You’re comparing an existing laptop- with 2 fans in it- to an iPad with no fans and severe thermal constraints, and single core performance is very similar. The A12z will never be in a production Mac.
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Rosetta Won't Support x86 Virtualization Apps Running Windows
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Sure. But on the other hand the Intel CPU in this comparison was handicapped by its outdated 14nm process node, which will no longer be the case with the CPUs that will be available when the first ARM Macs come out. You can go back and forth, but it is highly unlikely that Apple's CPUs will suddenly be "100% faster", as the previous poster suggested.
Intel’s 10nm processor node isn’t looking so hot either. That would be equivalent to TSMC’s 7nm node. And the consensus seems to be that the Apple Silicon will be 5nm.
I'm not sure I necessarily agree with the comments that Apple Silicon is only for Apple's benefit. I think there will be plenty of advantages for users and developers, mostly around performance and power. Presumably massive benefits over the current intel integrated graphics too.
I would be interested to know whether the a12z developer kits have heatsink or fan? Anyone with a raspberry pi knows that with a small fan you can easily overclock the pi by 40%.
By that logic, the 2.65Ghz in A13 could top out at something like 3.70GHz+ with active cooling.
I got my first Mac in Sept 2005, it was the last Mac mini PowerPC G4 1.5Ghz 'silent upgrade' shipped from the factory. This was after Steve had announced the switch to Intel at WWDC. It triggered my purchase. I love it, its brilliant and still runs today, but I would have been better of with the 1st gen Intel mac which came right afterwards.
I would be interested to know whether the a12z developer kits have heatsink or fan? Anyone with a raspberry pi knows that with a small fan you can easily overclock the pi by 40%.
By that logic, the 2.65Ghz in A13 could top out at something like 3.70GHz+ with active cooling.
I got my first Mac in Sept 2005, it was the last Mac mini PowerPC G4 1.5Ghz 'silent upgrade' shipped from the factory. This was after Steve had announced the switch to Intel at WWDC. It triggered my purchase. I love it, its brilliant and still runs today, but I would have been better of with the 1st gen Intel mac which came right afterwards.
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I doubled checked and the long video points to Virtualization at the 1:40:00 mark and at the 1:41:52 mark the go into the details of what that means. "So if you bring up a Linux VM in Parallels' desktop..." So right in the video it expressly states you can run VMs on these Macs. And unless he is using a ported version of Parallels (nothing to say he is) then it is a version of it written for Intel. And what other OS can you run on Parallels? Oh yes Windows for the Intel chip.
Yes, I know watching an 1 hour 42 minutes and 22 second video is a chore but there are little stop points to help find the section you want rather then having to slog through the whole thing.
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Parallels have have already done so though Apple could be using an Intel version they launch the Linux VM from in their presentation.
Just went to WINEHQ:
"
he original Motivation was to be able to run winelib-apps on ARM, that even was before it got public that win8 will run on ARM devices. Meanwhile we support these new ARM PEs for win8!
Status
- Yes, It works! (TM)
- Running win8 ARM PEs also works.
- Already ported Putty to ARM as winelib application.
- First patch was September 18. 2009, final patchset sent September 18. 2010 and they got in Wine-1.3.4
- Wine on ARM already gets packaged by Debian (since 1.7.35), Fedora, Maemo and openSUSE.
- Good debugger/disassembler support.
- Relay tracing.
- Relocation.
- Linux Kernel patched upstream for running Windows RT applications see
Bug 31322
- libs/port/interlocked.c: maybe native operations.
- wine-gecko/wine-mono ARM port (waiting for mingw-w64-arm).
- DCOM"
Parallels is already working with Apple on the matter, for now they stated that they developed an Arm version of Parallels capable of virtualize arm based platforms. To run x86 platforms we need emulation, not virtualization.
In the keynote, they are demonstrating an unreleased version of Parallels running native on the ARM processor, running an ARM version of Linux. This was clarified in the State of the Union video and later sessions.
If you really want to run x86 Linux, there already seem to be multiple repos on GitHub with source code that can virtualize Linux and Windows x86 binaries on iOS devices. Just build them using Xcode, and these VMs should run, not only on your iPhone, but as is on the eventual Apple Silicon Macs as well.
What on earth do you even know about ARM processors?
Actually, the fact that only a small subset of PCs can be turned into hackentoshes shows it is a hardware issue. Even when the hardware has "the right specs" from what I have read you have to do a lot of fiddling to get the OS to run or stay stable.
Your experience with Arm is with processors not aimed at the desktop market. It would be like saying ”xeons suck because my experience with celerons is that x86 is terrible.”
The problem is Intel knew that Apple was considering, for years, to go in house if they kept messing up with having chips ready when they claimed they would be. More over AMD also is having problems getting its chips out when promised (16-core Ryzen 9 3950X for instance). You can be aggressive about new chip technologies all you want but if you can't deliver the hardware when and in the amounts you claim you can then it is effectively meaningless. Personally I think CISC has reached the limits of what it can do in terms of power consumption and size reduction. There is a reason that RISC chips dominate the smartphone market and it is clear that is where the future is.
me and three other macforums members are secretly working on a 64-bit hyper threaded update of the 68k series of chips. We'll show you what CISC can do!
I tried the most recent version of Parallels Pro, and I have used Boot Camp. Both options were a complete bust that brought my machine to a crawl. Maybe it would run well on a new MacPro with a minimum of 128GB of RAM, but that's out of my league. I still love the Mac, but for running windows, not so much. Much easier to buy a mid-grade windows PC and call it done.
I only use Boot Camp for games, so I'll probably end up building my own gaming PC when it comes time to upgrade. I currently use an eGPU and who knows if that will continue to be supported even.
I have a 2016 tbMBP right now and it's great, I expect to keep using it the next couple years at least so I'm set for the time being anyway.
I have a 2016 tbMBP right now and it's great, I expect to keep using it the next couple years at least so I'm set for the time being anyway.
Apple keeps wanting to create proprietary hardware. SMH. I wonder how big of a performance hit these ARM machines will take. ARM are known for power efficiency, but not for power. I have to wonder if Apple are going to try some sort of massively parallel COU that will create nightmares for developers.
I can see many people in the Photoshop & Lightroom world giving up on Apple. If only Adobe would run their apps on Linux I’d say goodby to Apple and Microsoft.
You were saying?
ARM-based Japanese supercomputer is now the fastest in the world
Fugaku is being used in COVID-19 research
www.theverge.com
If i hear “ARM are known for power efficiency but not for power” from one more person ... So silly.
The problem I see is that free VM solutions being nonexistent on Apple silicon. Think Virtualbox or QEMU. I hate to say it but I knew this day would come where it’s not a possibility.
CodeWeavers CrossOver works with Catalina. It runs Win32 apps in a 64-bit process.
Why would they? It would be like Coke endorsing Pepsi and just as silly.
Back when Apple first released the Intel-powered Macs, they heavily promoted Boot Camp and the cross compatibility with Windows. It was part of the “Switchers” campaign.
Yes, it was. I just think that nowadays the ability to run Windows on a Mac is not as important as it was. Don't get me wrong here. I want to be able to run Windows on my Macs, at least in a VM, but there are other options out there. Maybe Microsoft will make an ARM version that doesn't suck. We will see. For running Server OSes I see no problem though. Just run VMs on Azure and problem is solved.
So, for me it is not showstopper but more of a convenience. I do not depend on Windows in any way.
They *needed* to back then. Now they don’t.