (and 100% optional to kill the app or uninstall it). Of course, this little consolidated.db location tracking is not optional.

Soooo, your logic is pretty weak. In fact nothing else on the iPhone works this way, nor does it need to. And therefor no, we should not just accept that it's okay for Apple to do this.

if your going to connect to someone else network then yes they can see where the device is? why is that so hard to understand? why are you using someone else network?

did you think you owned that connection you were on? or that it was a private network?

 

[Clutch21]

No one should have anything to hide, right? I mean, why should I care that some thief who steals my laptop and finds photos of my beautiful wife and kids now also has the location of my home? After all, I have nothing to hide in this pleasant world. I should have no concerns that a thief knows what we look like, where we live and when I'm out of the house.

LOL my point exactly. Even if you don't have anything to hide. Do you care about your right to privacy? If you don't, well ok that's your choice. But don't assume that the rest of us are ok with giving up the ability to say YES I want to enable that, or NO I don't want to.

Giving a choice is better than not.

 

[heisenberg123]

No, but it's quite convenient. More convenient then it should be.

Everyone knows you encrypt personal information. OH BUT WAIT! It's not personal because it doesn't contain any "Personal" information.

Which is pretty stupid, because obviously if I get your phone, I know who you are, I know who your friends are, I know your social likes.

And now!! Da Da DA!!!! I know where you live, work, and frequent.

Sure I can find that all out other ways, but why bother. Apple makes it so easy. There's an "consolidated.db" file for that.

i hear ya, but even before iphones - how many people have a number stored as "home" or "wife" in their address book with that number i can do a reverse lookup and see where you live, our infomation has been out there forever its only now that apple is doing it, now its news worthy

 

[heisenberg123]

LOL my point exactly. Even if you don't have anything to hide. Do you care about your right to privacy? If you don't, well ok that's your choice. But don't assume that the rest of us are ok with giving up the ability to say YES I want to enable that, or NO I don't want to.

Giving a choice is better than not.

but people want it both ways, as soon as you connect to a public networks or gps system your not on a private connection