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Safari Beta Security Slammed; 8 Vulnerabilities Found
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I don't dislike the private browsing feature, but it pales next to Firefox's approach. Honestly, it would nice to have both in one browser, to be able to set it up with all the options as in Firefox, but be able to toggle it from the menu when you wanted. However, if I had to pick only one, it would definitely be Firefox's version. It's just all-around a better approach and gives you more control.
safari bugs
This is really bad news. I would think Apple would pay special attention by introducing new software for the Windows platform. Common sense is that they would test the software before releasing it. Being beta does not justify such a level of errors. Apart from the security issues, many Windows users are experiencing problems displaying web pages correctly, including Apple's own pages. Apple pages should be the first ones to display perfectly on their own browser. From what I hear, even those patient windows users determined to use the browser despite problems are giving up because it just isn't usable. It doesn't work at all in many cases.
This is really bad news. I would think Apple would pay special attention by introducing new software for the Windows platform. Common sense is that they would test the software before releasing it. Being beta does not justify such a level of errors. Apart from the security issues, many Windows users are experiencing problems displaying web pages correctly, including Apple's own pages. Apple pages should be the first ones to display perfectly on their own browser. From what I hear, even those patient windows users determined to use the browser despite problems are giving up because it just isn't usable. It doesn't work at all in many cases.
Really, talk about sensationalism. Taking terminology used to describe WMD and applying it to computer bugs.
We're going to invade Cupertino, just you wait.
*smiles*
I love the internet and its capacity to allow assumptions about other people. I actually work on a 4 man team that does software testing for a program that monitors and controls UAVs. The ground control station is running Windows XP, and all our code is in C++ and C#. I'm actually taking a sanity break from my software testing to come here and rant to people who don't know what my job entails, and that no matter how well I do my job, some user out there will inevitabbly find something that even if I was given a thousand years, would not find. Call me stupid, call me mentally retarded if you will. It happens.
How are people supposed to test software/report bugs if by using the software they are opening up their computer to a remote exploit?
In my spare time I use OSX and spend my fair share of my time with Beta software. If I find a bug, I report it to the developer. I have my entire system backed up. And if I were really cautious about dev testing a piece of software like Safari, I'd only use it on a closed off intranet.
I do think remote exploits should have been found before making it a public beta. However when I use beta software whose primary use is to access the internet, I fully expect there to be large security holes, especially if we're talking week 1 of beta testing, not one month into public widespread testing.
What exactly makes you think that "in this day in age", flaws in software are any easy for a develoment / QA team to find?
Well of course it is news on this site and it is going to get brought to our attention, we're on Macrumors.com. I come to this site to read about things like this. Not just good news but bad news and this is bad news. But not news that shouldn't be welcomed. The vulnerabilities or exceptions or whatever they are have been brought to the attention of the public, now Apple has to fix them, re-release the software and the process will start again.
If security is promoted as a reason for switching then it should be expected that any flaw or vulnerability, no matter how minor, will be shoved in our faces. Which only gives Apple the chance to fix the minor error and claim greater security. So we can continue to drink our Kool-Aid in peace.
Not that I care, I use Firefox (which I still think is a horrible name, though I know the reason behind it) but am not sure how much longer I will if they continue to add "features" and get away from the original point of Firefox. I haven't used Safari since Panther.
If security is promoted as a reason for switching then it should be expected that any flaw or vulnerability, no matter how minor, will be shoved in our faces. Which only gives Apple the chance to fix the minor error and claim greater security. So we can continue to drink our Kool-Aid in peace.
Not that I care, I use Firefox (which I still think is a horrible name, though I know the reason behind it) but am not sure how much longer I will if they continue to add "features" and get away from the original point of Firefox. I haven't used Safari since Panther.
Private Browsing
To reiterate a point IT"S BETA.
Submit a bug report and maybe before it becomes GM maybe it will become more to your liking. It's just like OSX 10.0 was pure hell for those of us who came up thru OS 6 - OS 9 but as the years have passed more of our old favorite features have returned. My feeling that Private Browsing could be a detriment to parents who want to monitor their children's web activity.
To reiterate a point IT"S BETA.
Submit a bug report and maybe before it becomes GM maybe it will become more to your liking. It's just like OSX 10.0 was pure hell for those of us who came up thru OS 6 - OS 9 but as the years have passed more of our old favorite features have returned. My feeling that Private Browsing could be a detriment to parents who want to monitor their children's web activity.
This is good news. Its the bugs that havent been found yet people should be whining about.
I can see the software remaining in beta for quite a while. Apple need to play this one right as the (very possible) associated bad press is going to be major setback.
One of the reasons I decided to consider a mac was through using iTunes for windows. Safari needs to impress.
I can see the software remaining in beta for quite a while. Apple need to play this one right as the (very possible) associated bad press is going to be major setback.
One of the reasons I decided to consider a mac was through using iTunes for windows. Safari needs to impress.
Oh come on, everybody who's saying "This is a BETA!!!"
This is a slap in Apple's face.
They released it with much fanfare -- it was all over the news sites, messageboards, and a huge splash with a "Download" button on Apple's web page. They even said it was secure, and now even the OSX version even has bugs?
How could this a good thing?
Now it's up to Apple to fix the bugs and push Safari 3 through.
This is a slap in Apple's face.
They released it with much fanfare -- it was all over the news sites, messageboards, and a huge splash with a "Download" button on Apple's web page. They even said it was secure, and now even the OSX version even has bugs?
How could this a good thing?
Now it's up to Apple to fix the bugs and push Safari 3 through.
Ummm... I thought the whole point of releasing a BETA was to identify problems more quickly by allowing a larger user base to test the product.
Why haven't people been talking about what a major step this is for Apple. iTunes was a necessity for Windows so that iPod's would play nice in a controlled user environment. Safari is not necessary for any hardware sales. This is the first time (that I can recall) that Apple has made a concerted effort to create software for Windows that is just for the software's sake. It marks a huge departure and advancement on their global business strategy. I for one think this is a hugely positive sign for their growth as a whole.
Beta, beta, beta. Yes, we are all aware that it is beta. But this is a pretty major development in the PC world, which is getting a lot of press. Many, many people who are not fully aware what beta means (BUGGY) are downloading it. And I assure you anyone who has trouble with this version will not come back for the much improved final version when it is released. If Apple wants to gloat about its secure, quality products, it shouldn't offer a taste of Mac that is half-baked. Wait until it's perfect, then release it!
Don't you have anything else to do with your time than defend this POS software?
I'm defending Apple's software development group. I'm defending the idea of beta software. I'm defending any piece of beta software that gets trashed for having bugs. And I've stated in this thread that I wouldn't even bust Microsoft for releasing buggy beta software. It's the industry.
I'm trying to help educate ignorant (through perhaps no fault of their own) users of software who misunderstand the purpose of beta software.
And when I stop doing this, I'm going to flip to the application behind this beta version of Safari running on windows XP, and go back to my couple programs. What are those? Programs to track software issues with our pre-release software.
Don't you have anything to do than questions my motives? Because IMHO, I'm talking about something I do for a living, where as you are doing... ?
iPhone uses a tweaked version of Safari 2.0, a stable and often used program.
What we are talking about here is a beta version for Safari 3.0, a ton of new code, with a ton of rewritten code, running on two different operating systems from the iPhone, though one is similar.
Apples and Oranges, and to prove this, none of the 8 found would have any effect on the iPod.
But fine, link it to the iPhone and talk about how Safari vulnerablities effect the iPhone. But don't make yet ANOTHER leap and talk about the iPhone and it's other perceived problems. For Pete's sake..
And I think we shoulod tereform Mars.
Sorry, just rounding up my thoughts on the matters at hand. At least the matters at hand in my reality.
I think the point most have missed with the how high you can pee fighting contest going on is this.
Apple have created software for windows - to potentially increase it's market share and usher in future switchers.
If these future switchers experience, buggy, ineffective software from apple regardless if its the nature of the beast on windows, it will undoubtedly still put a few of those potential switchers off.
So regardless of how high you all can pee
I think everyone so far has missed the real reason why Apple have released Safari for Windows. That happens to be developers for the iPhone. Apple would not allow third party developers to write independent apps for the iPhone,
but have instead opened up Safari as a way to get third party apps onto the iPhone. These apps can be written on any computer running Safari. What better way to instantly increase the amount of people able to write apps for Safari
than to put Safari on another 95% of computers? Developers who might like to write an app for Safari/iPhone may not want to go out and buy a Mac just to write an app. But now, they can use safari on their Windows box. So, I guess
this could really be an iPhone related discussion.
The real question should be, will these vulnerabilities manifest themselves in the iPhone in any way? Steve-O said the reason for not allowing independent third party apps was security concerns. But these flaws in safari might
introduce the very insecurity Apple are trying to avoid. Apple is not trying to take over the Browser segment, rather they are trying to get as many people able to write Safari apps for the iPhone as possible.
Beta doesn't mean it's alright to have security flaws. It should still be a secure app. You can't go around laughing at when Microsoft run into these troubles then shout "it's beta get over it!!" when Apple does.
But then Maynor tends to stretch the truth a fair bit and never releases his exploits. Kinda like when he said he had a remote hack for a default MacBook through the Airport card. Everyone was asking him just to show it, but it took him 6 months to show him crashing it rather than remotely exploiting it. And this was on an outdated version of os x!
Neither really pleases me.
But then Maynor tends to stretch the truth a fair bit and never releases his exploits. Kinda like when he said he had a remote hack for a default MacBook through the Airport card. Everyone was asking him just to show it, but it took him 6 months to show him crashing it rather than remotely exploiting it. And this was on an outdated version of os x!
Neither really pleases me.
But we're talking about security holes! Not just normal bugs - those I can handle.
Interesting angle, but I suspect that Apple wants to lure people to its browser by offering bookmark syncing with the iPhone. Think about it...make all those who buy iPhones install another piece of Apple software on their computer to give them a little more of the feel of a Mac. They did it with iPods/iTunes.
Than you shouldn't be using beta software.
I'm sorry, but it's true. This is a comlicated piece of software whose soul purpose is to have access to the internet via many routes.
This isn't solitaire that you can play over a network.
I don't think it's a good thing Sfari has these issues. I quite wish they didn't, and I'm afriad I will uninstall Safari or not use it until these exploits have been fixed, because I myself am unprepared to be a beta tester on that level.
I dunno what to think. On the one hand, yes its a beta - no denying that. You install it at your own risk, and the whole point of a beta is to find flaws in the app. Anyone installing it and wanting it to run like a final version has missed the point. Also I seem to remember a small program called IE having severlal major security flaws even AFTER beta!
On the other hand this is a PR blow - although not a major one. Really it will only give people who hate apple a 'HA TOLD YOU SO' moment and the people who love apple a chance to defend it... Like I just did...
On the other hand this is a PR blow - although not a major one. Really it will only give people who hate apple a 'HA TOLD YOU SO' moment and the people who love apple a chance to defend it... Like I just did...
Yeah, and that was AGES ago...I remember installing Quicktime when I got Myst for my PC like 15 years ago.
Apple writing Windows Software
Lest you all forget Claris was once APPLE and they had two products that had Windows versions. To this day you can still go to the education store and and purchase a copy of AppleWorks for Windows that was made in hopes of winning the PC's in schools back to the Mac platform. Filemaker, a spinoff from Claris is one of the top Database applications on the Windows side.
Do love Safari 3's resizable windows especially as I get verbose in these threads,
.
Lest you all forget Claris was once APPLE and they had two products that had Windows versions. To this day you can still go to the education store and and purchase a copy of AppleWorks for Windows that was made in hopes of winning the PC's in schools back to the Mac platform. Filemaker, a spinoff from Claris is one of the top Database applications on the Windows side.
Do love Safari 3's resizable windows especially as I get verbose in these threads,
Wow, that's awesome (not that it happens but just that I was getting the same thing)
But then if this was about say... Internet Explorer, I'm sure most of the members here would be slamming it to no end...