Peanuts compared to the financial impact a definite IPhone 5 leak would have on Apple.
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San Francisco Police Did Assist Apple in House Search of iPhone 5
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Peanuts compared to the financial impact a definite IPhone 5 leak would have on Apple.
He claims, but can't prove
As for changing his story, good liars don't make that mistake
which doesn't prove they were there about the iPhone 5 or that anyone even implied the Apple folks were police
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Under Cali law, something found and no attempt to return it (say by giving it to the bartender) is deemed stolen, which is criminal
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Who says they changed anything. Perhaps the first time someone pointedly asked if they went to thus and such address to look for a stolen iPhone prototype and they had no report of such an item or that address and answered no. The second time the question was less detailed and produced a yes. They did go to that neighborhood to look for something for an Apple employee, though perhaps they weren't told it was a prototype
Apple did not even have any evidence that the guy had the phone let alone stole it. They did not have any case that's why they decided not to file any report whatsoever. For all we know the phone might have been sold by the drunk Apple employee to someone or was simply lost and is still resting in some garbage bin. And yet Apple police is in full force invading the houses of SF citizens. Very sad day.
Can you prove that there was some sort of invasion? According to all reports, Apple requested that they be allowed to search, with the police there supervising, and were granted permission. They did so, and left, having not found the phone and caused minimal trouble (none of which was illegal).
So, want to back up that libelous claim now?
jW
Really? Can you even quantify that? Apple sues anyone and everyone for having a device that remotely look or acts like an iPhone. So what is really lost by a phone being discovered within a month or two from release.
Do you think samsung or whoever can knock out a phone that quickly while securing the parts....
The only thing Apple "loses" really at this point would be the element of surprise. Not sure what the value of that is...
"Apple requested " would be correct if Anthony Colon told Sergio Calderon: "I am working for Apple, let me search your house, please." That's not what happened. Apple police misled Sergio in thinking they were SF police (remember, SF police spokesmen told that only Apple representatives actually talked to Sergio). In addition, SF police did not enter Sergio's house, so there was no any supervision when Apple police were ransacking Sergio's house.
Quoting HuffPost:
In general, Dangerfield said SFPD requires a supervisor's approval for personnel who are not law enforcement officers to accompany police during investigations.
"It's not routinely done at all," Dangerfield said.
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So where is this missing iPhone prototype then?
Something tells me CNET has it- or at least pictures.....
And they are lawyering up and trying to figure out if they want to publish.
If you read their initial story, they clearly know a lot more than they were revealing.
CNET probably wants to make sure they aren't gizmodo'd by apple- - but then again, Gizmodo was found to be clear of all charges and the case was dismissed.
I say CNET will publish something in the next week..... just watch
Something tells me CNET has it- or at least pictures.....
And they are lawyering up and trying to figure out if they want to publish.
If you read their initial story, they clearly know a lot more than they were revealing.
CNET probably wants to make sure they aren't gizmodo'd by apple- - but then again, Gizmodo was found to be clear of all charges and the case was dismissed.
I say CNET will publish something in the next week..... just watch
Perhaps, but we have to consider the relative accuracy of GPS. Say the phone was sitting at that location for a relative amount of time. It would be indicative of that house, no? I haven't looked at the topography or general layout of the area but if his house was sufficiently isolated (ie outside of the error range of GPS) then it would point to his address, no? Don't get me wrong-- it's possible that they did a little investigative work of their own given their power but I find it unlikely, and I find it actually quite amusing that people automatically assume the worst when there's not enough evidence to suggest such. Going to the PD with an address hardly spells wrongdoing if the above situation is indeed true.
Wouldn't that be the fault of the police department though? They were the ones there. They authorized the search by doing nothing. They came with the Apple employees. While Calderon may have been mislead by the fact that police officers accompanied the Apple employees, it's unlikely that this would become any corporate misconduct case. That said, don't get me wrong, having two employees search your house isn't exactly "cool."
Epic dumbness
Look, I've already copped probably a few too many warnings from the Admin of this site for being insulting to people, so I'll just refrain... sort of... by saying....
FFS you lot. Get a Fraken clue.
Some of the claims I've read here from you guys has well and truly crossed the line into the realms of the absurd.
Firstly, all you armchair analysts are basing your opinions on the SFWeekly 'Report'. An online newspaper that has as one of it's current top stories an article titled 'Annoyed Neighbor Is Beaten While Photographing Bar Patrons Puking'. And lets not forget their other big story 'Hells Angels Accuse Amazon.com of Being the Outlaw'.
I read the article before we saw the retraction article afterwards, and thought 'This is a load of tabloid tosh'. It's an example of the butt end of journalism. Facts substantiated by others, and opinions based on someone else's opinion.
It's total rubbish. I haven't seen anyone question the logic of the story progression as far as the SF police is concerned. If you recall, the original story broke because 'someone close to the matter in the SF police' leaked it, only for the SF police to then have 'not been involved', for it to eventually come full circle again. With this smorgasbord of rubbish, I'm not sure how any of you can feel confident to comment.
Secondly, you've made assumptions about how Apple tracked the device to this guys home which is based on your limited understanding on how 'Find my iPhone' works. I'm guessing that if there is an ex cop involved with chasing this, they would have checked with other areas first. Like pursuing data off craigslist as well.
Third, you've made absurdly huge assumptions about everyone involved. The victim has gone from thief to 'underdog' in 50 lines or less. There's calls for the guy to 'get paid heaps' for what happened... I'm guessing most of you have a mental image of the guy's house being ransacked, smashed vases and paperwork strewn everywhere as though he'd been burgled. I don't recall seeing any report of the guy actually being assaulted. He voluntarily let them into his home FFS.
Over here in Australia, we don't always wait for someone to have a warrant before we let police in through my front door. Why always be so confrontational? Especially if you have nothing to hide. Heck, if the police DID find something, and they were forced to go and get a warrant in the first place, it would go against you in the prosecution, indicating your non compliance.
Then there's the absurd and stupid claims:
'Police shouldn't get involved in a civil matter'. Oh really, what are the police for again? Oh right... civil matters. They're certainly not there to just bust drug dealers, kick down the doors of murderers and attend to Liquor store robberies.
'It was just a phone'. It's not just a phone. It's an unreleased product, which the competitors will do anything to get their hands on. This could potentially cost an industry leading company millions of dollars. And that's millions of dollars that would be sapped directly out of your economy if an overseas product were to be first past the post with a new technology. With the U.S. economy faltering, this puts products like this on the crucial edge. This will affect all of you, not just the rich.
Now, I don't pretend to know anything about U.S. law, but I do know that it is fanciful to think that the police wouldn't get involved. Just because the information from the SF Police has conflicted, doesn't mean that this is an indication of some kind of wider conspiracy theory. Police forces are complex organisations, and public relations bodies don't always know what investigations bodies are doing. Often this information takes potentially days to filter through channels. You've gotta remember that any developed police force in the world is structured around a bureaucracy. And although this might be hard to understand in the information age; you just don't get instant answers from a bureaucracy. Here in Australia, we'd have to fill out a FOI request and fight with politicians for 6 months just to get even this much comment from the police. During an investigation the police aren't exactly obligated to tell the public everything...
end rant. For now.
Look, I've already copped probably a few too many warnings from the Admin of this site for being insulting to people, so I'll just refrain... sort of... by saying....
FFS you lot. Get a Fraken clue.
Some of the claims I've read here from you guys has well and truly crossed the line into the realms of the absurd.
Firstly, all you armchair analysts are basing your opinions on the SFWeekly 'Report'. An online newspaper that has as one of it's current top stories an article titled 'Annoyed Neighbor Is Beaten While Photographing Bar Patrons Puking'. And lets not forget their other big story 'Hells Angels Accuse Amazon.com of Being the Outlaw'.
I read the article before we saw the retraction article afterwards, and thought 'This is a load of tabloid tosh'. It's an example of the butt end of journalism. Facts substantiated by others, and opinions based on someone else's opinion.
It's total rubbish. I haven't seen anyone question the logic of the story progression as far as the SF police is concerned. If you recall, the original story broke because 'someone close to the matter in the SF police' leaked it, only for the SF police to then have 'not been involved', for it to eventually come full circle again. With this smorgasbord of rubbish, I'm not sure how any of you can feel confident to comment.
Secondly, you've made assumptions about how Apple tracked the device to this guys home which is based on your limited understanding on how 'Find my iPhone' works. I'm guessing that if there is an ex cop involved with chasing this, they would have checked with other areas first. Like pursuing data off craigslist as well.
Third, you've made absurdly huge assumptions about everyone involved. The victim has gone from thief to 'underdog' in 50 lines or less. There's calls for the guy to 'get paid heaps' for what happened... I'm guessing most of you have a mental image of the guy's house being ransacked, smashed vases and paperwork strewn everywhere as though he'd been burgled. I don't recall seeing any report of the guy actually being assaulted. He voluntarily let them into his home FFS.
Over here in Australia, we don't always wait for someone to have a warrant before we let police in through my front door. Why always be so confrontational? Especially if you have nothing to hide. Heck, if the police DID find something, and they were forced to go and get a warrant in the first place, it would go against you in the prosecution, indicating your non compliance.
Then there's the absurd and stupid claims:
'Police shouldn't get involved in a civil matter'. Oh really, what are the police for again? Oh right... civil matters. They're certainly not there to just bust drug dealers, kick down the doors of murderers and attend to Liquor store robberies.
'It was just a phone'. It's not just a phone. It's an unreleased product, which the competitors will do anything to get their hands on. This could potentially cost an industry leading company millions of dollars. And that's millions of dollars that would be sapped directly out of your economy if an overseas product were to be first past the post with a new technology. With the U.S. economy faltering, this puts products like this on the crucial edge. This will affect all of you, not just the rich.
Now, I don't pretend to know anything about U.S. law, but I do know that it is fanciful to think that the police wouldn't get involved. Just because the information from the SF Police has conflicted, doesn't mean that this is an indication of some kind of wider conspiracy theory. Police forces are complex organisations, and public relations bodies don't always know what investigations bodies are doing. Often this information takes potentially days to filter through channels. You've gotta remember that any developed police force in the world is structured around a bureaucracy. And although this might be hard to understand in the information age; you just don't get instant answers from a bureaucracy. Here in Australia, we'd have to fill out a FOI request and fight with politicians for 6 months just to get even this much comment from the police. During an investigation the police aren't exactly obligated to tell the public everything...
end rant. For now.
It's Anderson Street, San Francisco, CA. Go to maps.bing.com, type in this address and turn on bird eye view. You'll see that the houses on this street touch each other which means that GPS accuracy would not allow Apple to identify exact house but an area covering 3 to 5 houses.
Apparently not anymore. They've lost their prototype with billions of dollars.
How the hell is a $200-$700 piece of equipment worth billions of dollars to Apple? It's practically a $700 write-off on free advertising.
I understand your point... however, GPS is typically accurate within 15 meters, or ~50 feet and thats in the worst-case scenario with the crappiest receivers (Garmin for example). Of course this depends upon the ionosphere, etc. but I would assume a 50 ft relativity would not transcend 3 or even 5 houses... even those seen on Anderson street.
Please go back and read my post. This phone is more than the sum of its parts.
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GPS civil specifications denote that the devices are typically accurate to within 5 meters (Radius), outside of interference with major structures.
I left my iPhone at work a few months ago, and used 'Find my iPhone' to find it. It displayed it on a map that placed it next door to my office, but the display on the screen indicated that because of structural interference, it could be within 15 meters (Diameter, not Radius) of this location.
My partners iPod touch has been located on a map at a location of the bedroom the unit was in. The icon itself for the iPod touch was bigger on the screen than the bedroom was on the satellite photo.
But even then, this whole GPS thing is a bit of an absurd argument against Apple. We're talking about a company that is on the cutting edge of technology here, and is widely renowned to be the most innovative in the world. We are aware of the possibility that two apple employees were involved, one of which was a former police officer. The idea that a company like this could be so knuckle-headed to chase a phone on just GPS data alone is absurd.
As there is absolutely no statement from Apple as to what intelligence they used to source this location, speculation about the GPS capacity of an iPhone isn't an argument against Apple, it's an indication of how little we actually know.
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This is the big question. What has happened to the device. Apple has moved as effectively as possible to try and discourage seeing a financial advantage out of leaked apple products, in order to discourage people in chinese factories from selling it on. C-Net would be very weary of this. Effectively this phone is potentially a poisoned chalice to journalists, as they are unlikely to want police storming through their front door to seize stolen goods, and charging people with possession of said goods.
Like anyone else can... I can search your house if I come over to your house and ask you to search it for something and you say it is okay.
Not so much that as just likely that the PR department of the police department did not have the proper information about an insignificant event where some officers were protecting the peace between two sets of civilians. Police actually do this ALL the time. It is a big part of their job.
Just hope all his family members have their green cards and papers in order before he starts making waves.
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Unlikely as the SFPD have no reason to allow the Apple people to identify themselves as police officers.
The police officers were simply there to oversee things and make sure nothing goes awry and no he-said she said. They were there for everyone's protection. I am pretty sure none of the police officers there saw Apple tell this guy they were police officers or anything of the sort.
Or what? Apple will deport him? Perhaps to China, to work for Foxconn assembling iPhone 5th? I am sure that with, say, $5 million the guy will have beautiful life in Mexico.
What the hell!?!
Mr. Calderon is legal and even if his 2nd cousin to his 3rd cousin isn't, what is Apple or SFPD gonna do? Go down the line on his family tree and threaten to deport everyone of his family that's not legal if he sues them?
With that statement I see what kind of person you are.
It doesn't say anything about his character. Your statement says more about yours. He was just making a point that they could play the immigrant card, which is quite valid. His statement more so speaks of the times and in particular the recent sentiment towards illegal immigrants-- make no mistake that it's a weakness that could be plied upon, extended family or not. That doesn't mean he advocates such an action, or anyone in particular does.
I've seen dumber. Make no mistake here-- someone's ass is on the line. Apple or not, everyone's liable to be knuckle headed at some time, some more than others. Apple appears to consistently lack social graces with these issues.
I would be inclined to agree. Without a solid confirmation from the SFPD it really is just speculation.
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It's not a matter of confrontation, it's more a matter of principle. Not having to submit to unwarranted searches or inspections without due process is a freedom, and exorcising a freedom shouldn't be considered confrontational. Simply saying "I'd rather you not" isn't being rude. Exorcising your rights can not be held against you in a prosecution - they're your rights and the government can not hold your use of them against you.
The police shouldn't get involved in civil matters where no report of a broken law has been filed. If a law was broken, the proper procedure would be for Apple to file a stolen property report which the police would then investigate themselves. The police are responsible for conducting searches related to criminal investigations, not Apple security personnel.
Apple couldn't make iPhone 4s fast enough to meet consumer demand and that product was leaked a couple of months before it was actually released. Lost sales aren't really a problem when you are selling out of your entire production capacity for months on end.
Cognitive Dissonance
Imagine instead of Apple, it was Microsoft or BP or Halliburton.
Sometimes reading these posts I feel like I'm on a religious website.
Imagine instead of Apple, it was Microsoft or BP or Halliburton.
Sometimes reading these posts I feel like I'm on a religious website.
No. Its been pointed out from what has come from the story. Apple employees or SFPD used threats of deporting Mr. Calderon and or his family if they were not legal.
The poster responded to a post that Mr Calderon will get money from Apple or SFPD. In his/her post that I and another forum member quoted said:
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I am getting tired of how people assume its FACT that:
1. Apple employees purposely lied about being law enforcement.
2. That the immigration card was played.
*news flash* The above are not facts, just accusations being thrown around in the fog of this still developing story.
1. Apple employees purposely lied about being law enforcement.
2. That the immigration card was played.
*news flash* The above are not facts, just accusations being thrown around in the fog of this still developing story.
You're in the wrong forum. You're complaining about facts on a 'rumors' site??
Get over it, or go start up 'macfacts.com' ... Good luck with that
So is there a lately-popular genre of movies, TV shows, or graphic novels that depicts these grand conspiracies where large corporations connive with the government and law enforcement to abuse the rights of individuals? The paranoia and lack of understanding of reality is too widespread, judging by the views often expressed on these threads, to just arise spontaneously.
It must be hard to live in a world where you believe such sinister forces are arrayed against you.
It must be hard to live in a world where you believe such sinister forces are arrayed against you.
Gathering the information based on one reporters account, here are my thoughts....
Doesn't matter what the SFPD or the iPolice did, what matters is that the gentleman in question did not exercise his rights.
Say it with me now, like a mantra.....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
MM
Doesn't matter what the SFPD or the iPolice did, what matters is that the gentleman in question did not exercise his rights.
Say it with me now, like a mantra.....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
"I do not consent to a search without a warrant".....
MM
Having failed to find the phone at Calderón's house, I wonder where Apple's GPS tracking has located the phone since then, and if it hasn't, why not? Maybe someone has disabled the phone.