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So is iMessage banned in Russia?

As far as I remember Apple saying, the messages are end to end encrypted and nobody has the keys even Apple.
I'm certain Apple has the key, judging by my ability to still get messages after resetting my password through them. Unless my security answers themselves formed a different, easily-brute-forceable key, lol.

In any case, with an opaque entity like Apple or Telegram in the middle, it's very hard to know whether you're getting the right keys or being MitM attacked. At least Telegram's client can be audited, but still.
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To be fair, Russia never said hello to free speech.;)
Neither did the rest of Europe. I can't tell which one is the worse offender, but neither technically guarantee it in any way, and I know there are cases of France and the UK abusing that.
 
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Neither did the rest of Europe. I can't tell which one is the worse offender, but neither technically guarantee it in any way, and I know there are cases of France and the UK abusing that.

Source?
 
To be fair, Russia never said hello to free speech.;)
Oh, no, they have free speech in Russia, you can say whatever you want about their president. Just, you might then accidentally fall down a flight of stairs. Into a tank full of sharks. With lasers on their heads.
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Oh come on. I don't like Trump either (at all) but when did he ever do something that benefited Russia? Last time I checked he was threatening to attack them in Syria and risk starting WW3. The idea that Trump is in any way supportive of Russia is absurd and laughable.
Every major intelligence agency in the US, says that Russia interfered and/or tried to interfere with our elections. But Trump says, "nuh-uh!" And won't address the situation any further. Because he fears that, if they did interfere that would cast doubt on the legitimacy of his having been elected. His ego is more apparently important that our independence as a nation. I'd say that's doing something that benefits Russia.
 
Telegram has great cloud-syncing, instant and synchronised notifications across devices, GIF-integration etc.. They are both great, with their own pros and cons.

Signal does all of this, at least for me.
 
Signal is a lot better anyway and has censorship circumvention.
Stop this signal propaganda. Telegram is fast and secure enough, the enemy is Whatsapp which is a monster, it works in stupid way, making cache and double size of media, doens't works with iCloud in intelligent way, is owned by Facebook and it is still client side.... Whatsapp is the worst of the worst and it is still use d a lot especially because users are ignorant.
 
Here are the examples I was thinking of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_ban_on_face_covering
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_against_Holocaust_denial
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_the_United_Kingdom#Specific_cases
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Stop this signal propaganda. Telegram is fast and secure enough, the enemy is Whatsapp which is a monster, it works in stupid way, making cache and double size of media, doens't works with iCloud in intelligent way, is owned by Facebook and it is still client side.... Whatsapp is the worst of the worst and it is still use d a lot especially because users are ignorant.
The encryption in Telegram is trash, and so is the app's reliability. I was using it to test a bot and had the most painful experience second to KakaoTalk. I couldn't even create a group on the Mac app, had to use the iPhone one. Also, there's hardly any reason to trust it more than Whatsapp. Maybe the open source client. Anyway, would not miss it.

Sorry for being so negative around here. I realize that scalable messaging is difficult, secure messaging is harder, and censorship-free messaging is even harder. Some of those things come at the cost of features and UX. It's just that Telegram has problems that I think are avoidable, and they don't achieve the security they claim, and others can do better.
 
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A couple of points that may be missed. When services are provided for Russian citizens the data at rest has to remain in Russia. Just think about what that means for alternatives.

Further more Telegram is the application of choice for alternative currencies, ICOs and TGEs and it’s like. A lot, a lot of Russian money is leaving the country that way and ownership is hard to establish.

The country is in an economic mess, lots of very rich people but an incredibly poor government that plays a game of keeping up appearances.

It’s a shame, as most most ordinary people I’ve met and worked with are fantastic. Just like you and high, caring, hard working, and trying to ignore their government as much as they can whilst getting on with life.
 
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When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns.

Yah, such all-encompassing comments and viewpoints don't really contribute anything of value to that discussion. The discussion has _always_ been about regulations and assault-class (semi-automatic and automatic, high-volume chamber) weapons, not legitimate hunting rifles!

Now let's bring it back on topic of electronic messengers, eh?
 
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We don't really have free speech in the US either. Just try saying anything not PC... the fact that the concept of being PC exists as well.
 
We don't really have free speech in the US either. Just try saying anything not PC... the fact that the concept of being PC exists as well.
Nope, you can be literally a Nazi, and it's not illegal. Sure you can make people hate you, but that's different. I also know that most people don't care at all about being PC even where I live (see location on left), and that includes me.
 
iMessage is much less of a threat to Putin as the market share of iPhones in Russia is significantly lower than the marketshare of mobile devices being able to run Telegram (the latter probably approaching 100% if we exclude non-smartphone phones).
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Trump might not be supportive of Russia but he has way too much admiration for authoritarian leaders like Putin, Xi Jinping (and others) than is healthy for a democracy.
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In regard to guns, that's a good thing because way too much damage is done with guns by non-outlaws (from accidents, over suicides to use by mentally unstable people).

I’m sorry. I’m confused by your posts.

You seemed to be critical of authoritarian leaders but then you seem perfectly willing to cede responsibility for your safety to a government that is run by someone who you claim has great admiration for authoritarian leaders.
 
Every major intelligence agency in the US, says that Russia interfered and/or tried to interfere with our elections. But Trump says, "nuh-uh!" And won't address the situation any further. Because he fears that, if they did interfere that would cast doubt on the legitimacy of his having been elected. His ego is more apparently important that our independence as a nation. I'd say that's doing something that benefits Russia.

They also said that Saddam Hussein did 9/11, is affiliated with al-Qaeda and had weapons of mass destruction, none of it turned out to be true and now are they saying similar things about Bashar al-Assad (while there's no independent evidence that he used chemical weapons ever and the accusation that he's somehow allied with ISIS is beyond ridiculous) who happens to be from the same political party and is allied with Russia just like Trump allegedly despite the fact that he has no problems bombing Syria with Russian forces on the ground. Don't believe everything you hear.
 



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A Russian law court has ordered that access to the Telegram encrypted messaging service should be blocked

Except for politicians and oligarchs.
 
I hope Russia sinks to a very low level then Russians may wake up to how bad Putin is but they probably won't as most Russians cannot think for themselves and believe Putin is the top dog in the Russian pack.
 
I’m sorry. I’m confused by your posts.

You seemed to be critical of authoritarian leaders but then you seem perfectly willing to cede responsibility for your safety to a government that is run by someone who you claim has great admiration for authoritarian leaders.
  1. It is an illusion that widespread gun ownership offers any kind of protection against authoritarian governments. Show me one example where this has helped in any country in the last century or so.
  2. It is also an illusion that widespread gun ownership overs any significant safety to its owners (outside of very rural areas), and whatever safety it provides is more than compensated for by the harm widespread gun ownership causes even just in the form of accidents, suicides, domestic disputes etc. (ie, before easier access by criminals to guns is taken into account). Crime rates aren't higher in other rich countries with much more restrictive gun laws, in fact their number of gun deaths are lower by several multiples. Making gun laws more restrictive have for example in Switzerland noticeably reduced the number of gun-related deaths and injuries.
  3. Trump is a dangerous leader, but to defeat him, public debate, the electoral system and the legal system have to be used. Arming the general population will do nothing (unless you advocate assassination).
 
  1. It is an illusion that widespread gun ownership offers any kind of protection against authoritarian governments. Show me one example where this has helped in any country in the last century or so.
Every armed population in the Middle East in the past decade. Relatively few armed ISIS fighters easily held hostage huge populations across Syria and parts of Iraq because those were unarmed, but Kurdish and Christian minority populations to the north and Lebanon (many civilian gun owners) to the south were safe. The Kurds had also been dealing with Turkey before that. Other countries like Turkey and Iran simply have enough centralized power to prevent terrorists from gaining territory, but they still have to fight tricky battles and kill many unarmed innocents taken hostage, which wouldn't happen in the first place if they were armed. Worse, the unarmed civilians being freed now from ISIS are falling back under Assad's or Putin's control, more dependent than ever.

Also, it's rare that you'll see an evil dictatorship stopped with guns, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen. Most authoritarian governments have already disarmed everyone beforehand, while anyone looking to turn evil has to take into account the armed population and won't do anything to provoke it. For example, any crackdown in Lebanon even on guns themselves would be met with so much resistance that it's not worth.
It is also an illusion that widespread gun ownership overs any significant safety to its owners (outside of very rural areas) [...]. Crime rates aren't higher in other rich countries with much more restrictive gun laws, in fact their number of gun deaths are lower by several multiples. Making gun laws more restrictive have for example in Switzerland noticeably reduced the number of gun-related deaths and injuries.
I don't doubt that restricting gun ownership decreases total homicides, but I'd have to see numbers. Saying that it decreases gun homicides is a silly argument. Of course with fewer guns, killers will use something else. There are gun attacks in the US and truck attacks in Europe. Americans also glorify guns to the point of weirdos feeling tempted to shoot things up for no good reason, so it's more of an issue here.
whatever safety it provides is more than compensated for by the harm widespread gun ownership causes even just in the form of accidents, suicides, domestic disputes etc. (ie, before easier access by criminals to guns is taken into account)
Nobody wants their right to self-protection limited because of the stupidest 1% of gun owners harming themselves, nor do they care. More people care to limit open carrying and such to reduce how many idiots are in close proximity with guns. But there's also the idealist argument that if nearly everyone has them and is trained properly, we'll be safer, like in Israel where people regularly carry AR-15s but also have all served in the IDF. Idk about the last one.

Trump is a dangerous leader, but to defeat him, public debate, the electoral system and the legal system have to be used. Arming the general population will do nothing (unless you advocate assassination).
I don't like him either, but comparing him to a bad dictator doesn't make sense and doesn't help defeat him. About half the Americans voted for him, he won a fair election, and he's not done anything to push large numbers of people to desperation. Some of the people who voted for him called Obama a Nazi but didn't really mean it; most of them have guns and could've taken him out if they really wanted.
 
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Stop this signal propaganda. Telegram is fast and secure enough, the enemy is Whatsapp which is a monster, it works in stupid way, making cache and double size of media, doens't works with iCloud in intelligent way, is owned by Facebook and it is still client side.... Whatsapp is the worst of the worst and it is still use d a lot especially because users are ignorant.


I don't know for sure if any of them are fully secured and private and encrypted. Do you? Are you sure? :)

In fact such "privacy" messaging apps probably serve the intelligence agencies the very best.

These pseudo-privacy apps act as "honeypots" to catch criminals.

It's true that Edward Snowden recommends a particular messaging app. But things change too.

If you really want encrypted secure private anonymous messaging I think it is a hard nut to crack, but a worthy cause for humanity.

It should be open source, and probably based on blockchain technology.

Just my 2 cents.
 
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It should be open source, and probably based on blockchain technology.

Just my 2 cents.
I'm not 100% sure, but I've given this some thought before and don't think a blockchain would be necessary or effective for this. Too much latency and cost. But maybe it will win anyway just from Ethereum becoming such a trusted standard. When it comes to security, people would rather be safe with generalized standards than sorry with optimized and obscure stuff.
 
  1. It is an illusion that widespread gun ownership offers any kind of protection against authoritarian governments. Show me one example where this has helped in any country in the last century or so.
  2. It is also an illusion that widespread gun ownership overs any significant safety to its owners (outside of very rural areas), and whatever safety it provides is more than compensated for by the harm widespread gun ownership causes even just in the form of accidents, suicides, domestic disputes etc. (ie, before easier access by criminals to guns is taken into account). Crime rates aren't higher in other rich countries with much more restrictive gun laws, in fact their number of gun deaths are lower by several multiples. Making gun laws more restrictive have for example in Switzerland noticeably reduced the number of gun-related deaths and injuries.
  3. Trump is a dangerous leader, but to defeat him, public debate, the electoral system and the legal system have to be used. Arming the general population will do nothing (unless you advocate assassination).

True on all points, but people attach cult-like observance to everything they do in life.
 
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