Showed my iPhone to my friend that works for Microsoft.

[littlewaywelt]

Last weekend I showed my friend my iPhone (1st Gen iPhone) and let him use it for a while. He had just picked up a Windows mobile phone a couple days before and he sat and compared the two phones. His phone was the Verizon Wireless XV6900 I believe.

Here are a couple direct quotes made by him.

"I think the iPhone has a better user interface then my Windows Mobile phone"

"The windows mobile interface is just terrible"

My experience is the opposite. I've had the iPhone for two weeks and ran WM5 on a Treo 700w and 700wx for two years.
Worse stability by far on iPhone - I've had more crashes, program quits and freezes in two weeks than I did in two years with WM5
It takes a lot more swipes touches and key presses to do simple things
WM is definitely easier and faster to use one-handed
WM it's easy to
Keypad (subjective and I'm not fully used to it yet) was quicker on a Treo, not requiring constant button pushes to flip between keyboards.
lack of office support stinks
attaching docs to email
no cut and paste
ability to easily edit the registry
FTP
Bluetooth was better
can use phone as storage device
sd cards for big files

IMHO, Wm is better for serious business users. iPhone is nicer and simpler for many tasks and media use. 3rd party progs for WM blow away what's available for iPhone, but this will likely change as time goes on. WM's biggest problem in my experience was active sync, but even that allows much more than mobileme.

While not high-tech a dpad is extremely useful and in many (not all) respects faster.

 

[Wingnut330]

It takes a lot more swipes touches and key presses to do simple things
WM is definitely easier and faster to use one-handed

I was in the same boat - Treo 700w for 2.5 years. While I like my iPhone, there are some things I miss about WM/Palm. The biggest is the ease with which doing simple things could be done on the Treo. I work in the internet field and we are constantly trying to reduce the number of clicks it takes for people to execute simple tasks. While the iPhone doesn't have a stylus (advantage iPhone imo) it does take more steps to make a simple phone call or view your calendar for the day.

A simple fix I would LOVE to see is to allow me to change the double click feature on the iPhone so that when I double click the square it opens up my phone contacts and keyboard so I can just begin typing a name to call. I really miss that similar feature from WM/Palm.

As for one handed, I think the iPhone can be used one handed, but it's going to take me a long time to get there. Definately can't use it while driving (not hat I advocate that). But with a WM/Palm I could easily manage conference calls and text messages while on the road just by using the tactive keyboard. It's not so easy with the iPhone.

The long and short of it for me is that the iPhone is an AWESOME multimedia phone and I love the integration into OSX. As for a true road warrior business phone, I give the edge to the Blackberry or Treo/Palm/WM.

Just my $.02

 

[t0mat0]

You obviously have no appreciation for simplification. Why dont you go the full mile? I can see the need for a wifi antenna on your head, a dslr and hd video camera around your neck, a full sized keyboard thrown over your shoulder, stereo headphones, vr glasses, and a garmin in your pocket. I guess you better get a really long extension cord also.

Don't be rediculous. He'd have a Vista compatible solar panel

 

[littlewaywelt]

A simple fix I would LOVE to see is to allow me to change the double click feature on the iPhone so that when I double click the square it opens up my phone contacts and keyboard so I can just begin typing a name to call. I really miss that similar feature from WM/Palm.

Just my $.02

One feature I loved on WM was the picture speeddial on the home page
and the contact lookup bar. From the home page I could just click on a picture and it would dial, or if I held it it would give me the option to send an email or text to that person. I also loved that I could just start typing a person's name right on the home page and get the same options.
Love having live weather and traffic images there too.

iPhone should have more ability to shortcut things to the home page and I'd love to see programs that allow you to reconfigure the home page like those available for WM.

 

[Queen of Spades]

Once again, the self-important asshattery around here is choking. That's the one thing I distinctly remember hating about Apple (basically the fanboys) before I switched - people trying to forcibly tell you why anything Apple is unequivocally better.

Most normal people don't care what kind of phone you use. If it works for you, great.

Stop acting like the little brother trying to overcompensate.

 

[Wingnut330]

One feature I loved on WM was the picture speeddial on the home page
and the contact lookup bar. From the home page I could just click on a picture and it would dial, or if I held it it would give me the option to send an email or text to that person. I also loved that I could just start typing a person's name right on the home page and get the same options.
Love having live weather and traffic images there too.

iPhone should have more ability to shortcut things to the home page and I'd love to see programs that allow you to reconfigure the home page like those available for WM.

Agreed - those were great options to use. That's why I suggested the double tap/search option. It seems that it would be very easy to bring up the type window in contacts so you could type the name and dial it just like the contact lookup bar in WM.

 

[Geckotek]

Once again, the self-important asshattery around here is choking. That's the one thing I distinctly remember hating about Apple (basically the fanboys) before I switched - people trying to forcibly tell you why anything Apple is unequivocally better.

Most normal people don't care what kind of phone you use. If it works for you, great.

Stop acting like the little brother trying to overcompensate.

AMEN!!! The one thing that almost stopped me from buying an iPhone was the somewhat undeserved smugness of the Mac fanboy community. Half of what they say on these boards is misinformed rubbish. It's like they watch the commercials and just believe it all. Marketing suckers.

IMHO, WM has many advantages over the iPhone. It's the iPhone that's playing catch-up here, not the other way around.

BUT, to be fair, Apple does an excellent job at entering an already established market (ex: mp3 players) and making a nice and shiny polished product that is hard to resist. I intentionally skipped the 1G iPhone because it was way to lacking in features. With 3G and the ability to load 3rd party apps, it has come a long way.

But to hear things in one thread about how much more stable the iPhone is and then in another read about how many times someone's new iPhone has crashed is laughable. It's like these guys can't smell their own ****.

I appreciate both WM and the iPhone. I hope that MS can find a way to improve WM in the future....but having control of the hardware you install your platform on is a great advantage for Apple. Also, controlling the testing and delivery of 3rd party apps is another advantage (while being a disadvantage at the same time.)

All I'm saying guys is be reasonable. Both products have their pros and cons. Don't speak out of ignorance if you haven't used both. Stop being a blind fanboy and be objective.

By the way, I work for MS and my buddies there love my new phone.

 

[RoboCop001]

Photos of his words, or it never happened.

R-Fly

I want photographic proof of you typing that!!

But I don't want a regular photo. It has to be a billboard. And make it sexy. Make sure Grace Park is in the photo instead.

 

[Wingnut330]

Just realizing something else I miss. When in the calendar of WM, you could tell when your meetings were just by looking at the date. A triangle in the upper part of the square meant a morning appointment. A triangle in the lower part of the square meant an eveing appointment. A square in the square meant mid day or all day and all day events could be solid or just bordered squares.

This was useful becase if someone asked you if you were free on a give date, you could easily tell them without opening that particular day. It was also nice to be able to tell what evenings etc you are available.

 

[ScottFitz]

Much as I'd love not to be able to say this but sometimes usability <> usefulness.

I really want to buy an iPhone - my heart says go get it: it's gorgeous, the UI is fantastic, the AppStore looks like being the bee's knees and it's a true all-in-one device but my head says not yet: no cut'n'paste, no editing of Office doucments, no Adobe Flash, crippled Bluetooth stack (no synching address book with my car!!!), no MMS (not a biggie), no landscape keyboard for SMS, and (apparently) early model build quality and reception issues.

None of the downers are apparent in my 18-month old WM6 HTC Tytn II and it's UI is acceptable (not great, acceptable).

I'm going to let the dust settle and Apple release 2.01 to fix some of the issues which affect me, but hopefully sooner rather than later the iPhone's usefulness will catch up with my personal requirements.

I don't know if this will help you, but I just made the switch from a TyTN2 to the iphone 3g. Great move.

I'm about to sell my TyTN 2 and got onto the HTC website. There's a WM 6.1 upgrade available there. I've not upgraded it yet, but I will then I'll ebay it. I added on several UI "tweaks" that really added to the instability of what is a pretty decent WM phone. 6.1 will take all that crap off and start fresh for the next owner.

 

[cohenspire]

Apple has always specialized in design and usability first and foremost. Their computers and operating system has always been the best in terms of usability and overall common sense. I have used both windows and macs and will defend apple to the death.

The iPhone is a marvelous product, i had a Motorola Q (horrible phone) with WinBlows Mobile on it and it was horrid. The design, overall function was atrocious. I consider myself a very very tech savvy person and I had issues adapting to it at first. When people ask about phones I always warn them about Windows Mobile, because in my opinion most consumers would have a very hard time navigating and taking advantage of a windows mobile phone.

 

[Project]

My experience is the opposite. I've had the iPhone for two weeks and ran WM5 on a Treo 700w and 700wx for two years.
Worse stability by far on iPhone - I've had more crashes, program quits and freezes in two weeks than I did in two years with WM5
It takes a lot more swipes touches and key presses to do simple things
WM is definitely easier and faster to use one-handed
WM it's easy to
Keypad (subjective and I'm not fully used to it yet) was quicker on a Treo, not requiring constant button pushes to flip between keyboards.
lack of office support stinks
attaching docs to email
no cut and paste
ability to easily edit the registry
FTP
Bluetooth was better
can use phone as storage device
sd cards for big files

IMHO, Wm is better for serious business users. iPhone is nicer and simpler for many tasks and media use. 3rd party progs for WM blow away what's available for iPhone, but this will likely change as time goes on. WM's biggest problem in my experience was active sync, but even that allows much more than mobileme.

While not high-tech a dpad is extremely useful and in many (not all) respects faster.

Most of your list of reasons why WM is better for "serious business" users are quite frankly, ludicrous.

I mean... editing the registry? I can assure you that I use my iPhone for "serious business" but have never felt the need to adjust some plist files on the device. SD cards for bigger files? What bigger files? Movies?

I get along fine with read-only office document access and have never edited a single document with a WinMob phone after using one for the last 4 years. I have a laptop to edit documents. I guess that makes me a non serious business user.

 

[ScottFitz]

AMEN!!! The one thing that almost stopped me from buying an iPhone was the somewhat undeserved smugness of the Mac fanboy community. Half of what they say on these boards is misinformed rubbish. It's like they watch the commercials and just believe it all. Marketing suckers.

IMHO, WM has many advantages over the iPhone. It's the iPhone that's playing catch-up here, not the other way around.

BUT, to be fair, Apple does an excellent job at entering an already established market (ex: mp3 players) and making a nice and shiny polished product that is hard to resist. I intentionally skipped the 1G iPhone because it was way to lacking in features. With 3G and the ability to load 3rd party apps, it has come a long way.

But to hear things in one thread about how much more stable the iPhone is and then in another read about how many times someone's new iPhone has crashed is laughable. It's like these guys can't smell their own ****.

I appreciate both WM and the iPhone. I hope that MS can find a way to improve WM in the future....but having control of the hardware you install your platform on is a great advantage for Apple. Also, controlling the testing and delivery of 3rd party apps is another advantage (while being a disadvantage at the same time.)

All I'm saying guys is be reasonable. Both products have their pros and cons. Don't speak out of ignorance if you haven't used both. Stop being a blind fanboy and be objective.

By the way, I work for MS and my buddies there love my new phone.

I've used, like I said above, the HTC TyTN2 w/ WM6 for a year or so. It was very stable until I added some UI tweaks. I was running it on the TMO network. My boss had a Tmobile Wing and he had to reset his daily. He definitely was incapable of adding any tweaks. Just a straight version.

So, my point is that the device hardware might have a lot to do with the instability of WM6. My ip3G has locked up once on me. We'll see how that goes from here on out. I have added 1800 contacts to it though, so part of this might be me, yet again, adding more than I'm supposed to (perhaps). With 16gb of memory, I'm guessing 1800 contacts should not be a problem, but it really slows down the search function.

 

[RRK]

AMEN!!! The one thing that almost stopped me from buying an iPhone was the somewhat undeserved smugness of the Mac fanboy community. Half of what they say on these boards is misinformed rubbish. It's like they watch the commercials and just believe it all. Marketing suckers.

Apparently you are not familiar with the concept of enthusiast groups. I find it more surprising that you would expect anything different from an open forum dedicated to rumors about a specific brand. I find "anti-fanboys" to be slightly more pathetic then genuine enthusiasts.

 

[littlewaywelt]

Just realizing something else I miss. When in the calendar of WM, you could tell when your meetings were just by looking at the date. A triangle in the upper part of the square meant a morning appointment. A triangle in the lower part of the square meant an eveing appointment. A square in the square meant mid day or all day and all day events could be solid or just bordered squares.

This was useful becase if someone asked you if you were free on a give date, you could easily tell them without opening that particular day. It was also nice to be able to tell what evenings etc you are available.

That was a great feature. Also great was that each day was listed on the home screen so as soon as it was on you could see your agenda for the day.

Calendar view for me is pretty much useless in that regard bc every day has a square. The list view though is pretty good. Supposedly WebIS is building a version of PocketInformant for iPhone. The utility that that app (and others like it) have w regard to calendar functions and views was amazing.

 

[BongoBanger]

Apparently you are not familiar with the concept of enthusiast groups. I find it more surprising that you would expect anything different from an open forum dedicated to rumors about a specific brand. I find "anti-fanboys" to be slightly more pathetic then genuine enthusiasts.

Or maybe he's just less jaded and cynical than you and hopes that people will rise above their petty natures.

Incidentally 'enthusiast' is not the same as 'fan boy'. Just so you know.

 

[littlewaywelt]

Apparently you are not familiar with the concept of enthusiast groups. I find it more surprising that you would expect anything different from an open forum dedicated to rumors about a specific brand. I find "anti-fanboys" to be slightly more pathetic then genuine enthusiasts.

The difference is that fanboys often don't want to have an intelligent discussion of the differences. They assume WM must be as bug ridden as many other windows offerings. They assume that because they don't need certain functionality, no one else should; that iPhone is perfect. ...and then they flame you.

I'll tell you this, at the WM forum I partook in, they have an iPhone forum link too, and they don't slam it like WM gets slammed here. The upsides and downsides to both get debated. ...though while they seem to sometimes enjoy some of the iPhone's obvious failings like document support, flash, cut and paste, tethering and inability to easily customize the phone, they are the first to acknowledge how much better the iPhone handles music media etc.

 

[ubersalad]

Should see the amount of people from Microsoft in line for iPhone.

 

[littlewaywelt]

Most of your list of reasons why WM is better for "serious business" users are quite frankly, ludicrous.

I mean... editing the registry? I can assure you that I use my iPhone for "serious business" but have never felt the need to adjust some plist files on the device. SD cards for bigger files? What bigger files? Movies?

I get along fine with read-only office document access and have never edited a single document with a WinMob phone after using one for the last 4 years. I have a laptop to edit documents. I guess that makes me a non serious business user.

ludicrous?
just because you didn't use those features doesn't make them not appropriate for serious business. Some of us used those features every day, all day long.
editing office docs would be a big one.
cutting and pasting is a big one
easily attaching documents to emails would be a big one, saving files to an SD card would be a big one
sd cards for databases, or for taking a camera card and emailing high res 10mp photos from the field,
lack of anything even remotely advanced PIM...apple's PIM is a joke. It's missing tens of fields that ppl use in contact management.

the iphone is missing a ton of features that business users want. you many not, but the point is that those limitations limit who can use the iphone.

 

[PittAir]

What do you use your phone for? I had a Dash for one year, and when the screen cracked in half in March I bought an iphone.

I just upgraded to an iphone 3G.

The ease of use of this product, with enterprise email, native apps, a bit faster 3G connectivity and GPS (plus A-GPS) simply blows the competition away.

I use my iphone more than my laptop now to check email, locate hotels, retaurants, and other services in unfamiliar areas, etc more than I ever have. I had several blackberries and the Dash with WM 6.0 before this.

Sure, there are a few bugs with the apps and the 2.0 software, but give them a break, the darn thing was only released two weeks ago!

If you doubt it, go to an Apple store and try it out.

Yes, I am a serious business user. I would be surprised if Windows and Blackberry devices will survive another 1-2 years once people get their hands on these. The only thing saving these OSs now is corporate inertia--nothing else.

 

[PittAir]

ludicrous?
just because you didn't use those features doesn't make them not appropriate for serious business. Some of us used those features every day, all day long.
editing office docs would be a big one.
cutting and pasting is a big one
easily attaching documents to emails would be a big one, saving files to an SD card would be a big one
sd cards for databases, or for taking a camera card and emailing high res 10mp photos from the field,
lack of anything even remotely advanced PIM...apple's PIM is a joke. It's missing tens of fields that ppl use in contact management.

the iphone is missing a ton of features that business users want. you many not, but the point is that those limitations limit who can use the iphone.

A few comments.

(1) How long does it take you to email a "high res 10 MP picture" from the field?

(2) Why have an SD card when you have 16 GB on board and can wirelessly transfer just about anything you want?

(3) How often do you edit office documents on your phone? Don't you carry a laptop with 3G and wifi, like most business users that I know?

(4) Cut and pasting would be nice, but again, how often do you and other business users do this on their phone?

(5) Look for a native app that edits office docs in the near future.

The iphone hits the sweet spot for this business user, who has a laptop for some things and a phone for others. No need to carry anything else.

 

[littlewaywelt]

What do you use your phone for? I had a Dash for one year, and when the screen cracked in half in March I bought an iphone.

I just upgraded to an iphone 3G.

The ease of use of this product, with enterprise email, native apps, a bit faster 3G connectivity and GPS (plus A-GPS) simply blows the competition away.

I use my iphone more than my laptop now to check email, locate hotels, retaurants, and other services in unfamiliar areas, etc more than I ever have. I had several blackberries and the Dash with WM 6.0 before this.

Sure, there are a few bugs with the apps and the 2.0 software, but give them a break, the darn thing was only released two weeks ago!

If you doubt it, go to an Apple store and try it out.

Yes, I am a serious business user. I would be surprised if Windows and Blackberry devices will survive another 1-2 years once people get their hands on these. The only thing saving these OSs now is corporate inertia--nothing else.

The dash if memory serves, like the Moto Q, uses WM smartphone edition, not WM PPC edition. It has much less capability.

Blackberry is the device for gvt and major corporations. It will never die. BB has had what, 2 major outages ever? It's a completely dependable platform. There was a very small sampling done of new iPhone buyers...less than 1% were former BB or WM users. It's simply a different market.

Again, ppl that have used both devices have to decide for themselves. There is a ton of functionality lost in the WM - iPhone move and some that's gained. IMHO, what's gained isn't what most big business users want and who is buying the units right now seems to bare that out.

 

[littlewaywelt]

A few comments.

(1) How long does it take you to email a "high res 10 MP picture" from the field?

I ftp'd them on EVDO, so not terribly long. Would also have to move around large pdf files.

(2) Why have an SD card when you have 16 GB on board and can wirelessly transfer just about anything you want?

because I might have to take something that's only available on a card. Wireless transfer isn't always possible out there.

(3) How often do you edit office documents on your phone? Don't you carry a laptop with 3G and wifi, like most business users that I know?

I never carry a laptop if I can avoid it. I edit (used to) docs on my phone on a daily basis.

(4) Cut and pasting would be nice, but again, how often do you and other business users do this on their phone?

I really miss this. I did this all the time. It was actually the one thing I didn't think I'd miss because I didn't realize how often I did it.

(5) Look for a native app that edits office docs in the near future.

That will be nice. Back in the days I used palm os and loved docs to go.

The iphone hits the sweet spot for this business user, who has a laptop for some things and a phone for others. No need to carry anything else.[/QUOTE]


Don't get me wrong. I love my iPhone and am willing to learn to live with what I gave up....at least for a while.

 

[Wingnut330]

Again, ppl that have used both devices have to decide for themselves. There is a ton of functionality lost in the WM - iPhone move and some that's gained. IMHO, what's gained isn't what most big business users want and who is buying the units right now seems to bare that out.

I agree 100%. iPhone is a great multimedia phone with great OS integration. Not quite ready for the big business big leauges.

 

[mcdj]

The iPhone is like a hot 18 year old girl. Sexy body, pretty face, fun to touch, maybe a little flakey, but tons of potential.

Windows mobile devices are like a 40 year old woman. She was hot 10 years ago. Now she's mature and reliable, but a little chunky, very set in her ways, and only people her age can even come close to figuring her out, or care to.