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First of all that type of tv is very rare. I don't know any tvs that have that much of a low res. Secondly a tv is used about 6-10 feet away vs the ipad which is used from about 2 feet away.

1024x768 isn't that rare in HDTVs, actually.

And you use the iPad a lot closer than two feet away. The resolution on the iPad isn't great. Never has been, since day 1. This is nothing new, and one of my biggest complaints about the device (along with lack of RAM).
 
We could get widescreen and would not do any damage. I'd settle for that :)

Something like 1365x768 would be doable and not hurt or break anything.
But I don't see Apple doing it unless they are forced to.

seriously widescreen would make the iPad an epic fail. i Dont get why all the other do use 16:9, i mean it totally sucks in potrait mode. I think a 3:2 aspect ratio would still be kind of good, but 16:9 is for HDTV not for a tablet!
 
1024x768 isn't that rare in HDTVs, actually.

And you use the iPad a lot closer than two feet away. The resolution on the iPad isn't great. Never has been, since day 1. This is nothing new, and one of my biggest complaints about the device (along with lack of RAM).

Did you purchase an iPad knowing your complaints before hand?

Until the iPhone 4 came out the iPad display was never an issue. Now it is something that others jump on the bandwagon and suddenly are concerned about the "poor" display and now the new reason to complain, "ram".
 
seriously widescreen would make the iPad an epic fail. i Dont get why all the other do use 16:9, i mean it totally sucks in potrait mode. I think a 3:2 aspect ratio would still be kind of good, but 16:9 is for HDTV not for a tablet!

The fact is, people have been asked how they use their iPad and the vast majority use it in Landscape mode all the time.

It's more natural to do so anyway. you have 2 eyes and your normal field of vision widescreen if you think about it. We as humans have a wide field of view, not a tall field of view.

Myself, my iPad has been locked in widescreen for the past couple of months and the only time I use portrait is when an app forces me to.

Remember for Web browsing, playing games and video playback (also many other things) widescreen (more pixels across) would be better.


And to be totally honest, I just don't believe your statement in the 1st place.

You may deny it all you wish and even think you are being honest with yourself but I'd bet if the current iPad was widescreen and other tablets were 4:3 you would be saying how Apple got it right and the others are epic fails choosing a format from the past.

I expect you to deny this though ;)
 
The fact is, people have been asked how they use their iPad and the vast majority use it in Landscape mode all the time.

It's more natural to do so anyway. you have 2 eyes and your normal field of vision widescreen if you think about it. We as humans have a wide field of view, not a tall field of view.

Myself, my iPad has been locked in widescreen for the past couple of months and the only time I use portrait is when an app forces me to.

Remember for Web browsing, playing games and video playback (also many other things) widescreen (more pixels across) would be better.

Agreed, but for book reading the tall across does not offer an optimal reading experience. Apple went for the middle of the road.
 
The fact is, people have been asked how they use their iPad and the vast majority use it in Landscape mode all the time.

It's more natural to do so anyway. you have 2 eyes and your normal field of vision widescreen if you think about it. We as humans have a wide field of view, not a tall field of view.

Myself, my iPad has been locked in widescreen for the past couple of months and the only time I use portrait is when an app forces me to.

Remember for Web browsing, playing games and video playback (also many other things) widescreen (more pixels across) would be better.


And to be totally honest, I just don't believe your statement in the 1st place.

You may deny it all you wish and even think you are being honest with yourself but I'd bet if the current iPad was widescreen and other tablets were 4:3 you would be saying how Apple got it right and the others are epic fails choosing a format from the past.

I expect you to deny this though ;)

Actually, for web browsing, books, anything with reading, portrait is better. Notice how most articles and blogs online, the column of text is narrow and doesn't fill the screen horizontally. That's because it's easier for our eyes to move up down, as opposed to left to right.

In web pages, you are mostly scrolling down, so vertical resolution is more important.

As far as gaming, widescreen is not better. It depends on the game and genre.

The only thing widescreen is good for is watching newer films. Of course, older movies and tv shows are 1.33:1
 
Actually, for web browsing, books, anything with reading, portrait is better. Notice how most articles and blogs online, the column of text is narrow and doesn't fill the screen horizontally. That's because it's easier for our eyes to move up down, as opposed to left to right.

In web pages, you are mostly scrolling down, so vertical resolution is more important.

As far as gaming, widescreen is not better. It depends on the game and genre.

The only thing widescreen is good for is watching newer films. Of course, older movies and tv shows are 1.33:1

I will disagree with 1 point :)

Web browsing.

It, in effect, does not matter about the vertical resolution as web pages are made to scroll up/down so you will get full detail vertically no matter what the screen resolution in that direction.

It's the horizontal resolution you cannot do anything about (unless you have a web browser on the iPad where you can scroll left and right on) and no-one want that.

1024 is simply not enough pixels across to really be idea for a web page. it's usable and ok, but not ideal.

The iPad actually scales with width/pixes down now to fit the limited horizontal 1024 rez. You can sometimes just catch it doing it.
 
The problem with portrait browsing on the iPad, is the lack of automatic text reflow on mobile Safari.

Mobile Safari breaks the cardinal mobile rule: whenever possible, avoid horizontal scrolling, especially to read text at different sizes.

Reflow is a major reason to use HTML, and almost every other mobile browser supports it.
 
Hmm ok, still, doesn't apply to me, I wasn't interested in those links, I was doing a quick post :p

Anyway, I don't think I'll buy another iPad until it goes retina, I think it is probable that a 7" iPad comes out with a (retina) 1920x1280 display, even though that is 4x more pixels than the iPhone 4 -- Apple can do it!

You must be incredibly dense to keep harping on this. That or you're just a troll.

It's been discussed before that the reason the original iphone apps are still usable on the iphone4 display is because the resolution was exactly doubled. Do you honestly think the fact the resolution was exactly doubled is simply a coincindence? Without a doubling the applications would not have scaled properly and app rewrites would have been mandatory.

To get the same effect on the ipad you would need the same size display with 2048x1536 resolution. The SGX535 cannot do that. Even if the SGX540 could do it, it would be a slideshow. The ipad as a gaming device would be crippled as no quality 3D titles can run at that resolution with the available mobile hardware. You could completely forget about titles like Epic Citadel running at native resolution.

Seriously, how many times does this need to be explained to you?

What kind of twisted reasoning do yo have to use to come up with "the new nano display isn't labeled as Retina so only displays with exactly 326ppi are Retina"? You claim to understand that "Retina" is simply a marketing term and that it is not static, yet turn around and completely contradict that.

I will say it again. The ppi that is required for a display to be considered "Retina" varies depending on the distance from the user. A phone requires a higher ppi to achieve that state as the device is held closer to the user. An ipad is typically held farther away from the user, which based on average distance means you'd only need a density of about 220 ppi. Doubling the resolution would put you at around 265ppi, which is well beyond what is required to make a display on the ipad "Retina"
 
Did you purchase an iPad knowing your complaints before hand?

Until the iPhone 4 came out the iPad display was never an issue. Now it is something that others jump on the bandwagon and suddenly are concerned about the "poor" display and now the new reason to complain, "ram".

The display is really nothing to harp about, I agree. Most people on the forum who do so have zero understanding of what makes a display "retina"

The RAM however is something that I think is worth harping about. Multitasking on the ipad will require more RAM per application on average due to obvious reasons. You can get away with 256MB in the ipod/iphone, but I don't think it will be as easy to on the ipad. You will see applications being dropped from save state sooner than you will on the iphone 3GS. As an anecdote, I personally have much more use for multitasking on my ipad than I do on a phone. I'd rather have 256MB of RAM in an iphone4 than an ipad.
 
You must be incredibly dense to keep harping on this. That or you're just a troll.


Probably the issue is many people don't understand the tech of LCD screens and can't understand why they can't just scale up an image to fill the screen as happened with CRT monitors over decades.

What could, and I mean COULD happen was that Apple could bump up the res a bit and current apps would run with a border all around the outside.

that would be technically fine, but I don't think Apple (or any of us) would really like that.

No, I think we are stuck at the current rez for quite a long time.
 
Personally, I much prefer the long battery life than having a Retina display.

At this point in time, I see a better resolution display for the iPad2. Will it be a 326 ppi display? Probably not.

If I am wrong, this would be one crow that I wouldn't mind eating. :)
 
Probably the issue is many people don't understand the tech of LCD screens and can't understand why they can't just scale up an image to fill the screen as happened with CRT monitors over decades.

What could, and I mean COULD happen was that Apple could bump up the res a bit and current apps would run with a border all around the outside.

that would be technically fine, but I don't think Apple (or any of us) would really like that.

No, I think we are stuck at the current rez for quite a long time.

The problem is even when the reasons for why it is not feasible at the moment are plainly explained to them, they completely ignore it. It's one thing to explain it to them and they say "ohhh ok, well then I guess you get the same effect with 220 ppi". It's something else when they stand proudly ignorant and simply repeat their initial assertion as if the explanation isn't even on the page.

With regards to the display I agree. Driving a web browser, photos (which would utilize all of the extra resolution) and 720/1080p video is likely possible with an SGX545 (which has not made any appearances yet). Driving 3D games is not.

Hell a standard desktop GPU would get bogged down at 2048x1536 with moderately demanding desktop titles. (yes I realize that's not a fair comparison, it's just an amusing anecdote) Even with mobile hardware developing ahead of Moore's Law (which is only used as a reference and doesn't technically apply to mobile device hardware) we're still a few years from mobile GPUs that could drive a quality 3D environment at that resolution.

Their only option is to go big and double the resolution (which for a 9.7" display would skyrocket the component cost) or jump to something around 220ppi and necessitate app rewrites. I cannot see Apple doing anything other than a resolution doubling. You can see how important it was not to alienate any developers or users when they upgraded the display in the iphone4
 
I've compared my iPhone4 and an iPad...such a big difference in terms of screen quality.

Do you think Apple will bring the retina display to the next version of iPad ?

Here yah go...

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1012466/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/932208/
https://forums.macrumors.com/archive/index.php/t-957494.html
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/931044/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/957494/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/985289/

Ah Man!!!

When did the admins start filtering "**************************" =(
 
You must be incredibly dense to keep harping on this. That or you're just a troll.

It's been discussed before that the reason the original iphone apps are still usable on the iphone4 display is because the resolution was exactly doubled. Do you honestly think the fact the resolution was exactly doubled is simply a coincindence? Without a doubling the applications would not have scaled properly and app rewrites would have been mandatory.

To get the same effect on the ipad you would need the same size display with 2048x1536 resolution. The SGX535 cannot do that. Even if the SGX540 could do it, it would be a slideshow. The ipad as a gaming device would be crippled as no quality 3D titles can run at that resolution with the available mobile hardware. You could completely forget about titles like Epic Citadel running at native resolution.

Seriously, how many times does this need to be explained to you?

What kind of twisted reasoning do yo have to use to come up with "the new nano display isn't labeled as Retina so only displays with exactly 326ppi are Retina"? You claim to understand that "Retina" is simply a marketing term and that it is not static, yet turn around and completely contradict that.

I will say it again. The ppi that is required for a display to be considered "Retina" varies depending on the distance from the user. A phone requires a higher ppi to achieve that state as the device is held closer to the user. An ipad is typically held farther away from the user, which based on average distance means you'd only need a density of about 220 ppi. Doubling the resolution would put you at around 265ppi, which is well beyond what is required to make a display on the ipad "Retina"

More nonsense. 220dpi? Where did you pull that number from? And you have NO idea what the graphics chips are capable of. And the iPhone 4 did not double the resolution. It quadrupled it.
 
More nonsense. 220dpi? Where did you pull that number from?

I believe he's referring to the "retina" (*) display distance, which, as defined by Apple, is the distance at which a normal person's retina cannot discern separate pixels.

With 326ppi, the distance is 11".
With 220ppi, the distance is 16".

And the iPhone 4 did not double the resolution. It quadrupled it.

The iPhone 4:
  • doubled the screen resolution (number of pixels in each direction),
  • doubled the pixel density (from 163 to 326ppi),
  • quadrupled the total number of pixels.

(*) Instead of "retina", Apple could've said "print quality" - 300dpi at 12" - but at least one previous high-res smartphone had already used that for ads, which no doubt factored into their creation of a new marketing term instead.
 
First of all that type of tv is very rare. I don't know any tvs that have that much of a low res. Secondly a tv is used about 6-10 feet away vs the ipad which is used from about 2 feet away.

It's a brand new TV (actually, TVs) they sell right now brand new at the store, to high user ratings I might add. As another poster mentioned, it is not "rare" it's just 720P, not 1080P, which is what my original point was.

Secondly, all I was saying is that the iPad shares the same resolution as displays 4 and 5 times the size, I made no mention about how far a typical viewing distance is.

I sit as close to my "inferior" PPI iMac display as I do the iPad in general use, and I don't feel bummed out whatsoever. All this whining about retina this and retina that is really annoying...

You can wish for your precious retina display in one hand and **** in the other and see which one fills up first. Get used to it!


Sent from my iPhone 4
 
I believe he's referring to the "retina" (*) display distance, which, as defined by Apple, is the distance at which a normal person's retina cannot discern separate pixels.

With 326ppi, the distance is 11".
With 220ppi, the distance is 16".



The iPhone 4:
  • doubled the screen resolution (number of pixels in each direction),
  • doubled the pixel density (from 163 to 326ppi),
  • quadrupled the total number of pixels.

(*) Instead of "retina", Apple could've said "print quality" - 300dpi at 12" - but at least one previous high-res smartphone had already used that for ads, which no doubt factored into their creation of a new marketing term instead.

You're confusing things. The iPhone 4 has 4x the resolution of iPhones prior. Period. It doesn't matter that the resolution is just doubled in each direction. The RESULT is 4x the resolution, 4x the detail, 4x as many pixels in the same area. The end.

And anyone who says the iPad isn't capable of a "retina" display is talking hogwash. Whether Apple wants to let us have it is another thing, but before the iPad came out, I suppose tablets weren't capable of 10+ hours of battery life, either?

Give it time. It WILL happen. Mark my words.
 
You're confusing things. The iPhone 4 has 4x the resolution of iPhones prior. Period. It doesn't matter that the resolution is just doubled in each direction. The RESULT is 4x the resolution, 4x the detail, 4x as many pixels in the same area. The end.

And anyone who says the iPad isn't capable of a "retina" display is talking hogwash. Whether Apple wants to let us have it is another thing, but before the iPad came out, I suppose tablets weren't capable of 10+ hours of battery life, either?

Give it time. It WILL happen. Mark my words.

Indeed it WILL happen, of that there is no doubt.

When they have a CPU/GPU that is 400% the speed of the current one :)

2020 here we come.
 
I don't require a higher resolution. I just had my eyes checked and in daily use I never think about pixels when reading Instapaper.
 
More nonsense. 220dpi? Where did you pull that number from?

It's been beaten to death, I am not your forum search/Google. Based on the average distance from the user, 220 is the approximate ppi value required to make an iPad appear "Retina" to the user. However to maintain current application compatibility, as they did with the iPhone4, you would have to double the width/length resolution (quadrupling the pixels). Doing so would put you at around 265ppi (263ppi exactly if I remember correctly) and 2048x1536 resolution, which puts you well beyond what is required to make the device's display "Retina".

And you have NO idea what the graphics chips are capable of. And the iPhone 4 did not double the resolution. It quadrupled it.

You are conflating the two. The number of pixels are quadrupled, as is the resolution when referred to in megapixels. As is common with many such things in marketing, most consumers see resolution measurements in terms of width/length, ergo to them the resolution was doubled. Yes it is stupid, but that's the hole that tech marketing dug for itself over the years by referring to a length/width and area measurement with the same term. I apologize for trying to remain bound by the simplistic consumer measurements. If you wish we can refer to the screens simply in terms of megapixels and/or ppi.

Amazingly enough I do realize that when you double two numbers, the result of their multiplication is four times the original value. Such a stunning revelation in mathematics.

And with regards to the graphics, take a netbook with a GMA500 in it (Intel's co-opted SGX535), hook it up to a display with 2560x1600 resolution and let me know how smoothly that runs even a basic 3D environment at native resolution for you. Go ahead, I'll wait.

And with the SGX535/540, it is readily available information what their (theoretical) raw power is. The SGX540 doubles the MPoly/s from the 535 from 14 to 28, which is not enough to maintain the same performance level at 2048x1536 as the 535 manages at 1024x768. Doubling the MPoly/s raw performance (which is the claimed theoretical) while quadrupling the number of pixels will clearly not net you the same performance even on paper, let alone real world. The SGX545 has, as of current announcements, not been made available to manufacturers on a large scale yet.

And anyone who says the iPad isn't capable of a "retina" display is talking hogwash. Whether Apple wants to let us have it is another thing, but before the iPad came out, I suppose tablets weren't capable of 10+ hours of battery life, either?

Give it time. It WILL happen. Mark my words.

No, they are most certainly not "talking hogwash". The iPad's hardware, in its current form (bolded and underlined for your emphasis), is not capable of smoothly powering a 9.7" display at 2048x1536. Even the successor to the 535, the 540, is not capable of doing that.

You do not seem to understand that. The rebuttal to morons clamoring for a "Retina" display in the iPad is not one of "it will never happen". It is that it will never happen with the current hardware powering the iPad. That is not up for debate. The iPad would require a substantial hardware bump to accommodate that type of display. So if Apple updates the iPad's display, all the internals will have to be updated substantially along with it. You will not see a simple refresh of the current iPad with a 2048x1536 resolution display.

And that battery life would take an absolute nosedive if you beefed the hardware up enough to drive a display with 2048x1536 resolution. Not to mention the sheer cost of the hardware and display that small with that great of a resolution would, at this time, bite so hard into the profit margin of the $499 iPad that Apple would possibly have to sell it at a loss or break even if it remained at the current pricing structure. These are basic fundamentals of hardware and cost. They simply have to wait until the cost of the components required to power such a display (and the cost of the display itself) drop down to where Apple can either maintain the current pricing structure or justify a slight bump. Otherwise the entry level devices will most certainly break even when you factor in development costs.

Somehow, and call me crazy, I don't think Apple wants to turn their massively popular and profitable iPad into a loss leader. That's what iTunes is for.
 
You do not seem to understand that. The rebuttal to morons clamoring for a "Retina" display in the iPad is not one of "it will never happen". It is that it will never happen with the current hardware powering the iPad. That is not up for debate. The iPad would require a substantial hardware bump to accommodate that type of display. So if Apple updates the iPad's display, all the internals will have to be updated substantially along with it. You will not see a simple refresh of the current iPad with a 2048x1536 resolution display.
That's rude, I'm not a moron, and nor is anyone just because they want a retina iPad.

Apple brought this upon themselves, they introduced the retina display and now they are expected to do the same on the iPad. I don't know how others feel, but I'm not going to buy another iPad just because it has a front and rear facing camera and a few upgrades. I'm probably going to wait for a retina display, I may be waiting a while, but I have a feeling I won't.

Remember the iPad is magical, Steve Job's said it himself, retina is required!

Out of curiosity could the Tegra 2 power a 2048x1536 res? Or, a 1920x1280 res?
 
If you want retina display on next ipad, just email steve jobs. Also, tell him you will pay even 1000 dollars for it. I am sure Steve will listen to you. If apple doesn't put retina display on next ipad, that would be because of the cost.
 
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