Several Retailers to Begin Testing Apple Pay Rival CurrentC

[chriscrowlee]

Most of the world other than the US refers to checking accounts as current accounts. So the use of the word "current" makes sense, but not to most people in the US.

It's really just a word used in the UK. I travel internationally extensively and anymore, the english version on an ATM shows as "primary" not current. Only see current in UK and HKG obviously. Everywhere else it's a rarity to see an ATM display "current account"... But either way, the product is targeted toward American consumers, so be it a catch on the word currency, or targeting those familiar with current term, it's bad marketing.

 

[chriscrowlee]

And you do know that it does not offer any protection unlike in the rest of the world where a PIN number has to be entered to validate the transaction.
The U.S. system is designed to make it easy for the customer, not safer. In that regard, no different than the magnetic stripe… wait, actually, with the stripe customers either had to show their ID - when the card was not signed - or sign and the merchant had to verify the signature.
What I highly dislike is the fact that the banks/Credit card issuers are advertising the chip as a security feature. It's not, it makes thinks worse!

I agree. Not sure why the US is going to the chip and sig. My only thinking is since it's the same terminal systems that allow chip\sig and chip\pin, they figure its easier to go one step at a time and gradually allow those credit\debit issuers to issue chip\pin based on their own training of their customers, and how they see fit.

 

[aajeevlin]

Can't really blame retailers for trying to get around credit cards fees (guess who has to pay for all those rewards you're earning). But this will probably fail, as others have pointed out.

I have always assumed the rewards came out of the late fee/interest of those that pay them.

 

[ArtOfWarfare]

So, why not allow ApplePay (and others) in the same stores as CurrentC? It either wins people over with a better offer/better service or it loses. Blocking other options almost says right away they know they have an uphill battle.

Signing up as a CurrentC member involved agreeing to be exclusive to CurrentC for three years. Those agreements were signed in August 2012 - long before Apple Pay and Google Pay and Samsung Pay came around. They're expiring next week. So that's why they're not accepting Apple Pay right now, and why many have announced that they'll begin accepting Apple Pay next week.

 

[bommai]

Most of the world other than the US refers to checking accounts as current accounts. So the use of the word "current" makes sense, but not to most people in the US.

I think CurrentC is a play on the word Currency.

 

[rkieru]

I wonder why they selected Columbus, OH as their testing city.

It's anecdotal at best, but as a citizen of CMH I've rarely seen anyone actually use their phone to purchase something. I have a iPhone 6 and I've never actually used Apple Pay... in part because it's hard to find a store with a reader, but mostly because I feel like such a pompous jerk pulling out my phone to make a payment instead of swiping my card.

 

[chriscrowlee]

It's getting quite embarassing for people from the US when you visit EU countries. During a trip to Norway/Finland/Sweden a few weeks ago, some US couple in our group couldn't withdraw any money from ATMs, because their US card didn't support EMV.

I travel extensively internationally and not having a CHIP+PIN (read NOT CHIP+SIGNATURE) card is DETRIMENTAL. Trying to buy train tickets, in many cases won't happen without a chip, and definitely won't happen in a self-serve machine without pin. Buying gas at a self-serve gas station WONT happen without CHIP+PIN.

My USAA Visa has Chip+PIN, so I use that when traveling. Wish Chase would jump on board with CHIP+PIN.

Interesting BofA just replaced my debit card (for fraud transactions ironically), and they sent a EMV card. I thought it was CHIP+SIG like ALL of their credit cards, but it came with a booklet showing it's CHIP+PIN NOT signature. Nice job, B of A. Might actually get me to use their Debit card again haha

 

[chriscrowlee]

I think CurrentC is a play on the word Currency.

I agree. Has nothing to do with the fact that a COUPLE countries (Mainly UK and HKG) call a primary account a "current" account. The product is a US-targeting product, they went with the cheesy play on words. Worst marketing mistake ever. Find me a company that's been successful with a cheesy play on words as a name. Hmm.... can't find any.

 

[Popeye206]

Exactly. I put as much on my credit card as possible and pay it off every month. There are no rewards for writing checks or using a debit card. Of course it's a different story if you can't afford to pay off the balance every month.

I do the same, but also for security reasons. I had my Debit Card number stolen in one of these large thefts and it was a major pain the side as they had to change everything about my account making so I couldn't use an ATM for a couple weeks. Whereas, if my Credit Card gets stolen, my normal bank account is fine giving me access to my money.

Plus, the rewards are nice. Free money every now and then.

 

[chriscrowlee]

I wonder why they selected Columbus, OH as their testing city.

It's anecdotal at best, but as a citizen of CMH I've rarely seen anyone actually use their phone to purchase something. I have a iPhone 6 and I've never actually used Apple Pay... in part because it's hard to find a store with a reader, but mostly because I feel like such a pompous jerk pulling out my phone to make a payment instead of swiping my card.

Sometimes test markets are selected because there are fewer people using a technology so it's easier for them to monitor those who do, and see how it goes.

I went to Starbucks the other day wearing my new Apple watch. Starbucks still does the stupid barcode for payments. Ugh. Watch wouldn't scan cause it was too reflective. Phone wouldn't scan either, so the clerk manhandled my phone and manually keyed it in. GROSS! Need more evidence why barcodes on phone screens are so past their prime?

 

[chriscrowlee]

I do the same, but also for security reasons. I had my Debit Card number stolen in one of these large thefts and it was a major pain the side as they had to change everything about my account making so I couldn't use an ATM for a couple weeks. Whereas, if my Credit Card gets stolen, my normal bank account is fine giving me access to my money.

Plus, the rewards are nice. Free money every now and then.

People don't realize how Amazing the benefits of a good credit card are. Especially Visa Signature. I clipped a pole in a rental car. Visa Signature (Chase) benefits paid 100%. I had a laptop stolen while in an airport, Visa Signature cut me a check for the entire amount. HUGE benefits for using a visa, especially a top-tier-credit visa.

 

[ronnyB]

I feel like this is the scene in Dumb & Dumber when Mary Swanson tells Brian Mooney (a.k.a. Lloyd) the chance of you and I getting together is 1 in a million, and Lloyd says, so yer sayin' we there's a chance...Next

 

[WigWag Workshop]

I don't have a choice for my medications, I have to use CVS. While it's not a big deal they don't accept Apple Pay yet, it would be nice to have the option. However, there is no way I would even consider using CurrentC. My wife asked about CurrentC, I got half way through explaining it, and I could tell she was getting a headache LOL. BTW I currently live in this "test market", and have a good relationship with the lady pharmacists, at our CVS has our sons have a lot of health issues, and we are there many times per month getting prescriptions.

 

[macnewbie91]

People don't realize how Amazing the benefits of a good credit card are. Especially Visa Signature. I clipped a pole in a rental car. Visa Signature (Chase) benefits paid 100%. I had a laptop stolen while in an airport, Visa Signature cut me a check for the entire amount. HUGE benefits for using a visa, especially a top-tier-credit visa.

Exactly, and I'm sure at the same time you're getting 3% back on gas, 2% at the grocery store, and 1% on everything else. Visa Signature cards also get you a free movie ticket on Friday's if you bring someone with you.

Those who are irresponsible with their cards and don't pay every day bills with it and then pay it off once a week, are morons.

 

[skellener]

 

[aristobrat]

So, I have to provide these people with my bank routing and account information? Then to use it, I have to open an app and scan a code; after which, I can make a payment, allowing the retailer to make more profit, while giving up any loyalty points/miles I might earn as well as fraud protections provided by my credit card company?

Sign me up!!!

Target has a version of their REDcard that (minus the QR code part for paying with it) works pretty much as you described -- pulls directly from your checking account.

They give you a 5% discount every time you use it. Not sure how that causes them to make more profit, but it'd be weird if they made less profit doing that.

As for giving up credit card loyalty points/miles, I don't know of many credit cards that pay 5% on a regular basis for department store purchases.

As clunky as CurrentC seems, if it's a way for me not to have to physically carry all of my loyalty and department cards in my wallet, I'm interested to see how it pans out.

 

[aristobrat]

Uh, why? I have to use these at Target now. They're much harder to use than the old swipe mechanism. They just make me extra annoyed that I can't use Apple Pay.

The Walmart Neighborhood Grocery stores in my area have started enforcing EMV (Chip & Sign). It easily doubles the amount of time it takes to pay with a credit card. Just sits on "Authorizing..." for an ungodly amount of time. Hopefully these are early pilot rollout issues and will get resolved sooner than later. Ugh.

 

[chriscrowlee]

The Walmart Neighborhood Grocery stores in my area have started enforcing EMV (Chip & Sign). It easily doubles the amount of time it takes to pay with a credit card. Just sits on "Authorizing..." for an ungodly amount of time. Hopefully these are early pilot rollout issues and will get resolved sooner than later. Ugh.

Weird I went to one of the Wally Neighborhood Markets (a very strange store concept) when I was in San Jose last week and I stuck it in and about 2 seconds later it said remove card. No signature, no waiting. Sounds like an isolated incident you had. Or an issue with the authentication between your bank and Visa\MC

 

[aristobrat]

Weird I went to one of the Wally Neighborhood Markets (a very strange store concept) when I was in San Jose last week and I stuck it in and about 2 seconds later it said remove card. No signature, no waiting. Sounds like an isolated incident you had. Or an issue with the authentication between your bank and Visa\MC

I think the signature thing is trigged by the amount of your purchase. I used an AMEX, so no bank involved. It's been slow every time I've used it (which is 10+ times), but I haven't used it in the past few weeks, so maybe it's improved.

 

[macs4nw]

They are well past the point of this being relevant. Newer phones typically have Google Pay, Apple Pay and even Samsung Pay preinstalled. Why would people install yet another pay system to their phone? People with older phones without NFC support typically aren't typically the tech savvy people who would want to pay using their phones anyway.

True that. Sure they will get some users, but at this stage, only if CurrentC has a compelling reason such as a unique feature, or special benefits that no one else has or will have, are the masses going to bother with it.

 

[aristobrat]

Not sure why the US is going to the chip and sig.

FWIW, here are some blurbs about that from a Kreb's article about that.

The PIN only addresses fraud when the card is lost or stolen, and in the U.S. market lost-and-stolen fraud is very small in comparison with counterfeit card fraud. Also, as we looked at other geographies — and our research has substantiated this — as you see these geographies go chip-and-PIN, the lost-and-stolen fraud dips a little bit but then the criminals adjust. So in the UK, the lost-and-stolen fraud is now back above where was before the migration. The criminals there have adjusted. and that increased focus on capturing the PIN gives them more opportunity, because if they do figure out ways to compromise that PIN, then they can perpetrate ATM fraud and get more bang for their buck.

Most card issuing banks and Visa don’t want PINs because the PINs can be stolen and used with the magnetic stripe data on the same cards (that also have a chip card) to withdraw cash from ATM machines. Banks eat the ATM fraud costs. This scenario has happened with the roll-out of chip cards with PIN – in Europe and in Canada.

The first is that we are the most competitive market in the world, and so as you look at the business case for chip-and-signature versus chip-and-PIN, no issuer wants to have the card in the wallet that is the most difficult card to use.

Where we are seeing issuers go with chip-and-PIN, largely it is issuers where consumers have a very compelling reason to pull that particular card out of their wallet. So, we’re talking mostly about merchants who are issuing their own cards and have loyalty points for using that card at that store. That is where we don’t see folks worrying about the attrition risks so much, because they have another point of stickiness for that card.

Once mag stripe goes away, chip-and-PIN will be a very strong solution. The estimates are now that by the end of 2015, 50 percent of the cards and terminals will be chip-enabled, but it’s going to be several years before we get closer to full compliance. So, we’re probably looking at about 2018 before we can start making plans to get rid of the magnetic stripe on these cards.

 

[macs4nw]

..... Other retailers remain in the process of exploring contactless payment solutions or installing the necessary infrastructure to support smartphone-based transactions.
Article Link: Several Retailers to Begin Testing Apple Pay Rival CurrentC

Translation: We're keeping all our options open and we'll go with the prevailing payment system(s).

 

[aristobrat]

True that. Sure they will get some users, but at this stage, only if CurrentC has a compelling reason such as a unique feature, or special benefits that no one else has or will have, are the masses going to bother with it.

I really like ApplePay, but there's a snowballs chance in hell that it's ever going to work with all in-house credit cards (for stores like Sears, Home Depot, Target, Lowes, Kohls, etc) or loyalty cards (insert name of just about every major restaurant, grocery store and pharmacy here).

I think if people see they they can reduce the number of cards in their wallet via this, that'll be a unique enough feature for them.

And if these merchants start passing along discounts every time you pay with it (like the 5% discount Target gives every time you pay with their REDcard that directly pulls from your checking account), people will really start to take notice.

 

[tmiw]

I'm wondering what percentage of Target stores actually have chip readers. There's a Target right across from my local Walmart, and I'd rather go to Target if they take chip cards. Never again will I swipe my card at Target.

I think someone should post a list of stores that currently accept EMV payment with their reader actually ON.

https://emvacceptedhere.com/ (Disclosure: it's my site.) It's based on user contributions and the occasional mass insert of all of a retailer's locations if I see any sort of news article or internal source.

BTW Target should be 100% chip enabled by the 17th if the source that I saw is accurate.

Personally I don't understand the obsession of Americans with creditcards, even more because in the US a creditcard is like a loan. Here in Europe, even when you pay via credit card, the money is taking from your account 4 weeks later.

Debit card fraud liability for the cardholder is worse in practice than for credit cards. Sure you'll probably get your money back eventually but it's still your money that went away. This probably won't matter nearly as much once chip becomes more widespread.

Not necessarily, it depends how the retailer has their software set up. I've used Apple Pay at a number of places where I'm still required to sign.

If they don't already support chip-enabled cards it's likely they're running Apple Pay just like a normal credit card swipe. Supporting chip cards means they can detect that Touch ID or some other device authentication was used and suppress signature entirely regardless of the amount.

I think the signature thing is trigged by the amount of your purchase. I used an AMEX, so no bank involved. It's been slow every time I've used it (which is 10+ times), but I haven't used it in the past few weeks, so maybe it's improved.

Usually $25-50 depending on the type of card and merchant.

I thought the chip still provided a one-off code that made it effectively non-cloneable. Even if you had access to the reader, can you steal a chip-and-signature card? I mean, even if it was PIN as you say, someone with access to a compromised reader could get the PIN easily.

And you do know that it does not offer any protection unlike in the rest of the world where a PIN number has to be entered to validate the transaction.
The U.S. system is designed to make it easy for the customer, not safer. In that regard, no different than the magnetic stripe… wait, actually, with the stripe customers either had to show their ID - when the card was not signed - or sign and the merchant had to verify the signature.
What I highly dislike is the fact that the banks/Credit card issuers are advertising the chip as a security feature. It's not, it makes thinks worse!

You can steal the physical card, but that's nowhere near a significant problem in the US compared to card cloning. That's why banks aren't bothering with a PIN, at least for now. Since the chip itself protects against counterfeiting regardless of how a cardholder's verified, it's unfair to say that chip and signature provides no benefit at all.

I travel extensively internationally and not having a CHIP+PIN (read NOT CHIP+SIGNATURE) card is DETRIMENTAL. Trying to buy train tickets, in many cases won't happen without a chip, and definitely won't happen in a self-serve machine without pin. Buying gas at a self-serve gas station WONT happen without CHIP+PIN.

My USAA Visa has Chip+PIN, so I use that when traveling. Wish Chase would jump on board with CHIP+PIN.

Interesting BofA just replaced my debit card (for fraud transactions ironically), and they sent a EMV card. I thought it was CHIP+SIG like ALL of their credit cards, but it came with a booklet showing it's CHIP+PIN NOT signature. Nice job, B of A. Might actually get me to use their Debit card again haha

In theory Visa's mandated that ticket machines and the like support chip and signature cards since July 1st. If you've traveled since the end of June I'm surprised you're still having significant problems. Can you tell us where exactly you've had problems since then?

Also my BofA debit card is still chip and signature internationally and at places in the US that don't support debit. If you really feel that you need a PIN I wouldn't rely on that as an option based on what https://www.bankofamerica.com/privacy/faq/emv-chip-card-faq.go says. (Not to mention that there's a 3% fee every time you use it overseas.)

 

[BruiserB]

If CurrentC wants to survive, they'd be better off partnering with ApplePay/GooglePay/SamsungPay rather than competing against them. Since ApplePay is about to allow store credit cards (JCPenney, Kohl's, etc) into it, why couldn't Target (for example) or other MCX merchant's just put their ACH cards into ApplePay? Not that I love the idea of giving Target direct access to my checking account, but I did have a RedCard for a while. If I were to give them direct access again, I'd be more comfortable doing it if ApplePay was handling the security of the transaction and the ease of fingerprint authenticated NFC payment rather than a clunky QR Code.